Insane DSL speeds - 170-245Mbps! How could this be possible?

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Aug 21, 2009
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This happened to me a while ago while I was having "line work" done by my ISP to ensure there weren't problems with my DSL line. I was getting a new modem for a 12/1 Mbps DSL connection with Windstream. The modem had their "windstream" username in the PPPoE while the technician was there doing diagnostics. While he was running tests on the line I decided to do some speed checks as my speeds had been sub 1Mbps for a while. To my surprise my first test was ~230Mbps when using a server in DC (about 150 miles away). I was totally surprised and ran the tests a few more times on the same server with similar results. I then changed servers to San Jose, about 3000 miles away and got the same results on 4 tests. Well this couldn't be right, there must be something wrong with the testing site so I checked on my laptop with my cable modem connection on the same site and got my 15Mbps seeds - which is normal for that connection. I tried on a seperate speed test site for the DSL line and got the top speed of 245Mbps on a NYC server and similar speeds on other servers across the country.

Now this made me really question all the stories I had been told by my ISP about not being able to provide speeds of greater than 12Mbps at my location and I even needed TWO lines to reach this speed (bonded modem). Strange thing is that I had 15/3 Mbps with the local phone companies DSL for 5 years (on a single line) before Windstream bought them out and spent years "upgrading" their equipment for faster speeds.....

Now for those who want more info, the connection is < 6000ft (by a few 100 ft) from the CO where the local DSLAM is (switch/router station). The wire pair that I use is part of a ~50 pair line run from that location and the wire is pretty old at at least 40+ years.

So I'm wondering how this was possible. IMO when on the "windstream" PPPoE account, there aren't the restrictions in the firewall that limit speed. The other option is that they pulled my wires at the CO from their standard customer port and put them on a "diagnostic" port that doesn't have the speed restrictions either by hardware or software (possibly firewall software limiting speed).

What this does show is that the stories that the infrastructure can't handle the speeds is not true (which has been confirmed by a number of techs I've talked to as well). The very odd part is the modem and the speeds it provided. I've done this with 2 different modems, one a single line and another a dual line bonded modem but both times it was when the tech was there doing diag work. When I showed the tech the speeds he kind of clammed up and hemmed and hawed that it was unusual and wouldn't answer any questions about if he had seen this before or if he knew that the system was capable of providing higher speeds. It was clear that he was totally uncomfortable talking about anything related to it and was pretty upset when I was taking screen shots and desktop video of the results and login info (PPPoE).

Has anyone else ever experienced speeds like this on DSL? If you get the opportunity to have line tests done and you know the tech has changed the modem login for diag, run some tests like this and see what you find. I'd be interested to see if others get similar or higher speeds.
 
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Just because a network can supply higher speeds do you while doing diagnostics work doesn't mean it can support higher speeds for you AND everyone else in the area 24/7. You aren't a special butterfly who gets to be the one person with faster internet while everyone else in the area eats shit on normal plans.
 
What...
Its a seperate DSL line so if it can pull 200mbits the line part can pull 200mbits no need to say hey you can only pull 12. it might go to another shared lines but that is on the ISP responsibility and has nothing to do with the technical limits of the last part of the line can only do 12mbit
offcause something else might be a play here, but your logic is just flawed on a technical level

Somebody trying to hard to be the "cool" kid here
 
Just because a network can supply higher speeds do you while doing diagnostics work doesn't mean it can support higher speeds for you AND everyone else in the area 24/7. You aren't a special butterfly who gets to be the one person with faster internet while everyone else in the area eats shit on normal plans.
I don't think I ever said I SHOULD have 245Mbps speed or that I should have faster speeds than anyone else. Did I ever say I should have faster speeds? I said that the line was CAPABLE of faster speeds, something which Windstream has said isn't possible. They have stated to me well over 25-30 times that a single line running to my house can't even supply 12/1 (even though I had 15/2 with local Telco, on same single line modem, for 4-5 years - then Windstream bought them out and suddenly my service dropped to 12/1 and requiring 2 lines/bonded modem, while costing more per month!)

The point is that the statements by Telco ISP's that their infrastructure can't physically handle the speeds past 12-20 Mbps isn't true. Even if it was on a "special port", the line to the residence is the same, the line "that doesn't support 12/1 over a single line". I've gone round and round with them about this and wanted explanations about why I was able to get the speeds before but now needed 2x the infrastructure, getting slower speeds, after they "added advanced, expensive equipment" while raising rates.


What...
Its a seperate DSL line so if it can pull 200mbits the line part can pull 200mbits no need to say hey you can only pull 12. it might go to another shared lines but that is on the ISP responsibility and has nothing to do with the technical limits of the last part of the line can only do 12mbit
offcause something else might be a play here, but your logic is just flawed on a technical level

Somebody trying to hard to be the "cool" kid here
And to SvenBent: IDK exactly what you are saying as it is somewhat jibberish at parts. DSL is not shared with other customers and is either terminated at a CO or a remote DSLAM (I know mine runes to the local CO and ALL lines in my cable terminate at the CO). Could you explain how my logic is flawed on a technical level? That would be enlightening! Also, I guess the "cool" kid remark was directed at me.. Mind explaining that since you decided to make that a public statement? What exactly was I trying hard at, or what did I do to "try" to be the cool "kid" (and why would I care about that on an internet forum...????)
 
I think the cool kid comment was directed at the other poster, but as you stated it's a bit of gibberish and keyboard pounding in there haha.
 
I think the cool kid comment was directed at the other poster, but as you stated it's a bit of gibberish and keyboard pounding in there haha.

Thanks for the clarification. I was scratching my head trying how I was coming off like that or what I said.
 
Well, at 6000ft on ADSL2+ on 24ga cable will get you about 17/1.5 in a perfect world.

VDSL2 8d profile will get you about 25/2 at 6000ft if you are on a good card. So bonded pair will net you about 50/4. There is no use going above an 8d profile at that loop length because the attenuation will kill the higher frequencies.

My point is that at 6000ft it is physically impossible for DSL to get you that bandwidth. If we were talking about 1500ft from an RT it's possible with bonded pair 17a VDSL2 or 30a VDSL2.
 
I did not see that high, but I had a similar scenario of the ISP saying no even though the lines clearly supported more. I was on 1.5mb DSL and they provisioned my account for 12mb that did end up working for a day or so. The issue was the line errors started going through the roof and it was not sustainable (would crap out and reset regularly). So the difference of "peak" speeds and "reliable" speeds were very different
 
Well, at 6000ft on ADSL2+ on 24ga cable will get you about 17/1.5 in a perfect world.

VDSL2 8d profile will get you about 25/2 at 6000ft if you are on a good card. So bonded pair will net you about 50/4. There is no use going above an 8d profile at that loop length because the attenuation will kill the higher frequencies.

My point is that at 6000ft it is physically impossible for DSL to get you that bandwidth. If we were talking about 1500ft from an RT it's possible with bonded pair 17a VDSL2 or 30a VDSL2.

I'd bet you either work in the industry in some capacity or you read the same info I did about various types of DSL - all of which point to the results I witnessed being impossible - which is why I posted - tech manuals say this isn't possible. I think my speeds are more in line with FiOS or DOCIS 3.0 w/ ultra high throughput. I also forgot to mention the ultra low latancy on the testing of about 15-25ms even from Philly to San jose!

I also just tried my smartphone tether for the first time and tested speeds and they were higher than "normal" at 18Mbps/18Mbps. What is strange is that with almost identical phones @ same location (we are on a family plan), my phone gets 4 bars and the other (not my phone) gets 1-2 - with the cell tower about 2-2.5 miles away - they don't get near same speeds I got and they are closer to the tower by 1/2 mile with about 8-9Mbps down & up. These tests have been in the last 3 months (on mobile device - "4G" LTE)

Now I have to say, I have more internet problems than the Coyote trying to catch the road runner - hence DSL & cable connection. One is usually down or maybe 50% of the time one is down.... I've spent more hours on the phone with tech support for DSL than I have cooking over the last few years (and that says something), I've had 3 repair vans and a line/utility truck at my house at once (it looked like a Windstream vehicle parking lot) with 4 "technicians" in my office, 2 outside at the junction box and a guy up on the line - for 4.5 hours (it was a nightmare - truly like a 3 stooges act.... Had techs asking what an IP was!!! SMFH). My cable seems better and speeds consistent but when it drops out it can be days, which is a major PITA & this is a "business" plan...

So Just like a CO connected with a fiber backbone - everything from the CO to customer is at a fraction of the backbone speed. I've seen some business LAN's with fiber or very fast cable that limits connection speeds to individual computers to a max of 5-10% depending on the size of the LAN, so that all systems can get some shared bandwidth. I kind of felt like my DSL was connected to a nearby fiber computer that HAD very high speed connection.

I've also played around with the idea of those "Stingray" devices that police use (and criminals) to intercept cell phone signals and listen in (basically a MITM - man in the middle - attack). I'm wondering if something like that exists for internet. I'm guessing there is a high probability that there is and may explain a lot of my issues.
Higher than normal 4g speeds, higher than other people's signal level - by a lot, Super - Super fast DSL at times, Major connectivity issues on DSL and Cable modem with drop-outs very often, phone company unable or unwilling to fix for over 10 years......

The strange thing is that this has been going on for SOO long and I get stone walled by my ISP's and when I speak to techs, they seem more like con-men sales men more than technicians. They tell me the most outrageous reasons for outages or possible reasons why it is a problem on MY end (I've been doing tech support /system/network admin for almost 20 years). Some of the technicians literally seem like their only training was reading the modem "quick install facts" sheet before coming out, and had no other experience. The were interested in ipconfig & ifconfig for crying out loud!!! So where do you turn when the "PRO'S" certainly aren't trained for professional work?

Anyone know what government agency I can go to to complain about services or if a law suit is possible?
 
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Thanks for the clarification. I was scratching my head trying how I was coming off like that or what I said.

oh yeah the cool kids comment was at the poster after you. not at you. :D well actually the entire post was
I was basically disagreeing with what he said on a technical level
sorry for the gibberish. mind and hands don't always sync up that well >.<
 
Hopefully the OP has screen prints and logs of the test results to show the Windstream folks the next time they say speeds faster then 12/1 are impossible. Of course, as others have pointed out, the real limitation might be the main line to the next upstream point, not the local wires. A gig fiber line can get saturated pretty fast if 2000 folks start watching Game of Thrones at the same time.
 
I totally agree. I had screen shots and video of the 10+ tests while the tech was on site. I did a screen recording for the whole 4 hours they were there so the whole session was captured. Thing is, when I told Windstream this first they acted like they didn't understand what I had done, then they didn't understand WHY it was important and what it proved. When I told them that it showed the line supported faster speeds, then the response is that they couldn't accept test results from any site that wasn't thieir speed test page and finally that even if I had the tests, it didn't matter because their policy and experts have deemed that it is already not possible and they cna't be sure the pics/vido weren't created or altered.

I kind of knew I was going to need some heavy proof to get them to budge from their position and obviously the vids/pics weren't cuttings it. SO the next time they came, it might be possible that I was testing my security cameras when the tech was doing his thing, and the video was recording the monitor that was itself recording the desktop. Out of sheer luck the tech was in the pic discussing the outrageous speeds and how they were a magnitude faster than what the management said was possible. Boy talk about timing and coincidence! Unfortunately the tech's technical ability doesn't exactly shine in this video and is cringeworthy to those who know a little about networking.
 
DSL is not shared with other customers and is either terminated at a CO or a remote DSLAM (I know mine runes to the local CO and ALL lines in my cable terminate at the CO). Could you explain how my logic is flawed on a technical level?


While your DSL connection isn't shared the bandwidth providing your DSL service is shared. There is only a certain amount of bandwidth allocated to the DSLAM your DSL modem is connected to. Your problems could be from busy times overloading the amount of bandwidth they have provisioned to the DSLAM or CO and that is lowering speeds at certain times.

This thread is very confusing but I'm sure your issues are related to the quality of the phone wiring between the CO and your modem. Very common especially of the problem comes and goes. Having a different tech each time you call doesn't help the situation either because they don't know what the other one has checked out or tried to fix.

Speaking of the speed tests it as others have said it is impossible for a DSL connection to provide 200Mbps service unless the laws of physics have changed were you live. It is either a malfunction with the modem or the PC the test is being ran on. Or the phone line quality is throwing off the test.

I've worked for a telco and with DSL for 15 years. There isn't any grand conspiracy holding back the speeds of DSL connections. 90% of the time it's a wiring issue. Having Windstream doesn't help and you will probably never get it fixed knowing them.
 
uhhh, G.fast does gigabit at under 100m, and can do 200mbps at 200m
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.fast
https://networks.nokia.com/solutions/g.fast

Also, DSL is shared; just not to the extent of cable.
DSL essentially gets shared at the DSLAM, on the fiber between the DSLAM and CO (if a DSLAM is in use.)
It could/would also be "shared" on any interconnects at the CO.

Those stupid DSL advertisements of "it's not shared!" is a crock of shit, because it is. Just not in the same points of connectivity as cable.
Of course, due to the technology, those points of shared connectivity generally won't have the constraints that the cable infrastructure does.
 
I have xfinity cable. if I replaced the coax from the pole to my house with a phone line, I might still get service, but reliability would go down. As stated, it isn't about can it be achieved, it's about can it be achieved reliably.
 
I can't remember the type of DSL I read about when I did those speed test awhile back but I found a list of about 12 types (symmetric and asymmetric version would count as 2 types). There seems to be 2 possibilities for DSL using standard twisted pair Telco wires - those being VDSL2 being 300/100 Mbps Down/up - but there is supposedly a bonded set that can offer symmetrical speeds of 400/400 for the VDSL2.

The thing is that I was told that I was on ADSL service. The modem I have is a Comtrend NexusLink 3100u which is a VDL2 Bonded. I also had a Comtrend NexusLink 5600u (tech told me they were same modem...) but this one isn't VDSL2 I don't believe.

I never knew the 3100 was VDSL2. I thought it was ADSL only. Well, that might explain the speed I had then. Also puts a damper on "line doesn't support it" excuse.

So now I know that those speeds I saw aren't some system error, bc the modem or line can't support those. Both the modem and line CAN support it with a bonded setup I had.
Wow, I don't know what to say now that I know that those speeds weren't some fluke or error.

Thanks to all those who helped out on this thread!
 
I can't remember the type of DSL I read about when I did those speed test awhile back but I found a list of about 12 types (symmetric and asymmetric version would count as 2 types). There seems to be 2 possibilities for DSL using standard twisted pair Telco wires - those being VDSL2 being 300/100 Mbps Down/up - but there is supposedly a bonded set that can offer symmetrical speeds of 400/400 for the VDSL2.

The thing is that I was told that I was on ADSL service. The modem I have is a Comtrend NexusLink 3100u which is a VDL2 Bonded. I also had a Comtrend NexusLink 5600u (tech told me they were same modem...) but this one isn't VDSL2 I don't believe.

I never knew the 3100 was VDSL2. I thought it was ADSL only. Well, that might explain the speed I had then. Also puts a damper on "line doesn't support it" excuse.

So now I know that those speeds I saw aren't some system error, bc the modem or line can't support those. Both the modem and line CAN support it with a bonded setup I had.
Wow, I don't know what to say now that I know that those speeds weren't some fluke or error.

Thanks to all those who helped out on this thread!


If the telcos could push those speeds on twisted pair don't you think they would? It's a physical limitation with dsl. I'm not sure what you're seeing on your speedtest results but there's no way its possible when you're 6k ft from a CO. Even if you were being fed from a remote site/remote terminal on bonded VDSL2 you would need to be within 1500ft(that's not accounting for plant condition). The problem with that is the only company in the states currently even able to do that right now is AT&T which uses 17a and 30a profiles. Max rate on a 30a profile is 200Mbps per side which you'll never see in real world conditions. I'm not even sure AT&T even does bonded on 30a yet.

At 6k ft most likely you're on a flavor of ADSL. The modem you have supports bonded VDSL2 on a 12a profile so max per side would be 68Mbps. That modem will train/try to sync up to whatever the dslam port is configured for be it ADSL2+ or VDSL. The newest tech being tested for dsl is vectoring but that's still in the testing labs and probably wont see much implementation.


As for the whole "windstream" pppoe account having different speed settings....it doesn't. It's just a generic bootstrap used to get a modem in sync and service. Your speed provisioning is controlled at the DSLAM port itself, you can take your modem and connect it at someone else's house that has dsl, if their port is provisioned at a slower speed, your modem will now operate at that speed even though your account is paying for a higher speed.

Alright talking about work related stuff makes me tired. Honestly I would question your speedtest results before anything else, looks more likely it's how your dsl connection is interacting with those speedtest sites. Your best bet would be to log into the modem and look at your modem stats. It'll show you what your current max sync rate is and what you're currently provisioned for. That will tell you what your line is actually capable of.
 
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