Identity of Whistleblower Behind NSA Leak Revealed

Personally I think he is an idiot.
There are LEGAL ways a whistle blower can expose information and be protected under his constitutional rights. That would be contacting a member of congress (would suggest Rand Paul).
He is right; what the government is doing violates civil liberties and rights to privacy. But he fled to a foreign country and leaked the information to foreign press. That is treason in anyone's book.

I don't doubt everything he is saying is true.
I would highly recommend for those who have not read George Orwell's 1984 please do so!
 
Krenum said:
Privacy is a freedom.
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Nope, it's not. There's nothing documented in the Constitution regarding privacy. It isn't a baseline thing that you get. I'm pretty sure the word privacy doesn't even appear in it anyplace or in the Bill of Rights.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Nope, it's not. There's nothing documented in the Constitution regarding privacy. It isn't a baseline thing that you get. I'm pretty sure the word privacy doesn't even appear in it anyplace or in the Bill of Rights.
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Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
 
lilbabycat said:
Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
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Yup, thanks for the big font. Where's the word "privacy" again in that?
 
Wow. Contracted with Fed for black projects, and skips off to a communist country.

I don't care if he found out who really killed JFK, he's a fooking traitor and a low-life scumbag.

He doesn't like the US spying, but he flies the the country with the most active spying program in the world? He's nothing but a rat.
 
No big secret, but unless things have changed, you sign a very explicit contract and are asked verbally if you understand:

"If you hire on, you are never permitted in perpetuity to disclose any information of the projects. Penalties are a minimum of 10 years in prison, up to and including the death penalty. You understand this shit, right bro?"

"Oh, and by the way, we catch you with a camera or recording device, ditto, regardless of whether evidence of spying is found."
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Yup, thanks for the big font. Where's the word "privacy" again in that?
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Privacy is not in that directly, though requiring probable cause and a warrant is. Secure in their persons and effects is. We know we don't have privacy in a public place, but we do have privacy on our own property. Wiretapping regular people without warrant or probable cause is illegal, no matter how little respect you have for your fellow man.
 
Qinsp said:
Wow. Contracted with Fed for black projects, and skips off to a communist country.

I don't care if he found out who really killed JFK, he's a fooking traitor and a low-life scumbag.

He doesn't like the US spying, but he flies the the country with the most active spying program in the world? He's nothing but a rat.
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Exactly. He signed the papers to work there, just like the rest of them. He knew what he was getting into and had to have planned to have a leak at some point. You don't go into the intelligence field and accidentally get on a project like that, and go, wow, we are doing something wrong, I feel compelled to copy all of these classified documents that I swore an oath on my life that I would not, and take them to a non-extradition country.

I'm not condoning what the government is doing by any means. But this guy had to have an SCI with bullets meaning he probably signed a few of those security forms that state potential punishments as death.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Yup, thanks for the big font. Where's the word "privacy" again in that?
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Are you serious or are you the product of today's worthless, revisionist high school civics education? The framers knew all too well how a government regardless of its good intentions can be corrupted by too much power. Yes the government is illegally monitoring Americans because it needs a warrant. People should be contacting their congressperson demanding this stop. This is out of control.

Furthermore Nixon was facing possible impeachment for much less than this. This administration makes Nixon look like Pee Wee Herman. I cannot understand how any logical, non-partisan hack can still place any trust in this administration. BTW before on of you loons starts foaming at the mouth about this starting with Bush, I disagreed with it then and still today exepct we now know much more and should not accept it.
 
LeninGHOLA said:
Privacy is not in that directly, though requiring probable cause and a warrant is. Secure in their persons and effects is. We know we don't have privacy in a public place, but we do have privacy on our own property. Wiretapping regular people without warrant or probable cause is illegal, no matter how little respect you have for your fellow man.
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That's one of those wierd things that people have started to feel like they're entitled to have, but were never given to begin with though. I can see that it's sorta reasonable to want that from a private company, but from your government? What do people think they have that's so important that it's worth hiding and why do they infer that the 4th, which was meant to protect personal property from seizure, has even a little to do with privacy?

The whole privacy concept doesn't even exist in the Constitution. If people want it, they really need to make a new amendment for it instead of complaining that they don't have it when there was never any allowances made for it to begin with.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
That's one of those wierd things that people have started to feel like they're entitled to have, but were never given to begin with though. I can see that it's sorta reasonable to want that from a private company, but from your government? What do people think they have that's so important that it's worth hiding and why do they infer that the 4th, which was meant to protect personal property from seizure, has even a little to do with privacy?

The whole privacy concept doesn't even exist in the Constitution. If people want it, they really need to make a new amendment for it instead of complaining that they don't have it when there was never any allowances made for it to begin with.
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Following your logic the government should be able to put a camera in your bathroom to check to sure you are not pooping weapons grade uranium right? Come on man. Expect more from your government.
 
The government needs to "extract" him from whereever he's hiding and transfer him to some unknown black site and bury him in a deep, dark hole for the rest of his life. If they drone him using the espionage / traitor / providing material knowledge to terrorists angle, then he will just become a martyr. Make him disappear forever and the world will forget about him. Creating a little pandimonium and terror wouldn't hurt the cause either. By giving the media something else to focus on like a minor terrorist attract or a really big one which is foiled just in the nick of time will be the easiest way to get him out of the spotlight.
Then back to business as usual, with the added change of no more stupid contractors with access to programs this sensitive. I would also "promise" congress, etc to stop doing in, possibly going to the extreme of publicly shutting it down, all while moving the entire program to a tighter, more restricted place and pulling access and knowledge from all but the highest levels. The government's goal should be to get the program back in the shadows ASAP so that can continue to function before people catch on and find new ways to hide their communications.
 
fdiaz78 said:
Following your logic the government should be able to put a camera in your bathroom to check to sure you are not pooping weapons grade uranium right? Come on man. Expect more from your government.
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Sure, whatever they want is fine with me. I've got nothing to hide from them so I don't really care what they're watching. Just like I've said before, there are more worthwhile people to watch that want to do dumb stuff to the state, or at least rant about it online so they can impress other computer nerds, that are worth watching and maybe carting away to summer camp.
 
fdiaz78 said:
Are you serious or are you the product of today's worthless, revisionist high school civics education?
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He's a troll. Nothing he ever says makes any sense.

The fact he can't equate 'unreasonable searches' with 'privacy' should just enhance this.
I've never seen him on his old (banned) account(s) or new account say anything meaningful (not completely retarded).
 
MasonD said:
He's a troll. Nothing he ever says makes any sense.

The fact he can't equate 'unreasonable searches' with 'privacy' should just enhance this.
I've never seen him on his old (banned) account(s) or new account say anything meaningful (not completely retarded).
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I see you're still upset over the other thread. I did apologize and say I wouldn't mention that thing you do again. I'm not sure why there are all these sour grapes about it.
 
Or can't differentiate between someone no longer wasting their time and losing. Sad case indeed.
 
MasonD said:
He's a troll. Nothing he ever says makes any sense.

The fact he can't equate 'unreasonable searches' with 'privacy' should just enhance this.
I've never seen him on his old (banned) account(s) or new account say anything meaningful (not completely retarded).
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+11ty billion
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
That's one of those wierd things that people have started to feel like they're entitled to have, but were never given to begin with though. I can see that it's sorta reasonable to want that from a private company, but from your government? What do people think they have that's so important that it's worth hiding and why do they infer that the 4th, which was meant to protect personal property from seizure, has even a little to do with privacy?

The whole privacy concept doesn't even exist in the Constitution. If people want it, they really need to make a new amendment for it instead of complaining that they don't have it when there was never any allowances made for it to begin with.
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It's kinda pointless to quote something without addressing it.
 
Bloody good timing ehh?
Manning's trial spinning up
DOJ busted for AP wire taps
Snowden bombshell because we are a nation of amnesia patients
and don't remember Mark Klein
or what was normal or freedom or liberty
or the proper roll of government

funny how when we were toe to toe with a well funded clever and nuclear superpower
we didnt hose up everything
 
fdiaz78 said:
Following your logic the government should be able to put a camera in your bathroom to check to sure you are not pooping weapons grade uranium right? Come on man. Expect more from your government.
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w4nn.jpg


Also, this guy is the most obvious troll around :D
 
Your phones have NEVER been private. Ever.

That is the history of telecommunications. It has caught serial killers, spies, murderers, child molesters, terrorists, etc.

When it is used for political reasons, it is evil. Did the Rat produce ONE document that indicated it was was used for non-criminal activities? Of course not. He was never high enough on the food chain to even know what the prime directive of the project was.

If you work on cryptographics, advanced weapon systems, foreign counterintelligence, you never see the Big Picture. It's compartmentalized. Need To Know trumps security clearance level.

The mofo had NO IDEA what he was really was working on. Guaranteed. That's how this shit works.

All he did was tell our enemies what tech we are working on, not why, or how, or when, or where.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Sure, whatever they want is fine with me. I've got nothing to hide from them so I don't really care what they're watching. Just like I've said before, there are more worthwhile people to watch that want to do dumb stuff to the state, or at least rant about it online so they can impress other computer nerds, that are worth watching and maybe carting away to summer camp.
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You want to be judged 24/7? Because that is what you're giving them permission to do if you don't mind being watched in the privacy of your own home.
 
Ididar said:
Apologist? I think they're both assholes. I'm pointing out that the debate quickly becomes an Obama vs Bush argument instead of the reality that is all the people are bitching about Obama or Bush while ignoring that the very representative they have in congress that they voted for supported the legislation. So, they won't take responsibility themselves for voting for a guy that supported it ... so they blame the President(s). You really missed the point.
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No, the point is that both Bush AND Obama had the opportunity to put that shit in the waste bin by vetoing it. After a veto the only way it can become law is a 75% vote in both the house and senate which pretty much kills it. Neither did the right thing because they're both salivating at the thought of more power. So, yeah, they deserve every finger being pointed at them right now.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Yup, thanks for the big font. Where's the word "privacy" again in that?
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Let me get this straight.
If someone demanded to see your personal financial paperwork and records of your phone usage you would say "Sure, those things are for public record".

BS. You would say "Hell no, those are my personal PRIVATE information and you have no business with it!"
 
Qinsp said:
Your phones have NEVER been private. Ever.
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The phones are not private from a technical perspective as obviously lots of folks at the telco have access to your phone logs, but the phones have ALWAYS been private when it comes to the government accessing this information.

What the government has done now is say that as a matter of national security they need access to all of this info and probable cause is no longer necessary to rummage through your life.

I see the technical appeal of analyzing all this data. You literally need to have access to all of it to be able to discern pattern and correlate patters to additional information you may have to draw some sort of conclusion about a person. I understand how it works conceptually and the benefit such analysis provides to law enforcement.

HOWEVER, in a democracy we trade a small amount of insecurity (exposure to criminal activity) for personal freedom. We accept that the price we pay for constitutional freedoms and personal privacy is that we will never be 100% safe.

If you want to be 100% safe you need to live in a surveillance society run by a police state, and even then it's not 100%. I don't want to live in a place like that, and I don't want to have elected officials sign off on such plans. So I will do the only thing that I can do and not vote for those who authorized this level of government spying.
 
Qinsp said:
Your phones have NEVER been private. Ever.

That is the history of telecommunications. It has caught serial killers, spies, murderers, child molesters, terrorists, etc.

.
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YES! Why stop there?! Think about how many more serial killers, spies, murderers, child molesters, terrorists can be caught if we just go ahead and do random house searches?!

We can just randomly drop SWAT in neighborhoods, blow doors open and search their computer harddrives, belongings, underwear. Doesn't matter if they are innocent and got nothing to hide, we have to make sure. Just think about how many criminals we can catch then?!

If they are truly innocent, then they done America a service by letting the police just randomly search them. It's the American way.
 
Regarding the Constitution and enumerated rights, the rights enumerated within the Constitution are not the only rights a citizen should lay claim to. There are rights that belong to all free men and women at birth. They are called, Natural Rights.

We know this to be true because it was written by the founders of this nation.

"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
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I don't know about anyone else, but privacy is essential to liberty. I can't picture a galaxy where Jefferson, Washington, John Adams, and the rest of the signers would forsake privacy.

He'll, they'd just waged a revolutionary war due in part to privacy invasions committed under the stamp act.
 
I love how people say that encrypted cell phones were not intended to be a secure and private medium. What the Fuck is it, a c.b. radio? Fucking technocratic semantics.
 
I might have something suspicious in my poop, maybe they should browse my poops from now on. Seriously though, anyone thinking the gov doing more and more (intrusive) spying is okay are fucking stupid or nuts.

Obama ran on gov transparency being a serious issue needing public attention but then just attacks whistleblowers and hides more issues under the BS excuse of "national security" once elected. POS politicians doing it and stupid citizens accepting it.
 
amddragonpc said:
You want to be judged 24/7? Because that is what you're giving them permission to do if you don't mind being watched in the privacy of your own home.
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If a government agency suspects me of doing something sinister, I'd prefer they watch me all the time so they can figure out that I'm not up to no good. So yeah, that totally includes my own home. They can watch me hug my cat and hang out on my couch with a good book and some hot tea so they know I'm okay.

Dr. Righteous said:
Let me get this straight.
If someone demanded to see your personal financial paperwork and records of your phone usage you would say "Sure, those things are for public record".

BS. You would say "Hell no, those are my personal PRIVATE information and you have no business with it!"
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I would happily turn over that stuff to someone who is investigating me. I wouldn't give it to any random person, but someone in an alphabet soup agency or whatever can have them and that's fine with me.
 
Showing others, you're the example of nuts or stupid or both. :D

Example:
If a government agency suspects me of doing something sinister
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It (he) doesn't even absorb they're doing all this spying whether they 'suspect' you of anything at all. They're just spying and collecting ALL information they can and WILL use it at a later time...for anything whatsoever!
 
MasonD said:
Showing others, you're the example of nuts or stupid or both. :D

Example:

It (he) doesn't even absorb they're doing all this spying whether they 'suspect' you of anything at all. They're just spying and collecting ALL information they can and WILL use it at a later time...for anything whatsoever!
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So just don't do something dumb that requires this collected information to get used against you. It's really only a problem for people who are up to no good anyhow.
 
So always do what the government tells you is good and right. Got it.

I wonder how that has worked out for anyone that is not a white land owning male over the past 250 years. You are willing to accept that the government always acts ethnically and morally although history tells you otherwise. Please, go submit to your overlords while the rest of us actually think.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
So just don't do something dumb that requires this collected information to get used against you. It's really only a problem for people who are up to no good anyhow.
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What if I'm bootlegging 3D printer material and then one day it becomes illegal to operate a 3D printer goop distillery, but I don't get the memo?
 
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