GPU prices — is the worst behind us ?

RPGWiZaRD

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At least in europe the pricing has stalled completely and bet they are very reluctant to lower it, no wonder... hopefully something starts happening soon, the pricing both makes me laugh and cry at the same time.
 

Axman

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can you please elaborate on those claims for those of us who are not fluent when it comes to reading or speak Techanese?

Sure.

AMD released a free-to-all, pretty universal piece of software that lets low-powered video cards basically take small, lower-detail video game scenes, and blow them up to larger resolutions, without looking bad. That's an oversimplification, but still basically what's FSR in this context.

So now both AMD and Nvidia are focused on low-power gaming chips since they can make these lower-cost parts run games, games that would normally not be able to run well, or even run at all, on that kind of hardware.

You can now scale video games with FSR support to run on what are essentially mobile parts. Sure, there is plenty of room for super-extra-heavy-duty video game machines, and they'll be able to run games at insane frame rates, even at crazy-high resolutions, but for regular screens, these low-power parts will be enough. At least for games that support it, but it's got a lot of game developers excited.

On top of that, because Steam just introduced the Deck, which is basically a laptop built into a joystick, they're putting pressure on developers to support their system, which, fingers crossed, means that they will want to update older games, too.
 

Gigantopithecus

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Or just the second a PS5 digital edition is possible for people to buy in store, an argument could be made that for a large range of game that it will be quite the time for low-mid budget gamers in that regard (and possibly that PC will need to compete with that when it happen).

For a PC gaming purist, this is awful.

A $400 PC absolutely can't compete with the performance of a $400 PS5 Digital Edition. Hell, even with pre-pandemic pricing, a PC that performs about as well as a PS5 (i.e., 3700X CPU + 5700XT GPU) was north of $1,000.

I am concerned about the long-term viability of "budget" PC gaming - it won't make economic sense to roll your own budget build unless gaming is unimportant to you. The consoles will be that much better and cheaper for gaming and streaming.
 

LukeTbk

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A $400 PC absolutely can't compete with the performance of a $400 PS5 Digital Edition. Hell, even with pre-pandemic pricing, a PC that performs about as well as a PS5 (i.e., 3700X CPU + 5700XT GPU) was north of $1,000.

Ie thus the point that if (that a big if) it would be possible to buy that right now, what gaming was possible for $400 + tax for someone with already a TV is currently quite something.

And when that become possible, it could pressure AMD-Nvidia-Intel to make an counter offer in that price range, there will be a demand for a 2070super -5700xt super video card (i.e. make your old computer a PS5 type of machine) for a smaller price than a PS5 and I imagine an offer for it, I would imagine in the first 6 month after it is possible to buy the new console we will see them. Just having 3060 ($330) and 3050Ti at MSRP available would do just that.
 

motqalden

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Prices on FB marketplace here in Vancouver Canada have dropped 25-30% or more from what was being asked for these cards a month ago.
 

HAL_404

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Sure.

AMD released a free-to-all, pretty universal piece of software that lets low-powered video cards basically take small, lower-detail video game scenes, and blow them up to larger resolutions, without looking bad. That's an oversimplification, but still basically what's FSR in this context.

So now both AMD and Nvidia are focused on low-power gaming chips since they can make these lower-cost parts run games, games that would normally not be able to run well, or even run at all, on that kind of hardware.

You can now scale video games with FSR support to run on what are essentially mobile parts. Sure, there is plenty of room for super-extra-heavy-duty video game machines, and they'll be able to run games at insane frame rates, even at crazy-high resolutions, but for regular screens, these low-power parts will be enough. At least for games that support it, but it's got a lot of game developers excited.

On top of that, because Steam just introduced the Deck, which is basically a laptop built into a joystick, they're putting pressure on developers to support their system, which, fingers crossed, means that they will want to update older games, too.

thanks for bringing me up to speed on this
 

wandplus

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Sure.

AMD released a free-to-all, pretty universal piece of software that lets low-powered video cards basically take small, lower-detail video game scenes, and blow them up to larger resolutions, without looking bad. That's an oversimplification, but still basically what's FSR in this context.

So now both AMD and Nvidia are focused on low-power gaming chips since they can make these lower-cost parts run games, games that would normally not be able to run well, or even run at all, on that kind of hardware.

You can now scale video games with FSR support to run on what are essentially mobile parts. Sure, there is plenty of room for super-extra-heavy-duty video game machines, and they'll be able to run games at insane frame rates, even at crazy-high resolutions, but for regular screens, these low-power parts will be enough. At least for games that support it, but it's got a lot of game developers excited.

On top of that, because Steam just introduced the Deck, which is basically a laptop built into a joystick, they're putting pressure on developers to support their system, which, fingers crossed, means that they will want to update older games, too.
Wait a minute, are you saying even if they come out with a desktop RTX 3050 Ti, I should probably wait for the next generation video cards?
 

Axman

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Wait a minute, are you saying even if they come out with a desktop RTX 3050 Ti, I should probably wait for the next generation video cards?

Oh, no, nothing like that. FSR already works on this generation's hardware. It works all hardware going all the way back to Polaris and Pasqual, IIRC.
 

D-EJ915

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At least in europe the pricing has stalled completely and bet they are very reluctant to lower it, no wonder... hopefully something starts happening soon, the pricing both makes me laugh and cry at the same time.
at this point retailers are not wanting to price lower than what is profitable since distributors were cranking up prices sky high
 

Zedicus

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you have 3 months of respite. come this holiday season it will be difficult to get anything due to it being the holidays. then around February crypto will start up-trending again. even if BTC fell to 24,000, it would not be enough to drop the GPU market considerably, and honestly it seems like 28,000 is the floor.
GPU's mine ETH or some other ALT, but right now the crypto market is in lock step with BTC.
 

GoodBoy

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Crypto's have all dropped in value (the ones I am familiar with anyway), so new miners, and existing miners that were thinking of expanding, might be rethinking it.

Ebay has cards near retail now. Watch out for the scams tho, the box only, picture only, heatsink only, or the shipping charge scams: 3090's for $9 but $1100.00 shipping (probably a scam, if someone didn't notice and bid it to $1000...). The legit ones sell quickly but they are there.

Demand has to be lessening... I finally got a card at retail at a BestBuy (below retail actually, had to wait in line overnight but it was worth it, had a 10% off one item coupon from rewardzone), so there's 1 less customer looking for a card.
 

jlbenedict

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Crypto's have all dropped in value (the ones I am familiar with anyway), so new miners, and existing miners that were thinking of expanding, might be rethinking it.

Ebay has cards near retail now. Watch out for the scams tho, the box only, picture only, heatsink only, or the shipping charge scams: 3090's for $9 but $1100.00 shipping (probably a scam, if someone didn't notice and bid it to $1000...). The legit ones sell quickly but they are there.

Demand has to be lessening... I finally got a card at retail at a BestBuy (below retail actually, had to wait in line overnight but it was worth it, had a 10% off one item coupon from rewardzone), so there's 1 less customer looking for a card.

that is what I see... just random browsing on Newegg in GPU section , there have been products (sold by Newegg) showing up over the past few weeks..

Granted.. not at prices that I will pay for.. but they have been in stock finally.. for multiple days in a row.. so that is at least a "positive" sign, if you want to spin it that way 🤣
 

sfsuphysics

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the prices on GTX 970's on ebay are dropping and I think it's a good indicator of where the market is at since it's one of if not the least expensive but still very capable gaming GPU's ... MSI Gaming 4G's @ $200 shipped was unheard of during the past year or so
Yup, it was the reason I was considering a graphics card a bit higher than my original aim (3060ti) but nothing happened so nope. Although kind of glad, because the 970 is still a great GPU, and would make for a nice emulator rig for my kid.
 

tosgamer

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Crypto's have all dropped in value (the ones I am familiar with anyway), so new miners, and existing miners that were thinking of expanding, might be rethinking it.

Ebay has cards near retail now. Watch out for the scams tho, the box only, picture only, heatsink only, or the shipping charge scams: 3090's for $9 but $1100.00 shipping (probably a scam, if someone didn't notice and bid it to $1000...). The legit ones sell quickly but they are there.

Demand has to be lessening... I finally got a card at retail at a BestBuy (below retail actually, had to wait in line overnight but it was worth it, had a 10% off one item coupon from rewardzone), so there's 1 less customer looking for a card.
The high shipping amount isn't a scam. They are trying to save the buyer's some sales tax. Ebay collects sales tax for the item amount and not shipping charges, at least in California.
 

DanNeely

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The high shipping amount isn't a scam. They are trying to save the buyer's some sales tax. Ebay collects sales tax for the item amount and not shipping charges, at least in California.
No, that just means it's a tax scam. 🤔
 

Bigbacon

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The high shipping amount isn't a scam. They are trying to save the buyer's some sales tax. Ebay collects sales tax for the item amount and not shipping charges, at least in California.

on ebay, they are not. they are trying to use the shipping as an added value to get more money out of the deal assuming you won't actually look at how much they paid to ship the item.

Ebay will force a shipping refund if you catch the sellers doing this.

It also reduces the fees ebay receives as well and is against ebay policy.

Ebay takes the shipping fees into account anymore. they learned this trick a long time ago.
 

tosgamer

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Ebay will force a shipping refund if you catch the sellers doing this.

If Ebay will force a shipping refund then why does ebay ask the seller specifically how much they want to charge for handling when they list the item?
 
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Crypto's have all dropped in value (the ones I am familiar with anyway), so new miners, and existing miners that were thinking of expanding, might be rethinking it.

Ebay has cards near retail now. Watch out for the scams tho, the box only, picture only, heatsink only, or the shipping charge scams: 3090's for $9 but $1100.00 shipping (probably a scam, if someone didn't notice and bid it to $1000...). The legit ones sell quickly but they are there.

Demand has to be lessening... I finally got a card at retail at a BestBuy (below retail actually, had to wait in line overnight but it was worth it, had a 10% off one item coupon from rewardzone), so there's 1 less customer looking for a card.

Once all the big spenders have their cards, the market will have to cater to us cheapskates. Cash flow is just as important as margin.
 

Guarana [BAWLS]

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If Ebay will force a shipping refund then why does ebay ask the seller specifically how much they want to charge for handling when they list the item?
Ebay can't always predict shipping charges. Especially over larger or oversized items.

But a GPU that weighs under 5 lbs? They know it doesn't cost 1000$ to ship. (Esp since tracking info can tell package sizes, etc.)
 

Lakados

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They will plateau soon still above retail because the up-channel distributors were marking them up as well, so they will only be able to lower them so much until the prices upstream come down to a point where they could hope to recover the losses. Hopefully, some of the scalpers are forced to take a bath on them but they probably made more than enough profits from this that it will hardly matter.
 

bigdogchris

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I've been doing some thinking lately about companies that normally sell at MSRP (like Best Buy, New Egg, Amazon, etc) and how they are now also 'gouging'.

I think, if I were a business owner, would I want to be the go to vendor for 'scalpers' who would just buy at my MSRP price and flip it for double the price? You would almost expect people to laugh at your ignorance as a business owner that people can do that to you. It gives me some empathy to businesses that increase prices to meet market conditions.

Where I would not feel empathetic would be the manufacturers, who could be empowered to create false shortages to trigger market adjustments like this. I think manufacturers should sell at whatever the original markup would be.
 

Saabjock

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Price decreases will stall and stay elevated until the market reaches a point of saturation and people no longer feel the need to pay out their a**es.
That is the 'new' sales model for retailers...gouge as long as twice the cost can be obtained.
Give no customer service and no after-sales support.
Sad!
 

dub77nj

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It does seem that amd prices have hit their ceiling and just because they are the only thing available doesn't mean people will pay. Nvidia is still much more indemand but I'm seeing them be in stock for a longer period recently but still hard to get. I think the prices have plateaued in terms of retail but they won't be going back down any time soon.

Edit to add that secondary sellers on places like Amazon and Newegg will have to start dropping their prices closer to retail.
 
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Endgame

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saw my first 3070ti in stock at microcenter . 1100 for a zotac though - not a brand I would actually want to buy
 

Mchart

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I've been doing some thinking lately about companies that normally sell at MSRP (like Best Buy, New Egg, Amazon, etc) and how they are now also 'gouging'.

I think, if I were a business owner, would I want to be the go to vendor for 'scalpers' who would just buy at my MSRP price and flip it for double the price? You would almost expect people to laugh at your ignorance as a business owner that people can do that to you. It gives me some empathy to businesses that increase prices to meet market conditions.

Where I would not feel empathetic would be the manufacturers, who could be empowered to create false shortages to trigger market adjustments like this. I think manufacturers should sell at whatever the original markup would be.
At least if you buy at retail MSRP scalp prices you'll have a warranty. A lot of these manufacturers won't honor the warranty if you aren't the original retail buyer.
 

cybereality

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At least if you buy at retail MSRP scalp prices you'll have a warranty. A lot of these manufacturers won't honor the warranty if you aren't the original retail buyer.
I bought a 6800XT off ebay and XFX did let me register without any issue, but we will see if I ever need warranty support. I know that has been a problem in the past.
 

Saabjock

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Warranty is another aspect of sales.
My company wanted to test a piece of software recently and the department head decided to look on ebay for a GPU since he simply wanted to test.
He settled on two PNY GTX1060-6GB XLR8 models from two different suppliers.
One was brand-spankin' new...the other used.
The used one worked flawlessly.
The new one badly artifacted right out of the box. It was a new, shrink-wrapped card w/ all accessories.
Pny refused to warranty the card citing the fact that though brand new, it did not come from one of their 'approved vendors'.
It was...in my mind, a 'cop out'
Many of my previous cards up to this point were PNY branded.
I'm not comfortable with how that situation got dismissed without a proper resolution.
It was a major f**kup on PNY's part.
The company's business sees them buy thousands of videocards every few years.
Taking a hard-lined stance on what is essentially a $160-180 part, was not smart.
 
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GoodBoy

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I've been doing some thinking lately about companies that normally sell at MSRP (like Best Buy, New Egg, Amazon, etc) and how they are now also 'gouging'.

BestBuy hasn't scalped. They've tried using slowing/bot interrupting techniques on their webstore, but hackers defeated that in April. For the 3080Ti launch it was in-store only limit 1 per customer, and they just did that again for all 3000 series GPUs (and I finally got 1!). The online store became a bot heaven once they figured out how to bypass the 'please wait', but at least they have been trying.
Newegg has been scalpy in their pricing, or only selling GPU's in a bundle with a mobo or PSU, something you may not want or need. They do the random daily drawings - but scalpers can bypass that by having 100 newegg accounts.. It's a mix of doing some scalping themselves while trying to be anti-scalper. It hasn't been a very good solution.
MicroCenter does the random drawings, and if you are picked you have 10 minutes to reply/buy the item - and once you win one, you are ineligible for any more drawings for 30 days. This has been a good solution too, avoids the botnets and waiting in line all night, but you are at the whim of RNG.
Amazon - they are a bot's heaven - never heard of anyone getting a card there at the normal price. The bots are too good.

I think, if I were a business owner, would I want to be the go to vendor for 'scalpers' who would just buy at my MSRP price and flip it for double the price? You would almost expect people to laugh at your ignorance as a business owner that people can do that to you. It gives me some empathy to businesses that increase prices to meet market conditions.

But the vendor selling at inflated prices doesn't really solve the problem either, they are just taking advantage of the situation. To me, this would leave the taste of shit in my mouth that I would not soon forget.. honestly, its not worth it for them to be the scalper.
I'm thankful that BestBuy and Microcenter never pulled any shenanigans...
The online stores have it harder, but I think Amazon could come up with something but they haven't even tried that I am aware of.
Amazon didn't do anything to offset the hackers, but they are soo big now it would be like a elephant trying to get that gnat off its ass that it can't even tell is there..
Newegg took advantage to bundle shit and increase sales of tangential products... they are diminished in my eyes and are a vendor of last resort for me now. I'll even go to Amazon before I go to Newegg.
 
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sharknice

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BestBuy hasn't scalped. They've tried using slowing/bot interrupting techniques on their webstore, but hackers defeated that in April. For the 3080Ti launch it was in-store only limit 1 per customer, and they just did that again for all 3000 series GPUs (and I finally got 1!). The online store became a bot heaven once they figured out how to bypass the 'please wait', but at least they have been trying.
Newegg has been scalpy in their pricing, or only selling GPU's in a bundle with a mobo or PSU, something you may not want or need. They do the random daily drawings - but scalpers can bypass that by having 100 newegg accounts.. It's a mix of doing some scalping themselves while trying to be anti-scalper. It hasn't been a very good solution.
MicroCenter does the random drawings, and if you are picked you have 10 minutes to reply/buy the item - and once you win one, you are ineligible for any more drawings for 30 days. This has been a good solution too, avoids the botnets and waiting in line all night, but you are at the whim of RNG.
Amazon - they are a bot's heaven - never heard of anyone getting a card there at the normal price. The bots are too good.



But the vendor selling at inflated prices doesn't really solve the problem either, they are just taking advantage of the situation. To me, this would leave the taste of shit in my mouth that I would not soon forget.. honestly, its not worth it for them to be the scalper.
I'm thankful that BestBuy and Microcenter never pulled any shenanigans...
The online stores have it harder, but I think Amazon could come up with something but they haven't even tried that I am aware of.
Amazon didn't do anything to offset the hackers, but they are soo big now it would be like a elephant trying to get that gnat off its ass that it can't even tell is there..
Newegg took advantage to bundle shit and increase sales of tangential products... they are diminished in my eyes and are a vendor of last resort for me now. I'll even go to Amazon before I go to Newegg.

Newegg has been the worst of all them. They started with the bundling but now they have also just straight up raised the prices of the items. Look at how much more this costs than November. They also increased the shipping cost.

1627316874244.png


I was lucky enough to get this card in November and was forced to combo it with memory I didn't need. And they actually sent me 2 x 8GB instead of the 2 x 16GB. And there was no way to resolve this through their website unless I returned the 3090. I called customer service and waited on hold before giving up.

Newegg was already last on my list for buying things. So I guess they didn't lose me as a customer or whatever, but now I speak out about how shitty they are on forums whenever they're brought up.
They were last on my list before because of the tax bullshit they pulled and they had their site hacked for an unknown amount of time (at least weeks) where new customers would get their credit card, address, etc. sent directly to hackers.
 

DPI

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Newegg has been the worst of all them. They started with the bundling but now they have also just straight up raised the prices of the items. Look at how much more this costs than November. They also increased the shipping cost.

In fairness your comparison has nothing to do with Newegg, though. MSI has progressively raised their MSRP's since launch.

1627331078994.png
 
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cybereality

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Honestly, the makers of the product should be the ones making the money. Not some 2-bit scalper on ebay.
 
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