From C2Q to IB or Haswell?

kasakka

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I've currenly running a Q9550 @ 3.4 Ghz and a GTX 560 Ti. Most games run quite reasonably on max or almost max detail as long as I don't go above 1920x1200 resolution.

That said, I am starting to think of upgrading just so that I can offset the cost a bit while I can still get some money by selling my old system.

Considering I don't do any of the tasks that the newer processor designs excel at (video encoding, compression etc) on my home computer, would going to a newer processor make much of a real difference mostly for gaming? Also would Haswell really matter much considering I would be using a discrete GPU anyway?

It's really unfortunate that there are no new games tested in reviews with the old Core 2 Quad stuff.
 

Dirtybird

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I would get out of that 775 rig while you can still get some decent money for it. You can get a nice IB setup that will run every game just as well and save you some power/heat.
 

Tsumi

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If you have a spare system, the best thing to do is sell it now, and wait for when everyone starts selling off their IB and SB systems for Haswell, and get some used parts for cheap. Or if you have a Microcenter nearby, go take advantage of those deals.
 

kasakka

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Unfortunately don't have a spare system (or a Microcenter as I'm on a whole different continent) but I was definitely thinking of waiting till Haswell release and then snagging a used IB or SB.

I would also have to upgrade all my cooling as currently I'm using watercooling but my blocks are not compatible with newer motherboards and the whole setup isn't exactly elegant.
 

DejaWiz

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Either would be a good upgrade for you, imo. The speculation is that HWL is going to be no more than 10% higher IPC than IB, and SB/IB being as fast as they are already, I doubt you would feel any real-world difference in games between any of the current generation processors or the upcoming release.

Just keep in mind that when HWL releases, it's going to drive the value of your current components down even further as people will be shifting to buy used SB/IB parts from the HWL adopters.
 

firas

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I went from Q9550@3.8 to 3770K@4.6, nice upgrade but I'll say wait for Haswell and for now try to push your OC more.
 

stm

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Any ideas if you have a 775 platform if the $$$ is in selling the cpu only, or mobo/sdram as well? Just seems much easier to ship a CPU out.
 

Jorona

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I'm waiting for Haswell to update both my and the wifes rigs. Then my rig will become the HTPC.
 

kasakka

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Any ideas if you have a 775 platform if the $$$ is in selling the cpu only, or mobo/sdram as well? Just seems much easier to ship a CPU out.

CPU still seems to command decent money, RAM and mobos go for peanuts.
 

Tsumi

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Intel Extreme processors hold their value for a fairly long time. DDR2 still has some value due to the fact that they're harder to find and no longer in production.
 

RamonGTP

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DDR2 is still being produced, just no where near as much as DDR3 is. Heck even DDR1 sicks are still pretty easily found brand new.
 

SonDa5

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IB now or wait for Haswell. From rumors Haswell really doesn't look that much better than IB. So wait for some hard numbers or enoy now.
 

ccityinstaller

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OP, If you like to overclock, I would wait before deciding on Ivy unless you are comfortable de-lidding the cpu..The stock Intel TIM isn't great, and there are varying tolerances in how "tightly" the Integrated Heat Spreader (IHS) sits on the die, which can result in very high temperatures even in stock situations...

There is no indication if Haswell is going to use this crappy cooling method, or if Intel will go back to fluxless solder (like on Sandy and older cpus)...That being said, if you aren't afraid of a little work, SonDa5 and I will gladly help you pop the top off any Ivy cpu you get and max that baby out!:cool:
 

atp1916

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Haswell is close enough, wait for it esp. if you got the extra cash.
 

TroyX

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I have a Q9550 oc'd 4ghz and bf3 runs only 8fps slower than the 2500k.

I found out that bf3 is not a console port and that it was made from ground up to run on pc allowing older cpu's to do very well with the game.
 

DejaWiz

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I have a Q9550 oc'd 4ghz and bf3 runs only 8fps slower than the 2500k.

I found out that bf3 is not a console port and that it was made from ground up to run on pc allowing older cpu's to do very well with the game.

Q9550 @ 4 GHz vs your 2500K @ ???

What GPU for each?
What resolution and settings for each?
 

TroyX

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Q9550 @ 4 GHz vs your 2500K @ ???

What GPU for each?
What resolution and settings for each?

1900x1200 resolution with a gtx 560ti

but I did notice a bigger increase when I dropped the resolution below native resoulution of my monitor, I tried it at 640x480 and 2500k showed much better performance.

but I play at 1900x1200 so Im not gonna drop the resolution down just to see much better frame rates.

all high with 4xaa, runs smooth with Q9550 at 4ghz, close to 2000fsb and DDR3 memory running at 2000mhz.

and to be honest, sometimes I feel bf3 runs smoother with the Q9550, some reports said that is because of the12mb of cache that bf3 relies on heavily.

but other games that are console ports run much better with the 2500k.
 
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DejaWiz

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That's a good comparison to see how the OP's 500 series would scale with a CPU upgrade. Anyone think a 660ti or 670 upgrade may be a better first step than a CPU upgrade for increasing gaming performance noticeably?
 

TroyX

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That's a good comparison to see how the OP's 500 series would scale with a CPU upgrade. Anyone think a 660ti or 670 upgrade may be a better first step than a CPU upgrade for increasing gaming performance noticeably?

it all depends on the game, take bad company 2 for example, a console port, with i5/i7 It runs like almost twice the frame rate than the Q9550.

but with bf3 which is not a console port there is very little difference in performance at 1080p and up.

remember when H reviewed the i7 920 long time ago?

it was useless for games, that was because most of the games they benchmarked were build from ground up for pc

but when console ports started pouring in and intel getting into the action things changed and then people started buying new cpu's that really didnt need for gaming.

this is why even up to today I give Dice a lot of props that they optimized the BF3 engine to work with older cpu's.

to me it looked like pc gamers were forced to buy new cpu's for better performance because the console ports favored the new cpu's only.
 
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RamonGTP

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It's all relative. If lack of memory is your only problem, it's still a whole lot cheaper to spend $25-$50 than it is to build a new system.
 

kasakka

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I have a Q9550 oc'd 4ghz and bf3 runs only 8fps slower than the 2500k.

I found out that bf3 is not a console port and that it was made from ground up to run on pc allowing older cpu's to do very well with the game.

Running it at 4 GHz is pretty impressive. I can't get mine over 3.4 GHz despite water cooling and low temperatures. I think my mobo or RAM is just crap.

That said, most games scale pretty linearly with CPU and GPU speed so it's not surprise that it comes close to the newer ones.
 

bigsnyder

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What chipset are you running? I have a P45 mobo and can hit 4Ghz very easily on my Q9550 e0 stepping.
 

illitirit

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id say stick with the Q9550 until haswell, i just went from core 2 duo e6600 2.4ghz to a 3770k and it has been awesome, but in my case the core 2 duo was really showing its age, but in yours..i dont think it would be as dramatic of a change to warrant getting an ivy right before haswell is out
 

kasakka

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What chipset are you running? I have a P45 mobo and can hit 4Ghz very easily on my Q9550 e0 stepping.

It's a P35 chipset, I think the RAM is just crap or the mobo's overclocking capabilities.

In any case I decided to get an Ivy Bridge setup. Got a lower end Gigabyte Z77 board, 8 GB DDR3, 3550K, Phanteks cooler and a used GTX 660 Ti coming in hopefully this week.

The way I see it, when Haswell is released, the motherboards will be expensive and the CPUs as well, not to mention in short supply and completely untested whereas IB stuff is plentiful and well-known right now.

I was somewhat bummed that motherboards no longer carry FireWire until you get to the uberexpensive stuff, had to order a PCI card because the PCIe stuff is still really expensive too. But unless there are some really big breakthroughs, this rig should be fine for me for the next 4 or so years.
 

Matija

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I'm running an old E4300 (overclocked to an incredible 2.4 GHz) and in a couple of months I should finally have enough money for an upgrade. However, I have no idea if the USB3 chipset bug is going to be that bad. I can't remember the last time my desktop went into standby; it's either on or off (and I don't have any USB3 devices at the moment, but I might get some eventually). Taking that into account, would you upgrade from C2D to Haswell *or* Ivy Bridge in, say, mid-July?
 

kasakka

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I got my new system running today. Specs:

  • Gigabyte GA-Z77-DS3H rev 1.0 (mostly for Hackintosh and because it was cheap), upgraded to F10F beta BIOS
  • 3570K
  • Phanteks PH-TC14PE cooler
  • 8 GB DDR3-1600, G.Skill Ares CL9-9-9-24
  • Asus GTX 660 Ti 2GB, it's the OC model
  • OCZ Agility 3 120 GB for OS/programs, 1 TB Samsung for games and storage
  • Fractal Design Define R3 case
I haven't been able to test this much yet but tried playing Tomb Raider (CPU at stock speed) for a while as that was what I'd been playing recently. Compared to my old system, there isn't a huge difference. Whether it's the SATA 3, extra 4 GB RAM, the faster CPU or all combined, the game seemed to run at a more solid framerate. With the GTX 660 Ti it was just fine on the Q9550 @ 3.4 GHz though so I'd say that if you have a new GPU but an older C2Q/Core i5/i7 overclocked quad core, you'll be fine for a few years more.

Running right now at 4.4 GHz, voltage seems to hover around 1.25V which is nice considering Gigabyte has skimped a bit and offers no VCORE adjustment on the mobo and it has no SLI support either (would've had to pay about 50 euros more for those two things plus a few extra ports). As I wrote this I was running LinX in the background to test for stability, it's done 20 cycles with CPU temps at a solid 70°C on load so looks like I got a decent overclocker here.

Compared to my previous watercooled setup which was near silent but really hacked together (it was probably around 6-8 years old so basically antique) the new air cooled setup doesn't sound too bad at all. The GPU is almost silent, will probably have to tweak case and CPU fans a bit. The Phanteks cooler is pretty massive and thankfully I did my research and got low profile RAM because otherwise it wouldn't fit in my case.

Rather than performance, I'm far more impressed by how BIOS/UEFI has improved over the years. Gone are the days when resetting CMOS meant finding some tiny, awkwardly placed jumper and after that having to painstakingly change every option again. Now entering BIOS the system just asks if I want to load defaults or just try to fix my own settings. Add to that the support for profiles and easy BIOS updating and it's a big step toward decent usability. If only they had proper descriptions of what options do and the UI looked a bit better...

On the flipside it seems motherboard features have gone down the drain until you get to the super expensive motherboards. Lack of FireWire was annoying to me, luckily the board still has a PCI slot so I dug out a spare FW card I had. Likewise the rather artificial lack of some overclocking settings is bullshit - Gigabyte makes way too many Z77 models as it is so why not just offer a few where one has enough settings and features for most users (the overclocking but always single GPU crowd) and then another one with all the bells and whistles for enthusiasts who want to run multiple GPUs, Thunderbolt etc.
 
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