Google Finds No Privacy On Private Roads

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by HardOCP News, Aug 25, 2008.

  1. oROEchimaru

    oROEchimaru [H]ardness Supreme

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    there arses might get sued soon.. or they'll blame it on the photographer who will get canned.

    its inveitable until they get shot. i can't wait till they do this during hunting season lol... that guys tires will be slashed and his car will be all fucked up.

    don't mess with texas, or rednecks in wisconsin that pretend they are from texas, at least thats what most of the rednecks from my highschool pretended to be.
     
  2. Ockie

    Ockie *** Self Proclaimed Storage King ***

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    While you are correct in your description, the HOA or coop generally does not bar the public from using it's roads, unless of course it's gated. So while it may be private, it's still publicly accessible, therefore Google vans can have access.

    Google should be able to take pictures wherever a car can go on the map (roads, not offroading) without having to circumvent security gates, but that is just my oppinion.
     
  3. vengence

    vengence Level capped

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    The only time they donate the land to the HOA instead of the city is so they can put a gate up.

    I have no problem with google taking pictures from PUBLIC property. The problem is many people think that if it is a road it is public property. It's not. If it is a PUBLIC road, then it is, if it is marked as private, it is no different than if it were grass. If they mark it as private, then it's private. That's what private means, no public. A no tresspassing sign is reduntant. You put a gate up because you are afraid people won't respect the laws. If you don't have a front door, is it suddenly some how ok for me to come inside and take pictures of the inside of your house?
     
  4. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics I don't get it

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    I'm waiting for the day that Google unveils "Property view" where you can get a view of the entire property too, I mean hell if there's no fence up it's perfectly legal to walk into the backyard and film everything right?

    Or Houseview! (now you better lock your doors).... otherwise Google teams will film every squarefoot of your house (then all your Texas people can shoot them though :D)
     
  5. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics I don't get it

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    Ack, damn quick post...

    Anyways, from what I understand its legal to film private property as long as you do it from public land (paparazzi live off this law), however if you need to go onto that private land to "get a better shot" you're trespassing which is illegal (and there doesn't need to be any signs, gates or fences up either :p).

    Hey if you have a quartermile long "driveway" I'm sure you probably got the cash to sue Google, so no biggy.
     
  6. Ockie

    Ockie *** Self Proclaimed Storage King ***

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    A car can't drive through a front door and google does not map the inside of homes.

    Actually, every house that has not been built privately have pictures. In fact, every house with an insurance policy or tax policy will have a picture of it search-able publicly. You should even be able to get full property information from your city records. If you bought your home from a realtor market or you had renovations done, you may be able to even find inside pictures.

    And as for your question about fences, HOA homes does not always have fences because the properties are deemd to be accessable by everyone. I hate this rule, because I always find kids running in my back yard.
     
  7. Ockie

    Ockie *** Self Proclaimed Storage King ***

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    Google should inventory everything, and those who does not approve, their addresses and streets should be removed from all their programs and software.

    Ironically, if google did not map ones neighborhood and streets, people will be in a major uprise. Almost double standards.
     
  8. NKDietrich

    NKDietrich [H]ardness Supreme

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    They do remove some stuff on request, evidently. The Citigroup call center where I used to work is suspiciously absent from Google Streetview. The business park where it is located is fully mapped, but no shot with an angle that shows the building is actually there.

    People get upset about being raped by a credit card company, so security there was rather tight. (I.e. we had retinal scans to get into the building, RFID to get out or move between floors.)
     
  9. Loki008

    Loki008 2[H]4U

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    Untill you get into issues like were discussed above, easements and adverse possession.

    Its not a difficult concept, its quite simular to the argument that is often brought up over intelectual property issues we see here.

    Party A owns a road.
    Party B drives up and down the road every day

    Party A never objects, it is assumed after the statute of limitations for trespass has expired that you have implied consent for party B to use the property in such a manner and an easement is created.

    Now if party A objects and persues trespass charges or makes efforts to physically block access from Party B using the road, then you have asserted your rights and the countdown to the easement stops and is reset on the next violation.

    In the tech field this is the argument of trademark holders having to agressively protect their IP issues. If they are aware of and make no effort to protect their trademark they lose it to public domain, such as what happened to the terms Asprin, Zipper, Jello (not to be mistaken with Jell-o) ect. This was most reciently seen with the case of Apple objecting to the latest trademark that NYC was filing, as well as T-Mobile objecting to the use of their trademarked color in other companies marking materials.
     
  10. Techx

    Techx [H]ardness Supreme

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    wtf do people have to hide is what i want to know..
     
  11. gdonovan

    gdonovan [H]ard|Gawd

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    A road marked private in CT is just that- PRIVATE.

    Unless you have business there, you are trespassing.

    See my driveway? It has "NO TRESPASSING" posted at the end of it, violate the clearly posted warning at your own risk.
     
  12. nigerian_businessman

    nigerian_businessman [H]ard|Gawd

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    So much for 'do no evil'.

    While I agree, you have no expectation of privacy on a public street, trespassing on private land is against the law, period. It's not about the pictures, it's about the trespassing.
     
  13. nigerian_businessman

    nigerian_businessman [H]ard|Gawd

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    Your understanding is absolutely correct. There is no expectation of privacy in public areas, and further, if it can be viewed from a public area where it is arguable that you had no reasonable expectation of privacy, then it is legal. So to take pictures of someone on a private beach with a telescopic lens from a perch in a tree on public land is perfectly legal. To take a picture of someone in their bathroom undressing to get a shower with the same method is not, because of the reasonable expectation of privacy.

    Really it comes down to this: It doesn't matter if they're taking pictures, doing a U-turn, or stopping to take a break. To do it on private property without consent of the owner is trespassing, it's against the law, and Google shouldn't be getting away with it just because they're Google.
     
  14. J Macker

    J Macker [H]ardForum Junkie

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    They should try keeping up with the public roads and new developments. There's neighborhoods 2-3 years old where I live and the streets aren't even on google maps.
     
  15. Loki008

    Loki008 2[H]4U

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    The issue really boils down to if it is really private property. As i have pointed out several times with little in a counter argument other than "but... but... but... its private property and i can shoot you if i want." there is still the matter on there likely being a public easment to right of way on the road, private or not. This is the stance that google is taking and unless the complaintant can show otherwise google will likely prevail.
     
  16. Loki008

    Loki008 2[H]4U

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    The new developments is likely the issue at hand. You know those developments that have fun sounding names such as Utopian Way or Glimmering shores, Those are typically private roads, and the type of road that is likely in dispute in this situation.
     
  17. pfunkman

    pfunkman 2[H]4U

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    I know, thing is there are alot of stupid people that believe they actually could do what they where saying and not spend the rest of thier lives in prison.

    You never know, especially when there are texans around :p
     
  18. Chiplg

    Chiplg Limp Gawd

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    You obviously don't live in Texas. Joe Horn called 911 and told them he was going to open fire on the robbers NEXT door. He goes outside and blasts 'em. God bless TEXAS!

    Just look up Joe Horn 911 call. You can listen for yourself.
     
  19. rahlquist

    rahlquist n00b

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    Security through obscurity son, just what I need ever gang banger in the hood to be able to shop what homes to break into on google. Dont even have to leave the house to case the place and see what looks like a secluded easy entry and what doesnt.
     
  20. Furystrike

    Furystrike [H]ard|Gawd

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    I live off of a private road that is NOT upkept or paid for by the government. It is paid for by the 4 homeowners who live off of it. As such, Google sure as hell better get our permission before come out on our private property to take pictures.
     
  21. Draax

    Draax [H]ardness Supreme

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    That really is amazing how a vigilante killing another person over stolen property, when the dispatcher stated the folly of doing so, can somehow be distorted into something worthy of not only supporting but the belief that [insert deity] would support such an action.
     
  22. rhexis

    rhexis Gawd

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    perhaps if the two criminals had stayed in their country of origin and not come here illegally to thieve they would still be alive today. i guess we will never know oh well.
     
  23. vengence

    vengence Level capped

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    Last time I checked, they had no trespassing signs up. They violated them. /thread

    Oh, and they complained immediatly after finding the violation. /thread
     
  24. Loki008

    Loki008 2[H]4U

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    No Trespassing signs do nothing to stop the creation of an easement. You have to actively defend against hostile adverse posession. And once the easement has been created you can scream up and down till you are blue in the face, its too late, the public now has a right to be there and isnt trespassing.
     
  25. Loki008

    Loki008 2[H]4U

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    oh, and the clock on the easement started and the first person without explicit business traveled down that road and there were not active attempts to prevent the use of that property. Once the time passed sufficent to create the easement passed, the easement automatically comes into effect. Now anyone can drive down that road and are technically not trespassing.

    Again see my earlier remarks about gated roads that close at least once or twice a year to keep the public from accesing them to prevent any such easement
     
  26. Justin42

    Justin42 n00b

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    If this was "Microsoft Streetview" and not "Google Streetview", would everyone saying people wanting privacy should just get with the times be saying the same things?

    I still think Streetview is really on the line of what should be allowed-- I think comparing photographs that are in some dusty corner office in some city hall somewhere that people have to hunt down and pay to get copies of to having your address cataloged in a database accessible from anywhere, at any time, from any computer in the world, for free, is ridiculous. Google makes a TON of money, this is not casually taking photographs from the street... at the VERY least I believe Google should have to notify the residents of an area a good amount of time (5 business days?) before they're coming to take pictures, and give clear instructions on how to "opt out" (have your pictures removed before they're even posted). Movie studios have to notify residents in areas where they'll be shooting, why shouldn't Google?
     
  27. bob

    bob 2[H]4U

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    QFT

    Although I dont find it suprising, it still bothers me that someone driving up a driveway, regardless of tresspassing, gets a gun-toting response of "Git the hail offah mah property, 'fore aww reload and shoot again". Lawd forbid someone makes a wrong turn, drives up your driveway, and gets shot in the face for disturbing your dirt/gravel before they had a chance to figure out where they were going.


    In other cases, I would disagree, but seeing as how google went up someones private road for buisness, theres not much to be said. Google trespassed. Though, I have to ask... So what? In the scope of things that a company can do wrong, tresspassing for a picture on an open driveway isnt exactly something that will stir up lawyers and the news. Is it wrong? Yes. Should they have done it? No. Will anyone actually do anything about this? No.
     
  28. Gorankar

    Gorankar [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Personally, I think the local authorities should just follow those people around and ticket them every time they do it. Google will either stop the practice or people will stop wanting to do the job for Google unless Google is paying the fines. If the benefit outweighs the fines Google may continue, but that would likely end with them in civil court with much larger sums on the line.
    Privacy may be a thing rapidly fading into history, but I would like to hold onto it a bit longer.
     
  29. Technoob

    Technoob [H]ardness Supreme

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    I guess that whole "don't be evil" thing is just pr bullshit. Fuck google. Go sell out to china some more.
     
  30. gaspah

    gaspah 2[H]4U

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    yeah its trespassing.. they should be prostituted... :)
     
  31. jnmunsey

    jnmunsey Limp Gawd

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    I was about to write, "come try to take image of my private road in Texas." First, I'll know somebody is coming down, and second, I'll have my shotgun ready. If I see it is Google I will blow the hell out of the car and confiscate the data...
     
  32. pfunkman

    pfunkman 2[H]4U

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    :rolleyes:

    You guys make Texans look like fucking morons.
     
  33. qdemn7

    qdemn7 [H]ardness Supreme

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    Texans really don't give a shit what other people think about us, ESPECIALLY people from NYC, Chicago and California and England. :p
     
  34. vengence

    vengence Level capped

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    Wait, I thought that was exactly what they were doing? Was defending your "magical creation of an easement". Sorry, but you don't know what your talking about.

    I'm going to walk onto your property and put up a tent in your front yard. At which point your going to come home and find me. I'll then claim squatters rights. According to your logic, since I set up the tent and you didn't defend it for those 2 hours before you got home, I can do this.
     
  35. HardOCP News

    HardOCP News [H] News

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    my biggest issue is not so much the "private road" stuff, that is pretty black and white. If it says no tresspassing...you deserve whatever happens to you.

    My issue is with the attitude that no one deserves privacy and we should just "get over it."

    :mad:
     
  36. Loki008

    Loki008 2[H]4U

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    That is bascially how it works. If i came home and you were there and i didnt make any efforts to stop you from using that part of my land for what ever period of time the statute (2 to 7 years for adverse possesion in most cases) calls for at the sunset of that period the squatter has the rights to in this specific example file a quiet title on that peice of property and it legally becomes theirs.

    The difference between your example and mine is that the public is not claiming adverse possesion, but rather claiming a prescriptive easement, which does not transfer ownership, but rather the rights to continue use of the property in such a manner that the adverse party has been using in the past.


    Again this really is only valid for "private" roads in community developments. It is highly unlikely this would take place on someones driveway. In that case it would be trespassing.
     
  37. vengence

    vengence Level capped

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    That is what this case is about. /thread.
     
  38. pfunkman

    pfunkman 2[H]4U

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    So to you private drive = driveway and its just that simple? :rolleyes:
     
  39. Loki008

    Loki008 2[H]4U

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    I will have to look at the article again, but it didnt look like it, it looks like it was about a development.
     
  40. Ockie

    Ockie *** Self Proclaimed Storage King ***

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    Huh? Google vans do not drive in each persons drive way to take pictures... that sounds absurd and wacky.

    I think you are confusing a private road with a private driveway.