HP LP2475w (Possible new IPS)

krisNO said:
Does all S-IPS generate more heat than S-ips?
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Capital letters or non capitals doesn't change panel type...
And like said amount of consumed power depends mostly on backlight/its brightness which is independent from type of LCD matrix.
(in fact because of structure LCD display's backlight has to produce many times more light than what escapes from white picture)
Power supply is other heat producer, but I would think they all have quite similar efficiency.

So probably biggest factor for temperature of display is design of casing, it it's such that air circulates well heat doesn't built up but if it doesn't have good cooling then heat gets stuck inside casing and temperature of casing has to rise until balance is achieved through increased conduction to air and radiative cooling
 
Can I ask a quick question to those of you who've recieved one of these: Does the brightness control in the OSD actually dim/brighten the backlight (modulate it if you where), or is it just simulated in the on-board electronics (i.e. darker and lighter colours).
 
My screen is mild to lukewarm on top after 2-3 hours of continuous use. The sides are cooler.

philjohn said:
Does the brightness control in the OSD actually dim/brighten the backlight (modulate it if you where), or is it just simulated in the on-board electronics (i.e. darker and lighter colours).
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I am not sure how to tell the difference.
 
I meant heat generation s-ips vs s-pva.

I ask since the 'watt usage' spec wise is much higher on the HP 2475 than Dell 2408...also the stand is so much smaller on the dell. So is the image quality(don't mind lag!) about the samme on the hp and dell? Or might even be better on the dell as it is a more expensive monitor??

Tell me, how big is this HP 2475 stand, how close can the screen be to the back wall? anyone got any pictures?

(i might get the hp anyways, as the sharpness problem is non existant(disabled on hp when running digital)).
 
SevenFour said:
My screen is mild to lukewarm on top after 2-3 hours of continuous use. The sides are cooler.


I am not sure how to tell the difference.
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good rule of thumb: is the brightness range quite large, i.e. low brightness really is quite low, and high brightness is eye-searing.

Also, just out of interest, would you recommend this monitor to other people? Is it that good?
 
philjohn said:
good rule of thumb: is the brightness range quite large, i.e. low brightness really is quite low, and high brightness is eye-searing.
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My initial reaction was that it was the latter of your descriptions, i.e. lighter and darker colors. But someone else will have to confirm.
philjohn said:
Also, just out of interest, would you recommend this monitor to other people? Is it that good?
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I love it. But I am coming from a 6 year old 17" TN screen so I have no reference to compare with really. And I do not play games, so I will leave it someone else to give you a better impression.
krisNO said:
Tell me, how big is this HP 2475 stand, how close can the screen be to the back wall? anyone got any pictures?
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I wish I had the photo skills of robbiekhan, and my cameras do not do the screen any justice. Anyway, I will link two pics of the stand for you to get an idea. The stand is about 14" wide and 8.5" deep if I converted it correctly (35.5x22cm). Standing against the backwall the monitor is about 9" out.
 
An odd request, but can you measure the width of the LCD? I need to know how accurate the official specs are.. Reason I ask is this monitor may be a very tight fit on my desk, but I'm thinking about getting it... I'd like to know if I need to take a table saw to my desk or not. :p

If you could measure it left to right from edge to edge of the plastic bezel in inches and cm I would definitely appreciate it. Thanks!

P.S.
I also echo the request for more pics lol.
 
Could you help check the OSD and tell us how good are the settings and whether it can be adjusted.

- contrast

- rgb

- brightness


and what other special settings inside. Interested to know because i just bought a calibrator so want to know whether the HP is modern enough to let me tinker with all the options :D
 
SevenFour

Thanks(!). That monitor really is a beast compared to the Dell 2408wfp. With that very immense stand it feels like twice the size.

After long hours of use, does it heat up your room? Does it create alot of heat(warm on top/sides of monitor)??

KRis
 
krisNO said:
SevenFour
After long hours of use, does it heat up your room? Does it create alot of heat(warm on top/sides of monitor)??
Click to expand...

There is no difference between technologies. This is simply a factor of how high your run the backlight. Running at the same light levels all the 24" screens will produce about the same amount of heat. It doesn't matter if it is is IPS/TN/VA, it doesn't matter if the case is aluminum/plastic, it doesn't matter if the power supply is inside or a brick.

A 24" panel outputting about 140cd/m2 of light will draw about 40 watts and that will end up heating your room the same as a 40 watt bulb.

Ask 20 people how much a 40 watt bulb heats their room and you will get 20 different answers because each person/room/cooling/heating is different.
 
DarkScythe said:
If you could measure it left to right from edge to edge of the plastic bezel in inches and cm I would definitely appreciate it.
Click to expand...
55.6cm, or just slightly less ;).

Moogle Stiltzkin said:
Could you help check the OSD and tell us how good are the settings and whether it can be adjusted.
- contrast
- rgb
- brightness
Click to expand...
All those. The color menu has the following choices (I am using DVI and Custom Color): 9300K/6500K/Custom Color/sRGB/Color Saturation (grayed out)/Color Tint (grayed out). Custom color is the one where you set RGB separate for each color.
 
Argh!!! WTF is up with UK Citylink couriers? I was supposed to have mine delivered yesterday. I paid for next day shipping and guess what? Citylink lost it! They have no idea where it was delivered to. The retailer has had to send out another yesterday and guess what? I sat in all day today monitoring my front door via CCTV and NOBODY called. Then on the tracking on their website it says they tried to deliver at 4:30PM and nobody was there so they left a card. There is NO card! Nobody came! I am now going to pick it up at my local depot tonight because I am tired of this. I have complained to Citylink and the retailer. This is a nightmare. I just hope there is nothing wrong with the monitor itself after all this (and that it will fit in the car backseat in it's box).

Sorry to vent here but this is so frustrating!
 
That's the problem with CityLink, they are a franchised business and it sounds like you've got a rubbish local franchise. The one here is ok, got a really nice delivery driver who always waits for a couple of minutes before popping a card through (I've seen this for myself).
 
It's here! No bad pixels (Phew!) Damn it's bright. Makes my Dell 2007 look positively drab. Set brightness to 54 but I think it's still too bright. Blacks look good but silvery if you move your head too far like someone else posted. I don't know how to set this correctly as I have no experience with calibration so don't ask me anything technical

The stand sucks. If I push the swivel to it's fullest horizontal point it's not straight. Maybe I have the stand setup wrong I dunno. Anyhow as for the dust trap I think I will try to find something to go over it. Now I need all new 1920x1200 and above wallpapers :p

Loving it thus far. It's so bright! The colours are a bit saturated compared to the Dell. Reds are very red. Hmm. I need to read the PDF (Zzzzz).

EDIT: I knocked the brightness down to 25 and it's still to bright in ambient light. Set it to 20 now. A bit better. Will see how it goes.

EDIT2: OK now I am noticing an issue. The saturation levels are way high. Reds are too intense. Some may like it. But I feel others will not. I am unsure how this effects colour accuracy. There appears to be no way to adjust the saturation levels when attached through DVI. I have it connected to a Nvidia 7600GT. Can anyone suggest any way to reduce the saturation?
 
deadman3000 said:
I knocked the brightness down to 25 and it's still to bright in ambient light. Set it to 20 now. A bit better. Will see how it goes.
Click to expand...
I have mine at 18, I followed the instructions from one of the calibrator programs. Probably ColorEyes since I did that one last. I can barely make out the number 2 box on the black level page of the lagom.nl site, during the evening.

I read somewhere that HP was promoting this screen as a demo screen. Bright for everyone to see and easy to swivel around.

deadman3000 said:
The saturation levels are way high. Reds are too intense. Some may like it. But I feel others will not. I am unsure how this effects colour accuracy.
Click to expand...
I have been meaning to ask this (for everyone to answer), since I am a newbie at calibration. I remember reading in a review that I should calibrate towards the adobeRGB color space for a wide gamut monitor. Is there a setting for this in the calibrator program(s) that I have missed, or does this mean that I simply should not start the calibration based on the sRGB setting of the monitor?

And a second question: it seems like both ColorEyes and i1display2 have programs that load the .icc profile at startup for general Windows (XP) use? And if this is true, will enabling the profile in Firefox apply the color changes a second time?
 
deadman3000 said:
EDIT2: OK now I am noticing an issue. The saturation levels are way high. Reds are too intense. Some may like it. But I feel others will not. I am unsure how this effects colour accuracy. There appears to be no way to adjust the saturation levels when attached through DVI. I have it connected to a Nvidia 7600GT. Can anyone suggest any way to reduce the saturation?
Click to expand...

That's to be expected on a wide-gamut display, it can physically display far more greens (and some more reds) than a normal 72% gamut monitor. You need a calibraiton device for such a monitor (or someone to post an ICC profile you can start working from). If you don't want to spend too much, a Pantone Huey is the best of the "cheap" calibration devices - can be had for between £50 (ebay) and £100 (amazon).

Does the monitor seem cooler to the touch when you have it on a dimmer brightness setting?
 
Snowdog said:
There is no difference between technologies. This is simply a factor of how high your run the backlight. Running at the same light levels all the 24" screens will produce about the same amount of heat. It doesn't matter if it is is IPS/TN/VA, it doesn't matter if the case is aluminum/plastic, it doesn't matter if the power supply is inside or a brick.

A 24" panel outputting about 140cd/m2 of light will draw about 40 watts and that will end up heating your room the same as a 40 watt bulb.
Click to expand...

This is patently false. Also: hilarious. There are 24" panels that consume 30 watts and 24" panels that consume 100 watts. I assure you it does not boil down to backlighting.

Different types of panels (not only backlights) have different drive characteristics (more/less power to switch). Different implementations of different types of panels have different specs. Different drive boards will have have different power handling characteristics. There is plenty of variation.

I've run quite a number of LCD's splayed out into pieces and I can state with absolute certainty that some LCD control boards ran quite hot and others were room temperature. Add in variation amongst the quality/efficiency of the power adapters (which will magnify any down the line inefficiency) and theres quite a large potential for the same backlight and same panel at the same settings doing the same thing to consume drastically different amounts of power. This does not even cover that the various panel technologies require drastically different drive characteristics; itself a major factor in power consumption. Further, different backlights will have different efficiencies.
 
Well I can see we won't agree. But the backlight is the major power user, the control circuits are trivial in comparison. Panels vary significantly based almost entirely on the power of the backlights.

Lots of people probably have Kill-a-Watts here. Lets get some number at equal brightness like my suggested 140 cd/m2 (or minmum if your panel doesn't reach that low). I bet they are within 10 watts of each other.

myren said:
This is patently false. Also: hilarious. There are 24" panels that consume 30 watts and 24" panels that consume 100 watts.
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Seriously. What 24" LCD do you think will be anywhere near 100 watts at 140cd/m2???? That is absurd.
 
I'm slightly confused about the cables included in the box. I have no idea what a DP connector is and there is a VGA cable included even though there appears to be no VGA connection on the back? All I see are two DVI connections?

EDIT: Nevermind read up on DP and the DVI input can take a VGA signal with one of those adaptors (Strangely not included with the VGA cable).
 
deadman3000 said:
I'm slightly confused about the cables included in the box. I have no idea what a DP connector is and there is a VGA cable included even though there appears to be no VGA connection on the back? All I see are two DVI connections?

EDIT: Nevermind read up on DP and the DVI input can take a VGA signal with one of those adaptors (Strangely not included with the VGA cable).
Click to expand...

DP as in display port ? It's the newest computer connection type aimed specifically for computer devices. HDMI is more towards HDTV and other consumer electrics. HDMI was designed for that but never really had the PC in mind, although pc makers have implemented some HDMI connections inside displays and in some graphics cards.

In this day and age i don't see whether it matters if you have vga or not :X doesn't seem like an issue to me.

DVI is a must as it's the common thing used know by monitors and graphics cards. HDMI port can be used but if your graphics card doesn't have it, you can still use a hdvmi to dvi cable. Display port is rare so not sure when the high end graphics cards will start supporting eiher HDMI or display port or both.

It's useful that our pcs have hdmi because we can then use it with the PS3 which does not have display port :D


By the way normally on HDTV you see a connection called PC Input ? I think that is VGA, does anybody know ? There is no DVI on HDTVs because they weren't designed for pcs in mind. So they provide the low end PC input which crappier then DVI. However it is possible to use a HDMI to DVI connection yet again. So yet again i cannot find any use for VGA in this day and age :X


*end of rant
 
Snowdog you are a true gem. This very thread mentions two monitors that can consume over 100 watts, you may have heard of them. The HP LP2475w and the Dell 2408. Both have maximum ratings over 100 watts.
 
has anyone did a gradient test? do you see banding? i want to use this monitor for *ACCURATE* graphic design

i have a NEC 20GMWX2 and the thing has banding like hell... it sucks for photoshop
 
I believe what he is saying is that the power consumption will be lower as backlight/brightness decreases.
Yes, the maximum consumption is rated at over 100W, but as it says itself, it is the maximum. I'm not sure if there are many users here who will use their LCDs at maximum brightness (according to his argument) and routinely see people running at 20% brightness or so.

I don't have an opinion on this argument, but I believe that was his point.
 
myren said:
Snowdog you are a true gem. This very thread mentions two monitors that can consume over 100 watts, you may have heard of them. The HP LP2475w and the Dell 2408. Both have maximum ratings over 100 watts.
Click to expand...

Just curious but did you caliberate your HP LP2475w ? Did you reduce the brightness and if you did, how does the monitor feel ? Is it very hot ? And if so, does the warm air get pushed/dispersed into your face like some monitors do :confused: ?
 
Omegaslast said:
has anyone did a gradient test? do you see banding? i want to use this monitor for *ACCURATE* graphic design

i have a NEC 20GMWX2 and the thing has banding like hell... it sucks for photoshop
Click to expand...

I found this thread over at DPReview:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1004&thread=28967370&page=2

Towards the bottom of the second page, there are a bunch of banding tests in which the guy seems to indicate that the 2475W produces a smooth gradient.
 
So the only issue for the HP is the glow which is there but cannot be seen directly, but only from an angle.

Any other problems i should be aware of ?


*UPDATE


> NTSC colour gamut 102%


Hmm, I was hoping this HP is an old-school sRGB LCD screen, which behaves normally outside color-managed applications, but alas... This one will also reward its owner with over-saturated colors in Windows XP, games etc. It is high time Windows/Vista become a true color managed OS, with all these LCDs with large gamuts!

Have you been able to calibrate it to a decent screen brightness (say 120 cd/m2)? Most of the newest LCD screens are too bright, even with brightness set to 0, which will give you prints which are too dark :-[

Thanks for sharing, Bernhard
Click to expand...

Source: http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1004&message=28996153


May i know what he means about his comment ?Over saturated colors in games ? :confused:




Here is some information from the manual -


The monitor is designed to support sRGB for color management, which adapts to the color standards used in the image technology industry.

To take advantage of the sRGB support, you will need to change the monitor’s color temperature to sRGB (via the OSD) and install the sRGB color profile (ICM) file.
Click to expand...

Is SRGB the normal rgb calibration i do using my eye One 2 display ? Do i still need to use the ICM or should i use my calibrator to do the rgb, im confused.
 
I received mine today. Great display, although the colors are far more saturated than I'm used to (due to the large gamut). No pixel errors as far as I can tell.

Good thing I got this instead of the Dell 2709W I was initially planning on buying. Why? The Dell wouldn't have fit between my speakers :p (pair of Event TR-8 near-field monitors). Anyways this thing seems huge after having used 15" laptop monitors most of the time for the last 4 years...

Only annoying thing is a slight buzzing sound at a brightness of less than 40, but since 45 is quite comfortable I guess I'll be ok.
 
myren said:
Snowdog you are a true gem. This very thread mentions two monitors that can consume over 100 watts, you may have heard of them. The HP LP2475w and the Dell 2408. Both have maximum ratings over 100 watts.
Click to expand...

You don't realize how specifications are designed. This is the maximum cover your ass type spec. It may never get that high in the real world.

Go back and read my comments each time I said 140cd/m2. Can you do even basic reading comprehension. These are 400+cd/m2 displays. As I also said the brighter you go the more power you consume.

Running at 140cd/m2 these will be around 40 watts (+/- 10W) like I claimed. This is nothing to obsess over.
 
There seems to be a slight misunderstanding of LCD technology in this thread, well maybe not everyone, but most I guess.

There is definitely a polarizer on the LP2475w, as without it you wont be able to understand anything that is displayed. I wont get into too much detail here, but a quick search on avforums will get you to the basics of how a LCD displays images. The only question is the type of polarizer used, which most of us waiting for this release from HP to be A-TW (Advanced True Wide) polarizer. The one that is used by eizo and nec.

Contradictory information seems to be polluting the net about this display, one of which that the display model is LPL LM240WU4; a LG. Philips LCD panel model that went into production in 2008. Some sites as the one I will give below identifies the panel as using the A-TW polarizer:

http://lcdtech.no-ip.info/en/data/monitor.lcd.panels.htm

On the other hand users are reporting the white-glow issue that was a problem with IPS panels with inferior polarizers. This, unfortunately, will make this panel dreadful for people who were expecting to use it for graphic and color sensitive work as the screen is quite large. It would not have been a problem if the screen we were talking about was 19" or lower as the angle of vision would have been enough, but on a 24" its pretty close and the a slight movement to either side might make the glow visible.

The only way, and I ask kindly, is for people who have bought this monitor to post some pictures of the viewing angles and also maybe of the screen texture (a shot that will require a macro lens). If users can give us that much it would be great.
 
When it's dark I may try to take some photos if I can. I have a good macro mode on my camera too.

BTW this site is excellent for testing your LCD thoroughly.

http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/

I noted on the black level test I was not able to see a number of squares. I was using an sRGB color profile and also in Firefox 3. I switched back to the color profile included on the CD and I was then able to see most of the black squares. I also have the monitor set to sRGB mode and set the brightness to 54.

Not being very knowledgeable about this stuff I can see that I will need to do some reading up on color profiles and calibration. That site looks like a good site to work my way through.
 
Well after reading the last few pages I think this is definitely the new leader on the "a lot less than a rent cheque" display with a huge plethora of inputs. Count me in when it arrives in Canada. I will scan the distributors to see when and how much it comes in at in September. My only concern is the wide gamut aspect which to me can be a problem if it can't be addressed to an extent internally (to the monitor) because I don't just want to rely on a color profile being forced down a video card's LUTs (which are reset for 3D games).

In regards to wattage/heat etc... there are a number of factors that come into play here. One is operating brightness, another is panel technology, a third can also be power supply efficiency. A fourth can be panel size. Try checking what a 30" can consume. That's a lot of light produced and a lot of power wasted in heat.

All panels are light blockers with a polarizer film on top that is a "color filter". The more light a panel blocks, the more powerful a backlight must be, and the more wattage it consumes. Often "better blacks" can be associated with better light blocking, but this is not always the case, though it may sometimes be the case. I know, I'm confused too :)

But that's when we get into how good a panel blocks light both on and off angles. TNs block everything very well from "below viewing angles" and poorly from above for an easily viewed example.

In regards to this, both S-IPS and MVA/PVA are known to consume more power than TN though it is not directly correlated to brightness but relative, yet operating a monitor at 140cdm/2 (white) brightness vs. one at 300 WILL lower the power consumption by quite a bit. This is why Digitalversus will show a monitor at 100 vs. 200 cdm/2 and the related power consumption for each 100% white brightness level. My personal preference is 140 cdm/2 in normal conditions and 160 on a bright day (with a window behind me).

I'm also speaking of this without talking about dynamic contrast which (due to backlight pulsing and changes) can use far more power than using static/native contrast.

For example my MVA monitor runs as hot as my H-IPS monitor, but it is 25 cdm2 brighter, and likely uses as much power even though it is 24" vs. a 26". So I guess the question here is, if you are running the monitor in a room at 24 celsius, how much hotter will the back or front of the monitor be above ambient?

Also, all screens have a polarizer, it's just that the polarizer in NEC screens and some other IPS monitors are A-TW (advanced true white) polarizers which effectively filter out the white glow effect from off-angles (as well as some other characteristics including aiding off-angle contrast). BUT, keep in mind, if you go off angle on a Dell 2408WFP with an S-PVA panel you WILL see a white glow, as is customary of most PVA and MVA panels I have viewed.

A good example of understanding the "power of the polarizer" can be when viewing polarized, vs. non-polarized sunglasses.

On angle my BenQ MVA panel is similar in blacks to my NEC LCD2690 but off-angle the NEC is far superior. Another way where the IPS panels are superior is that with lighter colors (even without A-TW polarizers) they do not suffer from off angle washout where all colors seem to wash strongly towards white like MVA/PVA panels (or in some cases yellow). Older S-IPS had a bit of brightness reduction and "purple" blacks off angle due to different/older polarizers.

Anyway, sorry for my bull5h1t lecture, but I just wanted to help explain as best as possible, even though I'm probably wrong on a few fronts here (due to fairly incomplete knowledge).

EDIT: I guess the 2408WFP is a big power hog for size. Compared to a 2709W which is bigger it uses less at 100 cdm/2 but MORE at 200 cdm/2.

http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=88&mo1=342&p1=3161&ma2=88&mo2=390&p2=3609&ph=14
 
I'm also stronly considering buying this piece of equipment. I'm currently working on a Iiayama 19" wich has served me well over the years, but is beginning to show some strange behaviour. As I just bought a new camera (Canon EOS 450D), my budget is quite limited, but as I am working as a visual artist in photography, illustration and (3D) Animation, I'm looking for a monitor wich gives me great colors and usability.

I wanted to thank all the users wich have generously tested the monitor in every way imaginable. But the thing that's not entirely clear is, how the in-monitor sRGB works. Is the result bearable in non color managed applications? I'm not sure if apps like 3d Studio Max and Adobe Premiere are color managed, and it's defenitely an important issue. I expect that with the current explosion of wide gamut screens the major software players will eventually all include color management, but until then I need my monitor to not oversaturate every non color managed program I use.

From what I hear Mac OS X is more Wide Gamut friendly then Windows (XP?). Well, to make a long story even longer.. How do you rate the sRGB setting of the monitor (I read that it's in option on the OSD?).
 
10e said:
EDIT: I guess the 2408WFP is a big power hog for size. Compared to a 2709W which is bigger it uses less at 100 cdm/2 but MORE at 200 cdm/2.
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=88&mo1=342&p1=3161&ma2=88&mo2=390&p2=3609&ph=14
Click to expand...

Unfortunately their results are pretty much useless unless they have a sensible calibration that lowers the brightness with backlight control instead of panel blocking.

For instance the 24" NEC TN screen using 20 watts more than the dell 2408 at 100cd/m2. But I expect that is a calibration issue. Running the backlight hot and using panel blocking to lower brightness. How does this factor with TN using less power?
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=88&mo1=342&p1=3161&ma2=52&ph=14

Or how about the Lacie 26" IPS ties the Dell at 100cd/m2 and uses much less at 200cd/m2... Actually the 26" Lacie IPS uses much less power than the 24" TN NEC across the board.
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=88&mo1=342&p1=3161&ma2=89&ph=14

Wasn't the Premise that IPS uses more than PVA, which uses more than TN?

I see zero correlation between panel type and power usage, and heavy correlation between display brightness/modulation and power usage.

Final nail in coffin of how useless their measurments are:
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=52&mo1=368&p1=3408&ma2=89&mo2=383&p2=3574&ph=14
Same monitor with a different name on the front. Uses significantly more power in NEC guise?


I would rather see power figures for 0%,25%, 50%, 100% backlight to see what is really going here. Throw in unblocked luminance levels to boot and you would have a real indication of lumens/watt.
 
h3ndrix said:
Contradictory information seems to be polluting the net about this display, one of which that the display model is LPL LM240WU4; a LG. Philips LCD panel model that went into production in 2008.
Click to expand...

That's what it says in the service menu. I'm sure it's accurate ;)
 
I have no doubts that its accurate. You can check all you want though, but the problem is not in the listed panel model; neither the pdf nor the website mentions anything about the A-TW polarizer, which is the only part that concerns me. Until I get to see the photos of the viewing angles I really cant be sure if its go or no go.
 
h3ndrix said:
On the other hand users are reporting the white-glow issue that was a problem with IPS panels with inferior polarizers. This, unfortunately, will make this panel dreadful for people who were expecting to use it for graphic and color sensitive work as the screen is quite large.
Click to expand...

This an example of how a particular sort of statements are "polluting the net about this display".
It has never been a problem.
People will continue to do their "graphic and color sensitive work " as they did before.
 
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