Heroes of Newerth beta

hhara

Gawd
Joined
May 8, 2009
Messages
817
I just gave away my 3 to the people that sent me private messages, sorry.

I will come back if I get some more though.
 

tpfaff

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 30, 2006
Messages
2,526
this game kicks so much ass..... its dota without the limits of the w3 engine
 

KillerPotato

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 14, 2005
Messages
167
If anyone has any extra invites, I'd really appreciate one. A few of my friends are playing and I need to get in on it.

email:
killerpotato [at] gmail [dot] com

Thanks in advance!
 

Crucible1001

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 7, 2005
Messages
1,611
Around 7200 players playing right now. It is a very popular game so far. I just played for 12 hours strait.
 

FatFed

Gawd
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
625
Has anyone played this and League of Legends? If so, how do they compare to each other and DOTA?
 

Vorret

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 26, 2003
Messages
1,100
The more I play this game, the more addicted I get.
I still suck balls (getting better) and I'm starting to understand the concept.

Been a while since I've playued a game and lost track of time, let's just say my weekend was short lol
 

Spaceman_Spiff

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2003
Messages
1,636
I'm not really seeing much reason to play this over dota...the matchmaking and interface are great and it looks very refined, but thats because thats where all the time went, seeing as they didn't have to spend any time being creative or balancing...the leveling up, the items, the map (supposedly they will have multiple maps)...there's no originality whatsoever.

My question is, when a new version of dota is released, what happens? Do they just copy all the new stuff so hon is basically just the previous version of dota? Maybe this is just the starting point and they do their own thing but I see no evidence of that yet.

It really reminds me of the iphone app store with the relentless, shameless ripoffs of other people's work.
 

Kelv

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 10, 2008
Messages
385
if anyone still has some, im in the LoL beta and I would really like to try this game out.
email is jordanchriss at gmail dot com
 

soulesschild

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Feb 18, 2007
Messages
6,176
I'm not really seeing much reason to play this over dota...the matchmaking and interface are great and it looks very refined, but thats because thats where all the time went, seeing as they didn't have to spend any time being creative or balancing...the leveling up, the items, the map (supposedly they will have multiple maps)...there's no originality whatsoever.

My question is, when a new version of dota is released, what happens? Do they just copy all the new stuff so hon is basically just the previous version of dota? Maybe this is just the starting point and they do their own thing but I see no evidence of that yet.

It really reminds me of the iphone app store with the relentless, shameless ripoffs of other people's work.

Icefrog is going to stop development of DOTA very soon from what I hear. Why the hell would he dedicate his time to a map that's basically his time for free when he could be developing HoN for money?

Also, HoN is made BY ICEFROG. The same person that made DOTA. So I don't see what you mean by "originality." He's continually porting over the old heroes and making new ones as well as rebalancing the old ones. You can see that certain heroes have changed a bit such as Naix to make them more fun/useful to play.

The whole purpose of HoN was to have a standalone game that could have it's own engine and not be restricted by the WC3 engine. It also is designed to have better games for players due to their stat tracking of leavers (keeping leavers out, etc) and have a ladder rank system. The main problem with DOTA was you either pub stomped with your friends or tried to play in a league like DXD/IHCHS but if you weren't up to DXD standards, you would get banned extremely quick. Neither of these foster any real growth of skill, where as a matchmaking/ladder system lets you play people on the same level as you, so in theory by playing people on the same level as you, you'll get better over time.

Also with centralized servers, you don't have to go through the hassle of hosting LC games or hosting a GHost Bot and all that other stuff.


Let me add some corrections,

DOTA was originally made by Guinsoo but he stopped development and Icefrog picked it up.

Guinsoo is working on LoL
Icefrog is working on HoN
 
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Spaceman_Spiff

[H]ard|Gawd
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Messages
1,636
Icefrog is going to stop development of DOTA very soon from what I hear. Why the hell would he dedicate his time to a map that's basically his time for free when he could be developing HoN for money?

Also, HoN is made BY ICEFROG. The same person that made DOTA. So I don't see what you mean by "originality." He's continually porting over the old heroes and making new ones as well as rebalancing the old ones. You can see that certain heroes have changed a bit such as Naix to make them more fun/useful to play.

The whole purpose of HoN was to have a standalone game that could have it's own engine and not be restricted by the WC3 engine. It also is designed to have better games for players due to their stat tracking of leavers (keeping leavers out, etc) and have a ladder rank system. The main problem with DOTA was you either pub stomped with your friends or tried to play in a league like DXD/IHCHS but if you weren't up to DXD standards, you would get banned extremely quick. Neither of these foster any real growth of skill, where as a matchmaking/ladder system lets you play people on the same level as you, so in theory by playing people on the same level as you, you'll get better over time.

Also with centralized servers, you don't have to go through the hassle of hosting LC games or hosting a GHost Bot and all that other stuff.

They've well publicized the fact that they asked him for permission and that he's fine with it, but I haven't seen anything saying he's specifically working for S2 games. I'd like to read that article though if you could post it. It definitely would make sense for him to do so, obviously, but he's worked on dota for so long for no pay, and really at this point it doesn't take all that much effort in terms of scripting...its mostly coming up with new ideas and lots of playtesting for balance. For these things there's tons of community support.

Either way the interface and stat tracking is nice, I certainly don't deny that, I'd just like to see more new stuff. Like I said, its easy to develop a nice interface and infrastructure when you don't have to spend much money at all developing the gameplay or content (outside of the art, of course) because you just use someone else's stuff. Again I hope it works out but everyone seems very confident they will maintain balance and introduce good solid content but its entirely possible they'll fall flat on their face when they have to be creative on their own. As of yet I don't see enough new ideas in there to be as confident as most other people.
 

soulesschild

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Feb 18, 2007
Messages
6,176
They've well publicized the fact that they asked him for permission and that he's fine with it, but I haven't seen anything saying he's specifically working for S2 games. I'd like to read that article though if you could post it. It definitely would make sense for him to do so, obviously, but he's worked on dota for so long for no pay, and really at this point it doesn't take all that much effort in terms of scripting...its mostly coming up with new ideas and lots of playtesting for balance. For these things there's tons of community support.

Either way the interface and stat tracking is nice, I certainly don't deny that, I'd just like to see more new stuff. Like I said, its easy to develop a nice interface and infrastructure when you don't have to spend much money at all developing the gameplay or content (outside of the art, of course) because you just use someone else's stuff. Again I hope it works out but everyone seems very confident they will maintain balance and introduce good solid content but its entirely possible they'll fall flat on their face when they have to be creative on their own. As of yet I don't see enough new ideas in there to be as confident as most other people.

It's been said here and there that Icefrog is more than likely going to drop DOTA as soon as HoN is actually published and then work with the staff there. (He does help here and there I believe) I'll look around for a link but busy with work :(

In regards to new stuff, it's alot more promising on HoN's end firstly due to its VASTLY superior scripting tool compared to WC3. Some people say SC2 is where the next DOTA is at but I just don't think its true since Blizzard basically said that the SC2 editor is the WC3 but with a few more features. So in the end, it's still fairly limited compared to HoN's system.

Also, basically DOTA is a one man team coding. Sure there's play testers and stuff (I used to beta test as well), but the actual coding is done by one guy only. Scripting in WC3 isn't easy as a map developer myself and I can't imagine myself making something as complex as DOTA. With HoN you now have a group of dedicated coders for the game that can take in more suggestions/feedback from the community.

Also, S2games is a great company in general, and they've made fabulous games (Savage 1 and Savage 2) so I have my faith in them :p So far the beta for HoN has been pretty nice, very few bugs and errors compared to other betas *cough WoW cough* :D

Also, if you've
 
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kumquatsrus

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 15, 2007
Messages
1,326
apparently i have six unused invites, so pm me with your email address if you wantey. first come first serve. will update when they have all been exhausted.

*NO MORE LEFT SORRY*
 
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soulesschild

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Feb 18, 2007
Messages
6,176
• Server Optimizations & Stabilization
• New Hero(es) - Valkyrie (potm port) & Maliken (hopefully makes it in)
• Basic Clan Functionality - clan creation, clan tags, clan management, reserved clan channel, clan buddy list, etc...
• Pub Skill Rating (PSR) - an elo based skill rating similar to chess
• Auto Team Balance - hosts can now auto balance teams in the game lobby based upon PSR as well as lock players to a team so people can play with friends and auto balance teams
• New Shop Interace - New smaller, streamlined, repositioned shop with cursor positioned tooltips (we're going to try and squeeze this in, hopefully it makes it, if it doesn't it'll be next patch)
• Game List Changes - you can now filter based upon no preference, show, do not show and we have added tooltips to the icons in the list
• Mechanic Clean up and balance changes - lots of small things that add up to a lot here


New patch hopefully this Tuesday I believe.
 

Alai

2[H]4U
Joined
Jul 19, 2008
Messages
2,701
I got into LoL and I find it way more fun than DotA. It's more gank heavy and more thrilling than DotA's denying and annoying map traveling. It's definitely still rough around the edges, but overall, the fun factor and strategy exceeds that of DotA. I would love to try HoN and compare the two. Could someone send me a few keys for my friends and I? I would really love at least three (for the more hardcore DotA friends of mine) if not five (two for casual DotA friends).
 

qbert3

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Oct 1, 2005
Messages
1,141
it would be luck if you got 3 or more keys, each person gets 3 keys.. im not even sure if they get more.
 

kumquatsrus

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 15, 2007
Messages
1,326
it would be luck if you got 3 or more keys, each person gets 3 keys.. im not even sure if they get more.

dunno how but they definitely gave me 6 to use. guess i'm just special. only got 1 left to give now.
 

eeyrjmr

[H]ardness Supreme
Joined
Apr 23, 2002
Messages
4,363
I am liking this game alot!!!
problem is I am crap at killing hero's (I am getting the hang of pushing my lane well to stat up)

There are a few problems, you do get stathunters that will join "newbie only" servers with KD of >2 (last night someone joined with a KD of 11 !!!!) and they are there purely to get stats. While us with KD near zero (4 kills 80deaths for me :( ) just get raped
 

gwu168

Gawd
Joined
Oct 17, 2004
Messages
721
Now I know why there has been recently decline in DOTA games in WC3...

Can someone PM me a key please :).
 

Spaceman_Spiff

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2003
Messages
1,636
• New Shop Interace - New smaller, streamlined, repositioned shop with cursor positioned tooltips (we're going to try and squeeze this in, hopefully it makes it, if it doesn't it'll be next patch)

Thank god, the tooltips are really annoying being way down in the corner of the screen.
 

HeavensCloud

Oswego, not shitty as Buffalo
Joined
Feb 7, 2008
Messages
7,485
JUST caught this thread. I have been playing DOTA for over 4 years now. If someone could send me an invite I'll give you a delicious cookie.
 

spindoctor

Gawd
Joined
Sep 30, 2005
Messages
820
as posted earlier in the thread, signing up as a fan on their facebook page will get you a beta key. they have already crossed the target of 30,000 fans so i imagine they will be sending out the beta invites shortly. anyone who wants one can sign up now before that happens.
 

Kelv

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 10, 2008
Messages
385
Some people say League of Legends sucks and like Heroes of Newerth better. Heroes of Newerth is better if you love Dota and find it perfect and can't imagine how it could be better. Its reskinned, heroes are basically copies. Visuals impress in the complexity but not interesting. Spells are bland etc. There are two maps. Neither is original but the Dota like one is better. The other is the same but its just straight up and down lanes. The only thing that I actually love about Heroes of Newerth is that they have a mac version.

League of legends has much better shop, visuals that are interesting as well as spell effects. A lot of people say its childish, I guess i'm bored of games that remind me of GeoW visuals. League of Legends is one of those games that 5 years from now, its gonna look a lot better than Heroes of Newerth. Heroes are unique and spells are unique. Gameplay is slightly different. No stupid systems such as creep denying (I played Dota and did deny but I did it knowing it was stupid). I'm glad the devs realize that killing your own creeps when there almost dead makes no sense how thought should hinder the xp gain of your enemy. I agree that it is just a pointless minigame done to make the early game in Dota and HoN less boring.

I'll give HoN slightly more time but its a struggle.

Anyone that heard that League of Legends sucks but hasn't played it yet, I should have 1 spare friend keys so PM me if you actually want to try it.
 
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soulesschild

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Feb 18, 2007
Messages
6,176
Some people say League of Legends sucks and like Heroes of Newerth better. Heroes of Newerth is better if you love Dota and find it perfect and can't imagine how it could be better. Its reskinned, heroes are basically copies. Visuals impress in the complexity but not interesting. Spells are bland etc. There are two maps. Neither is original but the Dota like one is better. The other is the same but its just straight up and down lanes. The only thing that I actually love about Heroes of Newerth is that they have a mac version.

League of legends has much better shop, visuals that are interesting as well as spell effects. A lot of people say its childish, I guess i'm bored of games that remind me of GeoW visuals. League of Legends is one of those games that 5 years from now, its gonna look a lot better than Heroes of Newerth. Heroes are unique and spells are unique. Gameplay is slightly different. No stupid systems such as creep denying (I played Dota and did deny but I did it knowing it was stupid). I'm glad the devs realize that killing your own creeps when there almost dead makes no sense how thought should hinder the xp gain of your enemy. I agree that it is just a pointless minigame done to make the early game in Dota and HoN less boring.

I'll give HoN slightly more time but its a struggle.

Anyone that heard that League of Legends sucks but hasn't played it yet, I should have 1 spare friend keys so PM me if you actually want to try it.

Lol @ denying is stupid. I'm sorry that makes me laugh. Maybe it's because I've played DOTA so much but creep denying is not some "minigame" in early game, but a key aspect of keeping your enemy down in terms of gold and exp. It requires a degree of skill, removing it is basically removes a portion of skill involved in the game.
 

Alai

2[H]4U
Joined
Jul 19, 2008
Messages
2,701
He's just saying it's stupid to be killing your own men. As in... if you were in an army and you had a bunch of soldiers that were injured, would you go around killing them while the enemy was at your gate?
 

soulesschild

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Feb 18, 2007
Messages
6,176
He's just saying it's stupid to be killing your own men. As in... if you were in an army and you had a bunch of soldiers that were injured, would you go around killing them while the enemy was at your gate?

The physical aspect of it (the killing your own men) may be stupid in a concept, but its also done in WC3 ladder system (or you retreat the unit/run it away). But basically he also finds it tedious from what I can tell in his post. This is what would separate the good players from the average players which is why I find it so funny because LoL is basically making the game easier, which is also why I feel that LoL will fail. A large population of the DOTA community revolves around this huge learning curve for DOTA, that's what makes DOTA so addicting. There's always new tricks and little things to learn/perfect in the quest to become a better player.

In another related note...you could look at denying as a way in which sometimes soldiers would kill themselves with a poison pill or have a spy kill a captured friendly in order to prevent the enemy from interrogating them/gaining new info

That's my .02 :p
 

newster

Gawd
Joined
Aug 22, 2004
Messages
653
I think that denying, although not a logical concept in and of itself, is a very important reason why DOTA is so popular and is still played so much. Without denying, there would only be last hitting, and therefore deeply giving advantage to ranged characters. With denying, you can choose to stifle your opponent, or advance yourself depending on the circumstance, and it gives melee characters something to even out their weaknesses early game. This adds depth to something as mundane as creep killing.

I am going to give this HoN thing a shot.
 

eeyrjmr

[H]ardness Supreme
Joined
Apr 23, 2002
Messages
4,363
He's just saying it's stupid to be killing your own men. As in... if you were in an army and you had a bunch of soldiers that were injured, would you go around killing them while the enemy was at your gate?

yer cause every army has magic spawning/unlimited troops that are walking trees ...
 
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