HELP! former intel user looking to build A64 system.

T

thenixhex311

Gawd
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
935
I'll admit it. Im lost.

Ive searched these forums up and down, newegg, google, zzf, etc. etc. etc.

Winchester, San Diego, Semperon, Clawhammer, Venice, Sledgehammer.


WTF?

Why is this so freaking confusing. All these terms are clogging my mind and I cant figure out what the hell i should be knowing here.

After some serious consideration (future upgrade compatibilities) im deciding on going with an AMD system.

and other than 'this one costs more than the other one' mindset, i have no FRICKIN CLUE what processor to choose.

I was going to get a 3800+ and then i start hearing and reading about this 3700+ being better (but then i think i read that the Neo4 Platinum SLI mobo wont recognize it)

then people are saying 3200+ 3500+.

THEN i heard and read people saying 'you need a 1mb cache, blah blah blah'

And now im lost.

I was looking to spend (max $) the 3800 but obviously would like to spend less to add some other TOYS to my system.

I basically want to go from a 2.8ghz PENTIUM system, to something that would be, although not having to be SIGNIFICANTLY FASTER, but a faster AMD system.

HELP!!
 
what will you do with it?
do you plan to oc?
total budget for the entire upgrade?
what components do you need to get along with the cpu and mobo?
 
(cf)Eclipse said:
what will you do with it?
do you plan to oc?
total budget for the entire upgrade?
what components do you need to get along with the cpu and mobo?
Click to expand...

Im not really a big overclocker...but reading threads about overclocking abilities and such got my mind going.

Total budget is a work in progress kinda. I search ZZF, newegg, ebay... right now its looking at around 1200.00 out of my pocket to buy:

(what i was planning on buying)


AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Processor (Clawhammer) Socket 939 $267.00


MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum/SLI nForce4 SLI Athlon 64(FX) Skt939 DDR ATX Motherboard w/Audio, Gigabit LAN, RAID/Serial ATA $173.00

BFG GeForce 6800 GT OC PCI Express 256MB DDR3 Video Card w/TV-Out & Dual DVI $419.99


Buying a Lian Li PC65B Plus case and some tweaks to it
Enermax EG565P 535W Sli ready PSU
Thermalright x90 Heatsink with fan

And other than buying a new keyboard/mouse, fans, (zalman controller) and some other tweaks. Im right around my price range i wanted to spend.

I would be using my 3 HD's, RAM (corsair value select 2x512 pc3200) and my Hauppauge PVR250, DVD Burner, DVD Drive and selling:

Intel P4 Northwood 2.8Ghz w/fan
MSI GeForce 5700 128MB
Sound Blaster Audigy ZS
Nexus 305 Fan/Light controller
Microsoft Wireless Keyboard and Mouse SOLD

I figure i could get SOME cash back from these parts to go towards the monitor i eventually want to get (Samsung 193P +Plus, eta??)


But basically that is the setup I want to have, the more i read, it seems like the 3500+ is a good way to go. Am I right?>
 
What will U be using it for... The Rev E3 (Venice) is a good thing for U I think especially if Ud like to dualcore (A64 X2) this autumn or next spring. If so a 3200 or a 3500 would be good.

I Ure gonne hold on to the system a while Id get the 3700+ (Rev E4 "San Diego") since it will probably (with som oc) hold up a little bit longer due to the larger cache.

The MoBo is prob. good but the PSU might need some upgrading. Look into the OCZ Power Stream series (the 600 is good).. They are expensive but U want to have it stable so...
 
The PSU made by Allied, Fortron and PC&P all put out more amps than the OCZ psu and they cost $120-150.00 cheaper to boot. As for the heatsink I think the stock one really performs well for what it is.
 
NEVERLIFT said:
The PSU made by Allied, Fortron and PC&P all put out more amps than the OCZ psu and they cost $120-150.00 cheaper to boot. As for the heatsink I think the stock one really performs well for what it is.
Click to expand...

Well please tell me where I find that PCP&C LoL... Also Id lookinto a good aftermarket aircooler. I am satisfied w. my 7700CU its big and heavy but it get the job done and its quiet. Now the Fortron Blue Stom 550+ would be a nice idea as well. And PCP&C is always good but very expensive and also loud (this ppl have told me I have no first hand xp)
 
Lazaryn said:
... but the stock cooling is loud compared to aftermarket coolers.
Click to expand...

The stock heatsink also comes with a 70mm fan making it hard to upgrade to a better fan.
 
Frallan said:
Jupp this is PCP&C that pcp^^ hmm lets just say that it wont end up in my case...
Click to expand...


Here's the Allied which powered my 2.2ghz AthlonXP, two 8x DVDRW's, 4x 120gb hdd's and a 30gb hdd for over 3yrs without giving me any problems. I sold the AXP and got my A64 and kept the Allied psu and its still going strong and the one I have is the 450w version.
Here is the 500w
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817154015
 
NEVERLIFT said:
Here's the Allied which powered my 2.2ghz AthlonXP, two 8x DVDRW's, 4x 120gb hdd's and a 30gb hdd for over 3yrs without giving me any problems. I sold the AXP and got my A64 and kept the Allied psu and its still going strong and the one I have is the 450w version.
Here is the 500w
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817154015
Click to expand...

That PSU is dead in the water with the DFI nF4...

Output: +3.3V@28A,+5V@52A,[email protected],+12V@20A,-12@1A,[email protected]

20 Amps on the 12V ???? on just one rail ???

And then these 500W is the MAX out put not the sustained. When U buy a OCZ they have a max way over how they rate the PSUs since they Use the max Sustainable Amps..

They also didn't say 24 pin which is needed for the DFI.
 
Frallan said:
That PSU is dead in the water with the DFI nF4...

Output: +3.3V@28A,+5V@52A,[email protected],+12V@20A,-12@1A,[email protected]

20 Amps on the 12V ???? on just one rail ???

And then these 500W is the MAX out put not the sustained. When U buy a OCZ they have a max way over how they rate the PSUs since they Use the max Sustainable Amps..

They also just said ATX not ATX 2.0 which is the 24 pin that is needed for the DFI.
Click to expand...

18 amps on the +12v is not bad and will handle anything you throw at it. The PSU's I recommended have 28 and 20 amps respectfully and have 50-66 amps on the +5v rail.
For the money you want find a better PSU.
 
NEVERLIFT said:
For the money you want find a better PSU.
Click to expand...

That might be true but Im u´nsure if itll hold up to DFI MoBo.. And Im almost certaint that it wont hold up to a SLI 2*6800gt setup on a DFI MoBo...

Thing is If u concider puttin 2*100W+ graphiccards on a MoBo that allready demands great amounts of power a cheap PSU is a very expensive way of saving money. Look here what the DFI ppl have to say about PSUs:

http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7952

http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10325

http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7619

http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10785

http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10854


That should show what I mean...
 
Frallan said:
That might be true but Im u´nsure if itll hold up to DFI MoBo.. And Im almost certaint that it wont hold up to a SLI 2*6800gt setup on a DFI MoBo...
Click to expand...

Thats an extreme setup for sure but I think the 28amps would do it, and from what I have read 18 amps on the 12v is good. I also recall hearing that if it the psu has over 18amps on the 12v it needs to be split to dual rails... I could be wrong or misread it but I could of swore thats what it said. So these psu with over 18amps on the one 12v run the risk of messing up.
 
NEVERLIFT said:
Thats an extreme setup for sure but I think the 28amps would do it, and from what I have read 18 amps on the 12v is good. I also recall hearing that if it the psu has over 18amps on the 12v it needs to be split to dual rails... I could be wrong or misread it but I could of swore thats what it said. So these psu with over 18amps on the one 12v run the risk of messing up.
Click to expand...

Well depends on what components U use but. even so that might be why DFI recommends split rails...
 
Frallan said:
Well depends on what components U use but. even so that might be why DFI recommends split rails...
Click to expand...

Yes and I believe this is from sata using 12v and not 5v like ide hdd's do, and the new cpu and videocards out need alot 12v power also. Makes sense to get a dual +12v rail now if you want max stability and will be using alot sata drives and o/cing. I also dont go by the watts when looking at psu's I go by how many amps they put out and how they handle being underload. Them PSU you linked to are very good and only cost $35-50 more so the original poster has alot to choose from.

Edit: Well that one 600w OCZ psu is $200 but its dual rails.
 
why do i feel like this thread just got BOMBARDED?

it turned from me asking some simple questions into people arguing about power sources!


Frallan, you say to get the 3700+, fine, but the MSI Neo4 diamond does not list it as a compatible processor on its site!?! I 'know' the MSI brand. DFI i have no clue

And as far as the enermax PSU, i have looked and see the EG701AX-VE is approved for SLI by SLIZONE.com

I have no freaking clue (after reading a lot of threads) what thes 5v 12v dual rails crap is.

I dont have the cash to thow down on a PCP&C!

Also, what is wrong with the Thermalright x90 heatsink (ill be getting a fan for it?

I already bought it because i got it CHEAP on ebay ( no one was bidding on it ) and read some great reviews for it.
 
Frallan said:
What will U be using it for... The Rev E3 (Venice) is a good thing for U I think especially if Ud like to dualcore (A64 X2) this autumn or next spring. If so a 3200 or a 3500 would be good.

I Ure gonne hold on to the system a while Id get the 3700+ (Rev E4 "San Diego") since it will probably (with som oc) hold up a little bit longer due to the larger cache.

The MoBo is prob. good but the PSU might need some upgrading. Look into the OCZ Power Stream series (the 600 is good).. They are expensive but U want to have it stable so...
Click to expand...


..and to try and get this thread back on track of the original reason i started it,

I will be using if for:

60% multimedia work
25% gaming (HL2, CS:S, Splinter Cell, Madden, Tiger Woods, etc)
15% web surfing, music, etc
 
thenixhex311 said:
why do i feel like this thread just got BOMBARDED?

it turned from me asking some simple questions into people arguing about power sources!


Frallan, you say to get the 3700+, fine, but the MSI Neo4 diamond does not list it as a compatible processor on its site!?! I 'know' the MSI brand. DFI i have no clue

And as far as the enermax PSU, i have looked and see the EG701AX-VE is approved for SLI by SLIZONE.com

I have no freaking clue (after reading a lot of threads) what thes 5v 12v dual rails crap is.

I dont have the cash to thow down on a PCP&C!

Also, what is wrong with the Thermalright x90 heatsink (ill be getting a fan for it?

I already bought it because i got it CHEAP on ebay ( no one was bidding on it ) and read some great reviews for it.
Click to expand...
Sorry for Bombing

Thermaltake xp 90 ok
Enermax EG701AX-VE should be ok however its 180USD... (Well I paid over 200 for mine so I think your right but that was part of the argument we had ;))

See if U can find a MSI Forum where they have tested the 3700+ if there is an incompatibility its probably only a question of a BIOS update.

DFI is right now the quality/overclocking topdog for AMD CPUs and has been for a year and a half or so (2 and a half any1???)... However its not a MoBo for newBs or impatient ppl it requires a lot of work...

Multimedia work as in encoding or as in rendering? If rendering Id get the 3700 and OC a bit if encoding Id get a 3200 to carry U over til autumn when the DualCores come.
 
Frallan said:
Sorry for Bombing

Thermaltake xp 90 ok
Enermax EG701AX-VE should be ok however its 180USD... (Well I paid over 200 for mine so I think your right but that was part of the argument we had ;))

See if U can find a MSI Forum where they have tested the 3700+ if there is an incompatibility its probably only a question of a BIOS update.

DFI is right now the quality/overclocking topdog for AMD CPUs and has been for a year and a half or so (2 and a half any1???)... However its not a MoBo for newBs or impatient ppl it requires a lot of work...

Multimedia work as in encoding or as in rendering? If rendering Id get the 3700 and OC a bit if encoding Id get a 3200 to carry U over til autumn when the DualCores come.
Click to expand...


I've found someone selling the Enermax on ebay for 160.00 so thats not TOO bad...felt it safer to go with something Nvidia recommended.


My thoughts exactly on why i think i should stay away from DFI. I know some things, but if its not going to be that Plug-and-play, and require some decent tweaking, i dont think its for me...

Multimedia work as in Photoshop, Dreamweaver, Director, some video/sound editing.

Another question, how much of a difference will this DualCores show as opposed to if i get a 3700/3800? I mean will it be like HOLY CRAP this is fast, or like a 'WOW, this is faster..ho hum' type deal. I've read somewhere that the DC's will be around 500USD, that right?


thanks for getting back on track and helpin me out Frallan! :D
 
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Yep, that's the San Diego. It comes in two flavors: 3700+ and 4000+. They both have 1mb L2 cache (the difference being 200Mhz in clock speed). The Venices come in 3000+, 3200+, 3500+ and 3800+. Folks have been advocating the 3700+ San Diego over the 3800+ Venice because of the extra 512k cache and the lower price.
 
ohfreak said:
Yep, that's the San Diego. It comes in two flavors: 3700+ and 4000+. They both have 1mb L2 cache (the difference being 200Mhz in clock speed). The Venices come in 3000+, 3200+, 3500+ and 3800+. Folks have been advocating the 3700+ San Diego over the 3800+ Venice because of the extra 512k cache and the lower price.
Click to expand...


im leaning towards getting this processor now, the only thing scaring me now is hearing things about the neo4 mobo not posting with it and then yet another 'what the hell does this mean' thing as far as 2T 1T and bios updates and such
 
I wouldn't worry too much about the 1T vs. 2T at this point... at least until you have yer system together. All of that stuff you can play with when yer ready.

Depending on your board you may need a BIOS flash for everything to function smoothly w/the Rev. E processors (Venice/SD)... but that procedure is no different from what you're used to on your Intel platform.

Definitely take the previous suggestion of checking out MSI's forums... or any forum for that matter (AnandTech, XSystems, etc.) and seeing what kind of trouble/solution people have for that board/CPU combo.
 
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