Intel DG45ID Motherboard @ [H]

Kyle,
THanks for the enlightening post-review. Interesting that you are seeing only VC1 encoded HA, as this is the one BD format that I find Intel IGP cores (G35 and G45) have the most difficulty with (stuttering, cpu offload, etc.) with my Asus boards. I am curious if you have tried this on the older PowerDVD 7.3 software, because for most HTPC folks spending another $100 to upgrade to PDVD8 isn't worth it (a discrete GPU would be a better value and have instant backwards compatibilty). Thanks again and looking forward to any further follow-ups to it!
 
Hi!

The link works fine for me aswell, but the %!@#& videostream freezes after Kyle says the boards name. Could you guys upload it somewhere else or give me a link to the file instead of the stream?

Or at least write down what's in the video?

I hate videostreams since quicktime.
 
kyle i always imagined you to be kind of on the heavy side with shorter hair and no facial hair but boy was i wrong lol
 
Doesn't look like its completely broken, but some codecs definitely are. Good report!
 
GLSauron said:
On the follow up, which BIOS are you using in the video? Intel wanted to use .0075, you used .0079, and .0081 is now available. Is that .0081 or .0079 in the video? (I dont care but some people might ;) )

And the above link works fine for me.
Click to expand...

0079 was used for all our testing.

S_T said:
Kyle,
THanks for the enlightening post-review. Interesting that you are seeing only VC1 encoded HA, as this is the one BD format that I find Intel IGP cores (G35 and G45) have the most difficulty with (stuttering, cpu offload, etc.) with my Asus boards. I am curious if you have tried this on the older PowerDVD 7.3 software, because for most HTPC folks spending another $100 to upgrade to PDVD8 isn't worth it (a discrete GPU would be a better value and have instant backwards compatibilty). Thanks again and looking forward to any further follow-ups to it!
Click to expand...

No, only the latest as the player supports more hardware out there and will support dual stream as well.

mufcfan said:
Hi!

The link works fine for me aswell, but the %!@#& videostream freezes after Kyle says the boards name. Could you guys upload it somewhere else or give me a link to the file instead of the stream?

Or at least write down what's in the video?

I hate videostreams since quicktime.
Click to expand...

4am...maintenance.

Linked said:
kyle i always imagined you to be kind of on the heavy side with shorter hair and no facial hair but boy was i wrong lol
Click to expand...

Been there too!

inotocracy said:
Doesn't look like its completely broken, but some codecs definitely are. Good report!
Click to expand...


Nope, not completely, but considering H.264/MPEG4-AVC is the big codec being used, it is a big deal if you multipurpose with your HTPC.
 
Kyle,

a interesting board for you to check out....

i'm using the J & W Mini ITX board that uses AM2 chips....it's a tiny little thing and has just about everything under the sun....right now i'm using a AMD 4850E 45W chip with 2gb of DDR667 ram and can play Bluray and HDDVD movies with ease (also can play high def .mkv files without issues either)

i''ve been watching the video acceleration and the HD3200 onboard chip handles the video's quite nicely (the only caveat i've noticed is i have to use PowerDVD 7 - but that's ok, because that is what came bundled with my LG HDDVD/Bluray drive)

i was looking at intel's mini itx boards but couldn't find anything i particularly liked (they have at least 1 775 board)....this J & W board was really quite a nice surprise and it would be interesting to see what you guys think about it

i've been trying to cut my power consumption (was using a "file server" pc, and my 360) now i use this new little machine with a 640GB mirror, and the dual purpose drive and everything is running great using Vista Ultimate!

btw, nice work on the video...it's great to see that you guys don't just publish stuff and leave it...that you actually care enough to go back and revisit this stuff....have liked all the video's i've seen so far!

***edited for spelling***
 
Silentbob343 said:
eh this is more of a PEBCAK issues than a board issue. It is really more like; why couldn't intel get their act together and make a "it just works" HTPC board?

For a more comprehensive look at the board from owners;
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1050334
Click to expand...

Oh those of little faith in real world testing. :) Why is [H] the ones outing this? Oh yeah, all the other sites did the testing with the Intel BIOS that worked that is not available to the public. Hmm...
 
Intel sez:

The Bluray HW acceleration in the G45 chipset does work when all of the appropriate ingredients are used (Application version, drivers, and BIOS). This is not unique to Intel's offering - all IGP require the right app, driver and BIOS to achieve the expected Bluray experience. Intel has successfully enabled many of our OEM customers to offer properly configured solutions in their product offerings that minimize the CPU load for Bluray playback. In the case of DIY, it is important to have all of the right ingredients to get the expected Bluray capabilities. In this specific case, there was a BIOS change on DG45ID that has had an unintended adverse impact on Bluray playback, and that is now being corrected and new BIOS posted. Your findings are not a reflection on the actual product capabilities and we are taking necessary corrective action to deliver a great Bluray playback experience for our customers.
Click to expand...
 
SamuraiInBlack said:
I think the people that are concerned by it would be those who intend to multitask while watching a movie or have more than just high-def movie watching in mind.

As for myself, I would like to put together a nice HTPC setup for my dad, who I know will probably use this as a regular computer just as much as a means of DVD/BD playback. So, I'm thinking this board, an E8500, and some Corsair DDR2. I would exclude the video card though unless my cousin comes over and wants to play something with me, so I could see where a video card would be beneficial in that respect. But for my dad, I don't think he'd need a dedicated vidcard.

For me though, I'd want to use this as an HTPC and a dedicated Folding box, so for me I'd probably throw in a video card to have it fold alongside one processor core when I'm not watching movies.
Click to expand...

For the multitaskers in the crowd out there; didn't you notice that this mobo does take Kentsfields and Yorkfields? Given the prices for the Q9450/Q9550, and especially the Q6600 (sub-$200 in most towns, even for retail), it makes for a pretty compelling non-gaming combo (especially if one task will be watching HD movies, regardless of source).

DG45ID at NewEgg: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121355

Q6600 at NewEgg: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115017
 
i gotta tell ya....with the right IGP it doesn't take much cpu power to play a bluray...

for me, i that was at the "pinnacle" as long as i could play bluray, that was the best i needed.

can't remember where i heard it, but the minimum that i heard (had to be dual core) was 1.5ghz with any modern day chip (i think it was achieved with a sempron) to play hd content on a HTPC....
 
Kyle,

Great video on the Intel Bios graphics problem. It is scarey that you choose 2 out of 3 of my favorite movies of all time (I liked 5th Element but not all time material to me). It would be great if you did more videos from my view point.

Thanks again and keep up the great work!!!

Jack R
 
Dr.LaRd said:
i gotta tell ya....with the right IGP it doesn't take much cpu power to play a bluray...

for me, i that was at the "pinnacle" as long as i could play bluray, that was the best i needed.

can't remember where i heard it, but the minimum that i heard (had to be dual core) was 1.5ghz with any modern day chip (i think it was achieved with a sempron) to play hd content on a HTPC....
Click to expand...


If you look at the review this thread is about, you will see that at 1.83GHz on a dual core Core2 processor it took about 100%. Now say you rip all the DRM out of that BD stream and play it back THEN it will be a LOT different. :) Not that anyone would do that with AnyDVD.
 
mjz_5 said:
i'm sure an nividia or ati graphics provide better HQV scores...
Click to expand...

ATI? That means you'd need a Phenom core (as the 780G isn't shipping in an LGA775 version). I don't know about nVidia yet (I just bought an ASUS P5N-EM mATX mobo with nForce integrated graphics; however, the mere fact that I'll be pairing it with a Q6600 would skew the numbers quite a bit).
 
So basically... We've been waiting for Intel to release a board like this for a little while and automatically out of the box.... it's broken?
 
I think it is now fixed, but I have not checked it again.
 
panfist said:
Thanks for the snarky comment. Isn't it possible that I read the evaluation, weighed both sides of the argument, and still decided that I would rather offload decoding to the GPU?
Click to expand...

Lots of possibilities there.
 
Well, I've ordered this board, along with a Western Digital 640GB AAKS drive to be the OS drive. (replacing a raptor 74GB)

Now all I need is an Earthwatts 380w, a better heatsink (I'm thinking a Silent Flux), and some ClearQAM cards. A Logitech Harmony remote would be a bonus.
 
panfist said:
Thanks for the snarky comment. Isn't it possible that I read the evaluation, weighed both sides of the argument, and still decided that I would rather offload decoding to the GPU?
Click to expand...

I would like to hear what made you decide like that...why offload to the GPU and not the CPU?
 
Atech said:
I would like to hear what made you decide like that...why offload to the GPU and not the CPU?
Click to expand...

1.) CPU may not even be fast enough to handle the video decoding by itself.
2.) CPU can continue to encode other videos while playing back video.
3.) GPU can do it with better performance per watt than CPU.
4.) Better multitasking when watching video on secondary monitor.
 
panfist said:
1.) CPU may not even be fast enough to handle the video decoding by itself.
2.) CPU can continue to encode other videos while playing back video.
3.) GPU can do it with better performance per watt than CPU.
4.) Better multitasking when watching video on secondary monitor.
Click to expand...

1+ 2 makes some sense...but I would like to se evidence for 3 + 4
 
Atech said:
1+ 2 makes some sense...but I would like to se evidence for 3 + 4
Click to expand...

For three, I can't pull up any hard evidence right now. I remember seeing one website that had a couple of power consumption comparisons when using hardware decoding or not. Obviously, it depends on your processor. If you have a 65nm vs. 45nm processor, the 45nm will probably give you better performance per watt decoding video over a 65nm GPU. This point could go either way depending on exactly what hardware you have.

Hypothetically speaking, I imagine that if there was specific dedicated hardware for decoding HD video, it could be much more efficient than a general purpose processor. The potential is there to save power and heat, even if in the real world only a small intersection of CPU and GPU gives you better performance per watt ratio when you offload.

For number 4, I don't have any benchmarks, but it makes perfect sense. Often I am compiling and testing code while watching a movie. Doesn't it seem obvious that you'd want to offload video decoding to the GPU?
 
panfist said:
For three, I can't pull up any hard evidence right now. I remember seeing one website that had a couple of power consumption comparisons when using hardware decoding or not. Obviously, it depends on your processor. If you have a 65nm vs. 45nm processor, the 45nm will probably give you better performance per watt decoding video over a 65nm GPU. This point could go either way depending on exactly what hardware you have.

Hypothetically speaking, I imagine that if there was specific dedicated hardware for decoding HD video, it could be much more efficient than a general purpose processor. The potential is there to save power and heat, even if in the real world only a small intersection of CPU and GPU gives you better performance per watt ratio when you offload.
Click to expand...

Mudding the water?
Point 3 is void untill you can back up your claim.


For number 4, I don't have any benchmarks, but it makes perfect sense. Often I am compiling and testing code while watching a movie. Doesn't it seem obvious that you'd want to offload video decoding to the GPU?
Click to expand...
More fuzzy-talk and no data...and no it dosn't make sense without data....presumption is the mother of all fuckups...and point 4 is still void.
 
Atech said:
Mudding the water?
Point 3 is void untill you can back up your claim.

More fuzzy-talk and no data...and no it dosn't make sense without data....presumption is the mother of all fuckups...and point 4 is still void.
Click to expand...

Point 3: I don't know what else you want from me for point 3. I don't have the data, but I saw it. I remember it. You can search it if you want. If you have a Pentium D manufactured on a 90nm process, I would bet both testicles that offloading video decoding to a 65nm GPU will save you power. I can't find the benchmarks. I don't have the hardware to make them myself. I don't need to convince you of this point; I'm content to vote (with my dollar) to the people that matter and can make a difference (the hardware manufacturers).

In addition to point 3, an old friend of mine worked for a hardware company that provided video decoding hardware. They were using ARM DSPs. They could decode standard-def h.264 encoded video using under 5 watts. www.vivacesemiconductor.com If that performance could scale up to 1080p video, you can certainly save power with dedicated hardware.

Point 4: Again, I don't need to convince you, but it's just common sense. If decoding a blu-ray is using 40-70% of my CPU, and I offload most of that so that the CPU is only doing 10-20% instead of 40-70%, that means there are that many more cycles available for my compiler.

I also run Prime95 to attempt to calculate Mersenne primes. When I get home from work, I could tell you the difference in time it takes to verify one number when playing Blu-ray, when playing Blu-ray with GPU decoding, and when not playing any Blu-ray. I already know how the numbers are going to come out.

This stuff just seems so obvious to me I don't see how you could say I'm mudding the water. It's crystal clear to me.
 
panfist said:
Point 3: I don't know what else you want from me for point 3. I don't have the data, but I saw it. I remember it. You can search it if you want. If you have a Pentium D manufactured on a 90nm process, I would bet both testicles that offloading video decoding to a 65nm GPU will save you power. I can't find the benchmarks. I don't have the hardware to make them myself. I don't need to convince you of this point; I'm content to vote (with my dollar) to the people that matter and can make a difference (the hardware manufacturers).
Click to expand...

I just saw Elvis...*hint-hint*

In addition to point 3, an old friend of mine worked for a hardware company that provided video decoding hardware. They were using ARM DSPs. They could decode standard-def h.264 encoded video using under 5 watts. www.vivacesemiconductor.com If that performance could scale up to 1080p video, you can certainly save power with dedicated hardware.
Click to expand...
The GPU is dedicated to 3D rendering, not video, so it's not dedicated video hardware...comparing chickens to motorbikes FTW.

Point 4: Again, I don't need to convince you, but it's just common sense. If decoding a blu-ray is using 40-70% of my CPU, and I offload most of that so that the CPU is only doing 10-20% instead of 40-70%, that means there are that many more cycles available for my compiler.

I also run Prime95 to attempt to calculate Mersenne primes. When I get home from work, I could tell you the difference in time it takes to verify one number when playing Blu-ray, when playing Blu-ray with GPU decoding, and when not playing any Blu-ray. I already know how the numbers are going to come out.

This stuff just seems so obvious to me I don't see how you could say I'm mudding the water. It's crystal clear to me.
Click to expand...
As long as you don't hit 100%, you are wrong...crystal clear or not.
 
Atech said:
I just saw Elvis...*hint-hint*

The GPU is dedicated to 3D rendering, not video, so it's not dedicated video hardware...comparing chickens to motorbikes FTW.

As long as you don't hit 100%, you are wrong...crystal clear or not.
Click to expand...

Wow, you just don't get it.

When I mentioned "dedicated hardware" I was referring to hardware that could potentially exist, and do people a lot of good, if it were actually packaged into something like an expansion card. Decoding h264 with an array of specially designed ARM processors would be orders of magnitude more efficient than using something like a CPU or GPU. I never meant to draw any connection between a GPU and real dedicated hardware other than the dedicated hardware IS DIFFERENT. FTW. Maybe the part where I said, "Hypothetically speaking, I imagine that if there was..." might have clued you in.

Sure, I still haven't provided an proof to backup my third original point, but I conceded that in my first response, and then went on to say something else. This is a discussion board and that's what people do.

And as for your second point...I am hitting 100%. With the compiler. The compiler will max the system out to 100% for as long as it takes to compile...which takes longer if I multitask.

Why are my points void until I prove them? Haven't you ever in 1.4 years that you left without citation?

Why don't you prove to me that CPU decoding is the way to go?
 
What does everybody think about the Gigabyte UD3P or UD3R for an HTPC? My configuration will have the e8500 with a 4870 HD OC video card. Would that be sufficient to run Bluray and future resolutions?
 
Just got this board last night for my dedicated HTPC. I have only loaded the OS (XP) so far. What do the owners of this board recommend as far as content players. TMT, PowerDVD, WinDVD, ect? Are you also using additional Codecs? I am relativley new to the HTPC realm. Also, what version bios and vidieo drivers are you using on your working system?
 
Just got this board installed and loaded last night. Using XP, 4gb ram, a measly E2200, LG Combo BD/HD player and the latest XP video drivers(12-29-2008). Using Zoom Player Max, HDMI through and SPDIF to my AVR then my DLP. I freakin love this thing. It played everything I threw at it last night and the CPU usage never went over 55%. Cant wait until I get home tonight to start customizing my Xlobby screens and import my libraries.
 
This board is realy nice for 64bit vista, Just a shame some of the settings in bois are disabled which motherboard will bottle neck devicers ports cpu pci-e card or HDD and OS to a poor like proformance.

If your runing windows Vista 64bit, Dont forget to turn on "HPET" in Chipset Configation
also PCI Latency Timer to [32].

Doing this in bois will fix the proformance probs and realy show the power of this midia board even for games with a gtx 295 in its pci-e slot ^^

I realy realy dont know why Intel have the settings turned off but only option i can think off is if your goin to install windows xp.
===================================================


id give it 9/10

PS: would be 10/10 if you could overclock cpu's on it but its a realy nice cheep and powerfull mini motherboard for HD videos and games and music.
 
offy said:
This board is realy nice for 64bit vista, Just a shame some of the settings in bois are disabled which motherboard will bottle neck devicers ports cpu pci-e card or HDD and OS to a poor like proformance.

If your runing windows Vista 64bit, Dont forget to turn on "HPET" in Chipset Configation
also PCI Latency Timer to [32].

Doing this in bois will fix the proformance probs and realy show the power of this midia board even for games with a gtx 295 in its pci-e slot ^^

I realy realy dont know why Intel have the settings turned off but only option i can think off is if your goin to install windows xp.
===================================================


id give it 9/10

PS: would be 10/10 if you could overclock cpu's on it but its a realy nice cheep and powerfull mini motherboard for HD videos and games and music.
Click to expand...

The HPET feature should be turned on (if present) in the BIOS of any motherboard in a Vista system if you have a Core architecture processor with more than one core. (This feature is also supported outside of Intel chipsets, as my nForce 630i/7100 chipset also has this feature, which I have turned on.) (And yes, I'm including such bottom-fishing oddities as the Celeron and Pentium DCs in the "Core architecture" comment, as they are basically cut-down Core2Duos.)
 
I've read this thread from start to end... just looking for an opinion.

I've got an Antec Aria case with a 350w power supply. Looking to add this mobo and processor to the case and make it a dedicated HTPC using the onboard equipment.

I'll be running W7, and probably throw in 4 or 8gb, depending on what spares I have around the shop.

I don't intend to run BD disks right now, but would like that to be an option. I am pulling and playing BD rips from Usenet.

Since it's going to be a dedicated HTPC and I won't be using it for anything but a HTPC, what processor(s) should I consider?

I'm not budget limited, but, I'd like to spend less if possible.

E7400/E7500 look tempting. Can I get away with something as cheap as an E5300? Will the 800/1033 FSB make any difference in terms of HD video playback?

Thanks :)
 
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The issue that I'm having now is that I changed from Windows Vista Ultimate to Windows 7 Ultimate. Running TotalMedia Theatre Platinum 3.0 played BR discs just fine on Vista, but I get a graphics overlay issue with trying to play them in Windows 7. Said to update the graphics driver. So I tried that and I still get the error.

Anyone else?
 
I am planning to dump my asus p5kpl-cm and go for this board..the only thing i am interested in is that it has pci express 16x 2.0.. is it worth...otherwise p5kpl-cm isn't a bad board either.
 
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