We need a whole lot more info and corroboration than this to even be able to form an opinion as to what is going on.
Oh yes, we'll need more sources than Charlie "Axe to Grind" Demerjian.
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We need a whole lot more info and corroboration than this to even be able to form an opinion as to what is going on.
Careful there, there's no real standard for what "10nm" or "7nm" means across manufacturers.
Intel's 10nm process should (but might not) have higher component density than its 14nm,
but Samsung/TSMC's 7nm isn't necessarily more dense than Intel's 10nm.
How does one say Ruh Roh in geekspeak.
INTC closed up 2.29% on the news.
So "the money" isn't taking SA's report as "news," either because they think it's fake or because they have known for a while.
Probably the former.
Intel is immune to almost everything it seems.
The chip in the Ideapad 330 is a Cannon Lake based 10nm CPU from Intel that has been blessed with the marketing name Core i3-8121U. If you look at the main Ark page this part isn’t currently listed but if you search for it specifically you end up on a spec page. There are a lot of interesting bits to be gleaned from this page starting with the name. 8121U connotes a low end i3, the lowest end of the non-crippled all that much range. Think products that go into bottom-feeder special laptops, then step up half of a notch. Volume, not quality.
In the end we have a chip being built on a troubled 10nm process. In six months Intel can make 15% of a day’s production on those production lines. The resultant chips are abjectly broken, they are 2+1 but the +1 doesn’t work which means they are selling a CPU with half the die turned off, an expensive proposition given the cost of the process and the shatteringly low yields. Even with the GPU turned off, the resultant CPU uses twice the power of the 14nm devices to run slower than those with a GPU.
I have been hearing talk of how Intel would ROFLSTOMP AMD when they came with Zen and just go with 10nm and even before that 10nm was a good reason to not even dare to make anything for years.
You can claim all the stories are false
Why do people find it far fetched that 10nm is not something Intel even wants ?
You should get your hearing checked.
You just used SemiAccurrate to validate... SemiAccurate. No claims need to be made.
Intel wants to make money. It's what they're good at.
You meant shoot the messenger ignore the message. Works for you right
I never heard anyone with a fab getting money from really bad yields but if you care to explain how exactly give Intel a call you have a rosy future
so can we safely assume that 90% of news specific to a company are BS aimed at day trading?
I'd imagine they're not even aimed at people directly, but targeting algorithms that competing firms use to make their hyper-fast short term trades.
There's a money war going on and it leverages stupid social media sites to spread misinformation so they can adjust stock prices the way they want for a few minutes (the key being they can predict what will happen and when for that short period of time after a new story breaks).
We aren't going to see a stop of this kind of market manipulation until they make rules that state that stocks must be fully acquired and held for a certain amount of reasonable time (1 continuous 24 hour period) before they can be sold again. Short term trading like you see with the ultra rich (with their insane low latency connections to markets and algorithms that trade thousands of stocks every second) is a cancer to the system and needs to be stopped.
They just fired their CEO- but their critics have been immune to facts for a long time
Intel is immune to almost everything it seems.
They just fired their CEO
Not sure what are you saying? Did their stock go down or up because of it?
And how is it that AMD can have 7nm already.
Basically, they've been developing these different architectural nodes (12nm, 10nm, 7nm) in parallel, and had a set schedule to complete them, begin testing, ramp up, and volume. Well, 10nm isn't working out too well, and is way behind schedule. Their 7nm design is getting near completion. There is the option to just scrap 10nm (call it a loss) and redirect funds which were going to 10nm development toward 7nm. The smaller node would save them money compared to 10nm, and they may not have even used 10nm for long due to how far behind schedule it was. If 7nm was designed around different fab technology than 10nm (likely), then issues with manufacturing and yields may not be as prevalent.As the dumbest person in this thread I’m curious about something.
If you keep dropping the ball on 10nm, why is Intel acting like 7nm is some sort of relief?
Wouldn’t 7nm add more problems.
And how is it that AMD can have 7nm already.
Did they make Ryzen so different it can leapfrog over Intel?
AMD doesn't- they don't own fabs.
The article is basically worthless without the analysis, which is held ransom behind a $1K/yr. paywall. When the wall went up I stopped reading. It was different when he was freely available to read on the Inq...
That's less than most cable bills, but still outrageous. Edit: well about equal to a cable bill ($83/mo) before hbo, etc.Charlie's paywall is $1000 a year? lol, omg.
Charlie's paywall is $1000 a year? lol, omg.
That's less than most cable bills, but still outrageous. Edit: well about equal to a cable bill ($83/mo) before hbo, etc.
As above, they did launch a 10nm laptop... barely. If yield was any worse it would've been a single core!I'll believe Intel's denial when we actually see these fabled 10nm products.
You said, and I quoted,
I responded with their CEO getting fired:
You responded incomprehensibly whining about stock prices:
And I'm still wondering how a company that is 'immune' loses their CEO.
Yes, it is.Charlie's paywall is $1000 a year? lol, omg.
Basically, they've been developing these different architectural nodes (12nm, 10nm, 7nm) in parallel, and had a set schedule to complete them, begin testing, ramp up, and volume. Well, 10nm isn't working out too well, and is way behind schedule. Their 7nm design is getting near completion. There is the option to just scrap 10nm (call it a loss) and redirect funds which were going to 10nm development toward 7nm. The smaller node would save them money compared to 10nm, and they may not have even used 10nm for long due to how far behind schedule it was. If 7nm was designed around different fab technology than 10nm (likely), then issues with manufacturing and yields may not be as prevalent.
That is all assuming Intel's 7nm is close to usable, and ignores probably many factors that they would want to consider, but that's the thought that goes behind that idea.
Np. Note that I was just using those numbers as an example–I don't remember off hand what intel has coming after 10nm, and before 10nm intel had (has) 14nm(+++), not 12nm.Thanks for explaining.
The 7nm I cited that AMD had was a misunderstanding, seems that was a GPU.
But isn’t that kind of like prepping for your CPU?
Seems logical to develope something like a GPU before going all in?
Exciting stuff though.
Since Intel made record revenue in Q3 I won’t feel bad switching to AMD for my next build.
I’m still getting everything I need done on a Quad i7 as long as it’s above 3.4GHz.
The Zen2 will have a GPU and most likely a Quad at the bottom of their choices.
Last time I Used AMD was when the MPs were rolling right over Intels line up.
I sure love the competition.
But AMDs single core performance needs to be equal or better if they want real competition.
Thanks
Cheerz
Np. Note that I was just using those numbers as an example–I don't remember off hand what intel has coming after 10nm, and before 10nm intel had (has) 14nm(+++), not 12nm.
If Intel can't do 10nm, how they going to do anything smaller?
So for now its only TSMC and Samsung that can do 7nm.
As the dumbest person in this thread I’m curious about something.
If you keep dropping the ball on 10nm, why is Intel acting like 7nm is some sort of relief?
Wouldn’t 7nm add more problems.
And how is it that AMD can have 7nm already.
Did they make Ryzen so different it can leapfrog over Intel?
Charlie Demerjian of Semiaccurate has dropped a bombshell article in which he reports that Intel insiders have proclaimed the current 10nm process is dead. He says that this is a good thing for the company as it was the right thing to do. Assuming that there is truth to this rumor, this means that only TSMC and Samsung are the gatekeepers of the next generation process. GLOBALFOUNDRIES has dropped out of the race. Samsung has begun production with their 7nm EUV process. TSMC announced that they expect their 7nm process to account for 20% of their revenue for 2019. There has been no official statement from Intel so far about the rumor.
For several years now SemiAccurate has been saying the the 10nm process as proposed by Intel would never be financially viable. Now we are hearing from trusted moles that the process is indeed dead and that is a good thing for Intel, if they had continued along their current path the disaster would have been untenable. Our moles are saying the deed has finally been done. This isn't to say the road to this point has been easy or straightforward, and the road ahead is even less solid.