Help me get some better computer audio going

G

greyeyezz61

n00b
Joined
Sep 3, 2016
Messages
7
Custom system,
FX8350
GIGABYTE GA-970A-UD3
Corsair 650TX 650W
CREATIVE SB X-Fi Titanium

Been an audiophile since late 70's so I know good sound. Recently blew my Klipch pro media for the second time, my Corsair SP2500 just don't impress me.

Looking at a few small powered speakers plus a small sub for 2.1, a little gaming, mostly music.

School me on DAC, how's it work, whats the advantage, how would I implement it into my system.

Was looking at Presonus Ceres 3.5BT and maybe a polk sub?


Budget $500 maybe more

Thanks.
 
The main benefit of an external dac is that you avoid the potential buzz/interference/ground loop problems you might get when using just a sound card and active speakers. You can either plug the DAC optically between your speakers and your computer sound card or you can use a USB model (but then you might still have ground loop issues). There may be slight audible changes too but they're generally very small compared to qualitative differences between speakers.

You should invest as much as you can to the speakers if you like good sound. I haven't heard the Presonus but looking at the size - I have never heard a speaker that small that would sound decent. You should really test and listen to speakers yourself before buying. If I were you I would look at the JBL LSR305's - don't be fooled by their professional audio status. Many people confuse controlling gear to PA but they're two different animals. Close field monitors are often very high quality and comparable to good hi-fi speakers. The LSR falls in that category.

Unless you want really ground shaking bass the LSRs can do without a subwoofer.
 
greyeyezz61 said:
Those are kind of large for my desktop. Perhaps Audioengine A2+ with built in DAC?
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All I can say is you have to test them out. Speakers sound different in different rooms - you have to find a pair that suits your needs. The A2's should be decent enough to try - but you can't beat physics. They're small.
 
For a large metropolitan area there are virtually zero dealers who would carry anything remotely similar to hear. It's a shame.
 
greyeyezz61 said:
For a large metropolitan area there are virtually zero dealers who would carry anything remotely similar to hear. It's a shame.
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For a true audiophile, finding a hifi-shop that offers the chance to test speakers before buying is essential. Unfortunately those are getting rare.
 
greyeyezz61:

How about these speakers (EDIT: they got a 60-day money-back guarantee): Equator D5 Coaxial Studio Monitors for Home or Studio. Active Nearfield Monitors.

I had the first revision and they were quite decent for the price/size. Also, coaxial driver arrangement is beneficial when you are very close to them.
The downsides are:

1) There goes your entire stated budget, just for the speakers

2) You need a DAC that can output a balanced signal (via XLR or TRS) -- thankfully they can be quite affordable, see e.g. Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 USB Recording Interface-Newegg.com (which includes microphone inputs and a bunch more stuff you probably don't need - I'll let other members chime in with alternative DAC suggestions, I am not really up to date on that.)
 
B00nie said:
For a true audiophile, finding a hifi-shop that offers the chance to test speakers before buying is essential. Unfortunately those are getting rare.
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Buying used works too. If you don't like something, you can flip it for minimal loss.
 
HammerSandwich said:
Buying used works too. If you don't like something, you can flip it for minimal loss.
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Also some places will let you return things for minimal/no fee if you take care of them. That's what I've generally taken to. I don't like returning things if I don't have to, particularly when there's shipping involved (and in shipped cases you usually eat the shipping) but it is a way to test things you can't find locally. Also it does have the advantage of letting you test in YOUR room, which can be very different from a good show room. The online-only companies like Emotiva and SVS (both of who I use and recommend) offer in-home trials of their stuff. Also many good online pro-shops will do returns for a reasonable restocking fee, or even no fee. You can also check Amazon as they are good about returns and have a surprising amount of high end stuff for sale.
 
After much research I think I'm going with a Focusrite Scarlet solo USB AI and Audioengine A5+. Can add a sub later if needed.
 
greyeyezz61 said:
After much research I think I'm going with a Focusrite Scarlet solo USB AI and Audioengine A5+. Can add a sub later if needed.
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Tell us how you like them when you get them. I hope the A5+ comes with a grill - those are ugly little buggers IMO lol.
 
I am a little shocked at some of the advice you're getting here. There are many different ways to accomplish your goal. Some of this advice is just terrible. It's terrible because it puts you back in the same boat. This is a great opportunity to take it to the next level.

The Audioengine A2+ are tiny with extremely small mids. Avoid. My gripe here is you're going to have the same tiny mid you've had in the past. Give your ears and sound stage an upgrade. This could be that chance.

You're going to want a sub. No question about that. Most of these guys have never had a sub as part of a desktop so they are just not aware of the major difference it really makes. I'm not talking big booming sloppy bass. I'm talking about getting true representation of any song you listen to. Little tiny desk speakers come no where close to doing this for you. You've own subs do you know what I'm talking about.

For your budget, you can very easily take it to the next level and maintain the smaller footprint you're wanting.

I would take a look at the KRK G5's. They can be had used for around $200 - $250, sometimes cheaper, or, new shipped free for $299 no tax off eBay. Locally ( craigslist ) could even be cheaper than $200. I've bought a few sets, brand new for $150 or so a few times. Make contact with the seller and ask all the right questions. How long have you had them, what were their daily use, condition, etc. It's really easy to spot high risk ( bad owners ) right off the bat. Don't let the word "used" scare you. Many times studio equipment can be just like home exercise equipment, meaning, bought and hardly used. I've moved maybe 7 or 8 of my friends over to KRK's and Subs over the past 4 years. I've dealt with a lot of studio equipment and monitors. I know exactly what I am talking about.

As far as size goes, they are maybe 35% larger than what you've used in the past. No, they will not crowd your desk. You can find the dimensions online if you want to be exact.

I would then look at getting the KRK S10 sub. You can get these used / shipped for $250 - $300. Both the G5's and the S10 should only set you back $500 to $600 and possibly even less.

This is the setup I run. I originally started out with G5's but moved to G8's along the way.

What I find interesting about your current dilemma is it matches exactly what I went through 5 years ago. I had the Promedia 2.1's ... then the Promedia 5.1's and then the Corsair 2500 setup. I actually enjoyed all of them but they all were cheaply made and developed issues forcing me to retire all those speakers. To this day I have a mint condition set of 5.1's that stopped working. They look brand new. I just need the amp repaired.

As far as a DAC, be careful, again, I see a lot of bad advice online. Especially with tube based DACs. Don't get me started. This is a whole different conversation.

You really do not need to spend a lot of money here. I've made the mistake of buying some pricey DACs. At the end of the day there is no real difference between most of them. They all do a pretty damn good job vastly improving your audio source.

You can also look at the G6's. A good DAC and a pair of new G6's, pads, cables will set you back around $500. You can also add the sub in at a later date. Sometimes taking a multi-layered approach to a very important upgrade makes all the sense in the world. Unlike a car that you cannot buy in pieces, a sound system you can. Not the best example but you get the point.

If you haven't used a DAC before you are in for a treat. Let me tell you, hooking up a pair of G5's or G6's with a DAC which is well within your budget will blow you away.

What qualifies me to give you this advice is I have over 15 pair of headphones, around 16 or 17 Dac's and have owned KRK, M-Audio, Klipsch, Yamaha, Mackie, JBL, Adam monitors and or have spent several weeks with the mentioned brands.
 
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SixFootDuo said:
What qualifies me to give you this advice is I have over 15 pair of headphones, around 16 or 17 Dac's and have owned KRK, M-Audio, Klipsch, Yamaha, Mackie, JBL, Adam monitors and or have spent several weeks with the mentioned brands.
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I don't get why someone would spend so much money collecting mif-fi gear when you could put all that money into a summit-fi system. Just my 2 cents. lol.

I mean I get someone like Tyll Hertsens having a huge collection, but his wall of fame stuff is all top of the line.
 
There is a massive PC swap shop here in Kansas City. All this stuff comes flooding in the doors daily. It's so much stuff coming I'm literally forced to go down there everyday so I don't miss anything good, but I can't always. The guy does studio equipment, monitors, midi, etc. He does high-end PC gear / workstations, accessories, headphones, etc etc etc. Lot of gaming stuff, even a huge retro section of consoles and games.

So no, I am not spending a lot of money at all. While the buying and selling doesn't quite even out for me ( one pays for the other ) the dollar investment month to month is only a few hundred. That's if I can sell for a profit a handful of the things I buy. A lot of the stuff I just want to keep. There are months where I make a few hundred and end up picking up 4 or 5 things that paid for themselves. It's easy buy a lot of really good stuff if you're in the right place a the right time.

Some of my recent finds in the last 2 weeks have been a Dragonfly USB Dac for $35, a newish pair KRK 8400 headphones for $55, a pair of AKG 702's for $80. At the start of the summer I picked up a pair of AKG K872's for $550 brand new in the box. I sold them for around $1100 on ebay.

A lot of the stuff I get, I buy just to resell but I still have a ton of stuff I've been able to buy cheaply and play around with.

The best deal so far this year the new Maschine Jam they just released. I bought that for $200 from a guy walking in. New in the box. He got it from N.I. free so $200 was a nice turn around for him. For me personally, that was something exciting to find.

When I tell you guys get a pair of KRK G5's or G6's, a DAC and then the Sub, then or later, do it. It's the next level up from the bs you guys are doing now, it's basically the same cost but a massive change in your sound stage. I use the word BS lovingly. For me, after awhile when I continually buy the same stuff within my comfort zone over and over again and then I do eventually, years later step out of that comfort zone and put better stuff around me, I get so damn mad at myself for not doing it sooner. The KRK's is a great example to me doing this.

I've literally played with over 25+ DAC's over the last few years. Sorry to burst your guys bubbles, 90% of them sound identical. There were a few that had what I was describe as more color in their sound. There is a ton of cheap chinese DAC's wrapped in plastic, cheap metal, some in aluminum. I think most DAC's are made in China. I do have 3 or 4 that are American made. The quality on them can be hit or miss. For the most part, the American stuff is shade better.

This is my personal perspective. If you guys want to keep those small speakers on your desk, keep doing so. I'm not mad. For me, tho, I say, why waste an opportunity to go bigger and bolder for nearly the same cost and same footprint.
 
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You still didn't answer which part of the advice was horrendous.
 
Speakers Genelec, or KRK. I'd go Genelec. You have to listen to it, or know your preferences. Makes a far bigger difference than the DAC as long as the DAC is resonable. If you go for passive speakers take a look at the NAD D3020.
 
Here is a picture of my KRK setup. KRK G2 8's with KRK S10 10" Sub under the table. DAC is an Asus U7 external. My total cost was $580. Took me 2 or 3 weeks to assemble. All used equipment off craigslist

KRK G5's can be had new for $299 shipped free with cables and pads off eBay. Good DAC for $100 or less, new.

A used S10 KRK Sub will cost you $250 - $300

You can also go with new G6's for $350 shipped new with pads and cables off eBay.

I would go with powered speakers. Don't mess with amps and receivers and all that other horse crap

As far as used stuff goes, for the most part it's expensive new and people just take care of it. The cheaper the speakers, the less people take care of it. I've had a lot of used speakers over the years. All of it has been in fantastic shape. I personally also do a sound test to make sure tweeters are not blown.


fvnwomS.jpg
 
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All the goober farmers around here have soundbars as their most treasured sound upgrades. So no craigslist hunting for me. :(
 
cageymaru said:
All the goober farmers around here have soundbars as their most treasured sound upgrades. So no craigslist hunting for me. :(
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I have a ghetto old school almost a soundbar :)

DXiSjff.jpg


KRknmk6.jpg

But I've collected speakers over the years, even have a couple old Kenwood trip Z's I use for dual subwoofers on a separate receiver these days.

If I were buying new speakers these days I would look at the mid ranged ELAC's, but they are not powered.

I like displacement myself if it is a decent speaker, you can find many powered ones somewhere like Sweetwater.

http://www.sweetwater.com/
 
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Saw this over on AVS Forum:

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-sp...ng-my-buck-around-400-range.html#post48301129

"Just thought that I would mention that your local Best Buy has the Sony Core speakers at 50% off! The Cores are better than the Pioneer AJ speakers, as well as, the Polk Monitor Series. Simply put, at the current prices of the Cores, there is NOT much out there that can best them. Usually don't recommend Sonywhen it comes to speakers, but they did a fantastic job with the Core series. The Core center is the weakest link in the chain. But, it does get the job done for the most part. Here is a link:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-co...ng-speaker-each-black/5926456.p?skuId=5926456


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-co...f-speakers-pair-black/5721014.p?skuId=5721014


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-co...channel-speaker-black/5720006.p?skuId=5720006


Personally, I prefer the Core Bookshelfs over the towers. But, both sound really good! Best wishes with your decision!

Cheers,

Phil"
 
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Phattio said:
Saw this over on AVS Forum:

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-sp...ng-my-buck-around-400-range.html#post48301129

"Just thought that I would mention that your local Best Buy has the Sony Core speakers at 50% off! The Cores are better than the Pioneer AJ speakers, as well as, the Polk Monitor Series. Simply put, at the current prices of the Cores, there is NOT much out there that can best them. Usually don't recommend Sonywhen it comes to speakers, but they did a fantastic job with the Core series. The Core center is the weakest link in the chain. But, it does get the job done for the most part. Here is a link:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-co...ng-speaker-each-black/5926456.p?skuId=5926456


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-co...f-speakers-pair-black/5721014.p?skuId=5721014


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-co...channel-speaker-black/5720006.p?skuId=5720006


Personally, I prefer the Core Bookshelfs over the towers. But, both sound really good! Best wishes with your decision!

Cheers,

Phil"
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I actually met the designer of the Sony Core series in Germany when the Core series was launched. They were demoing a larger model with 3 tweeters but I remember that the sound was very neutral. There was no wow effect but you couldn't find anything bad to say about it either. That's usually a sign of a good design.
 
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