H55 / H57 mITX boards: post them here

cyberkost said:
Man, do I need Gigabyte H55N-USB3 with 1 more SATA port (4HDDs + 1ODD)) ...
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There have been rather successful builds bypassing SATA for ODD purposes.

The people that bought the original revisions of the Zotac 9300i-based mini-ITX board (which only had 2 SATA ports) have used USB-SATA adapters with very good results. You basically cannibalize a USB bracket (or get a suitable USB connector with a motherboard connector on one end and a female USB connector on the other one), plug in a SATA-USB adapter and plug your SATA ODD to that. A little messy, but it should do the trick, since I don't think many ODDs can either read or write constantly at ~35MBps...
 
Lethal Jelly said:
What would people say is the best mITX board for gaming? building a compact rig to carry back and forth between Japan and the UK. Tom's Hardware did a group test back in February and said the ECS H55H-I

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/h55-h57-motherboard,2555-22.html

but a fair few board have been released since then.
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Been lurking in this forum for a few days now, and I'm also after SFF gaming setup. I see a lot of the H55 boards have heatsink issues due to the placement of the CPU on the board. This one seems to have a better placement, no reviews for it yet that I can find.
 
Lethal Jelly said:
I was looking at the gigabyte but the bit tech review shows poor game performance: http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/mo.../gigabyte-ga-h55n-usb3-mini-itx-motherboard/1
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Hmmm, remember they are comparing mini-ITX AND uATX mobos. And the Gigabyte actually fares very well when you only look at the mini-ITX boards (top spot for one of them, third one on the other, with a higher average fps count and a minimum fps count only 1fps below the board placed on 2nd place).

It is a well-known fact that smaller motherboards will have slightly lower performance that bigger ones. It's just the way it works, unfortunately, it's physics rearing its fugly butt (smaller PCBs mean closer traces, closer traces mean more crosstalk, more crosstalk means more overhead to correct transmission errors). Same thing happens to uATX boards: even if we've come to the point they are very good, the best ones in terms of overclocking and performance are still ATX. And don't forget the "YMMV" thing: that board might have been a dud, due to normal manufacturing variances.

Also, do consider the "Performance Analysis" section:

BitTech said:
that's hardly a damning criticism, as by installing a card that's longer than the board and taller than the CPU cooler, you'd have to house the system in a micro-ATX case, and which point you should opt for a more adaptable micro-ATX motherboard. Overall then, it's a mostly impressive outing for the H55N, with the only downside a practical irrelevance
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If you want to game hard (to the point where PCIe performance would make a difference), you are on the wrong form factor... For just about anything else, you should be good to go.

Now, sorry for the OT, but I'd like to know something: are there USB3 drive cages (multiple-drive enclosures) available as of yet? Or USB3 hubs + straight USB3-SATA cables (no enclosure, just the USB and SATA terminations)?

[EDIT]Hmm, that H55H-I from ECS is oddly up on the table, since it apparently also is a mini-ITX board. I can only assume the USB3 controller is messing up the Gigabyte board more than usual, since the ECS board is basically a no-frills solution, and DIRT CHEAP at that... hehe)[/EDIT]
 
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Murgh Bpurn said:
Been lurking in this forum for a few days now, and I'm also after SFF gaming setup. I see a lot of the H55 boards have heatsink issues due to the placement of the CPU on the board. This one seems to have a better placement, no reviews for it yet that I can find.
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Its better for the PCIe, But that may be too close to the top & in alot of cases you may have issues with that as a horizontal 120mm cooler would overhang the board & then may be into something else.
 
bastage said:
Its better for the PCIe, But that may be too close to the top & in alot of cases you may have issues with that as a horizontal 120mm cooler would overhang the board & then may be into something else.
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Let's face it: mini-ITX boards are pretty much like shooting fish in a barrel when it comes to space constrains (i.e., you WILL have them). Unless the basic I/O connections also migrate to the CPU on desktop parts (that is, the Southbridge being moved either to the CPU die or to the CPU package), a 2-chip design is basically as low as you can go with x86-derived stuff. And chip sizing can't reduce much more, either, since smaller chips are harder to cool down.

The only CPU cooler that *might* not have issues with this kind of socket placement would be something that would allow for the socket contact to be moved about freely from the main dissipation body (which is NOT easy to do, to say the least). Probably something with a fixed copper base which you would bolt down to the socket, with two channels and a screw hole on top to fit the heatpipe assembly and bolt everything together.

That would be a MAJOR pain to install, though. However, if done right, you might be able to end up with a vertical-or-horizontal cooler. Probably very expensive, unfortunately, and heat transfer is bound to suffer with the added layers. I reckon that mini-ITX CPU coolers will probably (and unfortunately) have to be somewhat limited to the Intel-mandated minimum socket clearance (on Intel-based builds, I don't know if AMD also imposes something similar), which is a shame, since I do feel that a horizontal 12cm fan covering the entire upper motherboard area is probably the easiest way to cool down the whole system while keeping it low noise (DISCLAIMER: I'm an SPCR fan :p)
 
__Miguel_ said:
Hmmm, remember they are comparing mini-ITX AND uATX mobos. And the Gigabyte actually fares very well when you only look at the mini-ITX boards (top spot for one of them, third one on the other, with a higher average fps count and a minimum fps count only 1fps below the board placed on 2nd place).

It is a well-known fact that smaller motherboards will have slightly lower performance that bigger ones. It's just the way it works, unfortunately, it's physics rearing its fugly butt (smaller PCBs mean closer traces, closer traces mean more crosstalk, more crosstalk means more overhead to correct transmission errors). Same thing happens to uATX boards: even if we've come to the point they are very good, the best ones in terms of overclocking and performance are still ATX. And don't forget the "YMMV" thing: that board might have been a dud, due to normal manufacturing variances.

Also, do consider the "Performance Analysis" section:


If you want to game hard (to the point where PCIe performance would make a difference), you are on the wrong form factor... For just about anything else, you should be good to go.

Now, sorry for the OT, but I'd like to know something: are there USB3 drive cages (multiple-drive enclosures) available as of yet? Or USB3 hubs + straight USB3-SATA cables (no enclosure, just the USB and SATA terminations)?

[EDIT]Hmm, that H55H-I from ECS is oddly up on the table, since it apparently also is a mini-ITX board. I can only assume the USB3 controller is messing up the Gigabyte board more than usual, since the ECS board is basically a no-frills solution, and DIRT CHEAP at that... hehe)[/EDIT]
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DFI's board performance is up there almost on top of other boards on most reviews I have read
 
__Miguel_ said:
Let's face it: mini-ITX boards are pretty much like shooting fish in a barrel when it comes to space constrains (i.e., you WILL have them). Unless the basic I/O connections also migrate to the CPU on desktop parts (that is, the Southbridge being moved either to the CPU die or to the CPU package), a 2-chip design is basically as low as you can go with x86-derived stuff. And chip sizing can't reduce much more, either, since smaller chips are harder to cool down.

The only CPU cooler that *might* not have issues with this kind of socket placement would be something that would allow for the socket contact to be moved about freely from the main dissipation body (which is NOT easy to do, to say the least). Probably something with a fixed copper base which you would bolt down to the socket, with two channels and a screw hole on top to fit the heatpipe assembly and bolt everything together.

That would be a MAJOR pain to install, though. However, if done right, you might be able to end up with a vertical-or-horizontal cooler. Probably very expensive, unfortunately, and heat transfer is bound to suffer with the added layers. I reckon that mini-ITX CPU coolers will probably (and unfortunately) have to be somewhat limited to the Intel-mandated minimum socket clearance (on Intel-based builds, I don't know if AMD also imposes something similar), which is a shame, since I do feel that a horizontal 12cm fan covering the entire upper motherboard area is probably the easiest way to cool down the whole system while keeping it low noise (DISCLAIMER: I'm an SPCR fan :p)
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I got an AXP-140 to fit on my H55N-USB3 with no mods.
 
fr500 said:
DFI's board performance is up there almost on top of other boards on most reviews I have read
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No objection there whatsoever, though that board is P55, not H55, so you don't actually need to print a truckload of traces on the PCB just to enable video output (which is rather substantial, actually), which makes things a little bit easier.

The same thing happened with the first very high-end (and expensive) uATX mobos (like that high-end mini-ITX DFI board), they were right up there breathing on the shoulders of full ATX boards, to the point it now has basically trickled down to the whole uATX line. Mini-ITX is the same thing, you CAN do it (within limits, of course... Expecting a mini-ITX motherboard to topple a full-blown ultra-high-end OC-designed ATX mobo is wishful thinking, right?), but it's not easy (in fact, it's way harder than uATX and ATX, due to those limitations I referred), especially if you don't really have experience with it.

Like everything, there's still room for improvement, and we'll probably see improvements over time, but right now mini-ITX is still new tech. Just keep things in perspective, there ARE limits to what you can do with PCBs with low layer counts, which is the only way to cut costs down without sacrificing major features.

Anyway, I don't want to stray too much from the topic. We can pick this up via PM if you want, but I think we're clear on each other's positions on the subject, right?

[EDIT]@Kasei: Damn, that's probably one of the smallest clearances I've EVER seen on computer hardware... Can you post a picture of the whole setup? I'd like to see if the cooler overhangs anywhere. Thanks! [/EDIT]
 
Sure. I haven't finished putting everything together but I'll post some pics once it's done, probably in a day or two.
 
SG05 (300W version). I wanted the all black interior 450W one but looks like it's only availble in Japan. :(
 
opinena, yay!! That it one densely packed case. Great job!! I haven't finished going through the gallery, but have several questions already:
1. What are the cables (data & power) you use in conjunction with your slim DVD drive? Did these come with the case? Can they be obtained separately?
2. I need to make do with fewer SATA ports on the motherboard than I have SATA drives. You seem to have 4 SATA drives (2HDD+1SSD+1ODD), but only 3 SATA ports on the motherboard. How did you make it work?
3. Is putting what looks like a 80mm fan *under* the AXP-140 your idea? Something suggested by Thermalright?
 
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cyberkost said:
opiena, yay!! That it one densely packed case. Great job!! I haven't finished going through the gallery, but have several questions already:
1. What are the cables (data & power) you use in conjunction with your slim DVD drive? Did these come with the case? Can they be obtained separately?
2. I need to make do with fewer SATA ports on the motherboard than I have SATA drives. You seem to have 4 SATA drives (2HDD+1SSD+1ODD), but only 3 SATA ports on the motherboard. How did you make it work?
3. Is putting what looks like a 80mm fan *under* the AXP-140 your idea? Something suggested by Thermalright?
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Silverstone Sugo SG05B
DFI MI P55-T36
OCZ 8GB (2x4) DDRIII 1333MHz CL9
Intel Core i7 860 2,8GHz
Intel X-25 M 80GB SSD - system
WD Scorpio Black 320GB 2.5" - data
WD Scorpio Blue 500GB 2.5" - data
DVD-RW - Sony Optiarc Slim Tray
Thermalright AXP-140
Silverstone 450W SFX 80+Bronze
Gigabyte HD 5850 OC
front fan 120mm Noiseblocker 1000rpm
cpu fan 120mm low-profile (12mm) Scythe 1000rpm

Fan the AXP-140 is 60mm Scythe 2500rpm but it is very quiet when it is switched on the CPU temperature is about 3-4 degrees lower, so I just thought of how to utilize the space inside the cooler, 3 HDDs connected to the plate and slim drive is Sata E-Sata reduction ViPowER VP-9218.
 
.. so there's a USB cable routed to the outside of the case and plugged into one of the USB connectors, right?
 
cyberkost said:
.. so there's a USB cable routed to the outside of the case and plugged into one of the USB connectors, right?
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classic usb bracket into the board, the already mentioned Bracket Adapter and adapter cable E-SATA to SATA slim drive.

somewhere on the forum has already been dealt with it as it is involved, see section Silverstone Black Box, the SFX Source 450W, DFI P55-T36 or Silverstone Sugo SG05B


my English is very poor so it is perhaps to understand the pres Google Translate :)
 
cyberkost said:
.. so there's a USB cable routed to the outside of the case and plugged into one of the USB connectors, right?
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I found it at

This is a classic white bottom usb bracket, which is used as PCI blind in the back of the box, I simply removed the piece of metal,adapter is more to the left under the fan, the involvement is next-in boards will come soon join the USB bracket, into the previously mentioned Vipower adapter, the adapter cable that has one end of the e-SATA and SATA on the other, engage in SATA DVD drive and you are done, it looks complicated but it's nothing, in the afternoon when he arrives from work for complementing still photos, prices adapter is around $ 18, since the matter was some time in the market as the manufacturer's site I just found a similar modification.
 
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