Gigabyte Aorus X470 now running at PCIe4

Discussion in 'Motherboards' started by kilroy67, Jul 12, 2019.

  1. kilroy67

    kilroy67 Gawd

    Messages:
    785
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    So here is the really cool thing I noticed, my X470 is now PCIe4 capable after I put my new 3900X in, HWinfo64 reports the PCIE 16 slot and others running at PCIe4, 16GT.
     
    Gamer X and jmilcher like this.
  2. mda

    mda [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,598
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2011
    Will reportedly be disabled with future AGESA patches.
     
  3. dvsman

    dvsman 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,694
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2009
    As cool as it would be to have, I don't have any bits or bobs that can use PCIE4 yet anyway, so maybe I'll upgrade my x470 Taichi to a x570 board when those accessories are more readily available down the road.

    For me it's /shrug right now.
     
  4. Ebernanut

    Ebernanut Gawd

    Messages:
    1,014
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2010
    I saw this mentioned for the Crosshair vii as well.

    If it's not intentionally enabled then I would be cautious using it though since PCIe 4.0 requires much heavier duty traces, I'd be concerned about potentially burning them out if they're not up to the task.
     
  5. jmilcher

    jmilcher [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,239
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    By that time x670 will be a thing
     
  6. jmilcher

    jmilcher [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,239
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    Actually the limit is 6” length at current pci-e 3 specs. So any slot that has a 6 inch trace or short is physically safe per spec. Doesn’t mean manufacturers will enable it though.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
    Ebernanut likes this.
  7. kilroy67

    kilroy67 Gawd

    Messages:
    785
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Gigabyte enabled it with the F40 bios, and of course once you installed a 3000 series cpu. I see now ASUS is now enabling it on certain X470 and B450 boards. I would imagine or would like to believe they tested it in house. I find it doubtful if they enabled PCIe 4 knowing it would blow up motherboards.
     
  8. Ebernanut

    Ebernanut Gawd

    Messages:
    1,014
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2010
    Good to know, I wasn't sure what the exact requirement was I just knew that it had changed because I know at least some of the x570 boards have beefed up trace layers for that reason.

    I've seen speculation that it's not intentional and haven't seen any official word so I figure a little caution is warranted, if it's intentional then I'm sure it's safe.
     
  9. jmilcher

    jmilcher [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,239
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    Yes if there are any additional slots rated for 4.0, they would have to have traces beefed up over 6 inches. I’m glad we can run 4.0 on our x470’s!
     
    Ebernanut likes this.
  10. Mchart

    Mchart 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,293
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2004
    I'd recommend not updating your board if it is working fine right now. AMD has stated it will be hard disabled in their binary moving forward.
     
  11. tangoseal

    tangoseal [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,415
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Update your boards! It wont hurt anything. Just change the toggle in your bios from pcie 4.0 to pcie 3.0.

    I just gamed last night on b450 Aorus M on my 5700xt and 3600 @ pcie 4.0 (as reported in bios and gpuz) and it was rock solid stable.
     
    N4CR and Gamer X like this.
  12. kilroy67

    kilroy67 Gawd

    Messages:
    785
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Apparently none of it matters if its true that AMD will strip out PCIe 4 in future AEGSA updates. They have to justify the hefty price for the X570 boards somehow.
     
  13. jmilcher

    jmilcher [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,239
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    Or they don’t want to risk stability issues with boards that are cheaply made or just plain suck.
     
  14. kilroy67

    kilroy67 Gawd

    Messages:
    785
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Maybe, but that would only be know through testing. I would like to believe Gigabyte and Asus would have tested the boards with PCIe 4 enabled first before enabling it. I saw a article at Guru of a B450 board using a PCIe 4 SSD drive performing very well at PCIe 4 numbers.
     
  15. jmilcher

    jmilcher [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,239
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    And amd would have to rely on manufacturers to test old hardware and certify them.

    So I could see why AMD wouldn’t want to risk it.

    I’ve seen plenty of posts of people running pcie 4 on x470 boards. Doesn’t mean they will all perform well or be stable.

    With AMD doing so well, I understand the hesitation. Intel is looking for any ammo. And even more so, the fan boy club is looking for ammo.

    Much of this hobby is perception to the average consumer. For them perception is reality. Reality is money.
     
    clockdogg likes this.
  16. kilroy67

    kilroy67 Gawd

    Messages:
    785
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    I don’t disagree with you, I don’t see any benefit to PCIe 4 at this point anyhow. That said I do think it is interesting all the same. There isn’t much that separates a good X470 board from a X570 board at this time other than price.
     
    jmilcher likes this.
  17. jmilcher

    jmilcher [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,239
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    I agree entirely. I don’t see the need to upgrade to pcie 4 or to x570. Maybe in a generation or two.
     
    kilroy67 likes this.
  18. Mchart

    Mchart 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,293
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2004
    No, because at a certain point when AMD patches it out of their AEGSA binary that they send to the motherboard makers you'll lose it. If you're stable with the current beta BIOS's that allow the 3000 series to run I wouldn't update again in the future. I know I won't be, unless there is a substantial enough bug that requires me to do so.
     
    jmilcher likes this.
  19. jmilcher

    jmilcher [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,239
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    Exactly this. It works currently. It won’t in the future and that’s a fact according to AMD. If it works now, and is stable, don’t update anything.
     
  20. kilroy67

    kilroy67 Gawd

    Messages:
    785
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    I'm not even sure if the latest bios update F40 from Gigabyte is beta, it only says full 3rd Gen Ryzen support, which has been out since May of 2019. I don't much care if my board has or has not PCIe4 at this point, but I do think this needs to be tested to see if it truly does work and without issue. For AMD just to say they will remove it in a future update is kind of crap. Seriously if it does work, and works well without issue, then why are the X570 boards so much?
     
  21. Mchart

    Mchart 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,293
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2004
    X570 costs more because they are at a minimum now on par with the mid-high end boards that you could get with X470. The gaming pro carbon for instance is still $180 and from a power/build quality standpoint can do everything a decent X570 board can, and this is about the cheapest X470 board available out there that is up to specs from a VRM/Power standpoint.

    As to why AMD isn't leaving the option up to manufacturers for what will get PCI-E 4.0 support or not.. I have no idea. It makes no sense to me. It could be AMD doesn't trust the various manufacturers to quality control what last-gen boards run it fine or not, and AMD just wants to avoid the issue all together. If you ask me, however, it's a pretty obvious attempt at planned obsolescence so they can sell more X570 boards.

    It is crap though, because a higher-end X470 board with good VRM/Power and build quality is for all purposes not a whole lot different from a $200 range X570 board.
     
  22. tangoseal

    tangoseal [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,415
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    That makes no sense what you're saying you're telling people not to Flash to the latest bios because of pcie 4, yet you HAVE to have the latest bios in order to use the zen 2 chips on 400 series boards, this makes no sense what you're claiming.

    You MUST use the latest agesa to enable zen 2. And if it currently uses pcie4 then you have either live with it or turn it off regardless of what is released next.

    Unless you people are installing these chips in 400 series boards stop arm chair quarterbacking what people should be doing.

    I had to buy a 200ge to flash my b450 gigabyte and guess what there is no other option but the current agesa. Pcie4 is just there. There is no other bios available to use zen 2 and have no pcie4.

    Sorry you guys are fake newsing the piss out of this.
     
  23. THUMPer

    THUMPer 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,006
    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    Anyone else getting WHEA errors?
     
  24. tangoseal

    tangoseal [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,415
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Yeah I get them on my x570 board as well. Probably a windows thing right now.
     
  25. Mchart

    Mchart 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,293
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2004
    No, not really.

    The current beta BIOS's with the current AEGSA code work with PCIE 4 and Zen 2 on X470, etc. Future BIOS's with newer AEGSA from AMD will have PCI-E 4.0 on anything other than x570 hard disabled / removed. This is literally what AMD has stated.

    It's really that simple. No one is 'fake newsing' anything here.
     
    Arcygenical likes this.
  26. Keljian

    Keljian Gawd

    Messages:
    640
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2006
    I don’t get why this is a big deal. PCIe 4.0 offers nothing to the average consumer with hardware on the market at the moment. All you are doing is potentially increasing your chance of failure
     
  27. sirmonkey1985

    sirmonkey1985 [H]ard|DCer of the Month - July 2010

    Messages:
    21,359
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    that's never been AMD's style, even when AMD officially said there would be no performance boost overdrive(PBO) on am4 and motherboard manufactures still added it anyways they didn't force them to remove it.. they'll continue to leave it up to the manufactures on whether or not they want to hurt their own sales on x570 to continue supporting pcie 4.0 on x470/b450 boards.. if it does ever get removed it'll be the AIB's, not AMD that removes the support.

    agree, unless it's a board that happens to have pcie 4.0 m.2 support.
     
  28. kilroy67

    kilroy67 Gawd

    Messages:
    785
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    And even then it's only in certain benchmarks, real world performance no difference really.
     
  29. THUMPer

    THUMPer 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,006
    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    I may 'upgrade' from x370 to x570 purely for RAM support and ram OC.
     
  30. Keljian

    Keljian Gawd

    Messages:
    640
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2006
    Even then...
    5gig a sec vs 3.5gig a sec really doesn't make that much difference unless you are moving big files around for a good proportion of the time, it's just a number (same as ram speeds)
     
  31. Gamer X

    Gamer X Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    288
    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2019

    I'd imagine it depends on how much of each PCIe3.0 lane, you are stressing to PCIe4.0. If you run 1GPU and SATA SSD, you probably get less problems than with more stuff hooked to the PCI bus, given the x470 Motherboard designs in contrast to the x570's design.

    And of course, being aware of the potential hazards in doing so and will monitor it.. or know if it goes kaboom... end-user fault!
     
  32. tangoseal

    tangoseal [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,415
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010

    What hazards are there?

    I'm not making fun but the lack of electronics and electrical physics knowledge on the forum is astoundingly alarming.

    Pcie is a serial bus with a 3 layer (protocol layers) design similar to ethernet layering.

    The difference in specifications has nothing to do with voltage or power or wattage or thermal output. It all has to do with bidirectional serialized data transfer rates based on a timing clock. The physics breakdown where there are not enough layers of metal to reduce emi and crosstalk interference. The biggest danger of running pcie4 on a thin, less metal layered board, is you have signal loss which results in latency increases and overhead because yes pcie like ethernet has error correction. Your not gonna burn a black smoldering hole in your motherboard or GPU. Lots of people in this forum have said some incredible stuff man.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2019
    IdiotInCharge and kilroy67 like this.