GTX 1080 now or wait for Vega?

Should I get a GTX 1080 now or wait?


  • Total voters
    151

Nenu

[H]ardened
Joined
Apr 28, 2007
Messages
19,868
980ti ended up comparing pretty favorably to the 1080, I'm framing mine when I'm done with it :p
Yeah, that kind of performance difference was something I would have upgraded to when I was on cheaper cards because the cost didnt impose on my other hobbies.
But at performance end prices, I want a bit more espesh with 4K knocking at my door.
Being a 60fps min whore I want it to be close to Titan XP performance.
 

Ieldra

I Promise to RTFM
Joined
Mar 28, 2016
Messages
3,539
Yeah, that kind of performance difference was something I would have upgraded to when I was on cheaper cards because the cost didnt impose on my other hobbies.
But at performance end prices, I want a bit more espesh with 4K knocking at my door.
Being a 60fps min whore I want it to be close to Titan XP performance.

Yeah I hate playing at low framerates, I always prefer lowering some settings. I was watching a benchmark video on youtube of a guy running a Pitan at ~1850mhz in Ark. Max settings ***1080p*** ; barely 60fps, dips to mid 40s. Ouch.


Sheer amount of objects onscreen is insane though, can't wait for DX12 version and (praying) enormous optimization patch.
 
  • Like
Reactions: noko
like this

housecat

Gawd
Joined
Jan 26, 2005
Messages
753
Here's my situation: I have a 4K monitor that I got mainly for work. I don't play games nearly as often as I used to, but every now and then I still find time to enjoy it. My GPU (Radeon 7970) is getting long in the tooth, and clearly can't power most modern games at 4K (though it seems to do OK at 2560x1440 in Fallout 4 with some settings turned down). The two games coming out later this year that I really would like to play are Deus Ex: Mankind Divided and Dishonored 2. Should I go ahead and get a GTX 1080 right now? Or wait for Vega?

Interesting side note, the last NV GPU I bought was the original GeForce 256 SDR (VisionTek, IIRC). Then I had a long string of Radeon GPUs:

8500 -> 9600 XT -> X850 Pro -> X1950 Pro -> 3870 -> 4870 -> 5870 -> 7970

1080 now. If you haven't seen by now that AMD can no longer match NV on the high-end, I'm not sure what to tell you. They have a more efficient design with Pascal anyway, and that won't change with Vega regardless of what anyone says. You're just waiting for disappointment, get the 1080 now and enjoy it for a long time.
 

Nenu

[H]ardened
Joined
Apr 28, 2007
Messages
19,868
buy now or forever be waiting. 1080 ti is not even confirmed at this point.
No shit sherlock :p
I'll stick with a 980ti at 1080p if they dont release the 1080ti - with higher fps than a Titan XP @ 4K.
I wont buy a Titan because I have better things to do with my money and dont mind waiting for 4K.
Too much money at the moment for the fps sacrifice.
I dont need a faster card for 1080p and 1080p on a PJ looks fucking awesome!
 

NKD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,850
Yeah I hate playing at low framerates, I always prefer lowering some settings. I was watching a benchmark video on youtube of a guy running a Pitan at ~1850mhz in Ark. Max settings ***1080p*** ; barely 60fps, dips to mid 40s. Ouch.


Sheer amount of objects onscreen is insane though, can't wait for DX12 version and (praying) enormous optimization patch.

Dude my jaw just dropped! Are those graphics mind blowing or what? I am surprised this is the first time I am seeing this. My jaw is dropping right now lol. For a long time I thought crysis set the graphics standard. But this is just looks like the next major step. When I saw the beach area with water/wet sand and the vegetation I was like holy shit!
 

NKD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,850
I wanna know the 7 people who voted wait for something else! I wonder how long they have been waiting, hahaha!
 

pendragon1

Fully [H]
Joined
Oct 7, 2000
Messages
32,752
I always vote "wait" because I want to encourage people that feel the need to ask this to just keep waiting for the next best thing in a never ending perpetual wait cycle. "should I wait for the next best thing" is a pointless question because the next best thing is always just a couple months away...
 

Maddness

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Oct 24, 2014
Messages
1,254
I wanna know the 7 people who voted wait for something else! I wonder how long they have been waiting, hahaha!

That originally was my thinking. But myself, I have waited long enough. My 7950 just doesn't cut it, so I'm going to get a 1080. I can't or won't wait any longer for AMD to sort out there shit.
 

razor1

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
10,120
I think 1070ish performance is what to expect from Vega. R&D matters.

It does, but if that is all they get, this generation will be a bigger step back then the Fiji. I can't see that being helpful in turning AMD's woes around.
 

NKD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,850
For Vega they need to just get the right clock speeds. Because they need to feed those shaders. if they can't that will suck, but lets hope polaris has been a learning experience. They had a few revisions so looks like they are still tweaking the 14nm finfet and global foundries is pain like always taking forever to get shit straight. lol
 

razor1

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
10,120
For Vega they need to just get the right clock speeds. Because they need to feed those shaders. if they can't that will suck, but lets hope polaris has been a learning experience. They had a few revisions so looks like they are still tweaking the 14nm finfet and global foundries is pain like always taking forever to get shit straight. lol

All the talk about the front end changes in Polaris, I don't see anything really outside of the tesselation performance increases. I know it has some better throughput though but not the degree AMD elluded to, I think, if I remember correctly AMD stated something like 20% more, I don't see outside of *special* situations. So unless they overhauled their front end from Polaris again.....

What I think the IP changes are is more to specific feature sets, like DX12.1, with better CR's things like that, I don't see or can even fathom them doing radical changes in architecture for Vega to overcome the perf/watt and through put gap respective of their nV counterparts outside of the use of HBM 2.

PS I think the changes AMD has to make for them to really become competitive again, is much deeper then just front end, I think their transistor arrangement and possibly even shader array structure has to change. And this is the area where as transitions to new, smaller nodes has become much more expensive, and time consuming.
 
Last edited:

Shintai

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 1, 2016
Messages
5,678
It does, but if that is all they get, this generation will be a bigger step back then the Fiji. I can't see that being helpful in turning AMD's woes around.

It was nothing but fairy tales in terms of turnaround. They dont have the R&D to compete in any meaningful way in GPU or CPU. And CPU made sure GPU would fail forever to the point that R&D wise, they are a good 3-4 years behind today. The current arrogance is now that they haven't focused completely on semicustom and dumped PC. Because they are endangering their future semicustom business that is over 60% of the company now. But again, the server dreams killed everything before, so why not continue.
 

Shintai

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 1, 2016
Messages
5,678
For Vega they need to just get the right clock speeds. Because they need to feed those shaders. if they can't that will suck, but lets hope polaris has been a learning experience. They had a few revisions so looks like they are still tweaking the 14nm finfet and global foundries is pain like always taking forever to get shit straight. lol

While 14LPP isn't going to do any good nomatter how long they try. The uarch is the second problem. There is no easy solution. The solution cost R&D $ and a couple of years. Something they are not spending. And I wouldn't be surprised if Polaris is going to get rebranded until 2020.
 

NKD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,850
While 14LPP isn't going to do any good nomatter how long they try. The uarch is the second problem. There is no easy solution. The solution cost R&D $ and a couple of years. Something they are not spending. And I wouldn't be surprised if Polaris is going to get rebranded until 2020.

Sure I will believe you in 2020. Improvements to a new process will always be made and I am sure there are plenty here that can confirm it with me. I am not expecting them to hit 2ghz. I am expecting them to be able to refine the process enough to get another few hundred mhz stable. I don't think that is unrealistic. But then again if amd succeeds it might hurt your feelings. We know it. Because we all know you are hoping they fail, I am sure I can dig through your 300+ posts and they have nothing positive to say about anything amd.
 

Ieldra

I Promise to RTFM
Joined
Mar 28, 2016
Messages
3,539
Sure I will believe you in 2020. Improvements to a new process will always be made and I am sure there are plenty here that can confirm it with me. I am not expecting them to hit 2ghz. I am expecting them to be able to refine the process enough to get another few hundred mhz stable. I don't think that is unrealistic. But then again if amd succeeds it might hurt your feelings. We know it. Because we all know you are hoping they fail, I am sure I can dig through your 300+ posts and they have nothing positive to say about anything amd.

The actual process is improved to a certain extent over the duration of it's run, but for all intents and purposes there won't be drastic improvements it's really up to AMD to improve their design with Vega if it's going to clock higher
 

NKD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,850
The actual process is improved to a certain extent over the duration of it's run, but for all intents and purposes there won't be drastic improvements it's really up to AMD to improve their design with Vega if it's going to clock higher

I am not not looking for drastic. I was saying if they are getting 1300 easily on most chips now may be they can go 1450-1500 with vega. I don't think that is drastic by any means.
 

razor1

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
10,120
That can be very drastic, a 10% - 15% increase we are talking about in frequency, that is a large amount if the design of the chip doesn't support that flexibility.

Clock frequencies in Polaris, well GCN in general, its a transistor layout issue, which will influence architectural design, its even at a lower level then architectural design. The question is did AMD have the time to do such changes, they have about 6 more months over Polaris for Vega, I don't think that would be enough time.

Depending on transistor layout, and gate layout, architecture is designed based on these when talking about power consumption and frequency targets. Cause voltage can change dramatically if there is a misstep here. Now I'm not an EE so someone with an EE background probably can go into this more deeply, but the premise is, AMD vs, nV the difference is here by nV using custom libs they were able to circumvent these problems, well not problems by base lines over the standard libs available, but they have been doing this for a very long time, since the g80, AMD has not to my knowledge by doing this as of yet.
 
Last edited:

razor1

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
10,120
ah cool!, hmm maybe you can help with what I just stated then about design and power targets and frequency lol. I know many things you might be still under NDA, but in general lol.
 

NKD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,850
OP here, thanks everyone for your input! I decided to just enjoy what's out right now instead of waiting for the next big thing. Just ordered a Gigabyte G1 GTX 1080 :)

Thats what I am talking about lol! Nice choice. I am impressed with my evga card. I don't think I can ever try anything else. The suckers are quiet and cool like crazy!
 

morfinx

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
1,105
ah cool!, hmm maybe you can help with what I just stated then about design and power targets and frequency lol. I know many things you might be still under NDA, but in general lol.
15% frequency lift would be pretty large for the same uarch. Keep in mind these are not CPUs, where traditionally there are many parts of the chip that are custom designed for max frequency. One of the reasons GPUs can be released at such a fast cadence is because they are for the most part synthesized. Meaning instead of laying out custom circuits by hand, you write the chip in a hardware description language (Verilog), then commercial EDA software automatically lays out the actual circuit (automatic place and route). I'm simplifying the process a great deal, but you get my point. The upside is faster time to market. The downside is the max frequency tends to lower. Although even CPUs nowadays are going more and more synthesized route. But, it's been a few years since I left, so I have no idea what they are working on now. So maybe they'll come up some voodoo magic for Vega. I wouldn't know :)
 

NKD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,850
I am trying to get one now, waiting for Newegg to stock them Gigabyte or Asus

Might wanna consider them evga as well. you will be surprised how good their coolers are. I think I have heard more complains about gigabyte and asus getting louder but I have evga and that thing keeps in the high 60s and quiet as hell.
 

Ripskin

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 15, 2004
Messages
2,376
I'm still on my 7970, I have about 5 games that I am waiting to play after I upgrade, with a few more on the way I am looking forward to. While I will get the best card I feel matches the performance and price I dont mind waiting a bit as I have a lot of games now that my card can drive. I prefer to play at 5760 X 1200 but some games dont do ultra wide very well.

I am waiting till fall to see what happens with the Ti or the 490. If nothing, a 1080 is still a great card and should be cheaper by then. If the Ti or 490 comes along or is on the way then I'll have some options to weigh.

Most of the games I am waiting to play I have waited to purchase so no rush for me and I'll save some money. I too plan to keep this card for a while, the 1080 looks like it will last a decent amount of time.
 

Maddness

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Oct 24, 2014
Messages
1,254
I'm still on my 7970, I have about 5 games that I am waiting to play after I upgrade, with a few more on the way I am looking forward to. While I will get the best card I feel matches the performance and price I dont mind waiting a bit as I have a lot of games now that my card can drive. I prefer to play at 5760 X 1200 but some games dont do ultra wide very well.

I am waiting till fall to see what happens with the Ti or the 490. If nothing, a 1080 is still a great card and should be cheaper by then. If the Ti or 490 comes along or is on the way then I'll have some options to weigh.

Most of the games I am waiting to play I have waited to purchase so no rush for me and I'll save some money. I too plan to keep this card for a while, the 1080 looks like it will last a decent amount of time.

I'm in the same boat as you. I have a 7950 that is in urgent need to be put out to pasture. I was holding out hoping AMD would release something worthwhile of an upgrade this year. Now that Vega isn't here until at least the first quarter of 2017, I am going to get a 1080. Most likely the EVGA after NKD's glowing recommendation. That and a nice 27" 1440p Gsync monitor.
 

killianss

Weaksauce
Joined
Mar 15, 2010
Messages
126
Might wanna consider them evga as well. you will be surprised how good their coolers are. I think I have heard more complains about gigabyte and asus getting louder but I have evga and that thing keeps in the high 60s and quiet as hell.
Thanks good idea, I like the idea of the step up as well.
 

skeeder

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 9, 2004
Messages
1,315
I voted now. Because often this forum gets stuck on the future. If vega is anything like Polarius, it won't be worth the wait.

The other alternative is two RX480's in crossfire.
 

n370zed

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 21, 2012
Messages
438
I'm still holding onto my 780 Ti that has a 2500k at 4.5ghz and 16GB ram. Looking to build me a new rig with a newer cpu this Christmas so I'll be buying whatever Nvidia or AMD has to offer at $650-$750 mark.
 

Maddness

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Oct 24, 2014
Messages
1,254
I gave up waiting and caved in today. Seeing as Vega isn't here till next year and the computer shop down the road had $160 off the EVGA 1080FTW, I pulled the pin. Added 100 on the core clock and runs stable at 2100 at 60 degrees quiet as a mouse. Sorry AMD, but I couldn't wait any longer.
 
Top