erek
[H]F Junkie
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2005
- Messages
- 10,786
"After a lot of testing, even I can confirm what other reviewers have reported during the Zen 3 launch: AMD has beaten Intel in gaming performance. But only in a best-case scenario, using fast memory, and with the latest graphics architecture. Now of course that is a reasonable requirement. People building a new next-gen machine or who upgrade to a new processor will probably buy a new graphics card, too. Memory speeds have been an open debate on Ryzen since 1st gen, so I'm hoping that people are aware enough that they won't pair their new shiny Zen 3 CPU with a single-channel DDR4-2400 memory kit, just because that's what fit their budget, or because they thought they found a good deal on memory.
On the other hand, AMD's wonderful AM4 platform makes upgrades very easy, because of the wide compatibility with previous generations. This makes it likely that gamers upgrade their processor independent from the rest of the hardware—possibly upgrading just the CPU, while keeping slower memory and an older graphics card. In these cases the gains will still be substantial, especially in application performance, but don't expect that you're 100% guaranteed to beat a Core i9-10900K. But does beating Intel even matter, in this scenario? You're still gaining a lot, with a relatively small investment. Any performance differences vs Intel's top CPU will be impossible to spot even in a blind side-by-side test, and you've saved a lot of money in the process—don't worry about that last one percent!
I could also imagine some gamers hoping that plopping in a Zen 3 processor will magically give them more FPS in their AAA gaming experiences. That might be true for cases where a very strong GPU is paired with light titles, like CS:GO or other MOBA style games. But in that case you have effectively wasted money on the graphics card—a weaker GPU would have achieved nearly the same performance, at much better cost. In what we typically call "GPU limited", even though it actually is "highly or mostly GPU limited", you will see much smaller gains, that vary wildly between titles, depending on how much of a bottleneck the GPU is—don't expect more than a few percent.
I'm also relieved that I found out what was "wrong" with my Zen 3 gaming performance results—nothing. I simply tested in a scenario that's not the most favorable for AMD. I have been using these exact same settings, methodology, games etc for quite a while, in over 30 CPU reviews for both AMD and Intel, so claiming that I deliberately cherry picked to make AMD look bad are far fetched. I'm more than happy that we now have a situation where both players have to innovate, or keep innovating to stay competitive—this is the best scenario for us consumers—companies fighting neck-to-neck means better products at better prices for the customer.
Are the other reviews wrong then? Nope, they are perfectly fine. Especially in the context of a CPU review it makes perfect sense to test in a more CPU limited scenario and skip resolutions like 1440p and 4K, or use lower settings to put more stress on the CPU. If everyone tested the same thing, results would be identical and you wouldn't have to look at multiple sources for your buying decision. Now, if at that point, companies manage to influence how we conduct our reviews, then they would have won—being able to hide what you should know about the product, before spending your hard earned cash on it.
For my future processor reviews I'll definitely upgrade to Ampere, or RDNA2 if that turns out to be the more popular choice on the market. I'm also thinking about upping the memory speeds a bit, DDR4-3600 seems like a good balance between cost and performance. I doubt I'll pick DDR4-3800 or 4000 just because AMD runs faster with it—guess I'll still get flak from the AMD fanboys. I also have many ideas for new tests, in the realm of applications, gaming and beyond. I expect this new CPU test bench will be ready in early 2021—I have a lot of processors to retest, stay tuned. Zen 3 for VGA reviews? I'm tempted and considering it, but not decided yet.
I'm definitely not finished with gaming performance on Zen 3. My next steps will be to investigate why there is a significant performance difference between AMD and Intel in certain cases, and how to overcome it. I feel like beating Intel in these cases is possible with Zen 3, with small tweaks or fixes.
If you have ideas, suggestions or requests, do let me know in the comments please."
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-10900k-vs-amd-5900x-gaming-performance/
On the other hand, AMD's wonderful AM4 platform makes upgrades very easy, because of the wide compatibility with previous generations. This makes it likely that gamers upgrade their processor independent from the rest of the hardware—possibly upgrading just the CPU, while keeping slower memory and an older graphics card. In these cases the gains will still be substantial, especially in application performance, but don't expect that you're 100% guaranteed to beat a Core i9-10900K. But does beating Intel even matter, in this scenario? You're still gaining a lot, with a relatively small investment. Any performance differences vs Intel's top CPU will be impossible to spot even in a blind side-by-side test, and you've saved a lot of money in the process—don't worry about that last one percent!
I could also imagine some gamers hoping that plopping in a Zen 3 processor will magically give them more FPS in their AAA gaming experiences. That might be true for cases where a very strong GPU is paired with light titles, like CS:GO or other MOBA style games. But in that case you have effectively wasted money on the graphics card—a weaker GPU would have achieved nearly the same performance, at much better cost. In what we typically call "GPU limited", even though it actually is "highly or mostly GPU limited", you will see much smaller gains, that vary wildly between titles, depending on how much of a bottleneck the GPU is—don't expect more than a few percent.
I'm also relieved that I found out what was "wrong" with my Zen 3 gaming performance results—nothing. I simply tested in a scenario that's not the most favorable for AMD. I have been using these exact same settings, methodology, games etc for quite a while, in over 30 CPU reviews for both AMD and Intel, so claiming that I deliberately cherry picked to make AMD look bad are far fetched. I'm more than happy that we now have a situation where both players have to innovate, or keep innovating to stay competitive—this is the best scenario for us consumers—companies fighting neck-to-neck means better products at better prices for the customer.
Are the other reviews wrong then? Nope, they are perfectly fine. Especially in the context of a CPU review it makes perfect sense to test in a more CPU limited scenario and skip resolutions like 1440p and 4K, or use lower settings to put more stress on the CPU. If everyone tested the same thing, results would be identical and you wouldn't have to look at multiple sources for your buying decision. Now, if at that point, companies manage to influence how we conduct our reviews, then they would have won—being able to hide what you should know about the product, before spending your hard earned cash on it.
For my future processor reviews I'll definitely upgrade to Ampere, or RDNA2 if that turns out to be the more popular choice on the market. I'm also thinking about upping the memory speeds a bit, DDR4-3600 seems like a good balance between cost and performance. I doubt I'll pick DDR4-3800 or 4000 just because AMD runs faster with it—guess I'll still get flak from the AMD fanboys. I also have many ideas for new tests, in the realm of applications, gaming and beyond. I expect this new CPU test bench will be ready in early 2021—I have a lot of processors to retest, stay tuned. Zen 3 for VGA reviews? I'm tempted and considering it, but not decided yet.
I'm definitely not finished with gaming performance on Zen 3. My next steps will be to investigate why there is a significant performance difference between AMD and Intel in certain cases, and how to overcome it. I feel like beating Intel in these cases is possible with Zen 3, with small tweaks or fixes.
If you have ideas, suggestions or requests, do let me know in the comments please."
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-10900k-vs-amd-5900x-gaming-performance/