Future Windows 10 Support Won't Come with Sneaky Charges

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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Microsoft is well aware of the rumors of a possible ’Gotcha’ on down the road for the ‘free’ upgrade to Windows 10 rolling out this summer. Microsoft stepped up to the plate to clear the air: There will be no additional charges for future updates. Period.

Suspicions about sneaky fees reached a fever pitch in May after a Microsoft executive said Windows 10 would be the “last version of Windows” as the operating system transitions to a “Windows as a service” model.
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the_servicer said:
But will they make you use it with a Microsoft account?
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The option to add local only users is still there. The average person will probably want to use a Microsoft account very much like most people use such accounts for their phones and tablets. I understand the issue many have with privacy but that ship has sailed on mobile a long time ago.
 
heatlesssun said:
The average person will probably want to use a Microsoft account very much like most people use such accounts for their phones and tablets.
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The average person will be tricked into using a non-local Microsoft account when initially setting up their computer.
 
BryanSTG said:
The average person will be tricked into using a non-local Microsoft account when initially setting up their computer.
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And if that person does manage to figure it out, will Microsoft punish her by giving her absolutely no updates to the Edge browser?
 
the_servicer said:
Thankfully one doesn't have to use an iPad with an Apple ID to get updates. Amazing that Windows has quickly become worse than iOS in this regard.
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When did Windows require an Microsoft account for OS updates? And how many people use an iPad without an Apple ID? I don't know one iPad user in my family with quite a few iPads that doesn't have an Apple ID.
 
Microsoft learned their lesson long ago, it's best to give EVERYONE updates, even users if pirated versions. When virus spread across vulnerable windows systems Microsoft gets bad press regardless of context.
 
heatlesssun said:
When did Windows require an Microsoft account for OS updates? And how many people use an iPad without an Apple ID? I don't know one iPad user in my family with quite a few iPads that doesn't have an Apple ID.
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1. Who cares what Apple does - one of many reasons most of us are running Windows.
2. My PC is not a tablet.
3. My PC is not a phone.

Do you EVER stop astroturfing?

Fact of the matter is Microsoft has been deceptively obfuscation the local account option since Windows 8 to make unsuspecting customers going through setup for the first time think there's no other choice. That's bullshit.
 
DPI said:
1. Who cares what Apple does - one of many reasons most of us are running Windows.
2. My PC is not a tablet.
3. My PC is not a phone.

Do you EVER stop astroturfing?

Fact of the matter is Microsoft has been deceptively obfuscation the local account option since Windows 8 to make unsuspecting customers going through setup for the first time think there's no other choice. That's bullshit.
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Exactly this. I would be much more ok with it if they werent trying to obfuscate it so obviously.
 
Digital identity services are going to form a large market.
Governmental digital identities should not be far behind, and then governmental protected space on the net
 
I don't see it mentioned here, but I think it should be obvious that the "free" Windows 10 upgrades are only going to be for people using a Microsoft account. As I heard it described elsewhere (can't recall where but it makes logical sense) the mechanism for the free upgrade will be to log in with your Microsoft account and submit a Windows 7/Vista product key. Then, your Windows 10 key will be tied to that Microsoft account. Thus, if you ever install Windows 10 and use a local account, your install won't validate as Genuine. It makes a lot of sense but I don't see anyone talking about this in the sense of forcing users down a specific path in order to get the free upgrade.
 
heatlesssun said:
When did Windows require an Microsoft account for OS updates?
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If you know of a way to get the touch version of Internet Explorer to update on Windows 8.1 without using a Microsoft account, then please share. I genuinely want to know if there is a way. The Windows Store app seems to get in the way when I refuse to sign in.

heatlesssun said:
And how many people use an iPad without an Apple ID? I don't know one iPad user in my family with quite a few iPads that doesn't have an Apple ID.
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The iPad seems to update itself even when an Apple ID is not used at all. I am assuming when iOS updates itself, Safari and all other apps get updates too.

I do get a little tired of having to act like Sherlock Holmes just to use devices anonymously.

On a limited basis, I would gladly pay some "sneaky charges" for Windows 10 if it means giving customers clearer choices and control.
 
svet-am said:
I don't see it mentioned here, but I think it should be obvious that the "free" Windows 10 upgrades are only going to be for people using a Microsoft account.
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Thanks for raising this possibility. If what you are saying is true then this whole discussion is pointless. On the other hand maybe there will still be choices for people who are okay with paying for Windows 10. We can hope, right?
 
DPI said:
Fact of the matter is Microsoft has been deceptively obfuscation the local account option since Windows 8 to make unsuspecting customers going through setup for the first time think there's no other choice. That's bullshit.
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The option to use a local account is at the bottom. It's not the first choice but it's not hidden and it is labeled not recommended. Phones, tablets and PCs aren't that different in many ways to average users that are now highly dependent on online services. I get the concerns with privacy issues but using a Microsoft Account particularly if one is using Microsoft services adds a lot of convenience and simplification over local only setups.
 
svet-am said:
I don't see it mentioned here, but I think it should be obvious that the "free" Windows 10 upgrades are only going to be for people using a Microsoft account. As I heard it described elsewhere (can't recall where but it makes logical sense) the mechanism for the free upgrade will be to log in with your Microsoft account and submit a Windows 7/Vista product key. Then, your Windows 10 key will be tied to that Microsoft account. Thus, if you ever install Windows 10 and use a local account, your install won't validate as Genuine. It makes a lot of sense but I don't see anyone talking about this in the sense of forcing users down a specific path in order to get the free upgrade.
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Haven't heard that yet - got a source for it to confirm?
 
carnageX said:
Haven't heard that yet - got a source for it to confirm?
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I actually spent a while after I posted that looking for it and I can't find it, so take it with a grain of salt for now since I cannot prove it. That said, the inkling in the back of my mind makes me think it was on Windows Weekly so it probably came from either Thurrott or Mary Jo Foley.
 
svet-am said:
scroll ALL the way to bottom and notice the upgrade exclusions. They specifically call out enterprise versions (eg, versions where you WILL NOT be using a Microsoft account) as not being eligible for the free upgrade.
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This has nothing to do with using a Microsoft Account. Enterprise versions are all on VL and those users can use whatever supported version of Windows they want.
 
heatlesssun said:
This has nothing to do with using a Microsoft Account. Enterprise versions are all on VL and those users can use whatever supported version of Windows they want.
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I agree but think about users with a VL. How often does an enterprise user actually have non-AD or LDAP accounts?
 
heatlesssun said:
This has nothing to do with using a Microsoft Account. Enterprise versions are all on VL and those users can use whatever supported version of Windows they want.
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This is how I understood it as well, that they're on VL's and unable to get the free upgrade because of that.
 
heatlesssun said:
The option to add local only users is still there. The average person will probably want to use a Microsoft account very much like most people use such accounts for their phones and tablets. I understand the issue many have with privacy but that ship has sailed on mobile a long time ago.
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Just wanna say I'm deeply enjoying Linux. Upgrades are free and no Ubuntu or Mint account required.
 
the_servicer said:
If you know of a way to get the touch version of Internet Explorer to update on Windows 8.1 without using a Microsoft account, then please share. I genuinely want to know if there is a way. The Windows Store app seems to get in the way when I refuse to sign in.
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IE 11, both desktop and modern, aren't updated through the store AFAIK because they aren't store apps.

the_servicer said:
The iPad seems to update itself even when an Apple ID is not used at all. I am assuming when iOS updates itself, Safari and all other apps get updates too.
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So how would you get apps on an iPad in the first place without an Apple ID?
 
heatlesssun said:
So how would you get apps on an iPad in the first place without an Apple ID?
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Yah, that. I use and support OS X, Android and iOS (and IOS) regularly. You can't do shit on a Mac or 95% of tablets without an Apple or Google account.

Hell, on a Mac updates are hidden in the App Store, trapped behind your Apple ID.
 
the_servicer said:
Thankfully one doesn't have to use an iPad with an Apple ID to get updates. Amazing that Windows has quickly become worse than iOS in this regard.
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Tricked, worse, conspiracy, "free", did I miss anything? :D Perhaps a little less emotionalism and a little more logic will help?
 
DPI said:
1. Who cares what Apple does - one of many reasons most of us are running Windows.
2. My PC is not a tablet.
3. My PC is not a phone.

Do you EVER stop astroturfing?

Fact of the matter is Microsoft has been deceptively obfuscation the local account option since Windows 8 to make unsuspecting customers going through setup for the first time think there's no other choice. That's bullshit.
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Not sure you could be any more emotional about it if you tried. :rolleyes:
 
wizzi01 said:
Good way to take it off topic. Go circlejerk in the linux suforum.
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You mean things didn't go off topic when pressuring users into creating Microsoft accounts was compared with the same thing on iOS and Android? But when someone mentions how an online account is not necessary at all on Linux Mint then that's suddenly off topic? :rolleyes:

 
I just broke down and created a Microsoft Account this week to go with the Windows 8.1 Phone I also had to get.

1) My non-smartphone on ancient family plan finally became more expensive to keep vs. getting a smartphone.
2) My pocket computing device (an ipod touch 4g) finally because too obsolete to use because no apps work anymore without iOS 7. And it's around 5 years old, it's gonna die soon.

Frankly, what I can do with linking my desktop files, one note, email and whatever else in real time through the MS Account and One Drive is pretty damn amazing. And it's entirely a better media player than the iPOD ever was. And I can shove a 128GB microSD card in it.

Yeah, I'm the original privacy nut... but this ship is sailing. If you use the internet at all, there are limits to what you can do. I'm coming to the realization that the most important issue today is less your data (which is a needle in a haystack the size of Jupiter) and more your location information. That part is still creepy as hell.

But being able to take notes and have them show up on 3 devices, tell Cortana to remind you of crap, dictate a message and manage multiple email accounts... yeah the MS Account actually does help you get some serious work done.

Still don't really like the state of personal privacy, but life has to go on also. Choose your battles.
 
Spire3660 said:
Exactly this. I would be much more ok with it if they werent trying to obfuscate it so obviously.
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Trying to explain the pros and cons and differences and blahblahblah to a not-PC-literate person is just way, way outside Microsoft's style. If they present a big long page of gobbledygook tech speak, nobody's gonna understand it and they will call their 13-year old grandson to explain it and that kid has better things to do.

If they offer an obvious choice, it becomes a matter of "which do I choose? I don't know. I'm scared. Hold me." If they default to a Microsoft Account and obfuscate the choice, not-PC-literate users just 'get' the benefits of a MS Account and they are oblivious to whatever argument the vocal minority may have against it. "oh wow cool, I logged in to my new Microsoft Surface Pro 3 and it has my car wallpaper that's on my Acer laptop."
 
If you are computing in the year 2015 without using "cloud" functionality then you should be sent back to the stone age where you belong.
 
Terminus said:
If you are computing in the year 2015 without using "cloud" functionality then you should be sent back to the stone age where you belong.
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Oh and another thing. If you were computing in 1995... like the rest of us.. you would realise you had been using the "cloud" all along (but hey... i'll let you float around on your puffy white cloud... up in dream land).
 
HoffY said:
Oh and another thing. If you were computing in 1995... like the rest of us.. you would realise you had been using the "cloud" all along (but hey... i'll let you float around on your puffy white cloud... up in dream land).
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The services that make up the modern cloud simply didn't exist in 1995.
 
heatlesssun said:
The services that make up the modern cloud simply didn't exist in 1995.
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You mean like an internet connection?

I'll spell it out for you. The Internet is the "cloud". Just because you wish to claim applications created in 2015 can be "cloud" but applications of then, cannot be - Is ridiculous.
 
HoffY said:
You mean like an internet connection?

I'll spell it out for you. The Internet is the "cloud". Just because you wish to claim applications created in 2015 can be "cloud" but applications of then, cannot be - Is ridiculous.
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I said the services that make up the modern cloud didn't exist in 1995, not the connections. Completely different things.
 
the_servicer said:
You don't have to "get" apps on an iPad because it leaves the factory with a bunch of them --the most important ones -- already installed.
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Like iTunes, but I don't think that works without an Apple ID even though it's preinstalled.
 
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