GPU prices — is the worst behind us ?

LukeTbk

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
1,616
next time I start thinking GPU prices are stupid high (because they are) I'll just glance at this receipt from Dubai
For a reference the exchange rate in early 2012 was only 3.67 AED by USD so you do not even divide those price by 4, that an over $100,000 USD bill.

That said if you go take a drink somewhere that look like this, you probably expect higher than even at the movie theater price:
Cavalli-Club.jpg
 

UltraTaco

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 21, 2020
Messages
150
I don't care anymore. I was holding out for a while, but I couldn't take it and I blew $1,500 on a GPU from eBay.

At first I felt kind of bad, but I got to build my new computer and I am 100% happy with it. Not gonna let market forces dictate my life. You only live once.
[in Russian accent] Taco know you still feel guilty about it : ) it was a traitor move, comrade, and the punishment is heavy, but you shall be redeemed.

TO THE LABOR CAMP!!!!!!
 

Marees

Gawd
Joined
Sep 28, 2018
Messages
997

Andrew_Carr

2[H]4U
Joined
Feb 26, 2005
Messages
2,322
Yeah, this year has been really weird. You had people selling stuff in anticipation of EIP-1559 and ETH 2.0 coming. Then China unexpectedly actually cracked down on miners. This had a huge positive benefit for ASIC miners outside of China and helped offset decreasing profits for ETH miners. The hashrate has crept back up and profits will probably continue to decrease though. Just a matter of time I guess until people start to capitulate and sell their GPUs unless prices rise further.
 

DPI

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 20, 2013
Messages
12,066
Looks like prices have bottomed out (atleast in German markets)

View attachment 390204
3DCenter.org (@3DCenter_org) Tweeted:

https://twitter.com/3DCenter_org/status/1432251491583021057?s=20
Mostly misleading data every time that site is linked, for reasons too boring to rehash because most people don't care about nuance.

Prices are actually on the rise on GPUs. And forecasts have GPUs and consoles across the board going up as we head into holiday (think $1100-1200 PS5s on secondary markets)
 
Last edited:

LukeTbk

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
1,616
Worthless data every time that site is linked, for reasons too boring to rehash because most people don't care about nuanced.

Prices are actually on the rise on GPUs. And forecasts have everything across the board going up as we head into holiday (think $1100-1200 PS5s on secondary markets)
Think there is a misread, this is exactly what the message you quoted is saying....
 

Flogger23m

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jun 19, 2009
Messages
11,999
Mostly worthless data every time that site is linked, for reasons too boring to rehash because most people don't care about nuance.

Prices are actually on the rise on GPUs. And forecasts have GPUs and consoles across the board going up as we head into holiday (think $1100-1200 PS5s on secondary markets)

Prices were dipping down, demanding was slowing (slightly). Seems like that is on the reverse now.

I sold my RTX 2070 for around $450 or so. The RTX 3060 was about to release and I assume that would put downward pressure on the used RTX 2***. Little did I know prices would get bumped up and the 3060 itself would be impossible to keep in stock. Probably could've sold it for $600 or so. Family member sold a GTX 1070 for around the same price as I did with my 2070.
 

GreenLaser

n00b
Joined
Sep 24, 2020
Messages
56
Sounds like game on to me
My severely dented wallet agrees... the HDR popping ...er exploding color is AWESOME! ....now how to shove the old 1080ti into my wallet?

The combo had OLOY 2x 8gb memory in it ...seems rated well online but i never heard of it before.
 
Last edited:

Icecold

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 21, 2013
Messages
270
This forum's FS/T section is actually a pretty solid barometer of the overall GPU situation. As things started to ease up for a bit you actually saw a fair amount of decently priced GPU's and they weren't instantly snatched up, but there's not many GPU's for sale currently. I do think the worst is behind us, though, but GPU's will probably be expensive and hard to come by until Ethereum goes proof of stake, which could easily be way further out than Q1 2022 like they say it will. Looking at Newegg though there actually are some fairly priced(for this market) 6600xt and 6700xt combos. The new APU's from AMD are staying in stock as well. When it was really bad even 6700xt's were super hard to come by. I guess the only good thing about the whole thing is a lot of older cards found new homes. I have a 980ti I bought for $175 2 years ago and it can provide acceptable framerates(70+) on modern games I play at 1440p if I drop the textures to medium-ish. Even something like a 7970 can probably run current games at a lower resolution and low settings.
 

Saabjock

Gawd
Joined
Sep 1, 2005
Messages
584
I want the top-end ARC GPU.
That is actually the one I am most excited about.
It should offer me more than enough performance for what I am doing in the PC space.
With Intel being a new player and looking to gain a foot-hold, I'm hoping they won't immediately go the silly route AMD did.
Sure!...AMD sold stuff but those sales do not represent real market growth since they were not wide spread.
Bulk sales to mining farms right off the bat was not a smart position to take.
AMD screwed up royally with that strategy and they unfortunately, do not yet see how.
They're focused on the massive profit margin of that one product...the GPU.
Had they influenced the AIBs to get many more of those GPUs to gamers, the resulting word-of-mouth could have generated sales ten-fold moving forward.
You cannot gain that kind of market advertising and influence by any other means.
The other failure is in the form of a slowdown of sales of other AMD related components, due to difficulty obtaining the very GPU.
How many guys do you think elected NOT to build a new computer, simply because they could not get a graphics card to match the build?
I personally know of at least nine.
Nvidia does not take a 'hit' in that area simply because graphics card are their core product to consumers.
They're not yet producing CPUs or widely adopted chipsets, etc...
The delay of builds has pushed what could have been an AMD boom, right up against Intel's new processor release.
With supposedly better pricing and comparable performance, guess which one has the potential to gain additional market share?
 
Last edited:

1_rick

2[H]4U
Joined
Feb 7, 2017
Messages
2,069
Had they influenced the AIBs to get many more of those GPUs to gamers, the resulting word-of-mouth would have influenced sales ten-fold moving forward.
They could have sold ten times as much as "every card we make", huh? Nice work if you can get it.
 

sc5mu93

Gawd
Joined
Jul 11, 2018
Messages
682
Since AMD has both high performing GPU and CPU IP, I would like to see them construct a more dedicated "gaming APU". maybe quad core (SMT enabled) CPU, and the MAX the hell out of the die space with GPU IP.
Historically, they have put more CPU resources on APUs and only modest increases in GPU IP. Given where discrete graphics products are heading, and the fact neither NV or AMD are looking at entry level discrete, I would like to see AMD attempt to address that market with a better gaming APU.

but I think high prices for GPUs are now here to stay. People are buying all the GPUs AMD and NV can pump out at inflated prices. No need to lower prices, possibly ever.
I hope intel affects that calculus, but I think they will price inline with inflated AMD and NV products.
 

Andrew_Carr

2[H]4U
Joined
Feb 26, 2005
Messages
2,322
Since AMD has both high performing GPU and CPU IP, I would like to see them construct a more dedicated "gaming APU". maybe quad core (SMT enabled) CPU, and the MAX the hell out of the die space with GPU IP.
Historically, they have put more CPU resources on APUs and only modest increases in GPU IP. Given where discrete graphics products are heading, and the fact neither NV or AMD are looking at entry level discrete, I would like to see AMD attempt to address that market with a better gaming APU.

but I think high prices for GPUs are now here to stay. People are buying all the GPUs AMD and NV can pump out at inflated prices. No need to lower prices, possibly ever.
I hope intel affects that calculus, but I think they will price inline with inflated AMD and NV products.
I wish I could track it down, but prior to the 5xxx series APUs being released someone predicted that the GPU improvements would only be modest and that the vega architecture actually works better for the APUs due to limitations on the APU side that don't really exist on the GPU side. I wish I could track it down because it was a pretty good explanation on why it's more difficult than just cramming in top end GPU and CPU components into a single chip. But it would be nice to kill off low end GPUs with APUs. It would basically give everyone a console-lite in their desktop computer and help bring down pricing for people that aren't hardware fanatics.
 

vegeta535

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 19, 2013
Messages
7,372
Since AMD has both high performing GPU and CPU IP, I would like to see them construct a more dedicated "gaming APU". maybe quad core (SMT enabled) CPU, and the MAX the hell out of the die space with GPU IP.
Historically, they have put more CPU resources on APUs and only modest increases in GPU IP. Given where discrete graphics products are heading, and the fact neither NV or AMD are looking at entry level discrete, I would like to see AMD attempt to address that market with a better gaming APU.

but I think high prices for GPUs are now here to stay. People are buying all the GPUs AMD and NV can pump out at inflated prices. No need to lower prices, possibly ever.
I hope intel affects that calculus, but I think they will price inline with inflated AMD and NV products.
They have them. They are call PS5 and Xbox.
 

sc5mu93

Gawd
Joined
Jul 11, 2018
Messages
682
I wish I could track it down, but prior to the 5xxx series APUs being released someone predicted that the GPU improvements would only be modest and that the vega architecture actually works better for the APUs due to limitations on the APU side that don't really exist on the GPU side. I wish I could track it down because it was a pretty good explanation on why it's more difficult than just cramming in top end GPU and CPU components into a single chip. But it would be nice to kill off low end GPUs with APUs. It would basically give everyone a console-lite in their desktop computer and help bring down pricing for people that aren't hardware fanatics.
oh yeah, i dont expect it to be as easy as just "add part X, and delete part Y" but I think the market is there for a config like that, especially since there have been little movement in the low end/ entry level dGPU market. And current APUs aren't there yet.
 

Marees

Gawd
Joined
Sep 28, 2018
Messages
997
If the GPU prices remain elevated, then AAA game developers might lose revenue as gamers would hold back on purchases till they can upgrade GPU

As a result, game developers might be forced to target Steam deck like devices

Cloud gaming service providers also could benefit from delay in upgrading GPUs

https://www.extremetech.com/gaming/327190-will-higher-pc-component-prices-drive-gamers-away

While the differences between the Switch and the Steam Deck are numerous, the form factor itself would still represent a disruption for the PC space, which has never had this kind of mainstream device. Nintendo has long proven that careful game design can compensate for limited hardware specs, so it’ll be interesting to see how (or if) the Steam Deck impacts the wider market. These trends could even reinforce each other, would people tapping a Steam Deck-like device in docked mode for AAA cloud gaming and using it in handheld mode (via the cloud or local storage) for on-the-go play.
 

DooKey

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 25, 2001
Messages
10,566
If the GPU prices remain elevated, then AAA game developers might lose revenue as gamers would hold back on purchases till they can upgrade GPU

As a result, game developers might be forced to target Steam deck like devices

Cloud gaming service providers also could benefit from delay in upgrading GPUs

https://www.extremetech.com/gaming/327190-will-higher-pc-component-prices-drive-gamers-away

NO, there are so many highly capable GPU's out there from the last three generations that it isn't going to hurt game sales. Just because you can't buy the latest generation card to replace your previous generation card isn't going to keep you from gaming or buying games.
 

cybereality

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
8,496
I think more likely devs just won't push graphics as much, or make sure their game scales down to say a GTX 1060.
 

GoodBoy

2[H]4U
Joined
Nov 29, 2004
Messages
2,188
If the GPU prices remain elevated, then AAA game developers might lose revenue as gamers would hold back on purchases till they can upgrade GPU

As a result, game developers might be forced to target Steam deck like devices

Cloud gaming service providers also could benefit from delay in upgrading GPUs

https://www.extremetech.com/gaming/327190-will-higher-pc-component-prices-drive-gamers-away
No, that doesn't make sense. If it's a good game, it will sell.

And the AAA game dev's will want to make it look as good as possible (add rtx +dlss). For those still running a 3 generations back (1080) or older GPU, there are always medium and low settings.
 

cybereality

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
8,496
Even Cyberpunk 2077, maybe the most demanding game in recent times, can run on a GTX 1060.

Not necessarily well, all low settings, 50% render scale, 1080p, but it is playable.
 

DPI

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 20, 2013
Messages
12,066
NO, there are so many highly capable GPU's out there from the last three generations that it isn't going to hurt game sales. Just because you can't buy the latest generation card to replace your previous generation card isn't going to keep you from gaming or buying games.
This.

Nothing happens in all-or-nothing absolutes. "Game developers" will continue to be just fine.
 
Last edited:

travm

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Feb 26, 2016
Messages
1,451
This.

Nothing happens in all-or-nothing absolutes. "Game developers" will continue to be just fine.
In fact, this likely takes some of the heat off incorporating new groundbreaking features. But I'm sure now that they're all working from home it's expected they work 26 hours a day.
 

JargonGR

Limp Gawd
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Messages
498
I lost interest in high end GPUs and still have a water cooled 1080Ti because I only play 1-2 games per year and maybe less........
I enjoyed the latest hardware up to a point when prices were not ridiculous so that I could just have occasional fun in very short does of 20 minutes sessions...

So now I spent my money elsewhere (i.e. travelling, a home gym, nutrition) and will upgrade much later.........I just don't see the value anymore. I am getting older I guess...
 

Saabjock

Gawd
Joined
Sep 1, 2005
Messages
584
They could have sold ten times as much as "every card we make", huh? Nice work if you can get it.
You do know that quotes are meant for an actual statement...right?
Not sure if you had a moment but I believe I am very clear.
AMD adopted a bad strategy here.
If they wanted to gain market share, they needed to get as much exposure as they possibly could.
That does not happen selling bulk to mining farms, as we all saw in that Dubai video.
 

LukeTbk

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
1,616
Was there anything to the finally ?:
https://www.mooreslawisdead.com/post/nvidia-s-rtx-3060-flood-in-august

Type of news or like most of the time it is a mix of logic, made up stuff, that happen to be right when the guess was good ?

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/shipments-of-grahics-cards-down-but-asps-remain-high

mQEMTcchoGh5XXcc3yp6ag-970-80.png


SgBDcLJqrxFHtunfGikHxf-970-80.png


NVidia Q2 2021 was close to double Q2 2019....... and the biggest ever I think in unit and with the current average price by far in sales $. Amd had one of is samllest one in a while (outside the low Q2 2020) in units.

If there is a jump in Q3 with the said flood, maybe will see some Q3 2017 level (but it could have been false).

They're focused on the massive profit margin of that one product...the GPU.
Is that true ? I thought because of CPU smaller size (and thus I imagine higher margin) they were prioritized after console by AMD:

https://www.hardwaretimes.com/1-mil...f-amds-7nm-capacity-at-tsmc-3-4-for-big-navi/

Their GPU sales are quite low, not just relative to the demand but even relative to 2019.
 

1_rick

2[H]4U
Joined
Feb 7, 2017
Messages
2,069
AMD adopted a bad strategy here.
If they wanted to gain market share, they needed to get as much exposure as they possibly could.
Funny, I'd have thought selling every card they could make was a great way to gain market share. Perhaps you can find an economics major and ask them.
 

LukeTbk

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
1,616
Funny, I'd have thought selling every card they could make was a great way to gain market share. Perhaps you can find an economics major and ask them.

I doubt it was every card they could make (you have to make a choice with limited 7nm production and so on), they lost 15% of their marketshare in the last 12 months in the Dgpu market I think


Q2'20Q1'21Q2'21
AMD20%19%17%
Nvidia80%81%83%
PC dGPU shipment market shares


Which was I assume the best decision (better to make smaller CPUs and not break contract with console makers), at least I do not see any reason to doubt it.
 

LukeTbk

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
1,616
That does not happen selling bulk to mining farms, as we all saw in that Dubai video.

With the canvas that I know nothing about supply chain, retail and what could be going on, the fact the video show regular retail box and from not only different models (going back to 580) but different brands (Sapphire, PowerColor, XFX) does not screem to me that the person had a direct bulk buying deal with AIBs (and if they did it would have been with many of them for an extremelly small number of cards overall but even more so by models, which is not bulky), that seem an amount-distribution someone with a connection and buying from a distributor or an actual shop (or even a group hussling with bots selling to them) could have, without buying directly from Sapphire, it could be anywhere below the chain.
 
Top