How Immersive are VR Games?

FrgMstr

FrgMstr

Just Plain Mean
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Today marks the second time I went to lean on a piece of VR furniture in the real world. And I am not talking like I thought I could touch something.....I went to lean on it to hold my weight and damn near ate floor....again.
 
I know exactly what you mean, I get tired and for a moment you think "let me just sit or lean on that". It also gets a bit disconcerting sometimes when you get too close to things and the objects pass through where your body should be.
 
Too much standing...I think I might grab a chair and sit down while I take pot-shots in the H3VR range next time. :p
 
If you guys make such mistakes, or, to put it in another words, if your minds become so certain about the VR objects, then I think I'd really like to try this stuff.

Has anyone tried playing flight sims using this technology? specifically, flying from the cockpit perspective, flipping switches and the like.
 
I keep wanting to put my Vive controllers down on various in-games tables etc. I haven't actually dropped one, yet, but frequently come very close!
 
Would putting a real card table or 6' banquet table ($50 @ Costco) out as a "brace" be workable for pool?
 
I think card tables are 3'x3' & typical banquet tables are 3'x6'.

How critical would this be when the USA pool table is 4'x8'?

I imagine you could easily drag the table to where it is needed, even while "blinded" by the headset.
 
michalrz said:
If you guys make such mistakes, or, to put it in another words, if your minds become so certain about the VR objects, then I think I'd really like to try this stuff.

Has anyone tried playing flight sims using this technology? specifically, flying from the cockpit perspective, flipping switches and the like.
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That is THE reason why I own a VR HMD (Oculus Rift CV1 in my case), right there. Nothing puts your head in the cockpit quite like VR. Monitor + TrackIR gaming feels so flat and unimmersive now.

Seriously, go fire up DCS World and witness how cramped it really is to be sitting in one of those pits, surrounded by switches everywhere. If the resolution isn't quite cutting it, just lean in a bit. If the buttons are blocked off by a center stick or something else, just lean around the obstruction. If you're lining up a target in your gunsights (particularly with the WWII-era aircraft), lean up against that virtual chin cushion for a better view to the kill. It's that immersive.

You'll also gain newfound respect for actual combat pilots quickly the moment you have to check your six, since you'll really be craning your head and upper body around to look back! It's much more of a workout compared to using the TrackIR, but one I can tolerate since I also don't have to put up with TrackIR jitter or the tracking clips going out of camera FOV. It's even accurate enough to let me use helmet-mounted sighting systems effectively, which helps a lot with the Ka-50 and Russian jets that can equip R-73s.

Incidentally, having to contort yourself so much to look toward the rear makes it even more important to have an ergonomic pit build; desktop placement does NOT cut it! You might lose your grip on the stick as you're looking back.

As for flipping switches, I still need to reach for the mouse or give up a few HOTAS binds to click 'em. It would've been nice if they implemented support for the Oculus Remote to provide mouse input, seeing as it's light and convenient to keep in an easily-reachable spot compared to a mouse, while HOTAS switches are at a premium if you're flying something like the A-10C and need every bind you can get.

FSX with FlyInside supports the Leap Motion camera for clickable cockpits, but I don't have a Leap Motion to test it out with. I would like to try it out, but then I have to keep it strapped to my Rift CV1 while thinking about where else I'm going to run the additional cable. (Unlike the Vive and Rift DK2, the CV1 lacks a standard USB port passthrough.)
 
NamelessPFG said:
That is THE reason why I own a VR HMD (Oculus Rift CV1 in my case), right there. Nothing puts your head in the cockpit quite like VR. Monitor + TrackIR gaming feels so flat and unimmersive now.

Seriously, go fire up DCS World and witness how cramped it really is to be sitting in one of those pits, surrounded by switches everywhere. If the resolution isn't quite cutting it, just lean in a bit. If the buttons are blocked off by a center stick or something else, just lean around the obstruction. If you're lining up a target in your gunsights (particularly with the WWII-era aircraft), lean up against that virtual chin cushion for a better view to the kill. It's that immersive.

You'll also gain newfound respect for actual combat pilots quickly the moment you have to check your six, since you'll really be craning your head and upper body around to look back! It's much more of a workout compared to using the TrackIR, but one I can tolerate since I also don't have to put up with TrackIR jitter or the tracking clips going out of camera FOV. It's even accurate enough to let me use helmet-mounted sighting systems effectively, which helps a lot with the Ka-50 and Russian jets that can equip R-73s.

Incidentally, having to contort yourself so much to look toward the rear makes it even more important to have an ergonomic pit build; desktop placement does NOT cut it! You might lose your grip on the stick as you're looking back.

As for flipping switches, I still need to reach for the mouse or give up a few HOTAS binds to click 'em. It would've been nice if they implemented support for the Oculus Remote to provide mouse input, seeing as it's light and convenient to keep in an easily-reachable spot compared to a mouse, while HOTAS switches are at a premium if you're flying something like the A-10C and need every bind you can get.

FSX with FlyInside supports the Leap Motion camera for clickable cockpits, but I don't have a Leap Motion to test it out with. I would like to try it out, but then I have to keep it strapped to my Rift CV1 while thinking about where else I'm going to run the additional cable. (Unlike the Vive and Rift DK2, the CV1 lacks a standard USB port passthrough.)
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Thanks!

Is it weird to flip a switch without getting a tactile response?
 
Yeah flight sims are incredible in VR. I have a love it and hate it relationship with DCS world. I love it's immersive nature but I can't play it long at all. I get motion sick in like 15 minutes or sooner. But I am very sensitive and do get air sick for real. I feel exactly the same feelings as I do when I get air sick in a real plane when in VR DCS world. It is a bit weird to not get any feedback when pressing buttons but unfortunately it can't be helped. Even having a HOTAS isn't exact because you can't look down and see your hands and what they are pressing.
 
This tread makes me want to try VR. I've had no interest until now.
 
michalrz said:
Is it weird to flip a switch without getting a tactile response?
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It'd probably be weirder if I was using a Leap Motion with FlyInside FSX, but DCS doesn't even support that. You're expected to use the mouse or a couple HOTAS binds, at which point the disconnect between my physical action and in-game action doesn't make it much of a bother.

Besides, this is half the reason I haven't built a dedicated simpit. Sure, I could dedicate one to the A-10C, the Ka-50 or whatever, but I like flying a variety of aircraft, all with drastically different cockpit layouts and arrangements, some of which are even multi-seat! (To be specific, that's the Mi-8, Gazelle, and to a lesser extent, the Huey. There's also an F-14 in the works, which doesn't give the pilot any direct control over the radar like the F-15, F-16 and F/A-18 do.)
 
NamelessPFG said:
It'd probably be weirder if I was using a Leap Motion with FlyInside FSX, but DCS doesn't even support that. You're expected to use the mouse or a couple HOTAS binds, at which point the disconnect between my physical action and in-game action doesn't make it much of a bother.

Besides, this is half the reason I haven't built a dedicated simpit. Sure, I could dedicate one to the A-10C, the Ka-50 or whatever, but I like flying a variety of aircraft, all with drastically different cockpit layouts and arrangements, some of which are even multi-seat! (To be specific, that's the Mi-8, Gazelle, and to a lesser extent, the Huey. There's also an F-14 in the works, which doesn't give the pilot any direct control over the radar like the F-15, F-16 and F/A-18 do.)
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Multi seat as in two people can play, one as RIO or whatever?
 
I was playing The Lab this summer, and due to the large room space I have I was able to walk myself outside the bounds of the lab area and stand right next to the path where the forklift intermittently races by. I think I was actually trying to get the dog to play in the path and see if it could get hit. I didn't realize that the forklift actually veers suddenly in that spot and was completely taken off-guard by it driving at me. All the muscles in my body locked up, my heart did something I've never felt before, and I froze for a fraction of a second. It's surprising how physically unpleasant it is to instinctively brace for impact and have nothing actually happen - you're left very keenly aware of what your body and brain just did.

It's cool though that that sort of shock could still happen after three years of frequent VR use. I guess the main determining factor is your conscious focus - if your attention is focused on something else, your subconscious will build up a trust for the environment that it sees and lead you act/react in a natural way even though you consciously know it's not real. In development circles you still hear frequent stories of dropped controllers by trying to set them down on virtual tables.
 
I swear I could feel heat from the laser bolts in Battles of Tatooine.
 
While I have only sampled VR for about an hour and a half. When I thought I was barely moving out of my place, my buddy needed to warn me multiple times that I was ALL over his living room while playing Space Pirate Trainer. It is so easy to get lost in the game, moving, dodging, and "trying" to stay within boundaries is much harder than it looks. There was one Under Sea demo with a bunch of tiny jelly fish, where I thought one touched my arm and it startled me when I thought I registered a touch but there was none, then I bonked another jelly fish with the on screen controller and it too had startled me, my brain definitely registered that they were "real" jelly fish and I needed to be careful with them. hah! I am sure if I played more VR games that I will get used to it but the that hour and a half was pretty amazing experience overall.
 
michalrz said:
If you guys make such mistakes, or, to put it in another words, if your minds become so certain about the VR objects, then I think I'd really like to try this stuff.

Has anyone tried playing flight sims using this technology? specifically, flying from the cockpit perspective, flipping switches and the like.
Click to expand...

I play DCS A10 a lot and it's a blast being in the plane. Flipping switches is still a bit off. I use two thrustmaster mfd's and a Warthog Hotas and use those with the Rift on my face. To be honest I still don't last longer than 30 minutes before I get a bit queezy. I also have five, thirty inch monitors in a portrait 160 dergree arc that I run and that experience is also enjoyable and I can play that for hours. I think we're a few generations of hardware away from where it's perfect. Resolution needs to come up a bit. The instrument clarity is still not 100% unless I look directly at it and there's a bit of lag left that causes the queezyness. If I move my head deliberately and slow I last a lot longer. Still I enjoy it, 30 minutes at a time.
 
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Bigc208 said:
I play DCS A10 a lot and it's a blast being in the plane. Flipping switches is still a bit off. I use two thrustmaster mfd's and a Warthog Hotas and use those with the Rift on my face. To be honest I still don't last longer than 30 minutes before I get a bit queezy. I also have five, thirty inch monitors in a portrait 160 dergree arc that I run and that experience is also enjoyable and I can play that for hours. I think we're a few generations of hardware away from where it's perfect. Resolution needs to come up a bit. The instrument clarity is still not 100% unless I look directly at it and there's a bit of lag left that causes the queezyness. If I move my head deliberately and slow I last a lot longer. Still I enjoy it, 30 minutes at a time.
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So it's only the lag that makes it a problem? I wouldn't want to get sick at the store when I go try it out :)
 
I have really been considering a Vive or the like, but wonder how it works as a monitor replacement. Not for everything, just games and non-VR supported games. I have been looking at getting a 144mhz G-sync 27" and the prices are pretty damn close to a Vive ($700-1k for the monitor), as my current monitor is no gaming monitor at all and it is time for one dedicated to gaming. Anyone have experience with this? Assuming I keep my normal monitor for web/video/photoshop/text, can a VR headset cover all gaming needs or would I be better off with a proper gaming monitor?
 
BlueFireIce said:
I have really been considering a Vive or the like, but wonder how it works as a monitor replacement. Not for everything, just games and non-VR supported games. I have been looking at getting a 144mhz G-sync 27" and the prices are pretty damn close to a Vive ($700-1k for the monitor), as my current monitor is no gaming monitor at all and it is time for one dedicated to gaming. Anyone have experience with this? Assuming I keep my normal monitor for web/video/photoshop/text, can a VR headset cover all gaming needs or would I be better off with a proper gaming monitor?
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I'd say we are all least one more generation of VR tech away before you should even consider going down the monitor replacement road. It's getting close, but current VR resolution is still somewhat limiting, especially where text is concerned. Definitely will be a viable mainstream option in 5 years or less though.
 
BlueFireIce said:
I have really been considering a Vive or the like, but wonder how it works as a monitor replacement. Not for everything, just games and non-VR supported games. I have been looking at getting a 144mhz G-sync 27" and the prices are pretty damn close to a Vive ($700-1k for the monitor), as my current monitor is no gaming monitor at all and it is time for one dedicated to gaming. Anyone have experience with this? Assuming I keep my normal monitor for web/video/photoshop/text, can a VR headset cover all gaming needs or would I be better off with a proper gaming monitor?
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It can, but it won't be as clear as an actual monitor. Depends what your priorities are. If the choice came down to a gaming monitor or a vr headset, I would go for the headset, but I'm not an iq whore that freaks out of they see a jagged line or some shimmering textures here and there. I'm too worried about playing the game.
 
michalrz said:
So it's only the lag that makes it a problem? I wouldn't want to get sick at the store when I go try it out :)
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I'm a professional pilot that's been flying for over thirty years. Never gotten sick in a plane flying upside down or otherwise. As long as I keep my head still or move it slowly I do fine. The brain expects certain visual cues with head movements. If the visuals lags the movement the brain gets confused. DCS A10 is all close to the ground and is more succeptible to it than flying high in a Mig 29. Dogfights are a blast. Bit of a workout though. Using Track IR you move a lot less. With the Rift I'm constantly trying to look behind me and that gets tiring after awhile.

My wife gets sick while reading maps in the car or sitting in the back of a bus. She put the Rift on for a few minutes and got sick while flying straight and level at 30000 ft the moment she moved her head.

If you experience motion sickness frequently in real life or have a bad equilibrium, make sure you're seated when doing the demo.
 
Thew more you can engage the senses, the more immersive the experience. At best we have Sight and sound. But we're missing quite a lot of experience.

Touch, Smell, Gravity forces.

After being at the demo for Oculus, man, made me a believer. I'd jump right into getting a headset if I didn't have a 780. I could see myself loving driving simulators.
 
I have a Note 4 phone & my kid suggested I TRY this: dscvr headset - I AM Cardboard



I'm a sim racer & would really love to try it, but IDK if this will work & he says there is an even better foam piece. I occasionally play Elite Dangerous & flight sims too.

Any OTHER cheap suggestions that are guaranteed to work with Assetto, Elite & FXS?
 
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I keep hitting stuff in my room while playing vanishing realm. I haven't done any damage yet, but I did give my TV quite a good whack. It takes a few minutes playing for me to really settle in.
 
I'm in my 30's. I don't get scared playing video games. I didn't get scared playing video games anyways. I'm not frightened in VR games per se, but there is a uneasiness and tension that certain games can create that I never feel when gaming on the monitor.

The Bellows demo kind of freaked me out.

Second level of Raw Data kind of freaked me out.

On a lighter note I also tried kicking a soccer ball in Final Goalie, ended up kicking the brick fireplace and hurt my foot. Yeah it's definitely immersive.
 
Ryan7968 said:
I'm in my 30's. I don't get scared playing video games. I didn't get scared playing video games anyways. I'm not frightened in VR games per se, but there is a uneasiness and tension that certain games can create that I never feel when gaming on the monitor.

The Bellows demo kind of freaked me out.

Second level of Raw Data kind of freaked me out.

On a lighter note I also tried kicking a soccer ball in Final Goalie, ended up kicking the brick fireplace and hurt my foot. Yeah it's definitely immersive.
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I can't deal with the scare the shit out of you games. Not my deal at all.

Steel toe VR boots? ;)
 
I could only stand about 4 minutes of Dreadhalls. Boy that was a waste of 10 dollars.
 
Ya, the immersion and presence VR brings to the table - actually putting you inside the world/game makes the horror genre take on a whole new level of in your face, visceral "crap your pants" type of game play. I can see this being just a bit too much for some people. I don't mind a jump scare every so often on a regular screen, but in VR it's just amplified 1000% and the stuff of nightmares. Just not my thing either. Won't be too long till someone tries out a horror game/experience on grandpa and ends up triggering a real heart attack...
 
With the Rift, exceptional now that it has the Touch controllers.

I couldnt get past the tiny focus area and fresnel rings on the Vive unfortunately.
The low res is less apparent on the Rift because its not as zoomed in, but there is a mild goggles effect because the image doesnt fill your field of view, choose your poison.
Both have streaks on bright objects unfortunately. It cant all go right on first generation I suppose.
The actual experience is phenomenal.

evilgrin said:
I keep hitting stuff in my room while playing vanishing realm. I haven't done any damage yet, but I did give my TV quite a good whack. It takes a few minutes playing for me to really settle in.
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This.
I have a choice, play pool or get rid of the table and have the best VR experience.
I've been looking for a top notch pool game on VR heh.
Tried Pool Nation FX (free version to see how it looks) but the image is royally screwed up.
Any others worth a try?

Tried the Vive, couldnt gel with it and ended up with the Rift.
This is the VR experience I was looking for :)
 
I was running a race in iRacing last week side by side with another guy in a Miata heading into a tight hairpin - a see who can outbrake the other guy type of turn. So I looked over at him fully expecting him to be looking back at me as we headed into the turn - the 'lets do this' look that happens from time to time in a race - only to see him staring dead in front of him. Then I realized we were just in a game and even if the guy was wearing a rift or vive, they didn't model head movement (yet). Having raced in real life it was uncanny how real it felt at that moment - and how much better it was to be able to just look over at the car next to me when battling for position instead of having to hit a button on my wheel or similar to change my perspective.

In iRacing they've even properly modeled the mirrors so the perspective changes as you move your head, the huge fake mirror most games put on the top of the screen is no longer necessary as you can glance at your mirrors and move your head slightly if necessary to see what's behind you. Amazing stuff for a car nut and racer like me, almost makes me want to sell the race cars.
 
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