I sold a 680 SC on [H], is this just?

Status
Not open for further replies.
When ever you have the first problem with someone you tell them to ship it back to you right away. This is your lesson on that. Then you refund them the money, typically you lose shipping and that's your lesson to not screw up, and they also lose some shipping which is motivation to not be to damn picky.

I have just found in general that if I ship out a working product and people are having trivial problems with it, they usually aren't competent, are over picky or don't know something and you don't want that person making more decision or changing screws etc...
 
If you sold that card to me I'd feel the same way like I've been tricked. A SC card is a different design than reference, it doesn't matter if it clocks better or not.
 
Bomber18 said:
I think the buyer is absolutely right here. You claim the hardware is something else in the title and no where in the post make clear the actual model number. You can't build a hackntosh and sell it as a mac.

I'd suggest offering the buyer a full refund and if it's too late for that know you deserve the bad feedback and learn to be more truthful in your listings.
Click to expand...

Yep, frankly I would read that listing 100% as the guy selling an eVGA superclocked model, not a reference vanilla with a modded bios at those clocks. The description is deceptive, hands down. I would, as others have said, I'd apologize profusely, rude buyer or not, and offer a refund + return, or a partial refund as compensation for the difference in the product you delivered, particularly since you know for a fact that the card was not a genuine superclocked and that it was not something people would have realized through how you worded it (intentionally or not).

By the way, the reason he's probably asking for $35 back is that 20 is the cost difference, and 15 is what he said he paid in shipping to eVGA for an RMA. Which, it is indeed possible you (inadvertently) stripped a screw while reinstalling the reference stuff. For such a minor detail, I wouldn't rule out that you just didn't notice, and it was an honest mistake.
 
5150Joker said:
First of all, the card works fine and is on the stock EVGA 680 bios it came with (I could make a video showing this easily). It does not however take a 680 SC bios. Secondly, I could post the entire PM conversation here but I'm not sure if HardOCP forums allow that or not. You know full well you were unwilling to compromise and flat out refused a partial refund.

And again, why wouldn't I RMA the card to EVGA? Did you mention it was stock 680 and not an SC? Nope. So what you originally mailed me and what I got back is immaterial, the fact is that both cards were vanilla 680 thus you should accept the vanilla 680 back and offer a full refund. Everyone here is calling you on it because what you did was deceptive and you're still refusing to own up to it and instead are placing the blame on me. I'm not a mind reader and no reasonable person should expect that.
Click to expand...

Why shouldn't you RMA it:
You don't get it do you? Does the term 'REFLASHED' mean anything to you? If not then google it.

As far as the refund is concerned, I wasn't willing to given one via PM and I'm still not willing to give one now. I'm not acting all 'goody goody' only because I'm talking on public forums. The actual refund would have only been possible if I was actually getting my own card back, but that's a goner.
 
Illyria89 said:
I'm not trying to defend myself in this reply, but on OCN, only one bios holds these clocks and with the power limit to 150%:

EVGA GTX680 SuperClock
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to hide)
Modded firmware
GPU Clock - 1111
Boost Clock - 1176
Memory - 1700
Power target - 150%
Fan Speed - 0% to 100%
Click to expand...

Illyria89 said:
Why shouldn't you RMA it:
You don't get it do you? Does the term 'REFLASHED' mean anything to you? If not then google it.

As far as the refund is concerned, I wasn't willing to given one via PM and I'm still not willing to give one now. I'm not acting all 'goody goody' only because I'm talking on public forums. The actual refund would have only been possible if I was actually getting my own card back, but that's a goner.
Click to expand...

You're still making excuses... take this as a lesson. You were in the wrong here... make it right. :). And, he would be sending you back the same card you sent him, model-wise, replaced directly by the manufacturer, so that argument doesn't hold much water.
 
So the card is not a 680 SC? Sounds like the buyer wanted a 680 SC and that's what you lead him to believe he was buying, but that's not what he got.
 
GoldenTiger said:
You're still making excuses... take this as a lesson. You were in the wrong here... make it right. :). And, he would be sending you back the same card you sent him, model-wise.
Click to expand...

I've already learnt my lesson, that's the not the problem anymore. The problem is the damage that the buyer did can't be undone now.
 
Illyria89 said:
Why shouldn't you RMA it:
You don't get it do you? Does the term 'REFLASHED' mean anything to you? If not then google it.

As far as the refund is concerned, I wasn't willing to given one via PM and I'm still not willing to give one now. I'm not acting all 'goody goody' only because I'm talking on public forums. The actual refund would have only been possible if I was actually getting my own card back, but that's a goner.
Click to expand...

I'd suggest the buyer send in a dispute with paypal for the full amount paid, and if approved just send you the card he has back. It's what I woudl do.

Bottom line. You sold him a SC. It's not a SC. You are in the wrong.
 
Illyria89 said:
Why shouldn't you RMA it:
You don't get it do you? Does the term 'REFLASHED' mean anything to you? If not then google it.

As far as the refund is concerned, I wasn't willing to given one via PM and I'm still not willing to give one now. I'm not acting all 'goody goody' only because I'm talking on public forums. The actual refund would have only been possible if I was actually getting my own card back, but that's a goner.
Click to expand...

You don't have to act "goody goody", this will just serve as a good public warning to everyone out there not to deal with you or think twice before they do. As for the rest, we'll see what PayPal says.

Illyria89 said:
I've already learnt my lesson, that's the not the problem anymore. The problem is the damage that the buyer did can't be undone now.
Click to expand...

What "damage"? Getting back a card in better condition than the one you sent me from the manufacturer?:rolleyes:
 
Just added Illyria89 to my no trade list.

Reflash basically means rewrite with no modifications. if your FS thread said Flashed to SC ok then buyer fault. But in the thread title you CLEARLY listed 680 SC and go on to say "reflash" SC bios.

So anyone (including me) would be thinking you just reflashed to a updated SC version.

End of story. OP is at fault.
 
LOCO LAPTOP said:
Just added Illyria89 to my no trade list.

Reflash basically means rewrite with no modifications. if your FS thread said Flashed to SC ok then buyer fault. But in the thread title you CLEARLY listed 680 SC and go on to say "reflash" SC bios.

So anyone (including me) would be thinking you just reflashed to a updated SC version.

End of story. OP is at fault.
Click to expand...

Not to sound like a stickler, but if someone takes the time to actually read the full post the whole "reflashed" bit... should have been a no-brainer to "anyone". Of course if you purchase Dell's on the regular, then go onto an enthusiast pc site in their classies, you might be mistaken in thinking what it is.

That's how I see it at least. However..... The thread TITLE, should certainly NOT have read 680 SC, that is for sure.

But my point is, he goes on to say he reflashed SC bios for better results in clocks. My mind at least, tells me if you had an SC, you won't be reflashing it.... Unless maybe to SSC/FTW?



Of course I think this whole thing is more like 2 kids fighting like little girls in a classroom, but ah well :p

*JERRY JERRY JERRY*
 
sobe88 said:
Not to sound like a stickler, but if someone takes the time to actually read the full post the whole "reflashed" bit... should have been a no-brainer to "anyone". Of course if you purchase Dell's on the regular, then go onto an enthusiast pc site in their classies, you might be mistaken in thinking what it is.

That's how I see it at least. However..... The thread TITLE, should certainly NOT have read 680 SC, that is for sure.

But my point is, he goes on to say he reflashed SC bios for better results in clocks. My mind at least, tells me if you had an SC, you won't be reflashing it.... Unless maybe to SSC/FTW?



Of course I think this whole thing is more like 2 kids fighting like little girls in a classroom, but ah well :p

*JERRY JERRY JERRY*
Click to expand...


Why would you flash from one SC to another? One reason can be to unlock voltages or up the power limit (which he mentions is 150%). That is what I assumed he had done and thought nothing further of it.
 
Last edited:
LOCO LAPTOP said:
So anyone (including me) would be thinking you just reflashed to a updated SC version
Click to expand...

I actually just flashed my 670SC with a modded 670SC bios with higher power % and higher core voltage. Reading the FS thread, I would think this is what happened. Not that a vanilla card was flashed.

I think it's foolish to assume someone gets what you mean when you don't state it clearly.

edit

5150Joker said:
Why would you flash from one SC to another? One reason can be to unlock voltages or up the power limit (which me mentions is 150%). That is what I assumed he had done and thought nothing further of it.
Click to expand...

Yup.
 
added to no trade list, dishonest and then unwilling to make things right.
 
LOCO LAPTOP said:
Just added Illyria89 to my no trade list.

Reflash basically means rewrite with no modifications. if your FS thread said Flashed to SC ok then buyer fault. But in the thread title you CLEARLY listed 680 SC and go on to say "reflash" SC bios.

So anyone (including me) would be thinking you just reflashed to a updated SC version.

End of story. OP is at fault.
Click to expand...

This.

Even this thread title the seller is claiming to have sold a 680 SC, it was NOT a 680 SC it was a 680 vanilla flashed to SC.

Seller is misleading.

To the buyer.

If the seller does not wish to refund you the money and you send him the card EVGA sent to you, then I recommend you informing Paypal of the difference in model/SKU numbers between a reference 680 from EVGA vs the SKUs from the SC from EVGA. They are not the same product.
 
Seller, the right thing to do in this situation is to apologize for the misunderstanding. Then, offer either a) a full refund and take the card back (yes, the new one evga sent) or b) offer a partial refund of the difference in value between a reference card and an SC card.

For option b, it is up to the buyer if they want the partial refund. If they do not, then the right thing to do is take the card back for a full refund.

Yeah, it sucks that you will lose ~$20 in shipping it back and forth. However, these FST forums are not "Buyer beware". They are built on the trust between members that the average H user is tech savvy enough to know their gear that they are selling, and disclose any and all pertinent information about condition and history.

I am sure that you would not be happy having paid $X premium for what you thought was a top end card, only to receive a standard card that someone set to run over factory default specs.
 
The buyer is asking for more than the $20 difference though, and a $15 RMA just for replacing one stripped screw? Are you freaking kidding me?

I see both the seller and the buyer being extremely unreasonable. buyer rushing things way too fast, doing a dispute before negotiations have even really started, and asking way too much for compensation. Buyer also said that he's escalated this to a claim less than 2 and a half hours after this thread started. Seller made an honest mistake, explained his reasoning as to why he labeled it as such, and is now learning why that is wrong. Seller clearly didn't know this beforehand, and (probably) won't do this again. I don't see why you're all jumping on the seller for what appears to be an honest mistake, and trying to deal with a semi-unreasonable buyer?

Seller was in the wrong for mislabeling? Yes. Does he appear to try and make amends? It appears so. Is the buyer cooperating? It appears not.
 
Tsumi said:
The buyer is asking for more than the $20 difference though, and a $15 RMA just for replacing one stripped screw? Are you freaking kidding me?

I see both the seller and the buyer being extremely unreasonable. buyer rushing things way too fast, doing a dispute before negotiations have even really started, and asking way too much for compensation. Buyer also said that he's escalated this to a claim less than 2 and a half hours after this thread started. Seller made an honest mistake, explained his reasoning as to why he labeled it as such, and is now learning why that is wrong. Seller clearly didn't know this beforehand, and (probably) won't do this again. I don't see why you're all jumping on the seller for what appears to be an honest mistake, and trying to deal with a semi-unreasonable buyer?

Seller was in the wrong for mislabeling? Yes. Does he appear to try and make amends? It appears so. Is the buyer cooperating? It appears not.
Click to expand...

Not cooperating? I asked the guy for a partial refund and he flat out refused and that's when the dispute was opened with PayPal. Do you call that trying to make amends? Even if I had shipped the card to him, I'd have been out $15 in shipping. So the $35 partial I asked was hardly unreasonable or unjustified. There was absolutely no rushing on my part, he was informed of everything every step of the way and skirted his responsibility. The fault lies 100% with him for misrepresenting what he was selling and as stated in this thread by him, he really doesn't care.
 
Tsumi said:
The buyer is asking for more than the $20 difference though, and a $15 RMA just for replacing one stripped screw? Are you freaking kidding me?

I see both the seller and the buyer being extremely unreasonable. buyer rushing things way too fast, doing a dispute before negotiations have even really started, and asking way too much for compensation. Buyer also said that he's escalated this to a claim less than 2 and a half hours after this thread started. Seller made an honest mistake, explained his reasoning as to why he labeled it as such, and is now learning why that is wrong. Seller clearly didn't know this beforehand, and (probably) won't do this again. I don't see why you're all jumping on the seller for what appears to be an honest mistake, and trying to deal with a semi-unreasonable buyer?

Seller was in the wrong for mislabeling? Yes. Does he appear to try and make amends? It appears so. Is the buyer cooperating? It appears not.
Click to expand...



This part-

As far as the refund is concerned, I wasn't willing to given one via PM and I'm still not willing to give one now. I'm not acting all 'goody goody' only because I'm talking on public forums. The actual refund would have only been possible if I was actually getting my own card back, but that's a goner.
Click to expand...

tells me that the buyer is not going to get any further help from the seller.

No, the buyer should not have jumped on an RMA so quickly. However, if the seller had properly identified the card, the buyer would be happily ticking away with his new SC right now, since that is what they would have sent him.

Unfortunately, both sides have some fault here. However, the proper thing to do as the seller is what I have listed above. Anyone else in the top 1k+ heat users would agree. Yes, it sucks for the seller, but it was indeed a domino effect started by his description of the card.
 
You asked for a refund for more than the difference of the cards brand new, which should be lowered since the card is used. The most he should be offering you is $20, and the most I might have given you had I been in this situation is $15, as the price difference in used cards is less than what it is new. I may give you $20 if I was feeling generous, and you were being reasonable and respectful, but the starting of the dispute before negotiations fell apart tells me that you're being neither respectful nor reasonable.

Now, you may feel that you're entitled to more than $20 because it wasn't what you wanted, but the hard facts say that you're not.
 
Both sides seem a bit off. But just on the selling point issue.

I'm going to have to side with the buyer on this one.

The title of the sale thread was mis-leading as it was stated only as "680 SC".

The seller does have a point that it would seem weird for a 680 SC to be reflash with the 680 SC bios.

However that is where the seller fails and shouldn't assume the buyer would know.

If the buyer was perhaps someone who wasn't computer savvy they would have never known it was a reference 680 card.

I wouldn't be happy if I was the buyer in this case. It is like unlocking those AMD chips into quads/hex cores and selling them at a higher price.

Overall, it is not very good salesmanship here in the forum if you aren't being up front with the details.

The other issues like partial refund, rma, and etc is just going a bit overboard.
 
5150Joker said:
Not cooperating? I asked the guy for a partial refund and he flat out refused and that's when the dispute was opened with PayPal. Do you call that trying to make amends? Even if I had shipped the card to him, I'd have been out $15 in shipping. So the $35 partial I asked was hardly unreasonable or unjustified. There was absolutely no rushing on my part, he was informed of everything every step of the way and skirted his responsibility. The fault lies 100% with him for misrepresenting what he was selling and as stated in this thread by him, he really doesn't care.
Click to expand...

I see where you are coming from. In truth though, and of course I don't have pictures so maybe I am off base here, I am wondering why you RMA'd a card for a single screw? That itself seems a little unreasonable.

However, back to the issues. It looks like the difference between the cards on NE is $20, and the buyer claims the shipping will be $15 (RMA), so a $35 does sound somewhat reasonable and not out of line. FWIW though, many times a buyer is expected to pay return shipping, much like if you return an item to a store (and you have to pay for your gas, time, etc).
 
Asking for a partial $35 refund is not the same thing as asking for a full refund plus return shipping costs...

You either:
A. Ask for partial refund of $20, or
B. Ask for full refund plus return shipping costs.
 
Tsumi said:
Asking for a partial $35 refund is not the same thing as asking for a full refund plus return shipping costs...
Click to expand...

I did ninja edit that to clarify RMA shipping costs, so I am not sure if that is what you were referring to.
 
Mr34727 said:
I did ninja edit that to clarify RMA shipping costs, so I am not sure if that is what you were referring to.
Click to expand...

The seller was going to send him the replacement screws free of charge, it was the buyer's fault for going the RMA route, and as such he should be the one to stomach those costs.

If the seller had told the buyer to RMA the card to replace the screws, that would be a different story.
 
Tsumi said:
The seller was going to send him the replacement screws free of charge, it was the buyer's fault for going the RMA route, and as such he should be the one to stomach those costs.
Click to expand...

Yes, that is fair, I agree.
 
Even though this guy has F'ed my name on this forum and also on heatware for an honest mistake that I made, I'll put my pride on a side and offer him a $20 i.e. if he cancels the dispute first. The shipping part to EVGA he made himself without my consent or comment, so that was none of my concern. This is fair enough from my side.

Let me know in this thread only if you're interested. If $20 would change your life then be my guest and take it, it's yours.
 
Illyria89 said:
Even though this guy has F'ed my name on this forum and also on heatware for an honest mistake that I made, I'll put my pride on a side and offer him a $20 i.e. if he cancels the dispute first. The shipping part to EVGA he made himself without my consent or comment, so that was none of my concern. This is fair enough from my side.

Let me know in this thread only if you're interested. If $20 would change your life then be my guest and take it, it's yours.
Click to expand...

You're going to lose the dispute. Especially if he shows them this thread.
Reflashed is not the same as flash.
 
No, you don't ask a person to close the dispute before offering the refund. In this case, the best thing to do is contact Paypal and tell them that you have reached an agreement for a $20 partial refund, and for the buyer to do the same thing.
 
Illyria89 said:
Even though this guy has F'ed my name on this forum and also on heatware for an honest mistake that I made, I'll put my pride on a side and offer him a $20 i.e. if he cancels the dispute first. The shipping part to EVGA he made himself without my consent or comment, so that was none of my concern. This is fair enough from my side.

Let me know in this thread only if you're interested. If $20 would change your life then be my guest and take it, it's yours.
Click to expand...

You're going to lose the Paypal dispute and it is 100% your fault.

5150Joker is not going to cancel his dispute first.
 
Originally, I didn't myself know that what 'Model' this card was because it had two Model no. stickers on it as you can see clearly in the picture. Only after registering it did I really know the real model no., but then it was too late as the transaction had already been made.

Just thought I'd share this piece of information:

2013-03-28_0242.png
 
Looks like the seller is making it right here.

Seller- you'll need to do the partial refund through paypal. If the buyer accepts your offer, communicate this with paypal and they will facilitate.
 
That picture is mostly irrelevant, as now you're practically claiming you don't know what model card you bought, which I frankly find hard to believe. That only destroys your credibility...
 
KrAzYaZnFLiP808 said:
Product: EVGA GTX 680 SC
Condition: Used for less than a week in SLi, roughly. The condition is as good as new.
Accessories: Just the card itself would be included.
OC Potential: Reflashed with the SC Bios with 150% Power Limit and stock boost clock at 1228Mhz on air. Under water, it runs at 1293Mhz with the 2.12V Bios fully stable.
Pics: Pic1

Price: Sold

Please note:
- No Trades
- No Returns
- The prices represent shipping within USA only.
- Payment through PayPal
- No faulty product is being sold, all have been tested and confirmed functionality.
- I have feedback on heatware, ebay and pakgamers.

Thanks for looking.

I have read the listing, and it states it has been reflashed with SC Bios. It you dont really look for it, it could be safe to assume that you were actually getting a SC version. But, like OP said, who would reflash a SC bios, to another SC bios.
Click to expand...

Haven't read through all 4 pages yet, but responding to this response. It does say the product is an 680 SC. Reading the part about the OC potential just makes me think that he flashed it with a custom SC bios that upped the clocks. So it is kind of mis-leading.

OK, back to reading the rest of the pages.
 
Tsumi said:
That picture is mostly irrelevant, as now you're practically claiming you don't know what model card you bought, which I frankly find hard to believe. That only destroys your credibility...
Click to expand...

It's hard evidence and I bought it off ebay.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top