How can a PC be functioning when it's submerged by mineral oil?

Discussion in 'Cases & Case Modding' started by Happy Hopping, Nov 7, 2017.

  1. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    Doesn't mineral oil cooling essentially work by convection? The hot oil rises, replaced by cooler oil? Or are fans still a requirement in those kinds of builds?
     
  2. Guarana [BAWLS]

    Guarana [BAWLS] Bad in Bed

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    look at all the mineral oil rigs in the post, they're all using HS/F still.

    Convection does not move liquid quickly.
     
  3. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    Makes sense, I guess. I was hoping the thermal capacity of the oil would kinda make up for the slower moving fluid.

    I was really just looking for a new way to use an external radiator rig anyway. XD
     
  4. ChoGGi

    ChoGGi Gawd

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    If you position the intake for that external rad so it helps move the oil around the CPU/GPU then maybe?

    Though if you're gonna mess around with an external rad then why not just skip the oil, and get some overtly beefy rad.
     
  5. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    I was hoping maybe if the "send" line from the tank was positioned high, so it pulled warm oil out, and the "return" was low, dumping cool in the bottom, convection would take care of the rest.
     
  6. Happy Hopping

    Happy Hopping [H]ardness Supreme

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    First of all, where's the source of the above test?

    Further, the heatsink is meant to drain out the high temperature of your CPU or your GPU and from there, suck out by large fan to the outside. For eg., I use 2 x 200 mm fan to suck out the heat from the 4 x heatsinks of my 2 x CPU. And when I use 6 x heat sensor of my lamptron fan controller to measure 6 separate location of my PC, guess what? currently it's sitting at 23 deg. C to 27 deg. C (I use a full tower)

    PS: i only use fans at silent mode, I don't do water cooling
     
  7. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    That's great. Don't mineral-oil cool your PC. Problem solved.
     
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  8. Happy Hopping

    Happy Hopping [H]ardness Supreme

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    My point is, why would anyone go thru that tank + oil?

    Here's my cost: 1 extra 200 mm fan, + 3 x 140 mm fan. (the rest c/w the case), you & I both know the cost of a few fans. I'm going to guess that a fish tank + oil costs a lot more.

    2) On the top cover of my PC, I have a thin layer of dust every 7 days or so. It's a NZXT phantom 820 case. So I just use a paper towel, 10 second job, I wipe the dust clean.

    Now, looking at that video, the fish tank is open, so some dust gets in. Is that someone going to change the oil every 7 days? Or wait till once a month, when it's really gross, a tank of oil + dust, before he change it?

    Like seriously, this is crazy. Even if it totally cut temperature down to the lowest compares to fan or water cooling, the trouble + maintainence + health harzard is not worth it
     
  9. ryan_975

    ryan_975 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    What health hazard? Mineral oil is non-toxic.

    As for maintenance, the guy in the video you posted is running a 780i motherboard from ten years ago. He said he's had to change the oil once, and that was because someone broke the tank at a dorm party. I have to take my giant heavy ass case out from under my desk once a month to get all the dust out (even with mesh filters on the intakes).


    (FYI it looks like the oil in the tank is indeed covered and isolated from dust).
     
  10. ChoGGi

    ChoGGi Gawd

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    We are on the hard forums yes? Cost isn't necessarily a large factor in custom case building.
     
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  11. ryan_975

    ryan_975 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Even it was, he's comparing a 20 gallon tank you can find for $50-100 and $150-200 worth of oil to at least $80 worth of spinning blades and a $200 case that you wouldn't need. It pretty much nets out on cost.
     
  12. Ultima99

    Ultima99 [H]ardness Supreme

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    I remember that!

    If I was to go as far as immersion I'd pony up for 3M Fluorinert or Novec. I'm actually surprised I'm the first to bring this up here.
     
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  13. Guarana [BAWLS]

    Guarana [BAWLS] Bad in Bed

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    Why? Because they can. Because they are [H]ard, while you are clearly (S)oft.
     
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  14. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    What are you, a communist?

    Build your computer the way you want to build your computer and enjoy it. Everyone else will do the same.
     
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  15. Susquehannock

    Susquehannock 2[H]4U

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    Source (warning: contains science) :

    >> http://www.symscape.com/examples/rans/electronics-cooling-fluid-comparison-study
     
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  16. Happy Hopping

    Happy Hopping [H]ardness Supreme

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    As you all know, if this fish tank idea is practical, at our "Show your rig" thread, at least a reasonable no. of people here would have a fish tank to show. So clealry this idea is impractical.

    As to cost, I used to waste quite a bit of $ on heavy rig. And I did regert it. My current rig is dual Xeon on a $600 Asus motherboard on a Notuca 2 x 2 - 14 cm fan, 2 x 2 heatsink . These CPU doesn't fail, and high quality Asus motherboard doesn't fail. I should have bought a $150 Asus w/ a i5 instead. In fact, even the Asus military grade motherboard w/ 5 yr. warranty is still cheaper than my current setup. So cost does matter, and it should.
     
  17. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    I'd accuse you of trolling at this point if I hadn't been feeding you so long.

    No one said it was practical. That's not the point.
     
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  18. LigTasm

    LigTasm [H]ardness Supreme

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    Ah yes, Ye Olde Happy Hopping threads. So much entertainment.
     
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  19. Guarana [BAWLS]

    Guarana [BAWLS] Bad in Bed

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    Go ahead and call him out, I do.

    Hoppy: Quit being a terrible troll, get better at it.
     
  20. Happy Hopping

    Happy Hopping [H]ardness Supreme

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    I'm just sticking to the facts:

    1) if you use mineral oil, you need 2 extra person to help you

    2) if you have something called carpet, don't use mineral oil

     
  21. N4CR

    N4CR 2[H]4U

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    The main issue with submerged oil PCs is actually preventing/designing around oil wicking through cables that go outside of the tank.
    Most fans can generate enough circulation to move the oil.

    One poster here with an external radiator/SFF build concept has a good idea,. if you had a decent pump with dual outputs, you could potentially direct them at cpu+gpu heatsinks and cool it well without fans I'd say.

    Happy Hopping, you should go back to reddit.
     
  22. Happy Hopping

    Happy Hopping [H]ardness Supreme

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    Look, don't kill the messager. You don't like what those 3 guys said, write them a letter. What they are saying seems to be: a cheap fish tank just doesn't work.
     
  23. ChoGGi

    ChoGGi Gawd

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    I don't think anyone here has said immersion is easy.

    It's just another option for cooling your system, one which you obviously don't have any inclination to do :)
     
  24. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    Cheap fish tank is out. Got it.

    I'm half tempted to build a submerged PC now.
     
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  25. gtrguy

    gtrguy n00bie

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    LOL I can't believe this ridiculous thread... dude has got to be trolling hard.
     
  26. spugm1r3

    spugm1r3 Gawd

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    Practicality, feasibility, cost, necessity... if these things are important to you (the general you), you might be in the wrong place. This thread has morphed from "how does this work" to "why you shouldn/shouldn't do this". I'm willing to bet there are at least a few people that feel as if they have been compelled to take a position on something they really have no position on.
     
  27. Guarana [BAWLS]

    Guarana [BAWLS] Bad in Bed

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    *sigh* if that's what you're getting out of the video, you're not watching the video.

    "I knew what I was getting into when I built an Oil Cooled PC"

    That says all there is to be said. An Acrylic Seam cracked a bit during a move, that shit happens. End of story.

    Once again: Get better at trolling, ya scrub.
     
  28. Guarana [BAWLS]

    Guarana [BAWLS] Bad in Bed

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    Anyways, just to prove you wrong on just about everything you've said:

    you don't need 2 or 3 people to do that. He was doing it stupidly.

    1) Pull your computer out and put it in a bin to catch everything dripping off (much like he did.) This is a thing.
    2) Get your clean bin, and a plastic jug of some variety. Easily scoop oil from the tank into the bin. (Suddenly you're not picking up 150+ lbs of tank and oil at once! *gasp*)
    3) He caused the damage himself by being stupid. If he had emptied most of the oil from the tank and moved it intelligently, there would have been no damage. (Assuming it's a 15 gallon tank, that's 120ish lbs of mineral oil in it.)
     
  29. bigddybn

    bigddybn [H]ardness Supreme

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    This thread really makes me wonder how some people deal with ACTUAL PROBLEMS in their lives.
     
  30. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex Gawd

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    Happy Hopping's tried and true method:

    1.) Decide there is a problem.
    2.) It's other people's problem, but it's yours too.
    3.) Argue with other people on the internet about the problem you've made up. Important: be sure to ignore their responses.
    4.) Problem... solved? No? No big, it's their problem, not yours. Plus, you're right anyway.
     
  31. NoOther

    NoOther [H]ardness Supreme

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    For the record, I have been watercooling since the early 2000s. Some chemicals can be toxic, but most are not. Also, it is unlikely you would actually consume enough of the chemical for it to matter unless you are purposefully chugging the coolant. Do you not have a refrigerator? News flash, it has freon, as do many aerosols. How about your car, it contains many chemicals that can be hazardous to you as well.

    As far as warranties, I have spilled water with chemicals on CPUs, RAM, Motherboard, GPU, etc and had them returned with no problem whatsoever. I have even used graphite on both motherboard and GPU for changing resistance to hone in clocks before and still had no trouble returning the MB or GPU. It certainly can depend on the company, but I have been successful with a number of various companies (PNY, ASUS, EVGA, Corsair, OCZ, G.Skill).

    As for the whether its worth the trouble, when did [H]ard become a forum for the scared average builder? This site was all about pushing the limits of what you could do, because you could do it.
     
  32. NoOther

    NoOther [H]ardness Supreme

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    No you are sticking to what you believe are the facts. There are any number of ways you can get around the problems they experience. If you are going to go into a project like that without a real plan on upgrading, maintenance, etc, you are going to experience problems. This is why there has been so many changes and progress with computer cases over the years. People realized if you did a bit more engineering, you could get a lot more out of it.
     
  33. BrainEater

    BrainEater Gawd

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    Dammit !
    I guess I have to chime in here, cause this train is off the rails.
    ------

    I joined this forum to share my 'thinktank' casemod back in 2004.
    I'm the first person ever to build an actual 'case' for submersion cooling.I've been published in the book "Case Modding for Dummies".
    The thread is still here somewhere , but I'm sorry the pictures are not up anymore.
    I've also done more research into submersion cooling than anyone.
    I've made computers run in alcohol.

    ----------

    Yes , oil cooling is messy. I used Midel 7131 transformer oil.
    The cpu/ram/mobo I had in it , runs to this day. My router.110,000 hrs uptime.

    any other outstanding questions ?

    :eek:
     
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  34. Guarana [BAWLS]

    Guarana [BAWLS] Bad in Bed

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    And I believe someone just smacked their dick down in the middle of this here thread.....