How is the Vp191b for gaming really

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falcon26

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 21, 2005
Messages
128
I wanted to take the plunge and get rid of my 3 year old crt 19 inch. I play BF2 alot and was wondering how well the viewsonic vp191b does with games in particular BF2? I tried a friends LCD that had 16ms response time, and on his when I would turn quickly it would blur alot. How does the viewsonic hold up in this reguard? I can get the monitor for about $430 out the door. I want to pair it with my new BFG 7800 GTX. Any input would be great :)


Thanks, Falcon26
 
I also forgot to ask, how is the vp191b out of its native resolution? Say 1024x768. Does it still look ok at this res?


Thanks, falcon26
 
Well,. I went from a Viewsonic 19in Viewsonic P95f+ CRT to a VP191P LCD and I keep asking my self why didn’t I do this earlier. I mainly play battlefield 2 and could not be happier no ghosting and the game looks amazing and yes I have a 7800gtx. The only thing is you have to play in the native resolution of 1280x1024. LCD is the way to go and the VP191P performs flawlessly, I aslo like all the deskspace I have now and less heat and its also easier on the eyes
 
Well I ordered it :) The place where I got it from has a good return policy so if I don't like it, I can return it without a loss. THe LCD my friend had btw was a samsung 930B how does the viewsonic compare to that one :) Because I didn't like that one at all.


Falcon26
 
Isn't the 930B an 8ms monitor? If you weren't happy with how it performs in games, I doubt you'll like the VP191B. Hopefully I'm wrong :)
 
Dam I never thought of that :-( What a dummy. Well now I don't know weather to cancel the order or not. Maybe I'll give it a try and see, I've got nothing to lose.


falcon26
 
you will be happy, its rated as one of the best gaming lcd's. There is NO ghosting in BF2
 
I got one, my friend has got one...the things are the best out there. Don't be fooled...these are probably the best gaming LCDs.
 
the samsung 193p+ is also another good option. I have no ghosting when I play games. The screen looks great out of its native res.

Also, THERE IS NO backlight leakage issue and blackis really black. these 193p+ are really well built. when i compare the black of my screen on vs when it's off in a dark room, it is practically identical. :eek: :eek:
 
One thing I have always wondered was why do all the gaming conventions still aboout 95% of the time still use CRT monitors as opposed to LCD's?



falcon26
 
What is the contrast on the vp191b? I've seen some sites say 600:1 and some say 800:1 which is it?


falcon26
 
falcon26 said:
One thing I have always wondered was why do all the gaming conventions still aboout 95% of the time still use CRT monitors as opposed to LCD's?



falcon26
Click to expand...

CRT's despite being an older technology, still produce the most accurate final result without any fuss. I'm considering switching to TFT but am well aware that CRT's are still superior (a good quality one that is)
 
Yeah its very hard to find a good crt now. Almost no stores online or offline have a big selection. Most companies have stopped making them. I just hope that the viewsonic is better than my 930SB. Some people I have spoke to say CRT blow away LCD's at games hands down, and that no matter what LCD you get it will suck for games. Then they are people who say the exact opposite of that. So I've decided to try one out for myself and be the judge. We'll find out within the next couple of days just how good a LCD is when playing games, in my opinion of course :)


falcon26
 
falcon26 said:
Yeah its very hard to find a good crt now. Almost no stores online or offline have a big selection. Most companies have stopped making them. I just hope that the viewsonic is better than my 930SB. Some people I have spoke to say CRT blow away LCD's at games hands down, and that no matter what LCD you get it will suck for games. Then they are people who say the exact opposite of that. So I've decided to try one out for myself and be the judge. We'll find out within the next couple of days just how good a LCD is when playing games, in my opinion of course :)


falcon26
Click to expand...

I just ordered the viewsonic vp191b will be here tomorrow. Its my first lcd as well, i really hope im not let down.

Crts will probably be hard to find new by the end of the year, newegg still sells a decent selection but nothing really high end.
Zipzoomfly doesnt even sell them anymore.
 
I have the LG 1980Q. No ghosting or motion blur in any games. I did try the Samsung 204T but it had bad motion blur and screen door effect.
 
For those of you getting their vp191b's tommorrow if you wouldn't mind post a quick review if you have time :)

Thanks, falcon26
 
falcon26 said:
Yeah its very hard to find a good crt now. Almost no stores online or offline have a big selection. Most companies have stopped making them. I just hope that the viewsonic is better than my 930SB. Some people I have spoke to say CRT blow away LCD's at games hands down, and that no matter what LCD you get it will suck for games. Then they are people who say the exact opposite of that. So I've decided to try one out for myself and be the judge. We'll find out within the next couple of days just how good a LCD is when playing games, in my opinion of course :)


falcon26
Click to expand...

Good luck with that. .I basicly went through the same thing but after running the LCD (2001FP) next to my G520P CRT for 3 weeks I ended up returning the LCD for various reasons.

A good CRT definately offers the best image quality and flexibility.
 
falcon26 said:
Can I ask what reasons made you return the LCD?
Click to expand...

It was my first LCD purchase so I wasn't really sure what to expect, My initial impression was very good when I first saw the desktop appear on the LCD , it was very bright & vibrant with crisp text clarity(Although it almost seemed TO bright) So far it was looking better than the CRT.

After loading my first game (Half Life 2) I witnessed the first negative on the LCD , Slight motion blur effect..it wasn't bad but noticeable with the CRT sitting next to it(clone mode), framerates just didn't look as smooth on it either, Then as I entered dark areas in the game I noticed the LCD had a washed out look , black levels didn't look black but instead they had a more grayish appearance ,I tried correcting this using the monitors brightness control,in game and video card gamma/brightness/contrast settings(6800 GT 256mb)..none of it really helped, The CRT on the other hand maintained pitch black levels.

Doom 3 looked really bad on the LCD because of this.I took a pic but my camera settings weren't ideal ,the LCD didn't look THAT bad in person in fact it was very sharp without the overbright contrast you see in the shot ,but you can get a general idea of the black level difference.

I didn't think being stuck at 1600x1200 (native resolution) would be a big deal ,I'm used to running this res on the Desktop with my CRT for the last 2 yrs,but Gaming wise there's a few games I would run at 1280x960, However when I tried this on the LCD (1280x1024) the motion blur became noticeably worse due to scaling, Image quality actually looked pretty good still but the extra blur made it unusable for fast paced FPS action ,Seeing the LCD struggle at this res while the CRT maintained a crisp / motion blur free output was a bit disappointing.

Viewing angles on the LCD were pretty good but I noticed you had to be looking directly at it ,any slight shift to the left or right would cause the screen to start changing brightness and appear more washed out.. Of course the CRT has no viewing angle restrictions.

I noticed a slight input lag on the LCD side, for example whenever I'd open or close windows I would see the window open a split second sooner on the CRT, This delay was noticeable during gaming as well. I do a lot of online FPS gaming so I wasn't to pleased with this. I decided to try two CRT's to see if this lag still existed, I connected my Sony HDTV CRT to the same DVI input the LCD was using and the input lag was gone..so the lag had to exist somewhere in the LCD itself.. Shame.

I have an ATI HDTV Wonder card and although HD looked pretty nice on the LCD @ 1600x1200 it looked even better on the CRT when running the proper 1080i (1920x1080) resolution , Not a huge deal being I'd normally run the hdtv wonder output to my hdtv via DVI.

Grayscale was another issue ..I noticed on the extreme bottom end the LCD would just go flat ,Im guessing this is due to its poor contrast ratio (400:1) , Certain details in my digital camera photos were lost on the LCD because of it. I also noticed a slight dithering effect (banding of color rather than a smooth transition) on certain images / games which didn't occur on the CRT.

Wow did I type all that lol , Anyhow ..that pretty much sums up my first LCD experience ... Hopefully yours will be better. :)
 
I checked the THG website regarding Overdrive and it says the vp191b has an 8 ms response time in g2g only. Does this mean vp191b's ghosting is on par with the Samsung 193P+ ( which also has 8 ms g2g and some people are saying it ghosts )? Are there any 19 inch panels with a genuine, non-overdriven 8 ms response time that is not restricted to g2g?

If money is no issue, which panel should one get?
 
"...wanted to take the plunge and get rid of my 3 year old crt 19 inch"

Seriously, you are best off replacing the old CRT with a new, high-quality CRT. They may be 'old' technology, but they are still the best tool for the task (gaming).
 
falcon26 said:
What is the contrast on the vp191b? I've seen some sites say 600:1 and some say 800:1 which is it?


falcon26
Click to expand...

It's 800:1 600:1 was the older version with 16ms panel.
 
Thought I'd chime in here, since I just sent my VP191 back to Dell.

This was my first LCD purchase (previously used a 19" Trinitron CRT) and since I play a lot of first person shooters I wanted to make sure I got the "best" LCD I could find for response times. Playing BF2 was great. I wouldn't say that it was any better than a CRT (actually, LCDs to me all have a grainy look to them so I'd actually say there was a loss in picture quality) but there was no lag, no ghosting, bright and dark areas were all clear and viewable, and the text was readable. I played it at native res, but the 1024x768 mode didn't look too terrible either (I'd still stick to full res).

Half-Life 2 was a completely different story. My theory about this monitor is that if you play a game that has the right balance of colors, then the monitor will shine. Parts of HL2 were just as wonderful to play on the LCD as BF2, but there were parts that ghosted so badly that it was completely and inexcusably distracting. Basically it was any area where there was an edge between solid black and beige or dark red. When you moved your view, the black areas would bleed or just seem to copy themselves onto the lighter areas. The results were either double-exposure looking images, or very blurred edges. Like I said, it didn't happen all the time, but when it did you really noticed it.

I noticed the same effect actually scrolling through these forums. If I grabbed the scroll bar and scrolled the forum header around (the part with the red background that says "Thread", "Thread Starter", "Last Post", etc) I saw an after image of that header that was clear enough that I could read the text on it. Scrolling around some of the images taken of the space station on the recent shuttle trip, I would see stars disappear completely as the black space around it bled over the star field.

Now my friend has a Dell 2001FP, and he didn't notice a lot of these blurring effects on his panel. I had the VP191 plugged in through the DVI port on my 6800 GT, and I know I had the 8ms model, so I'm pretty sure these ghosting issues are specific to this panel (or just more apparent than on others).

So the LCD went back, and once I get my refund I will be purchasing another CRT. My theory is that in another 3 years they'll have the LCD tech up to CRT quality (as far as response time) so that will be the best time to change.
 
Errrr I didn't need to hear that :-( But like I said we'll see. Actually their's more nays then yeas on lcd's for gaming now but I will give it a try.........



Falcon26
 
Well you said that you play mostly BF2, and I loved playing BF2 on that monitor. Had that been the only game I played, I wouldn't have returned it. Just be aware that there may be some drawbacks when playing other games. The only way to tell if you're okay with it is to try it and weigh the pros and cons.
 
That is true :) So I'll have it tommorrow and I'll give it a shot and report back here :) Thanks for all the input guys....



Falcon26
 
DigitalEdge said:
you will be happy, its rated as one of the best gaming lcd's. There is NO ghosting in BF2
Click to expand...



Not true! While minimal, ALL current LCD's ghost a little compared to a fast CRT. If the guy did not like the Samsung 930B, I seriously doubt the VP191 will be any better for gaming as far as IQ. I love my samsung LCD,and that is coming from a 21" Trinitron, so don't tell me I am biased. The LCD ghosts some compared to the cRT. Period.
 
falcon26 said:
Question just how fast are crt monitors in terms of response time?


Falcon26
Click to expand...

Most sites will say negligible other say just below 1MS , Basicly there is no notable lag wich is why you never see response times listed on CRT specifications.

Same goes for Contrast Ratio , LCD's are known for having weak black levels so a higher contrast ratio is important (generaly the higher the ratio the deeper the black levels)

Heres one chart showing how CRT's contrast ratios compare, they used a new (Iiyama) and an aged CRT (Sony 200sx) to show the loss of brightness over time as they age (lcds will do this as well) But even the aged CRT had a higher ratio than any of the LCDs.
 
So it seems to me the only benefit lcd's have over crt's is their footprint is smaller. Oh and they use less power. But for everything else, colors picture games crt are better. At least that's what it sounds like. So if crt's were thin like lcd's than crt's would be alot better.


falcon26
 
falcon26 said:
So it seems to me the only benefit lcd's have over crt's is their footprint is smaller. Oh and they use less power. But for everything else, colors picture games crt are better. At least that's what it sounds like. So if crt's were thin like lcd's than crt's would be alot better.


falcon26
Click to expand...

The one advantage I saw when using my LCD was text clarity, even tho Ive never had problems reading text on my CRT @ 1600x1200, the LCD's text was just cleaner / crisper and generaly easier to read at the same 1600x resolution..so basicly if you were someone wanting a display for office work / web browsing / forums etc. and not really gaming then I'd recommend LCD.
 
falcon26 said:
So it seems to me the only benefit lcd's have over crt's is their footprint is smaller.
Click to expand...

Don't forget flicker. Some people can't stand CRTs because of that. Personally if I couldn't run a CRT at 85 hz or higher I'd be a total LCD convert. This is especially important for those long gaming sessions.

The ability to run a signal through a DVI output is nice since you don't have to adjust for geometry, no matter what resolution you run it at.

Plus, never underestimate the style factor. Once you put that LCD on your desk, even before you turn it on, you won't want to ever get rid of it. Trust me, had I bought the 24 inch Dell flat panel I probably would have never sent it back no matter how much I hated it. ;)
 
How does flicker work? I mean at 85hz on a crt I see no flicker what so ever and its great on my eyes. On the lcd's here at work their at 60hz and it kills my eyes. So what is the difference in hz on a crt vs. an lcd?
 
Ive always ran at least 85hz on this CRT and flicker / eye strain has never been an issue.
 
falcon26 said:
How does flicker work? I mean at 85hz on a crt I see no flicker what so ever and its great on my eyes. On the lcd's here at work their at 60hz and it kills my eyes. So what is the difference in hz on a crt vs. an lcd?
Click to expand...

As the article above shows, LCDs and CRTs update their screens differently. With a CRT, if you want a pixel to light up you shoot it with an electron beam. The phosphorous on the pixel glows for a split second emitting the light that you see, then immediately fades to black. At 60hz, it draws the screen 60 times per second, with a brand new image on each cycle (since the old one would just fade away). The issue here is that in the time between each update the phosphorous fades, and the screen darkens. Then the next update comes, and the screen updates to full brighness. At a slow rate, this light->falloff->light change appears as a constant flicker. Higher refresh rates cut the amount that the phosphorous fades, so the flickering is less severe. At a high enough rate your eye doesn't notice the flicker, but this rate varies from person to person.

LCDs don't update this way. The backlight in an LCD is constantly on, and the LCD pixels act as shutters to control how much light comes through. (This, incidentally, is why black levels in LCDs aren't as good as CRTs. A single LCD pixel can never become completely opaque, so it can never block all of the backlight from bleeding through. With a CRT, if you don't hit the pixel with a beam, it doesn't emit any light -- hence, black.) All this response time stuff deals with how quickly the LCD pixel can change from one state to the next, allowing different amounts of light through it. The hz setting for an LCD just tells the computer how often it wants to retrieve information for what to display: 60hz means "give me 60 images per second, and I'll draw them as fast as I can move my little shutters". If a pixel value hasn't changed, however, the shutter doesn't move. Since there is no falloff in brightness, the flickering that you see is dependent on the quality of the backlight of the display. It's basically a fluorescent light, and better quality lights flicker less than bad ones. Changing to 75hz on an LCD shouldn't affect flickering, but it may generate smoother looking motion if your LCD is fast enough.
 
just go my vp191b and have to say im impresed, with it so far. No dead pixels :)

I havent got to game with it yet but noticed bf2 doesnt have an option for 1280x1024 which kinda bothers me.

The blacks look good after a few quick adjustments, however they arent as good as my crt, but that doesnt bother me.

im off to game!
 
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