How is Nintendo successful?

Armenius

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Indeed. Sony used to make a great product, they had games I'd want to play. Now days? I don't even bother. They make shit. Or rather, the industry makes shit?
The PS5 is the fastest selling console in history. The PS4 sold nearly 90 million units worldwide, and they stopped making them long before the 12 years the original PlayStation continued to be produced. The PS3 is Sony's worst selling console in their history and they still sold over 60 million of them. That is saying nothing of quality, but Sony's exclusives have been lauded by community and critic alike during both Gen 8 and now Gen 9. Popular opinion seems to be that Sony is making a great product, with the software to support it.
 

Bigbacon

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Seriously Nintendo could drop out of hardware and make a killing on their IPs just smashing them out to every platform imaginable or they would make MASSIVE deals with one party to be exclusive. I feel they are leaving so much money on the table only dealing with their own hardware. they would make more money just distributing games than they ever would with hardware.
 
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Saying the N64 flopped is demonstrably false. It still sold 3.5 times as much as the Saturn. (32 million vs. 9 million).
 

Chris_B

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I don't know if anyone was ready for Sony back in the 90's. The N64 smacked Sega around, but Sony was playing a different game than everyone else. Plus, there was a certain level of polish to the PlayStation that captured casual and serious gamers. The PS2 kept that going. I don't recall hearing or thinking anything negative about Sony (videogame-wise at least) until the PS3. I don't know if that was negative so much as just Microsoft brining something really good (maybe better) to the table at the same time.


Sony may not have even got into the gaming arena had it not been for their short collaboration with Nintendo who ditched them for Phillips when they were working on the cd drive addon that never appeared. Even the name "PlayStation" was what Sony was going to call their hybrid version of the console. Nintendo just seemed to develop the super cd as an answer to Sega but the Sega mega cd was a massive turd that never had many games anyway so the super cd basically got canned.

There was reportedly a rift that developed between Nintendo and Sony when Nintendo ditched them, you could say the PlayStation was a form of revenge as well for the shenanigans that ensued..
 

Axman

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I don't know if anyone was ready for Sony back in the 90's. The N64 went out and smacked Sega around, but Sony was playing a different game than everyone else.

The Playstation targeted young adult kids and actual adult young men and women. By the time I was in college I didn't know anyone who didn't own a Playstation or Playstation 2. Even PC gamers.

However, the main drive for Nintendo today is nostalgia and parenting. That's why they don't bother with any conventional marketing, and that's why their properties are so critical.

I think Nintendo is on a knife's edge, to be honest. All they have to do is screw up the Mario or Zelda universes and it will all fall apart. Do I think they're dumb enough to botch either or both of those franchises?

Normally, I'd say no, but just look at Disney right now. And CBS. It's almost like companies are looking for ways to tank their IPs.

Nvidia is forcing them onto next-gen hardware, which is good, but will cut into Nintendo's margins based on their previous business model. I wouldn't be shocked if they decide to shake up some other parts of their business models and IPs.
 

Nytegard

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Saying the N64 flopped is demonstrably false. It still sold 3.5 times as much as the Saturn. (32 million vs. 9 million).
The NES sold ~60 million. The SNES sold ~50 million. When your latest console only sells 2/3s of what your previous one does, yes, it is a flop by their standards. It's not about how they sold compared to Sega. Now, take into account there actually were more people buying video games then too, compared to 1985, where video games were all but considered dead due to the video game crash, and this makes the N64 look even worse. Plus, the NES didn't even really sell at all in Europe, whereas the N64 did. In roughly 10 years, Nintendo lost half it's audience. In no way, shape, nor form, is losing half your business considered a successful business approach.

The N64 was not a success. The reason why people think it was, was more likely due to people being young at the time, and growing up with it, with other children around also having one too.
 

Krenum

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The NES sold ~60 million. The SNES sold ~50 million. When your latest console only sells 2/3s of what your previous one does, yes, it is a flop by their standards. It's not about how they sold compared to Sega. Now, take into account there actually were more people buying video games then too, compared to 1985, where video games were all but considered dead due to the video game crash, and this makes the N64 look even worse. Plus, the NES didn't even really sell at all in Europe, whereas the N64 did. In roughly 10 years, Nintendo lost half it's audience. In no way, shape, nor form, is losing half your business considered a successful business approach.

The N64 was not a success. The reason why people think it was, was more likely due to people being young at the time, and growing up with it, with other children around also having one too.
numbers wise, it wasn't a success but it sure was fun! It had GREAT games, in the end for the consumer that's all that matters.
 

Axman

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When your latest console only sells 2/3s of what your previous one does, yes, it is a flop by their standards.

The NES had a North American sales period of 10 years. The Super Nintendo was on the market for 8 years. The N64 was only on the market for less than 6 years.

That's practically selling as well as the previous two consoles. Not flop territory by a long shot.

Nintendo ended the N64 because of the GameCube, and that was sort of a flop, but at the same time, Nintendo was transitioning to handhelds, and the DS crushed it.
 

Nytegard

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The NES had a North American sales period of 10 years. The Super Nintendo was on the market for 8 years. The N64 was only on the market for less than 6 years.

That's practically selling as well as the previous two consoles. Not flop territory by a long shot.

Nintendo ended the N64 because of the GameCube, and that was sort of a flop, but at the same time, Nintendo was transitioning to handhelds, and the DS crushed it.
And how many units were they selling in 1995?

In 1991, which is a 6 year life span, the NES had sold 30 million units in the USA alone, 50+ million world wide. By the end of it's life span in 1995, it had sold 34 million in all of North America. So, add an extra 4 years and now include Canada and Mexico for an extra 4 million units. Similarly, the PS2 was discontinued in 2013 (13 years later), but the bulk of it's sales happened early. Like with the Genesis and Sega, the N64 was basically saved via North America alone. And in Japan, where Nintendo cares about most, being it's home base, the N64 sold only 5 million units in it's lifetime compared to 20 million Famicom units.

And prior to the DS, Nintendo already was dominating the handheld market with the Game Boy. Sony was never really able to break into this market, nor were Nokia, Sega, Atari, etc.

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/finance/hard_soft/

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1101902/unit-sales-n64-switch-region/

Popular Mechanics, Dec. 1991:
https://books.google.com/books?id=puMDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA75&dq=snk+neo+geo+million&ei=VWb5SZXXEpGuzQTRmtTEAw&client=firefox-a&hl=en#v=onepage&q=snk neo geo million&f=false
 
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Axman

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And how many units were they selling in 1995?

It's not really relevant when we're comparing the long tail of sales for all of the consoles. However, if you lop off those long tails, and only focus on the years where the consoles were then-current, then the N64 will look even better since its relevance was all that much shorter.

I'm not a Nintendo fan. If anything, I kind of dislike their products. But I'm not going to throw shade at the N64.
 

Flogger23m

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The PS5 is the fastest selling console in history. The PS4 sold nearly 90 million units worldwide, and they stopped making them long before the 12 years the original PlayStation continued to be produced. The PS3 is Sony's worst selling console in their history and they still sold over 60 million of them. That is saying nothing of quality, but Sony's exclusives have been lauded by community and critic alike during both Gen 8 and now Gen 9. Popular opinion seems to be that Sony is making a great product, with the software to support it.

PS4 will end up becoming the 3rd best selling console in history, surpassing Gameboy sales. I'm sure the PS5 may be able to top that. But the shortages do make me wonder if that will hamper its overall sales. Shortages seem like they will continue well into next year.
 

Derangel

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Seriously Nintendo could drop out of hardware and make a killing on their IPs just smashing them out to every platform imaginable or they would make MASSIVE deals with one party to be exclusive. I feel they are leaving so much money on the table only dealing with their own hardware. they would make more money just distributing games than they ever would with hardware.

Yes, I'm sure you know more than everyone single person at Nintendo.
 

ZodaEX

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The PS5 is the fastest selling console in history. The PS4 sold nearly 90 million units worldwide, and they stopped making them long before the 12 years the original PlayStation continued to be produced. The PS3 is Sony's worst selling console in their history and they still sold over 60 million of them. That is saying nothing of quality, but Sony's exclusives have been lauded by community and critic alike during both Gen 8 and now Gen 9. Popular opinion seems to be that Sony is making a great product, with the software to support it.

You're wrong. The Sony PS-TV sold worse than the PS3. Way to repaint history there
 

Armenius

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And how many units were they selling in 1995?

In 1991, which is a 6 year life span, the NES had sold 30 million units in the USA alone, 50+ million world wide. By the end of it's life span in 1995, it had sold 34 million in all of North America. So, add an extra 4 years and now include Canada and Mexico for an extra 4 million units. Similarly, the PS2 was discontinued in 2013 (13 years later), but the bulk of it's sales happened early. Like with the Genesis and Sega, the N64 was basically saved via North America alone. And in Japan, where Nintendo cares about most, being it's home base, the N64 sold only 5 million units in it's lifetime compared to 20 million Famicom units.

And prior to the DS, Nintendo already was dominating the handheld market with the Game Boy. Sony was never really able to break into this market, nor were Nokia, Sega, Atari, etc.

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/finance/hard_soft/
Nintendo's own published data in your link only goes back to FY'98, so I'd like to know where your annual numbers are coming from.
 

toast0

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How exactly is Nintendo behind in terms of online?

Have you seen what it takes to get two kids together online in Splatoon 2? It's primitive. Tetris 99 and Mario 35 (rip) take forever to get a round started, even after the match making is done.

Re: BigBacon's proposal to make Nintendo software only, I think that's really not a good position to be in for Nintendo. Sega did that, but only because they ran their console business into the ground (with help from EA refusing to support Dreamcast and Sony hyping the PS2's DVD player, but the Saturn disaster set the stage), but what was the last Sega game you were excited about? Owning a platform means you can showcase your games in a way that Sony or Microsoft won't, but it also means you can tailor your platform if needed.
 

SeymourGore

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Big factor for Nintendo's success is their family friendly platform. I've got a 6 year old and setting up a Switch for him was a breeze. It was easy to setup the hardware for him to use on his own: no inappropriate content, no unauthorized purchases; And he's easily able to navigate the UI. I originally wanted to set him up with an Xbox (and take advantage of Game Pass) but what a gong show that was. Puzzle-like interface, login restrictions were the biggest headaches.
 

chameleoneel

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How is Nintendo successful when they're consistently behind the times, from not using CDs to having bad online?
1. Historically, its games and/or game series which are all time staples of gaming. Nintendo's games sell REALLY well.

2. Recently, its still games. with Switch in particular, they seem to be selling relatively better than ever. Nintendo games have dominated Amazon's top 10 for about 3 years. And that should also be a good indicator for how well the digital sales are.

3.providing something which no one else does: portability. The portable aspect translates well to a lot of games. and allows people to play real games, portably. That's a big deal.

4. last but not least, costs less. and doesn't need a TV. So, people also do not need a second TV, in order to allow someone else to watch TV shows. Making the attached costs even lower.
 
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1. Historically, its games and/or game series which are all time staples of gaming. Nintendo's games sell REALLY well.

2. Recently, its still games. with Switch in particular, they seem to be selling relatively better than ever. Nintendo games have dominated Amazon's top 10 for about 3 years. And that should also be a good indicator for how well the digital sales are.

3.providing something which no one else does: portability. The portable aspect translates well to a lot of games. and allows people to play real games, portably. That's a big deal.

4. last but not least, costs less. and doesn't need a TV. So, people also do not need a second TV, in order to allow someone else to watch TV shows. Making the attached costs even lower.

How is costing less a good thing? Haven't you ever heard the saying, "You get what you pay for"? Nintendo should make a more powerful and expensive console.
 

Axman

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Nintendo should make a more powerful and expensive console.

That is contrary to their business model. Nintendo is the only console maker that sells their hardware at an up-front profit. Everyone else takes a loss, at least with their first and often even second revisions, only to turn profits on their long tail sales. The only initial profits they make is through licensing with game developers.

We'll see if that changes with the Ampere Switch.
 

UnknownSouljer

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They are successful because they are making a product that people want. Bottom line.

<sidetangent>
Basically take business 101. Marketing is the practice of finding out what the customer wants/needs and producing a product to meet that want/need. Which is a very different understanding that consumers have. They think that marketing is effectively advertising. Those two words aren't synonymous. When someone says they're marketing towards a specific group: it means they are producing a product to meet the need of a specific group. Used in any other context is incorrect.
</sidetangent>

So if your 'version' of 'what people want' doesn't include what Nintendo is doing, then you are out of sync with the demands of the market that Nintendo is reaching. Clearly the market Nintendo serves doesn't care about your definition of "behind the times", and they don't care about what you think is necessary from a technology or power perspective.

There is zero reason for Nintendo to change their model to meet your definition. Why make a more powerful console that costs more when they already are selling a less powerful, less expensive console that they can't even keep in stock? Why move from a model that is making them a ton of money to one that would make them less?
 

LukeTbk

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Seriously Nintendo could drop out of hardware and make a killing on their IPs just smashing them out to every platform imaginable or they would make MASSIVE deals with one party to be exclusive. I feel they are leaving so much money on the table only dealing with their own hardware. they would make more money just distributing games than they ever would with hardware.

I am not sure who well decades down the line their IPs would be doing without the Hardware side, maybe short term, but hardware change are in part of the new generation of those IPs and having giant console base that have good support for those IPs and not the others is synergetic.

But we are talking about one of the biggest hardware sellers in the world, that sells often over 100m units of is consoles and the giant moat that come from that to enter a world of high competition and little moat is quite risky.
 

chameleoneel

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How is costing less a good thing? Haven't you ever heard the saying, "You get what you pay for"? Nintendo should make a more powerful and expensive console.
What you get, in this case, seems to be enough for tens of millions of people.

And as I mentioned, the costing less aspect is also reflected in not requiring a TV. And if you don't want TV capability at all......there is a $200 Switch Lite.

By this point, it seems clear that Nintendo isn't interested in doing a mid-gen hardware update, like Sony and MS did with the Playstion 4 Pro and Xbox One X. Instead, they are doubling/tripling down on the portable aspect, with an even better screen. The portable aspect is really important, for Switch and many of its customers.
 

Axman

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By this point, it seems clear that Nintendo isn't interested in doing a mid-gen hardware update

No, they wanted Nvidia to keep making the old chips. Nvidia is forcing Nintendo to update by discontinuing production.
 

Denpepe

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2. Recently, its still games. with Switch in particular, they seem to be selling relatively better than ever. Nintendo games have dominated Amazon's top 10 for about 3 years. And that should also be a good indicator for how well the digital sales are.

A lot of the nintendo games are only available on nintendo hardware while a lot of AAA games are multiplatform, they may sell more but on a wider range of hardware, amazon top 10 says little especially with digital sales taking over over physical. Take PC for example there are barely any physical sales left for the platform.
 

chameleoneel

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A lot of the nintendo games are only available on nintendo hardware while a lot of AAA games are multiplatform, they may sell more but on a wider range of hardware, amazon top 10 says little especially with digital sales taking over over physical. Take PC for example there are barely any physical sales left for the platform.
To have your games dominating the top 10 at the largest etailer in the world, does not say "little" ;)
 

inbedwithhomer

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I would like to buy and play some of Nintendo's games, but on someone else's hardware.

Their hardware is bad and has been for years.
 

UnknownSouljer

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I would like to buy and play some of Nintendo's games, but on someone else's hardware.

Their hardware is bad and has been for years.
You could've been doing that for the past 20 years. It's called a PC.
Basically what it tells me is that you're not their customer. Which is fine. However it makes zero sense for Nintendo to cater to you when clearly they are catering to a much bigger portion of the market that does like their hardware, despite your opinion.
 

Armenius

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I would like to buy and play some of Nintendo's games, but on someone else's hardware.

Their hardware is bad and has been for years.
There are Nintendo emulators up through the Switch that work well on PC. 3DS games are pretty much the only ones I still play on original hardware since 3DS emulation still isn't that good yet. It's made some good progress in the past couple years, though.
 

inbedwithhomer

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You could've been doing that for the past 20 years. It's called a PC.
Basically what it tells me is that you're not their customer. Which is fine. However it makes zero sense for Nintendo to cater to you when clearly they are catering to a much bigger portion of the market that does like their hardware, despite your opinion.
I'd like to be their customer.

Also I think it's a reach to say people truly like their hardware. People like the games, and are willing to deal with their hardware in order to play them. There's no question that the games would be objectively better on superior hardware.
 

UnknownSouljer

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I'd like to be their customer.

Also I think it's a reach to say people truly like their hardware. People like the games, and are willing to deal with their hardware in order to play them.
“Most people” by which we mean not traditional, not hardcore gamers, don’t see much of a difference between a game console and a toaster oven or any appliance with one job.
There's no question that the games would be objectively better on superior hardware.
This is the one that gets argued a bunch and that isn’t really true either. For what Nintendo makes, you really wouldn’t get them to be better on ‘better hardware’. You’d just get a prettier picture.

I refer you back to the statement you quoted: you’re not their customer. If you want m04r graphics there are already two console makers that cater to you. If you aren’t happy with a $300 console because you want to pay $600 for some reason - you’re not who they’re after.

There is no value for them in making Link look real, and indeed if any of their remakes have shown us anything, they’re more than happy at their current graphical level - and when given a huge amount of rumors about a “Switch Pro” can’t even be bothered to make Switch games in 4K or a console to support it.
 

ZodaEX

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I'd like to be their customer.

Also I think it's a reach to say people truly like their hardware. People like the games, and are willing to deal with their hardware in order to play them. There's no question that the games would be objectively better on superior hardware.

It's not a reach what so ever. I'm a people and I preferred their hardware many times over the competition. The SNES is my second favorite piece of hardware ever. And dispite the PS2 being more powerful than the N64 in 2001, I still preferred the N64 hardware over the ps2's because of the 4 controllers ports and it's higher number of 4 player games. You sound like you think the world revolves around you and just you're own preferences. But in reality it doesn't. People are different and not everyone wants the same thing as you.
 

Denpepe

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This is the one that gets argued a bunch and that isn’t really true either. For what Nintendo makes, you really wouldn’t get them to be better on ‘better hardware’. You’d just get a prettier picture.

I refer you back to the statement you quoted: you’re not their customer. If you want m04r graphics there are already two console makers that cater to you. If you aren’t happy with a $300 console because you want to pay $600 for some reason - you’re not who they’re after.

There is no value for them in making Link look real, and indeed if any of their remakes have shown us anything, they’re more than happy at their current graphical level - and when given a huge amount of rumors about a “Switch Pro” can’t even be bothered to make Switch games in 4K or a console to support it.

While what you say may be true, as I said b4 they get very limited AAA 3rd party support due to their weak hardware, if their hardware was up to snuff they could make tons more money from all the extra games they could sell while they keep churning out the same games they do now.

So far I bought 3 nintendo consoles in my life, an old 2nd hand Snes I got to play some of the better RPG's on that were nintendo exclusives, a 3DS XL and a switch, I was not interested in any others due to their outdated cartridge based hardware or gimmicks based consoles like the Wii.

But more power to them to keep going the way they do, seems the shareholders don't want more money then they are getting now
 

defaultluser

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Dropping Shovelware on the market, and just using marketing plus platform lock-in to convince Parents to drop their pants "just one moar time, I swear"

There are two dozen different Mario Party game, all of which are identical. There are several dozen 3d Mario games, all of which are barely different

They keep delaying their new expensive-to-make, with uncertain returns games to once every 5-10 years (Zelda, Metroid Prime, Xenoblade), while still pumping out tons of trash like Pokemon, Mario Cart, Animal Crossing and Smash Brothers (all easy to make slightly-different rebadges of the previous version)

This is why Nintendo will always be massively successful; , most of the sheep continue to Bray about another delayed major title, but then to make themselves feel better about being conned once-again, they salve their problems by buying other shovelware - even if its not their cup-of tea, because you have no other choice
 
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Choopyplz

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Dropping Shovelware on the market, and just using marketing plus platform lock-in to convince Parents to drop their pants "just one moar time, I swear"

There are two dozen different Mario Party game, all of which are identical. There are several dozen 3d Mario games, all of which are barely different

They keep delaying their new expensive-to-make, with uncertain returns games to once every 5-10 years (Zelda, Metroid Prime, Xenoblade), while still pumping out tons of Pokemon, Mario Cart, Animal Crossing and Smash Brothers (all easy to make slightly-different rebadges of the previous version)

Nothing in this post is accurate.
 
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