Gateway FPD2485W - 24" HD LCD

peTeMelster

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yang88she said:
You can just check bestbuy.com and click "pick up" and see what local stores have it.

I've never had an issue w/ returning anything (other than software ie. games etc.)

so returning it, should not be an issue

Well, apparently some people got it for $5xx or some ridiculously low price, rather than $679 (the price listed on the Best Buy site). I'd like to know how. Also, if I open up the monitor and actually use it...then bring it back to Best Buy and ask for a refund, will they give me 100% back (actual refund, not exchange, not store credit) with no restocking/other fees? Even if my refund reason is I just didn't like the monitor, even though there's nothing technically wrong with it/no defects?
 

aeon

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i think they got it with the 10% off coupon. I just picked up my monitor today and they wouldn't let me use the coupon.
 

SteveW928

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peTeMelster said:
Well, apparently some people got it for $5xx or some ridiculously low price, rather than $679 (the price listed on the Best Buy site). I'd like to know how.

I think they were just good at dealing and/or had a great sales manager. The 12% coupon doesn't seem to apply. If I remember, the poster said they argued that they were using it as a TV (as the coupon covered TVs)... and after arguing with a couple levels of management, they finally gave in. But, maybe the sales manager really wanted to make the sale for some reason too.

Anyway, seems like an exception... not the norm. Hopefully there will be some other deals, though the price seems pretty good anyway. But, I think Gateway priced it this way because of things happening in the LCD market... so I will guess that some of the other similar monitors will be forced down into their price range soon.

The Dell can already be gotten at points for these kind of prices... and unless the BenQ offers something really special.. it can't hold its higher price for long.

-Steve
 

aspman

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Steve, it's not only a matter of what kind of electronics this thing is. They just use it's barcode. They have only ids, so if no id in their list, then coupon can't be applied.
 

SteveW928

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Go back and read the post by 1080pee on page 10. I think they kind of went around the whole scanning thing. Sounds like they argued with the sales manager, and got it 'approved' somehow.

It sounds (from what other posters said) that this coupon will NOT work by scanning. The LCD isn't included in the list. So, unless you're a good haggler... I'm doubting you'll get the deal. :)

-Steve
 

bigddybn

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When I picked up the 22" in the other thread I was able to have the coupon applied. The manager just manually adjusted the price down. I argued it was no different then his LCD TVs that the coupon does work for. It has the same inputs and does the same thing.
 

1080pee

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Just to confirm. I did exactly what bigdaddy did. It won't scan or even except it if they type in the bar code. I also said that I didn't want it if they wouldn't give me the discount. Be prepared to walk out. If they say no, go to another and just bite the bullet and pay up. Most of the time in my experience if they won't give it to you after threatening to leave then they definately can't do it.

Another note, has anyone else noticed horizontal banding with this monitor when using the 360 through VGA? To me it's pretty bad in the dark images.

Also, in regards to horizontal tearing, I'm still trying to figure why it's doing it. For some reason it'll be there with the 360-vga and sometimes it's not. Inconsistent but at least there seems to be some way around it.
 
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Not sure if you seen my previous post but it was on the tearing subject. With the dells you had to reduce sharpness or drop down to 720 to get rid of the tearing while using the 360. Perhaps this is the same with the gateway.
 

Wastegate

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No luck with coupon either. Manager was on the phone for 10 minutes, bought it anyway, still a decent price for 24"w.
 

WildSide

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You guys should feel lucky, when--if this thing does become available in canada it should sell for around $1000.00 CDN with tax!
 
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I`m really wanting to buy this monitor but the news I got from gateway doesnt sound good for getting it soon because of being in the UK.

" Regarding your inquiry, Gateway is no longer selling or shipping internationally to Consumer customers. Gateway and eMachines products will be sold through an expanding network of retail partners in the future. I do suggest you can check the retail stores at UK that sells Gateway products for more information. "

The resellers in the UK dont have alot of Gateway products. The only monitor I`ve seen being sold is FPD1960. So I`m left with not many options since I dont want a DELL/Benq since they have problems with the 360.

:(
 

WildSide

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Perhaps someone here on the forum who resides in the states could buy and ship a tested peice overseas? just a thought :cool:
 

Frank_G

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Well I have had this monitor for a couple of days now and have tuned and retuned the color on the monitor several times now and think I have it right where I need it or close! I have been examining the color banding problem that most people have been experiencing with this monitor which I have seen a slight amount on mine. It seems if you set the color in the monitor setup to the warm setting it disappears. So for all of you that are having heartburn with this issue this setting may take care of your problem. As far as the backlite bleed through, give it a few days and let the monitor settle down and get hot and cold a few times it will either get better like mine has or it will get worse in which case I suggest if it is causing you sleeploss from worry RMA it !!! :) That's my take on all this . I am happy with mine just for not having any dead or stuck on pixels and that light doesn't bleed through all over the screen like my Dell 2001 did and I had to RMA it 3 times to get one without stuck pixels and to get the backlite bleed through to just an acceptable level!! I have owned 4 other LCD's and by far this one has been the most problem free yet!!
 

Puterplay

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Will I be happy with this monitor if I am not a "gamer." I will be using it for work related projects, text is very important..WORD...Publishing Programs...some Photoshop...many hours on the internet...as well as an occasional dvd and tv program. My plan is also to use the monitor as a replacement tv for one that is used about five hours a week. All comments welcome. Oh some, may say it is overkill. Please note: I am a bit of a computer junkie: :D
Oh , I went to look at this monitor yesterday at BB. When I went back today to buy it they were SOLD OUT! Next shipment is due next week. Now I have time to procrastinate.
Your advice and comments are welcome.
 

peTeMelster

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PaRaNoiDJaCK said:
I`m really wanting to buy this monitor but the news I got from gateway doesnt sound good for getting it soon because of being in the UK.

" Regarding your inquiry, Gateway is no longer selling or shipping internationally to Consumer customers. Gateway and eMachines products will be sold through an expanding network of retail partners in the future. I do suggest you can check the retail stores at UK that sells Gateway products for more information. "

The resellers in the UK dont have alot of Gateway products. The only monitor I`ve seen being sold is FPD1960. So I`m left with not many options since I dont want a DELL/Benq since they have problems with the 360.

:(

Seems the problem is with the 360, not the monitor. Or at least, nothing has been proven it's the monitor's fault, but there have been several reports of the 360 having problems with 1080p over component.
 

Tim-in-CA

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Puterplay said:
Will I be happy with this monitor if I am not a "gamer." I will be using it for work related projects, text is very important..WORD...Publishing Programs...some Photoshop...many hours on the internet...as well as an occasional dvd and tv program. My plan is also to use the monitor as a replacement tv for one that is used about five hours a week. All comments welcome. Oh some, may say it is overkill. Please note: I am a bit of a computer junkie: :D
Oh , I went to look at this monitor yesterday at BB. When I went back today to buy it they were SOLD OUT! Next shipment is due next week. Now I have time to procrastinate.
Your advice and comments are welcome.

This monitor makes a GREAT non-gamer display as well. If you have DVI on your, you should use that connection (DVI cable is already included :) VGA is also available as well. As for apps like IE / Word / Excel / DT publishing, this display is awesome ... with the 1920x1200 res, you can easily view two docs side by side. Plus, with the autorotation feature, you can view an entire tabloid sized page at once. You need to install the EzTune CD in order to get the auto-rotation to work. As for the TV functionality, using your set top box, you can connect up via component (HD) or S-Video / Composite (SD). I'd recommend getting the speaker bar accessory as well. This gives you a nice integrated look ... the speaker bar sounds great and has touch controls as well and has R/L RCA audio input from your set top box. You can get the speakerbar separately from www.gateway.com ... I don't think that the Best Buy stores have the speaker bar in stock. Good luck ... let us know how it goes!!!

Tim-in-CA
 
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Maybe you guys can help me figure something out about this monitor's 1:1 scaling. The picture below is of the PS3 playing FFXII (a PS2 game). The PS3 plays 480i PS2 games very poorly, but that is a different issue (see http://boardsus.playstation.com/pla...read.id=808212&view=by_date_ascending&page=17). My question is this:

I have this game set to 16:9 mode, and the monitor is set to 1:1 scaling. Thus, I was expecting it to have black bars on the top and bottom -- like a 16:10 display is supposed to look when displaying a 16:9 image. This is how everything else is displaying. However, this game ends up with black bars on the sides, as you can see in the image.

I'm not trying to be off topic here -- I wonder if this can tell us something about the 1:1 scaling of this monitor.

 

iketeru

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shahidhaque said:
Maybe you guys can help me figure something out about this monitor's 1:1 scaling. The picture below is of the PS3 playing FFXII (a PS2 game). The PS3 plays 480i PS2 games very poorly, but that is a different issue (see http://boardsus.playstation.com/pla...read.id=808212&view=by_date_ascending&page=17). My question is this:

I have this game set to 16:9 mode, and the monitor is set to 1:1 scaling. Thus, I was expecting it to have black bars on the top and bottom -- like a 16:10 display is supposed to look when displaying a 16:9 image. This is how everything else is displaying. However, this game ends up with black bars on the sides, as you can see in the image.

I'm not trying to be off topic here -- I wonder if this can tell us something about the 1:1 scaling of this monitor.
I've been playing FF XII as well, and I noticed that 16:9 setting too. When I tried it on my regular CRT TV, it sort of just squished the picture; I'm not sure if outputs in a "true" 16:9 fashion. You have to assume that your display will stretch out the picture, which will look normal if it is compressed horizontally like you show. Maybe try using the "fill" option?
 
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iketeru said:
I've been playing FF XII as well, and I noticed that 16:9 setting too. When I tried it on my regular CRT TV, it sort of just squished the picture; I'm not sure if outputs in a "true" 16:9 fashion. You have to assume that your display will stretch out the picture, which will look normal if it is compressed horizontally like you show. Maybe try using the "fill" option?

Does that look horizontally squished to you? Using the "wide" setting makes it seem horizontally stretched. This 1:1 setting seems to be the accurate picture, but its just strange. Perhaps this game just has a weird resolution. At any rate, since you have confirmed nothing strange with the monitor, its all good.
 

iketeru

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shahidhaque said:
Does that look horizontally squished to you? Using the "wide" setting makes it seem horizontally stretched. This 1:1 setting seems to be the accurate picture, but its just strange. Perhaps this game just has a weird resolution. At any rate, since you have confirmed nothing strange with the monitor, its all good.
I didn't think Vaan was that rail-thin, haha... but I'm just saying what I noticed. I think because the monitor is 16:10, it'll be difficult to get the correct picture on the widescreen mode with ps2 games. Ideally what you'd want is for the monitor to scale to 16:9, but there probably isn't a setting for that on a non-widescreen signal. Anyway, sucks for me too since I wanted to play FF XII on this monitor too.
 

SteveW928

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Here is a new question I just thought of....

What is the expected long term quality for this monitor? I really don't know much about Gateway other then their computers, which weren't what I would call tops in quality. I'm guessing these LCDs are such a different animal, that there really isn't a comparison. But, I'm curious if those who have owned their other LCDs.... do you think they will last as long as other brands like Dell or BenQ?

I guess I can get the 3yr warranty... but I'm hoping for more like 5+ :D

Thanks,

-Steve
 

Frank_G

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This monitor has decent black levels, but no LCD has what you would call complete black! This one looks ok,this web page background looks black as it has on both of my other panels before it(they were S-IPS panel which are supposed to have better color ) !! As far as quality this one has been 100% better right out of the box than either one of my Dells' have been! I have owned a Ultrasharp 2001FP and a Ultrasharp 2005FPW, and have had to RMA both of them 3 times each due to backlite issues, pixel problems(stuck on or dead) , Electronics issues in their circuitry on the 2001. Both of those monitors were RMA-ed, brand new out of the boxes, they were shipped in. So about Quality, this monitor has better Quality to me than either of those were when I received them. Because it is a keeper so far with no issues! Both of the Dell's also had color banding issues till I got them calibrated properly. I hope this helps all of you asking these questions, but, as a rule on Computer parts if it's gonna go bad, it will happen fairly quickly in less than 30 days , at least that's been my experience.
 

JaconKin

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Thanks for letting me know, do you know if it is a dynamic contrast ratio monitor and will actually dim the backlight a bit to help with the black levels.

I am well aware of not getting True Black, but I have a toss up of two monitors. I was set on the LG 204WT 20 inch monitor that I have seen in person and know that it is a high quality monitor that produces decent/really good blacks from others who have the monitor.

The reason I am on the cliff of not getting the LG is due to the fact that the Gateway has two component inputs and the size of the monitor itself and its ability to do a higher resolution mainly 1080.

I intend to double my new monitor once I get one for an HDTV as well, and thus I want to hook up an HDTV Cable Box to the monitor. Having the extra inputs will make this less of a pain in the arse to accomplish.
 

BPini

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Scunner said:
I've been using one for a couple of days now. Here's my observations so far:

1. Beautiful, huge display. Very sharp with great colour. Like others have said, it's exceedingly bright out of the box but a quick adjustment later, and you won't feel like your retinas have been burned into the back of your eyes.

2. No buzzing that I can detect at all. This was the big one for me; I had a 2185 last year, and the buzzing was just unbearable.

3. I see minor vertical banding in certain shades of blue, as posted previously, but nothing severe.

4. Very minor backlight bleed in a couple of the corners, but you'd need all the lights off and a completely black screen to notice.

5. Awesome stand, height adjustment, and rotation. Very smooth mechanically.

6. When I've got AA and AF on, I notice what I can only describe as a brownish ghosting effect at times. A good example would be the flag and teammate death icons in COD2 MP. I noticed some on EQ2 when I enabled AA and AF, but didn't notice it before. Gonna try reducing the filtering to see what effect it has. Anyone else have a similar experience? I'm using an 8800GTX.

I haven't tried my 360 with component, and I don't have the VGA adaptor, so I can't comment on those. Haven't tried DVD yet, simply because I don't watch movies on the pc any more.

Overall, I'm thrilled with this monitor. I tried the 2275 for a day or two prior to the 24, and it was nowhere near as good as this panel. Totally love this thing.


To Number 6:

I have seen this browning ghosting effect. It is minor, but somthing that I definently see. I have noticed it when playing fear and other games mostly. In fear I would see it on the side of columns when the view pans at a quick speed. I have seen it in other games as well but at different levels. I think the color difference between what ever object and what is behind it make the difference. I have seen it in 360 games as well. Now this is the first lcd I have gamed on so maybe it is more noticeable to me.
 

BPini

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I used the coupon at bestbuy and I didn't even argue with the guy. He definently didn't scan the bar code though. I think he just punched it in. I also did it at the customer help desk because I was supposed to be picking up the order I placed on line. But what I did was buy it seperatly with the discount and then cancel my online order.
 
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WildSide said:
Perhaps someone here on the forum who resides in the states could buy and ship a tested peice overseas? just a thought :cool:

The only problem with importing from the USA is the difference in power supply since UK uses 240v. Also they would add a huge amount of extra tax when it comes into europe since it can be used as a TV.


peTeMelster said:
Seems the problem is with the 360, not the monitor. Or at least, nothing has been proven it's the monitor's fault, but there have been several reports of the 360 having problems with 1080p over component.

Yeah the 360 is part of the problem but I would rather not buy a monitor that does have issues since I dont count on Microsoft fixing them soon because there latest update has caused some displays to stop working at 1080p. Anwyay the reason I dont want a Dell is due to component not very good with fast moving games and also the tearing issue at 1080p over VGA. The BenQ has the 1:1 aspect problem which is meant to being fixed with a firmware upgrade but theres no official word on it yet. If theres any other alternative to these apart from the gateway, it would be good to know.
 

Frank_G

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JaconKin said:
Thanks for letting me know, do you know if it is a dynamic contrast ratio monitor and will actually dim the backlight a bit to help with the black levels.

I am well aware of not getting True Black, but I have a toss up of two monitors. I was set on the LG 204WT 20 inch monitor that I have seen in person and know that it is a high quality monitor that produces decent/really good blacks from others who have the monitor.

The reason I am on the cliff of not getting the LG is due to the fact that the Gateway has two component inputs and the size of the monitor itself and its ability to do a higher resolution mainly 1080.

I intend to double my new monitor once I get one for an HDTV as well, and thus I want to hook up an HDTV Cable Box to the monitor. Having the extra inputs will make this less of a pain in the arse to accomplish.
Well not that I have been able to tell yet!! Like I said in the earlier post, blacks due look black for the most part on this monitor they're as good as I have seen.
 

phobic

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PaRaNoiDJaCK said:
The only problem with importing from the USA is the difference in power supply since UK uses 240v. Also they would add a huge amount of extra tax when it comes into europe since it can be used as a TV.

You can double check with the peoplr in this thread that have one, but there's a good chance this monitor is dual voltage meaning all you'll need is an adapter to convert from a US plug to the UK 3 prong plug. I'm using my US bought Dell monitor in Germany right now.
 

unimatrixzer0

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In terms of just using this as a PC monitor are there any areas that this display exceeds above the Dell 2407FPW or problems one has and one doesn't?

Reading about the humming or buzzing noise made me think twice about purchasing this.

I would ask how this does over component from a Comcast or whoever cable HD cable box, but everyone is just xbox xbox xbox xbox...
 

Tim-in-CA

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unimatrixzer0 said:
In terms of just using this as a PC monitor are there any areas that this display exceeds above the Dell 2407FPW or problems one has and one doesn't?

Reading about the humming or buzzing noise made me think twice about purchasing this.

I would ask how this does over component from a Comcast or whoever cable HD cable box, but everyone is just xbox xbox xbox xbox...

I've tried this monitor over Cox HD on both DVI and Component ... both look great!!! The speaker bar option is very cool too as you can connect both the audio from your PC (headphone jack) and from your cable box (L/R RCA) to it. Plus the extra auto-hiding PIP features are way cool as well .... I'd highly recommend this display :cool:
 

Seemore

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I went and picked up a FPD2485w Friday at Best Buy. They wouldn't take the 12% coupon, so I paid full price. The following is an account of the problems I have found with the monitor in my day and a half of working with it.

Unlike the Dell, this monitor has some assembly required, and to get a screwdriver to the monitor stand height tension screw you have to pop off a cover over the screw hole, as the quickstart guide shows. I pushed on the cover gently with my thumb, and the cover promptly broke into 3 pieces. So much for that. Fortunately, you cannot see the hole where the cover goes from the front of the monitor, and it is very small. Not having the cover isn't really an issue.

When you first hook up the monitor, the first thing you will notice is that it is *bright*! As Scunner said, it will burn your retinas. Time to play with those proximity-sensitive controls.

Well, the way these controls work is very cool for exactly 5 seconds, is interesting for another 30, and are simply a painful chore beyond that. The controls are very slow to respond, requiring a 1 second pause between each press, and provide no feedback. To make up for the lack of feedback, the monitor makes very loud noises. The volume setting for the monitor feedback sounds ranges between loud and very loud, or can be turned off, as I chose. The "up-down" control on my monitor has 4 "positions" where you can touch. When using your index finger, the bottom three make the selection go down, and the top one makes the selection go up. I had to train myself to center my finger one knotch higher on the selector in order to stop being frustrated by it sensing down when I meant up. The other way to use the control is to use your thumb and come in "from the side" of the monitor and then you get a 2-up, 2-down behavior, but that hand position isn't very natural. Anyway, a big thumbs down on the controls on this monitor, but hopefully you won't have to use them often.

On to color... I should preface this by saying I work in the film and video industry, and color managing displays is part of my job. I stare at a calibrated Mitsubishi 2070U (probably the finest consumer-grade monitor ever made) all day long. I bought this monitor attempting to replace my trusty 19" Hitachi SuperScan Elite 751, which also has awesome color, or at least it did when I bought it 7 years ago. I can tell 6500K by eye within about a hundred degrees, so I will likely complain about things that wouldn't bother the average user. That said, the FPD2485w has a few serious problems with color.

The biggest issue with this monitor is that it badly crushes blacks. You can almost completely compensate for this by turning up the brightness to 100%, but unfortunately this monitor also increases the lightness of the blackest black (RGB 0,0,0), so you can partially fix the crushing of the blacks only at the expense of reducing your contrast ratio. The crushing was bad enough that I chose to make this compromise, and have my brightness set to 100%, but it is very annoying. I should also note that if you leave your monitor at the default of 80% brightness you will get serious banding in the blues and greens. Setting to 100% helps with this as well.

The second major issue that you *will* notice is that the color presets on this monitor are pretty disappointing.

Game, Picture, and Web mode all distort the color, as with other monitors that have these sorts of presets, and I'm not sure why anyone would use them. "Movie" mode activates the Faroudja chip, which dynamically adjusts the color based on what is currently on the screen. When this technique is implemented corerctly, this can give the appearance of a greatly enhanced contrast ratio. Unfortunately, on this monitor it is not done right. Movie mode crushes the blacks even further (much further) than they already are, and cranks up the saturation until everyone is glowing. It's unusable, and very disappointing.

Finally, the Warm and Cool settings. One would expect these settings to perhaps match 6500K and 9300K respectively. They don't. The Cool setting is so blue it's like you're underwater. Nobody would want to use it for anything. The Warm setting is something slightly higher (cooler) than 6500K, enough that skin tones have a sickly cyan tone to them. The appearance of Warm mode is equivalent to seting the R,G,B sliders each at 100% in User mode, so Warm is the "neutral" position to have the monitor. Still, it seems that the internal color lookup tables they are using for the panel give the monitor a noticeable cyan push in it's neutral setting. I compensated for this by eye in my User mode settings, but I will do further testing with a colorimeter when I get a chance.

I should mention that I have used both a 24" Apple Cinema Display and the Dell 2405FPW, but don't have them here for side-by-side comparison. I do know that both were much closer to 6500K in their out-of-the-box configuration.

Strangely, this monitor has no lamp intensity adjustment. I have my Contrast turned down now so that I don't burn my eyes out, but the lamp is in there burning itself out faster, even though I'm having the panel block a significant amount of the light that the lamp is putting out.

Another thing I should mention is that this monitor has a *very* small sweet spot. Moving your head from side to side will vary the color. I have a Dell 2001FP monitor that I can view from 30% off-axis and the color change is barely perceptable. On the Gateway, if my head is not perfectly centered, I can see a change when moving my head just two or three inches to the side or up and down when sitting 2 feet away. At steep angles, the image is very washed out, at least in comparison to the best modern LCD panels.

This monitor does have banding issues, mostly in the greens. I used CheckeMON, and have tried almost every possible color setting and cannot find any combination in which there is no banding. Adjusting the color away from neutral even one tick increases banding, so it appears that this monitor is processing color in 8-bits internally.

In case anyone wants to test with my current settings, here they are:

Picture
Brightness 100 (fixes crushed blacks)
Contrast 35 (fixes stabbing pain in my eyes)
Gamma 0 (Gamma doesn't do anything, as far as I can tell)

Color (these values fix the cyan push)
Red 100
Green 95
Blue 90

With these settings, the display actually looks very good. Not, fantastic, but very good. These were done by eye, and are likely off by a bit. Also keep in mind that your display will not look exactly the same as mine with these settings (every device is different), but differences in individual LCD panels of the same make and model are generally much smaller than differences in CRTs of the same make and model.


Other small issues:

The power and menu lights on the front are annoying in a dark room. Putting the monitor in "Night Mode" dims them, and it isn't so bad, but it's still there.

The Gamma adjustment doesn't appear to do anything, at least in DVI mode.

I have noticed the dark-to-light flickering issue, but only in Half-Life so far. I also think I noticed the ground strobing in World of Warcraft, especially when running around in Warsong Gulch. I need to do more testing with this.


Things I have yet to test:

I will be hooking my DVHS VCR up to this via HDMI. I'll be checking out the color again, and making sure 1:1 mode works. I've already attached it via component (1080i signal) and 1:1 works very nicely, other then the crushed blacks issue.

I haven't heard any buzzing because the room I have the monitor in is too noisy. I may move it to another room to check it out.


So here's the summary:

Pros:
24 inches!
price (in comparison to other 24" displays)
Text looks great
Photos, movies, and games look very good, after tuning


Cons:
Crushes blacks (partially helped with adjustment, but hurts contrast ratio)
Banding noticeable in greens, less so in blues
Cyan push (helped with adjustment, but increases banding)
No lamp intensity adjustment
Very narrow ideal viewing angle
Color controls are limited, presets are bad
Turning on the Faroudja chip makes the picture look really bad
Controls are awkward and annoying
Light on front is annoying (no more so than other panels, though)
Gamma adjustment doesn't work
Maybe some weird strobing or light-dark adjustment happening in games


Will I keep it? The crushed blacks and banding are the only things that have me really thinking hard about it. The other issues are adjustable or minor enough that I could live with it for the price I paid.
 

aeon

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very nice review, your setting helped me out a lot. my eyes don't hurt as much anymore.
 

BPini

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Has anyone seen some ghosting or motion blur? Like a bleeding of color on the edge of objects, looks black brownish most of the time I have seen it happen. It seems to happen with some colors more then others.

This is when moving at a swift speed like in a first person shooter just straifing back and forth.
 

RyanGrob

Weaksauce
Joined
Nov 17, 2006
Messages
82
Seemore has the most accurate review you'll read. I noticed the exact same things after just a few hours. Not knocking on it by any means, but at first I was excited and didn't notice its flaws but soon after I did.
 

Seemore

n00b
Joined
Dec 3, 2006
Messages
19
peTeMelster, "crushed blacks" refers to an image in which the very dark gray colors have been shifted darker so that they also appear as black. It is especially a problem in very dark images like night time scenes.

CRT monitors naturally convert linear color values, like those commonly stored in image or video files, into the correct color space for your eye to see the way you expect. LCD panels do not inherently do this, and so the manufacturer must add color conversion hardware as part of the display, and then must code the color conversion formula into the software of the monitor. This formula is complicated, and manufacturers of inexpensive displays often get it wrong, causing crushed blacks.

Here is a simulation I created. Notice in the lower-left area of the first image you can see detail on the wall and can make out a radiator. In the second image, all of the detail has disappeared along the wall and the floor.

Normal image:


Image with simulated crushed blacks:
 

SteveW928

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
146
Excellent review!!! Thank you so much for doing that.

I have a few questions and comments though...

Seemore said:
Well, the way these controls work is very cool for exactly 5 seconds, is interesting for another 30, and are simply a painful chore beyond that. ... Anyway, a big thumbs down on the controls on this monitor, but hopefully you won't have to use them often.

LOL... that is exactly what I kind of though when I saw what they had done. But, my hope is, as you just said... that once I would get it set up, I wouldn't have to use them much at all. At that point, having them hidden is a nice thing.


Seemore said:
I bought this monitor attempting to replace my trusty 19" Hitachi SuperScan Elite 751, which also has awesome color, or at least it did when I bought it 7 years ago.

I had one of those as well. Excellent monitor. And.. I've yet to see an LCD that will match it, though they are getting better. Now I use laptops most of the time, and just kind of deal with it... but I don't do as much graphics work these days.

Seemore said:
I can tell 6500K by eye within about a hundred degrees, so I will likely complain about things that wouldn't bother the average user. That said, the FPD2485w has a few serious problems with color.

I guess my big question, after reading the rest of the color stuff you went through... is that after you got it all set up as best you did... how do you feel it might compare with the Dell 2407 or BenQ 241 (if you have seen one of those) after they have been similarly tweaked?

In other words.... as long as I can adjust stuff, I don't care so much about the defaults. I notice you mentioned a Dell 2405. My friend has one and considers it pretty much the monitor to compare all these 24" LCDs against. In fact, while the 2407 is 'faster', I'm not certain it has better color... I'd love to know if someone compared the two on that aspect.


Seemore said:
"Movie" mode activates the Faroudja chip, which dynamically adjusts the color based on what is currently on the screen. When this technique is implemented corerctly, this can give the appearance of a greatly enhanced contrast ratio. Unfortunately, on this monitor it is not done right.

Bummer..... it seems that no one can get this right. That is one of the big issues it seems with the Dell's problems as well (I guess before some of the 'updates', you could not turn the Faroudja chip off... but in newer revisions you now can... solving some of its problems. Good to hear the other modes turn it off.

Seemore said:
I compensated for this by eye in my User mode settings, but I will do further testing with a colorimeter when I get a chance.

Wow.. that would be REALLY cool, and very generous of you. Please post the results if you do in case I get one. I figure even with the variation of units... setting any of them to a calibrated setting will be better than out of the box. :)

Seemore said:
I should mention that I have used both a 24" Apple Cinema Display and the Dell 2405FPW, but don't have them here for side-by-side comparison. I do know that both were much closer to 6500K in their out-of-the-box configuration.

Yes, as mentioned above.... how do you feel the 2405 compared after you got both units tweaked as well as you could? Is it more a matter of having to tweak... or is one unit just not able to get tweaked as well as the other?

Seemore said:
Strangely, this monitor has no lamp intensity adjustment.

That is odd.... well hopefully their MTBF is rated with the lamp going wide open.



Seemore said:
Moving your head from side to side will vary the color. I have a Dell 2001FP monitor that I can view from 30% off-axis and the color change is barely perceptable.

Hmm.... what about compared to the 2405? They both have similar specs at like 178 degrees I think. You would say that this aspect is worse than other 24" panels you have seen? That is one thing that might drive me away from it... though I intend mostly to use it as a TV from about 6 feet away... so I might not actually notice it that much from a distance.

Seemore said:
The Gamma adjustment doesn't appear to do anything, at least in DVI mode.

I'm wondering if this only effects the analog inputs. This might also explain a couple of the really blown out looking pics people have taken over VGA. If the gamma setting were off... that might do that.

Thanks much,

-Steve
 

FerretBoi

n00b
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
22
Seemore said:
II have noticed the dark-to-light flickering issue, but only in Half-Life so far. I also think I noticed the ground strobing in World of Warcraft, especially when running around in Warsong Gulch. I need to do more testing with this.



Crap.... this is one of the biggest issues im having with the monitor and buying another I was hoping it would be fixed. Playing WOW on this monitor gives me a migraine because the light to dark issue/ flickering / and the motion blur is seriously getting to me. I wish I wouldnt have taken my Dell 2407 back so soon without testing all of this stuff =(


This monitor is definately not for a gamer with sensitive eyes, I cant stand the flickering. atleast on my monitor the flickering is due to Motion Blue/ Lag that creates Purple Trails on Trees, Fire and other characters.
 
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