From ATI to AMD back to ATI? A Journey in Futility @ [H]

SixFootDuo said:
Lot of pages and threads. I'll sum it up for the new people joining us.

Don't buy AMD .... Do buy nVidia. If you're still with AMD, I promise you will enjoy the nVidia experience. Drivers are constant, performance is king. Excellent end-user experience.
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Not sure if serious......
 
AMD have reportedly secured Polaris contracts with Apple:

Apple to adopt AMD's new Polaris graphics chips in upcoming Macs - report

And there have been whispers that Intel is in negotiations to license AMD GPU IP:

Bloomberg: Intel in talks with AMD to license GPU patents

SO let's recap. Many in the tech world including [H] have trumpeted AMD's imminent collapse or bad financial situation in the last several years.

AMD has recently contracted with Apple for Polaris chips and is reportedly in talks with Intel for some of their GPU IP (possibly to be included in Intel chips rather than Intel's own GPU tech) which would provide significant income stream from two of the tech behemoths in the world.

Yet, somehow, [H] paints the potential Intel deal (and its income) as a BAD THING?
 
I'd love to see AMD as a company rise from their slump. I still have fond memories of my X2 3800 and ATI 850xt.
 
SeymourGore said:
Those Anand fuckers were probably the community voting for that other girl in that baseball poll Kyle posted.

Sad article either way. Does Intel even have a reason to be involved in the dedicated GPU category? Seemed like their interest with Larabee fell off fast.
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I remember that shit! I tried to vote as much as I could LOL
 
SocratesScrotum said:
AMD have reportedly secured Polaris contracts with Apple:

Apple to adopt AMD's new Polaris graphics chips in upcoming Macs - report

And there have been whispers that Intel is in negotiations to license AMD GPU IP:

Bloomberg: Intel in talks with AMD to license GPU patents

SO let's recap. Many in the tech world including [H] have trumpeted AMD's imminent collapse or bad financial situation in the last several years.

AMD has recently contracted with Apple for Polaris chips and is reportedly in talks with Intel for some of their GPU IP (possibly to be included in Intel chips rather than Intel's own GPU tech) which would provide significant income stream from two of the tech behemoths in the world.

Yet, somehow, [H] paints the potential Intel deal (and its income) as a BAD THING?
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The apple insider article is based on stuff that was stated months before ;)

Also the AMD graphics license, it might be a proactive thing something we don't know anything about right now...... just in case things with nV and their graphics IP license falls apart or to put pressure on nV during negotiations.
 
That article is all kinds of... wrong. Besides the obvious butt hurt because AMD didn't invite me. It's more of a forum post than an article, but whatever.

In the simplest terms AMD has created a product that runs hotter and slower than its competition's new architecture by a potentially significant margin.
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And what evidence is there to prove this? A very bold claim considering that Pascal is 16nm FinFET while Polaris is 14nm FinFET.
Let the internal finger-pointing begin! The NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080 and 1070 launch was a surprise to AMD and it simply does not have a harpoon for Moby Dick this time...again.
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Surprised everyone considering that nobody can get their hands on it, and the 1080 is more like Maxwell 2.0 than a new architecture.
After conversations with a number of current and recently departed employees a clear picture emerges. A picture ripe with tension, blind ambition, and backwards thinking.
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Recently departed employee’s would of course say negative things. That's just common sense.
I can already hear the fanboys ripping into my thoughts here yelling about the HardOCP's NVIDIA and Intel bias. This editorial is based on what I hear throughout the industry from insiders that know what is going on inside of AMD.
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Really can't blame them since you have nothing but hearsay to backup your claims. And you started by saying that you haven't been invited to AMD's party. Not long ago, you had a similar issue with AMD and the Nano. You did something to upset AMD, that's for certain. What that is nobody will know for sure. As far as sources go, others have credible sources that contradicts your information.

But don't let anyone here stop you from finding one of these ex AMD engineers to talk about what goes on behind the scenes. Cause hearsay doesn't cut it. I heard from a girl, who dated a ex AMD engineer who's responsible for the power connector on their graphic cards. Sounds silly.
 
§kynet said:
You might want to think about this for a bit. Take your time.
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I see what you did there. I didn't say they were giving us huge IPC jumps (they aren't) every year. Just that they have a great product stack from bottom to top.
 
§kynet said:
Looking at the die size is the absolutely false. Unless you think AMD was trying to pull off a miracle and make a tiny chip perform way beyond what is reasonable given its transistor count. To be clear we are talking about Polaris 10/11 Polaris is going to show up as a high end GPU as well.
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What was the time again for the respin of a GPU 6 months ? So 3 months ago at GDC AMD showed the "roadmap". They already knew that what they had back then their "roadmap" would not ever reflect something else. It would be totally weird if it reflected that they would compete. What surprised me are the rumours of Vega being pushed forward and this might just turn up to be just that.
DukenukemX said:
Really can't blame them since you have nothing but hearsay to backup your claims. And you started by saying that you haven't been invited to AMD's party. Not long ago, you had a similar issue with AMD and the Nano. You did something to upset AMD, that's for certain. What that is nobody will know for sure. As far as sources go, others have credible sources that contradicts your information.

But don't let anyone here stop you from finding one of these ex AMD engineers to talk about what goes on behind the scenes. Cause hearsay doesn't cut it. I heard from a girl, who dated a ex AMD engineer who's responsible for the power connector on their graphic cards. Sounds silly.
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Hearsay does not get you very far in this industry. Kyle did not upset AMD at all Roy Taylor did something bad. AMD did not like the [H] article describing Roy's actions which is silly because if your employee does something wrong you should be cross with him not someone describing his actions.

And calling AdoredTV a credible source is the same as saying: I'm a complete and utter moron please ignore me ...

People on youtube entertain at best some might even have decent stuff but youtube as a serious source give me a break ...
 
Great article, Kyle.

AMD buying ATI was a huge mistake for both parties. If RTG wants out so bad, AMD should at least try to sell it and get something for it. What's Intel going to do with it anyway? Let RTG / ATI be their own brand? Manufacture and market the cards themselves and shoot the bird to all the AMD GPU AIB's? Or just to absorb the IP and roll the tech into integrated GPUs. I don't get it.

I don't know what that would mean for their APU products with no new tech inbound, but it's not like they're really making any money off those anyway. AMD is just trying to make the best out of a bad situation there.

Nvidia isn't foolish enough to want AMD and all their baggage. One would hope.

I would like to think an outsider could step into the GPU ring with this turmoil and pull out a rabbit. But all the old names have been bought, sold, and used up by now. Sad.
 
DukenukemX said:
That article is all kinds of... wrong. Besides the obvious butt hurt because AMD didn't invite me. It's more of a forum post than an article, but whatever.


And what evidence is there to prove this? A very bold claim considering that Pascal is 16nm FinFET while Polaris is 14nm FinFET.
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This isn't confirmed yet, but I can't see Polaris reach Pascal in perf/watt at the same performance level, and that's from the AMD perf/watt statements. (2.0 compared to today's midrange), I can find a single way to get it match up with Pascal unless they were talking about Nano and they were not that was confirmed

Did you notice when they first starting showing and talking about Polaris they were comparing it to Hawaii and Granada with the 2.5 perf/watt then they changed it to 2.0 to today's midrange? They were changing its target bracket, could be......
Surprised everyone considering that nobody can get their hands on it, and the 1080 is more like Maxwell 2.0 than a new architecture.
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the shader array as in individual arrangement of each pipeline seem the same, but there are many changes under the hood, that's why they don't need the amount of bandwidth as before.

Recently departed employee’s would of course say negative things. That's just common sense.
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If they were fired, if they left on their own accord?

Really can't blame them since you have nothing but hearsay to backup your claims. And you started by saying that you haven't been invited to AMD's party. Not long ago, you had a similar issue with AMD and the Nano. You did something to upset AMD, that's for certain. What that is nobody will know for sure. As far as sources go, others have credible sources that contradicts your information.

But don't let anyone here stop you from finding one of these ex AMD engineers to talk about what goes on behind the scenes. Cause hearsay doesn't cut it. I heard from a girl, who dated a ex AMD engineer who's responsible for the power connector on their graphic cards. Sounds silly.
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Well I can tell you for almost all certainly Raja was talking with Intel. This is what actually opened up the gate for the IP licensing from AMD. And really AdornedTV? Come on......[/QUOTE]
 
DukenukemX said:
Really can't blame them since you have nothing but hearsay to backup your claims. And you started by saying that you haven't been invited to AMD's party. Not long ago, you had a similar issue with AMD and the Nano. You did something to upset AMD, that's for certain. What that is nobody will know for sure. As far as sources go, others have credible sources that contradicts your information.

But don't let anyone here stop you from finding one of these ex AMD engineers to talk about what goes on behind the scenes. Cause hearsay doesn't cut it. I heard from a girl, who dated a ex AMD engineer who's responsible for the power connector on their graphic cards. Sounds silly.
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You didn't seriously put up a link to adoredTV? Really? Seriously?
 
SocratesScrotum said:
Yet, somehow, [H] paints the potential Intel deal (and its income) as a BAD THING?
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A bad thing for Intel. Reading is fundamental.

AltTabbins said:
I'd love to see AMD as a company rise from their slump. I still have fond memories of my X2 3800 and ATI 850xt.
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Me too brother, me too. 9700s all over again!

DukenukemX said:
That article is all kinds of... wrong.
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But yet you offer no proof to the contrary. Guess you are a hypocrite?

DukenukemX said:
As far as sources go, others have credible sources that contradicts your information.
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LOL! Youtube dude.....LOL. That is funny.

DukenukemX said:
I heard from a girl, who dated a ex AMD engineer
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You know the rule....pics.
 
DooKey said:
You didn't seriously put up a link to adoredTV? Really? Seriously?
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LOL! A guy that cuts and pastes from other sites and takes videos of it then rambles on about things he doesn't know about "has sources".......
 
jgreath said:
It would probably have to be someone like Qualcomm and a desktop version of the Adreno GPU (*hint* ADRENO ~ RADEON)

What a twist that would be...

In reference to another thread on the forums: Whatever happened to PowerVR and S3? They were reasonably big players long, long ago. Are either of them still around in any capacity?
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PowerVR got too distracted with the Dreamcast debacle. They won the contract, but the ongoing lawsuit filed by 3DFX helped eventually helped to crater all three companies (Sega included).

By the time PowerVR Second Generation was launched on PC (single pipe, 64-bit), it was dead in the water. A card that would have been competitive in 1998 got slaughtered by the dual-texture, 128-bit cards of 1999, especially when you turned on 32-bit color.

VideoLogic Neon 250 Review - Introduction

They eventually caught up with the 128-bit dual-pipe Kyro 2, but they were just not making enough money with low-margin cards.

Hercules' 3D Prophet 4500 graphics card

S3 just got cratered from two directions at once: on the one end was the high performance 3D graphics they had never taken very seriously, and on the other hand was ATI stealing mountains of their traditional OEM contracts with their far more powerful Rage Pro. Until the Savage 3D released in summer 1998 S3 didn't have a single chip as powerful as the Rage Pro (released in summer 1997).

So they rushed the Savage 3D to market, and it was a mish-mash. It had a very small frame buffer, and low bandwidth, but made up for it by having lossy texture compression. In the rush to have the first 250nm chip, they suffered from poor yields. Their 3D drivers had never been that good with the ViRGE, and now it was still bad. And the card had the bad timing of being announced on two months before the Riva TNT shipped.

Then their follow-up with the Savage 4, a dual-texture card with the same crappy 64-bit memory bus, same crappy drivers. That was a massive boondoggle. Unless you were playing Unreal Tournament in METAL, you had shit performance.

So they again rushed their next card out the gate to compete with the GeForce, the Savage 2000 (4 pipes, 128-bit bus, T&L). This was obviously their first cut at a 128-bit bus because it was obviously bandwidth-constrained. And yeah, the crappy drivers continued. You can only get away with that for so long :(
 
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SixFootDuo said:
Lot of pages and threads. I'll sum it up for the new people joining us.
Do buy AMD .... Don't buy nVidia. If you're still with AMD, I promise you will enjoy the nVidia experience. Drivers are constantly crashing windows 10, performance is king. Excellent end-user experience.
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Some people would say: fixed it for you ;)
 
Michaelius said:
Apple contract isn't anything high volume - look at their product stack it's intel igpu in almost everything except some high end skus
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Also being Apple, AMD probably cannot charge them much as they would like to.
 
People seem to think that RTG can just go and bail to Intel without AMD, their CEO and the board approving the sale. It doesn't work like that.

RTG not playing along with AMD leadership? Fucking fire RTGs leadership, if they bail and run with secrets to their buddy at Intel, fucking sue Intel and them.

If I was Intel leadership I'd be looking at this toxic mess and wanting to stay far away.
 
I have read some Nvidia lovers say they will be glad when AMD goes bankrupt. I'm sitting and wondering how they can not see the future prices if that happened. So if AMD bribes people does that mean Nvidia has tried also?. Even if Polaris turned out to be a sub-par product, someone will buy it anyway cause Nvidia is so overpriced. The only problem with this is that AMD is also raising prices to Nvidia levels. This is a good thing for AMD but might backfire as well if the product doesn't match the price.
I use to be a fanboy of both companies in the 90's. Now I just get a good GPU for the lowest price I can find. I would not like to see either company fail. I would like to see more GPU companies add to the competition. Having just 2 companies going at it is a disadvantage to the comsumer. Hopefully some of what I have said makes sense. :vulcan:
 
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Genuinely curious , those trumpeting AMD's chips being used in the consoles ,

Do they actually make that much per chip for that ?
 
razor1 said:
LOL! A guy that cuts and pastes from other sites and takes videos of it then rambles on about things he doesn't know about "has sources".......
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What you never been to Youtube before ;)

Or are you just watching it for all of those amazing cats videos ?
 
linkgoron said:
Do you have a source for that?
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No I do not. It is a number that has been thrown around to me by engineers over the past year. Obviously it all comes down to transistor design, right? You threw out an argument, I gave you a reply. If you do not like my answer, I am good with that. :)

pcgeekesq said:
I don't want to believe you are posting click-bait articles, Kyle, but critics of the [H] might be able to make a colorable claim to that effect.
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Wow, alrighty. I wrote that whole article while channeling Buzzfeed, and I a got a clip-on manbun too so I was in the "write" mood. You can call it a lot of things, but clickbait is about the worst thing I have seen it called today. That one really hurts. Damn.
 
You know. I do appreciate we still have fanboys on the Red side. I just hope they are following through with their money other than just their mouth. It's been pointed out many times and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that we need competition. No one wants AMD to die.

Me, I don't see how you can waste your money on AMD. Intel and Nvidia combination is just unmatched right now. Or just Intel for low power consumption PC usage.
 
Intel-Features.jpg

Intel-14nm-Cost-Per-Transistor.png
Intel continues to deliver lower cost per transistor, tsmc and global foundries do not :p

This 16nm FF though, if I don't remember incorrectly FF+ has smaller SRAM size as lower leakage
 
Well this is a bomb shell, and as always, the very reason I come here, the [H]ard story! Nice work.
 
§kynet said:
Count on what? You slammed Nano relentlessly then gave it a Gold award. So I assume this will repeat with some variant of Polaris.
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AMD had a paper launched release of Nano and deserve to be slammed. [H] gave it a gold star for reviewing it as a SFF card that was competing for mini-970 and that deserve a gold star for the best performance card if you are into SFF. Once again reading is fundmental.
 
§kynet said:
Count on what? You slammed Nano relentlessly then gave it a Gold award. So I assume this will repeat with some variant of Polaris.
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Einstein said "It can scarcely be denied that the supreme goal of all theory is to make the irreducible basic elements as simple and as few as possible without having to surrender the adequate representation of a single datum of experience." You have simplified far too much, Einstein would not be amused.

Einstein's quote is often (over-)simplified to "Things should be as simple as possible, but no simpler." How ironic is that!
 
pcgeekesq said:
Einstein said "It can scarcely be denied that the supreme goal of all theory is to make the irreducible basic elements as simple and as few as possible without having to surrender the adequate representation of a single datum of experience." You have simplified far too much, Einstein would not be amused.

Einstein's quote is often (over-)simplified to "Things should be as simple as possible, but no simpler." How ironic is that!
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Incidentally, this is the best use of a (claimed) Einstein quote I've seen in years. I'm can't be bothered to check he actually said or wrote that :p
 
snowcrash said:
You know. I do appreciate we still have fanboys on the Red side. I just hope they are following through with their money other than just their mouth. It's been pointed out many times and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that we need competition. No one wants AMD to die.

Me, I don't see how you can waste your money on AMD. Intel and Nvidia combination is just unmatched right now. Or just Intel for low power consumption PC usage.
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That is such a nice sentiment especially when you prolly be the first to bitch about the good old days when you could still afford a cpu and gpu without paying premium prices for mid range hardware.
 
Chimpee said:
AMD had a paper launched release of Nano and deserve to be slammed. [H] gave it a gold star for reviewing it as a SFF card that was competing for mini-970 and that deserve a gold star for the best performance card if you are into SFF. Once again reading is fundmental.
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So you're saying if a Polaris equipped card is reviewed in the proper context it could also get a Gold award. But by all means expect a tiny GPU to compete with the likes of the 1080 makes perfect sense because 14nm and 16nm.
 
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