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Gateway FHD2400
- Thread starter GTOViper
- Start date
Turning it down isn't to reduce the bleed -- it's to reduce or eliminate the damage. In other words, turning it down after you are damaged does little, as you are already damaged. Turning it down from the get-go can reduce or prevent the damage. At least that's how it appears from reports we've seen here.
BLB isn't due to the CCFL being damaged, its due to poor manufacturing in how the bezel is secured around the panel. I've seen more than a few people tear apart LCDs and reduce BLB majorly.. However when you just buy the monitor, this isn't advisable for obvious reasons.
I'm not being mean or anything but don't give gateway an excuse to have a shitty QC department, and yes I had a FHD2400 :-p BLB was terrible
I'm not being mean or anything but don't give gateway an excuse to have a shitty QC department, and yes I had a FHD2400 :-p BLB was terrible
I wasn't defending Gateway -- but the problem with this particular monitor is NOT how the bezel is secured around the panel... We get backlight bleed 'creep', which means the monitor may be perfect on day 1, and slowly gets worse. This indicates slow damage, and so far the culprit seems to be the heat given off by the backlight. I had mine turned down from the get-go, and was almost the only one to escape any significant creep. Later others did it as well, and they reported no significant creep also.
So, yes, normally it is something like the bezel, but in this case it appears to be heat damage...
I'd blame it on Gateway engineering? Seems to be a bad design, rather than QC...
So, yes, normally it is something like the bezel, but in this case it appears to be heat damage...
I'd blame it on Gateway engineering? Seems to be a bad design, rather than QC...
Hmm,
So obviously turning down the brightness (theoretically the backlight) turns down the heat.
Maybe it's a de-lamination problem on the panel caused by excessive heat over time.
Of course who wants to be a guinea pig and grab two, use one at 0 brightness and another at 100 and see how fast BLB sets in?
I was so interested in this monitor until I read this thread just like I was interested in that FP2485W before I read THAT thread, just like I was interested in the XHD3000 before I read that thread too.
I'm seeing a trend here.... For those who have good ones, enjoy. Not trying to slam Gateway or anything but it is disappointing, similar to a monitor that starts developing dead pixels after a week or two, or longer periods of time...
Regards,
10e
So obviously turning down the brightness (theoretically the backlight) turns down the heat.
Maybe it's a de-lamination problem on the panel caused by excessive heat over time.
Of course who wants to be a guinea pig and grab two, use one at 0 brightness and another at 100 and see how fast BLB sets in?
I was so interested in this monitor until I read this thread just like I was interested in that FP2485W before I read THAT thread, just like I was interested in the XHD3000 before I read that thread too.
I'm seeing a trend here.... For those who have good ones, enjoy. Not trying to slam Gateway or anything but it is disappointing, similar to a monitor that starts developing dead pixels after a week or two, or longer periods of time...
Regards,
10e
TechLarry
RIP [H] Brother - June 1, 2022
- Joined
- Aug 9, 2005
- Messages
- 30,481
Do we know if this monitor is true 8-bit ?
Heh --Yea, the more research you do, the more disappointed one gets. I've never found the perfect monitor, just the best set of compromises for a given situation...
Can't wait for that first perfect panel though! It will be the next one to market.
Have not heard, but my attempt to find banding was fruitless, so either they are doing a super job of dithering, or it is more capable than most TNs. Here was my test. Note if you see banding, the system you are using is probably your limitation. I saw none when I viewed the pictures at 100% on my 2400:
http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1031705726&postcount=367
Do any of these monitors NOT have the red creeping in?
The biggest problem for me is not the redness on the sides-i hardly ever see that. Its the top 1" of the screen. If im at eye level with the "gateway" lettering, the colors in that area start to "inverse out" when i get within about 1.75 feet, and even if im perfectly centered
The biggest problem for me is not the redness on the sides-i hardly ever see that. Its the top 1" of the screen. If im at eye level with the "gateway" lettering, the colors in that area start to "inverse out" when i get within about 1.75 feet, and even if im perfectly centered
That was one of hundreds (edit* 386 to be exact) of 1920x1200 wallpapers i got in a pack from bittorrent
Tracker:
http://exoteric.roach.org:3393/announce
Im seeding right now just for you
Website: http://exoteric.roach.org/bg/
Tracker:
http://exoteric.roach.org:3393/announce
Im seeding right now just for you
Website: http://exoteric.roach.org/bg/
You can't view this monitor (or probably any TN) from UNDER the display. They no doubt designed it for ergonomic guidelines that put your eyes even with the TOP of the screen, looking slightly down. Since a TN has limited viewing angles, that is where you will find the best performance.
You definitely should expect problems when viewing images from other angles, especially the bottom up, which is the worse case.
I'm an avid reader of the forum but a newbie poster. so hello to all. I'm on the market for a new monitor and this monitor caught my eye until i read about all the BLB owners are having.
Hopefully some one can answer a few questions for me.
Does any one know if a new revision is going to come out for this monitor to correct the current issues? Is gateway going to continue to put problematic monitors on the market? How does the BLB affect console gamers?
Hopefully some one can answer a few questions for me.
Does any one know if a new revision is going to come out for this monitor to correct the current issues? Is gateway going to continue to put problematic monitors on the market? How does the BLB affect console gamers?
Welcome! This monitor does have a BLB problem, but so far it seems to be controllable if you set your brightness on all inputs to '0' from day 1. Zero sounds small, but is still reasonably bright because of the way they designed the control. I posted some pictures at 5 out of 100, and zero isn't much lower than that.
No one here has mentioned any knowledge of a new revision, so there is nothing we are aware of. Minimal BLB will not affect any bright screen, but it is noticeable on screens with dark areas. The more BLB you develop, the more problems you will notice, like reduced viewing angle and color changes.
I had my brightness set to 5 for the first few months, then reduced it to 0 after that. I still have great everything -- color fidelity, viewing angle, and my BLB is minimal.
So, if reducing the brightness level at the very beginning is the key, and I'm not some sort of oddity, you should get normal TN expectations if you just turn down your brightness from the get-go.
Agreed, I think some people are just overly picky and many folks just actively look for flaws so that they can say something isn't perfect and therefor do not want to have anything to do with it. Honestly I have a very slight amount of BLB and I only notice it when I first turn the monitor on and even then it's not that bad. I've only had my monitor a month but it doesn't seem to be getting worse. I set my brightness at 0 from day one thanks to reading this thread. Overall this monitor kicks serious @ss and I don't, for one instant, regret buying it.
My FHD2400 does this same thing, all the other inputs are affected after using HDMI and then switching to any of the other inputs. I have to unplug the A/C power plug on the monitor to reset it. Did you get yours replaced, or call customer service?
Thanks,
Tom
Overly picky? I don't think so...
My first FHD2400 had no BLB at all the first few days... When it started to appear, I was ok with it... But in about a week and a half, it was so bad that the top 5 inches of the screen was washed out... I was playing a first person shooter and you couldn't see any of heads-up-display gauges due to the BLB (they were completely washed out).
After the BLB got really bad, I had 3 friends over to play Rock Band and they all said that it was absolutely the worst monitor they had ever seen. On the day I got it, they came over also, and they said it was the best looking one they had seen. Go figure.
This is a serious issue. And after speaking with Gateway, and them telling me that they have not had any complaints about this, I don't think I will ever buy another product of theirs again, because they obviously don't take customer complaints seriously, because we know that people on here have called, and I am sure countless others...
My first FHD2400 had no BLB at all the first few days... When it started to appear, I was ok with it... But in about a week and a half, it was so bad that the top 5 inches of the screen was washed out... I was playing a first person shooter and you couldn't see any of heads-up-display gauges due to the BLB (they were completely washed out).
After the BLB got really bad, I had 3 friends over to play Rock Band and they all said that it was absolutely the worst monitor they had ever seen. On the day I got it, they came over also, and they said it was the best looking one they had seen. Go figure.
This is a serious issue. And after speaking with Gateway, and them telling me that they have not had any complaints about this, I don't think I will ever buy another product of theirs again, because they obviously don't take customer complaints seriously, because we know that people on here have called, and I am sure countless others...
People with your experience aren't overly picky, i'm talking about people who have a monitor like mine and a lot of us have who complain, BLB on one side that is minimal. I think most of us have this issue but it is minimal. For some that's a real problem. For others, like myself, I think it's overly picky to state that it's a real problem. But to each his own.
Ok, so I've had this monitor for 2 months now. I consider myself pretty picky when it comes to how things look and I was constantly noticing the bleed while gaming and it really annoyed the crap out of me. The bleeding on the left/right side is tolerable, but the bleeding at the top inch of the screen really bugged me because it makes everything darker and changes the colors.
The response time on this lcd is good. This monitor is great for windows applications, the bleed wasn't noticeable unless I was gaming, watching dark movies, or had a black desktop wallpaper.
Recently I figured out a fix for the backlite bleeding for gaming and I thought I would share it with you.
I tried turning down the brightness really low like many suggested, but games just seemed way too dark and the bleeding was still very noticeable. I have an ATI video card so I don't know if the darkness was from that or what. Anyhow, what I did was I setup a few different color "profiles" in the ati catalyst control panel which are all hotkeyed. The key is increasing the contrast and brightness in your video cards software control panel. I increased the contrast to 150 and the brightness between 15-40. I run the lcd at 15 brightness, 40 contrast.
I can now game without constantly noticing the bleed. The only annoying thing is having to hit the various hotkeys for the different color profiles. It's not a perfect fix as colors may not look as rich, but it's a fine compromise imo, games still look great and I don't notice the bleed anymore so I can focus on having fun while playing my games again.
The response time on this lcd is good. This monitor is great for windows applications, the bleed wasn't noticeable unless I was gaming, watching dark movies, or had a black desktop wallpaper.
Recently I figured out a fix for the backlite bleeding for gaming and I thought I would share it with you.
I tried turning down the brightness really low like many suggested, but games just seemed way too dark and the bleeding was still very noticeable. I have an ATI video card so I don't know if the darkness was from that or what. Anyhow, what I did was I setup a few different color "profiles" in the ati catalyst control panel which are all hotkeyed. The key is increasing the contrast and brightness in your video cards software control panel. I increased the contrast to 150 and the brightness between 15-40. I run the lcd at 15 brightness, 40 contrast.
I can now game without constantly noticing the bleed. The only annoying thing is having to hit the various hotkeys for the different color profiles. It's not a perfect fix as colors may not look as rich, but it's a fine compromise imo, games still look great and I don't notice the bleed anymore so I can focus on having fun while playing my games again.
that sounds like a great idea, thanks for sharing. i will give that a look although i don't really have much problems in most games with the darkness at 0.
I'll have to try a contrast adjustment when I get home tonight. Thanks!
This bears repeating, as I keep seeing repeats of the wrong reason for reducing the brightness -- it is NOT to clear up any BLB, it is to PREVENT it. Once ya got it, ya got it. So, if you have had your brightness up, and you've developed BLB, turning the brightness down will probably not do much for you, other than maybe prevent further damage. However, turning the brightness down on day 1 may allow you to escape any significant damage (we think the damage may be coming from the heat of the backlight).
Also, turning down the brightness after you develop BLB can very probably cause other issues, like not being able to see dark areas, because you can experience viewing angle and color changes as the BLB increases.
So, turn your brightness down from day 1, and you have a lot better chance to be happy with this panel.
Brightness=0, all inputs. That's still pretty bright on undamaged panels. I have posted many pictures at 5 out of 100, and 0 isn't much dimmer than that. As near as we can tell, anything higher will slowly develop more BLB. Once ya got it, ya got it forever, unless you turn in the panel in for excessive BLB.
This bears repeating, as I keep seeing repeats of the wrong reason for reducing the brightness -- it is NOT to clear up any BLB, it is to PREVENT it. Once ya got it, ya got it. So, if you have had your brightness up, and you've developed BLB, turning the brightness down will probably not do much for you, other than maybe prevent further damage. However, turning the brightness down on day 1 may allow you to escape any significant damage (we think the damage may be coming from the heat of the backlight).
Also, turning down the brightness after you develop BLB can very probably cause other issues, like not being able to see dark areas, because you can experience viewing angle and color changes as the BLB increases.
So, turn your brightness down from day 1, and you have a lot better chance to be happy with this panel.
Brightness=0, all inputs. That's still pretty bright on undamaged panels. I have posted many pictures at 5 out of 100, and 0 isn't much dimmer than that. As near as we can tell, anything higher will slowly develop more BLB. Once ya got it, ya got it forever, unless you turn in the panel in for excessive BLB.
verylostindeed
Gawd
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2004
- Messages
- 660
I'm not using my 2400 anymore as my primary display now that I've got the Doublesight, but I'm thinking of sending it in to either Gateway or BB to get a new one. From there, I will either attempt to sell it or try dropping the brightness down to 0 to see where it gets me. To be honest, though, 0 is too dim for my tastes -- not to mention the fact that I shouldn't have to do that to have a functional monitor.
In any event, I wonder if dropping the panel's brightness down to zero and the adjusting brightness through the video card would produce acceptable levels of viewing for me without damaging the panel itself.
Just purchased one of these and I'd have my own experience to toss in as well as some clarification:
~ did the brightness to zero tip and it really does muddy the colors a bit too much for me. The reason for this is that the image is already muddy and dark, compared to my old CRT, on the component, composite or vga inputs from xbox or television.
While the tip of mixing and matching contrast/brightness settings on the video card makes some sense, it's unfortunately not possible for the TV/XBOX inputs at such a refined level.
~ the backlight bleeding is pronounced. Day one and I have a lot more than I've seen in pictures here, but it isn't an amazingly bad amount. It's as much as I've had on most of the LCDs I've owned.
What I'm curious about is the fidelity of the monitor. I hear people raving about how great XBOX360 looks on it and I'm just not getting anywhere near the same quality out of the VGA input that I do when plugging into my CRT monitor. I will try an HDMI cable but the screenshots I've seen comparing the HDMI / VGA / component cables all look basically the same to me. It seems a bit reaching to talk about shadow detail increase when the rest of the image is dreary and blotchy.
Perhaps this is a calibration issue? I'm using the "game" preset and tweaked the colors and settings as best as I can, but they're just generally very contrasty (especially with brightness down to zero) with the blacks crushing together.
I've tested this with gears of war which is a contrasty game and blue dragon / katamari which are both very vibrant. They both become very dull and contrasty.
The oddest part about it is that the computer looks fine through VGA, which is why I bought the monitor - it really is the best 24" monitor i've seen color/brightness and saturationwise. I'm using it for apps so not too concerned about the mediocre television, upsampling or whatever this thing must have given its price point... but of course it has this stuff and I'm just boggled at how people can rave about how great it looks with that stuff.
Can someone clue me in? I've seen too many rave reviews, specifically for xbox, and I'm just not seeing it. Gateway even shows an xbox on their page for the monitor so i'd assume it'd look "great." But is this "great for a low-end LCD tv technology"? Because I have a $50 20" CRT monitor that looks absolutely flawless for x360 with the VGA cable...
In the end, I wish they'd just chop the price down even more and produce this as a computer monitor only. Of course I'm still considering that I'm doing something wrong (I can rule out defective unit because the VGA input from the computer looks fine, right?) but it really feels like all of the inputs are tacked on with cheap-o conversion going on in the guts. That rhetoric should be enough to convey how little I know about how these things work
~ did the brightness to zero tip and it really does muddy the colors a bit too much for me. The reason for this is that the image is already muddy and dark, compared to my old CRT, on the component, composite or vga inputs from xbox or television.
While the tip of mixing and matching contrast/brightness settings on the video card makes some sense, it's unfortunately not possible for the TV/XBOX inputs at such a refined level.
~ the backlight bleeding is pronounced. Day one and I have a lot more than I've seen in pictures here, but it isn't an amazingly bad amount. It's as much as I've had on most of the LCDs I've owned.
What I'm curious about is the fidelity of the monitor. I hear people raving about how great XBOX360 looks on it and I'm just not getting anywhere near the same quality out of the VGA input that I do when plugging into my CRT monitor. I will try an HDMI cable but the screenshots I've seen comparing the HDMI / VGA / component cables all look basically the same to me. It seems a bit reaching to talk about shadow detail increase when the rest of the image is dreary and blotchy.
Perhaps this is a calibration issue? I'm using the "game" preset and tweaked the colors and settings as best as I can, but they're just generally very contrasty (especially with brightness down to zero) with the blacks crushing together.
I've tested this with gears of war which is a contrasty game and blue dragon / katamari which are both very vibrant. They both become very dull and contrasty.
The oddest part about it is that the computer looks fine through VGA, which is why I bought the monitor - it really is the best 24" monitor i've seen color/brightness and saturationwise. I'm using it for apps so not too concerned about the mediocre television, upsampling or whatever this thing must have given its price point... but of course it has this stuff and I'm just boggled at how people can rave about how great it looks with that stuff.
Can someone clue me in? I've seen too many rave reviews, specifically for xbox, and I'm just not seeing it. Gateway even shows an xbox on their page for the monitor so i'd assume it'd look "great." But is this "great for a low-end LCD tv technology"? Because I have a $50 20" CRT monitor that looks absolutely flawless for x360 with the VGA cable...
In the end, I wish they'd just chop the price down even more and produce this as a computer monitor only. Of course I'm still considering that I'm doing something wrong (I can rule out defective unit because the VGA input from the computer looks fine, right?) but it really feels like all of the inputs are tacked on with cheap-o conversion going on in the guts. That rhetoric should be enough to convey how little I know about how these things work
^ The VGA cable for XBOX360 has very bad picture quality (atleast through LCD screens). I tried it once with a 19" LCD monitor and an LCD TV and in both instances the color looked washed out and the image was overly fuzzy. Component and HDMI on the other hand seem to offer great colors in terms of saturation and overall vivedness (though some people complain that component oversaturates images).
verylostindeed
Gawd
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2004
- Messages
- 660
Just purchased one of these and I'd have my own experience to toss in as well as some clarification:
~ did the brightness to zero tip and it really does muddy the colors a bit too much for me. The reason for this is that the image is already muddy and dark, compared to my old CRT, on the component, composite or vga inputs from xbox or television.
While the tip of mixing and matching contrast/brightness settings on the video card makes some sense, it's unfortunately not possible for the TV/XBOX inputs at such a refined level.
~ the backlight bleeding is pronounced. Day one and I have a lot more than I've seen in pictures here, but it isn't an amazingly bad amount. It's as much as I've had on most of the LCDs I've owned.
What I'm curious about is the fidelity of the monitor. I hear people raving about how great XBOX360 looks on it and I'm just not getting anywhere near the same quality out of the VGA input that I do when plugging into my CRT monitor. I will try an HDMI cable but the screenshots I've seen comparing the HDMI / VGA / component cables all look basically the same to me. It seems a bit reaching to talk about shadow detail increase when the rest of the image is dreary and blotchy.
Perhaps this is a calibration issue? I'm using the "game" preset and tweaked the colors and settings as best as I can, but they're just generally very contrasty (especially with brightness down to zero) with the blacks crushing together.
I've tested this with gears of war which is a contrasty game and blue dragon / katamari which are both very vibrant. They both become very dull and contrasty.
The oddest part about it is that the computer looks fine through VGA, which is why I bought the monitor - it really is the best 24" monitor i've seen color/brightness and saturationwise. I'm using it for apps so not too concerned about the mediocre television, upsampling or whatever this thing must have given its price point... but of course it has this stuff and I'm just boggled at how people can rave about how great it looks with that stuff.
Can someone clue me in? I've seen too many rave reviews, specifically for xbox, and I'm just not seeing it. Gateway even shows an xbox on their page for the monitor so i'd assume it'd look "great." But is this "great for a low-end LCD tv technology"? Because I have a $50 20" CRT monitor that looks absolutely flawless for x360 with the VGA cable...
In the end, I wish they'd just chop the price down even more and produce this as a computer monitor only. Of course I'm still considering that I'm doing something wrong (I can rule out defective unit because the VGA input from the computer looks fine, right?) but it really feels like all of the inputs are tacked on with cheap-o conversion going on in the guts. That rhetoric should be enough to convey how little I know about how these things work
You should try to adjust the gamma settings in the xbox console. If I recall correctly, there are three such settings, although I think the intermediate one is useless. That normally does the trick in terms of fixing the VGA "wash-out" problem.
Yeah I had the same problem until i put it on the maximum setting, then VGA looked great.
Will that be noticable in games, because when I was fiddling with it in the console it didn't look to be having the dramatic effect needed to really fix the muddiness that'd be in game. I'll try and pay better attention.
Thanks for the tip on the VGA cable for the xbox with LCDs. That's disappointing. I honestly didn't notice much diff between the VGA and the component. Now to find a $4-5 hdmi cable, the prices i've seen at bricks&mortar stores around here are laughable. Like, I literally brought the item up to the sales rep and laughed at them. ;{
Thanks for the tip on the VGA cable for the xbox with LCDs. That's disappointing. I honestly didn't notice much diff between the VGA and the component. Now to find a $4-5 hdmi cable, the prices i've seen at bricks&mortar stores around here are laughable. Like, I literally brought the item up to the sales rep and laughed at them. ;{
Ugh - defective monitor then? Or perhaps I'm being too fussy about what "great" means. I will try and grab some photos tonight.
If it still don't look great then perhaps a bad monitor or more likely a bad vga cable.
If you are within 14 days they will, I asked when I bought mine. Outside of that it goes back to Gateway if you didn't buy the Best Buy warranty.
well, these screenshots are very close to mine
http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1031712145&postcount=391
The blown out, blurry jaggedness of the mini-track in the upper left, with the lights.
how cod4 looks very splotchy and contrasty...
the dullness of the images in general...
is this what people considers "great"? Never mind that the original poster's screen might not be represented in the photos, but pretend that's what my screen looks like
http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1031712145&postcount=391
The blown out, blurry jaggedness of the mini-track in the upper left, with the lights.
how cod4 looks very splotchy and contrasty...
the dullness of the images in general...
is this what people considers "great"? Never mind that the original poster's screen might not be represented in the photos, but pretend that's what my screen looks like
well, these screenshots are very close to mine
http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1031712145&postcount=391
The blown out, blurry jaggedness of the mini-track in the upper left, with the lights.
how cod4 looks very splotchy and contrasty...
the dullness of the images in general...
is this what people considers "great"? Never mind that the original poster's screen might not be represented in the photos, but pretend that's what my screen looks like
I see no blurry jaggedness in the mini-track in the 1st photo. Overall I do think those pictures look very nice, the call of duty one does look kinda dull but that's a part in the game where the field is supposed to look dull and subdued, after all you're in a field of wheat/hay or whatnot, it shouldn't be bright and colorful.