Final Fantasy games have an annoying quip lately

huxley

Pleeze Maik Mee STFU!!
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Oct 23, 2001
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In all older RPG's there are a ton of sidequests and optional content which I love. There are usually clues or other things that you can figure out for yourself, ultimate weapons etc.

Then I played through Final Fantasy 10, it was a fun game but one thing I noticed is they are adding a lot of secrets that are near impossible to figure out without a guide. I remember looking up how to get a characters ultimate weapon and it included randomly avoiding 200 lighting bolts in a row as well as a bunch of other complex things you would never ever figure out by yourself, has anyone else noticed this?

I just started playing 12 and was told by someone to get the leads ultimate weapon you have to not open some certain random chests in the beginning. There is no way to no this without a guide and I hate using guides. Is this some way for them to increase strategy guide sales or is it just some move they think is good?
 
I've been annoyed by this also, especially because, like you said, it's obviously a method to sell strategy guides. But, that's the great thing about GameFAQ.com.
 
Yeah, I hated that too. But in 12, you can get it, it's just A LOT easier without opening those chests. But of course, not opening those chests without a guide is pretty hard.
 
Yeah, I hated that too. But in 12, you can get it, it's just A LOT easier without opening those chests. But of course, not opening those chests without a guide is pretty hard.
Yeah, what I hated about that is there's absolutely nothing in game that makes reference to that secret.
 
This isn't just FF lately, but it seems all RPG's do this, as well as regular games.

Hell, you would be surprised at the amount of strategy guides that have wrong or missing information, so you can't even rely on those... but I'm fairly certain strategy guides aren't as big of a deal in Japan as they are here, maybe I'm wrong?
 
This isn't just FF lately, but it seems all RPG's do this, as well as regular games.

It is about money. They probably have negotiated contracts where a certain percent of content/gear can only be figured out with the guide. This isn't a horrible thing...since we still have gamefaqs. However...

I'm still a big FF fan. I tend to enjoy the games for what they are. I tend to play through the first time without a guide. The second time is for a the hope of one-shotting the final oss ;) But damn if that spear in 12 with haste/berserk wasn't just brutal. It really did turn most of the game into a joke if you went down that path. Also the auto-level script wasn't bad either. :p
 
Agreed completely.

Final Fantasy VI had the best sidequests, followed by VII.
 
Hah! Suikoden 2 had teh best side quests, followed by Xenogears.
 
Hah! Suikoden 2 had teh best side quests, followed by Xenogears.

Know what's mindblowingly amazing? I have a copy of Suikoden II coming to me through the mail from a Goozex user. It cost me 1000 points, which is the price for an in-demand newer used game (like Lost Odyssey, or Heavenly Sword, etc..). Haha, too bad the guy who's sending it to me doesn't know what it's worth :D.

Can't wait to start playing through the game.
 
Then I played through Final Fantasy 10, it was a fun game but one thing I noticed is they are adding a lot of secrets that are near impossible to figure out without a guide. I remember looking up how to get a characters ultimate weapon and it included randomly avoiding 200 lighting bolts in a row as well as a bunch of other complex things you would never ever figure out by yourself, has anyone else noticed this?
I generally agree, but that's a bad example. It was obvious that there would be a good reward for dodging a lot of bolts :p
 
I generally agree, but that's a bad example. It was obvious that there would be a good reward for dodging a lot of bolts :p
yes, but 200 bolts, good luck with that without cheating, can you imagine the frustration? Also that is just one piece of the several things you have to do. Anyway, what was up with the poetry too? "the black night hath doneth the harvest of the blue owl, thou shall know what is to come by the halberd of the midnight oil" or something equally ridiculous, I'm sorry but that isnt a good clue.

7 was the last one that had good sidequests that you could understand, 6 was excellent and you could get just about every secret by yourself by testing things out or using clues, although I am playing 12 right now and man it is good, I hated the new battle system at first but I really like it. I also love how money means something and you really have to think on who you want to give good gear too because you never have enough money, and you actually need to steal a lot to afford most things, good job!
 
yes, but 200 bolts, good luck with that without cheating, can you imagine the frustration? Also that is just one piece of the several things you have to do. Anyway, what was up with the poetry too? "the black night hath doneth the harvest of the blue owl, thou shall know what is to come by the halberd of the midnight oil" or something equally ridiculous, I'm sorry but that isnt a good clue.

7 was the last one that had good sidequests that you could understand, 6 was excellent and you could get just about every secret by yourself by testing things out or using clues, although I am playing 12 right now and man it is good, I hated the new battle system at first but I really like it. I also love how money means something and you really have to think on who you want to give good gear too because you never have enough money, and you actually need to steal a lot to afford most things, good job!

I never did dodge those 200 bolts until I built a circuit that looked for light pulses and then hit the jump key. Actually...FFX was the only game where I completely filled the sphere map but never had all the weapons. BTW...one shotting final bosses is the da bomb.
 
I can honestly say, this is NOT something new. Game developers have, for a long time now, made content in their games obscure and not make alot of sense at times....on purpose. Its all about marketing, im sure. "Hey, we can make this game, sell it for x amount and then, make additional profit by creating a "guide" that people will HAVE to buy to complete parts of the game".

Back in the ol 5 1/4 floppy days, this was going on too. I recall playing a Kings Quest game. I think it was number 5, I dunno....anyhoo......I was playing thru it and I came across this canoe that I needed to use to get across a lake/river. But it had a hole in it and I had to "USE" something to patch the hole.

I had all sorts of items in my inventory, but nothing made any sense to be used as a "plug" for the hole. I couldnt figure it out and since these games were linear, I couldnt do any more till I crossed the lake. I finally gave in and had to go buy THEIR guide.

After looking it up, I found out that I was supposed to use a honey comb to plug up the hole. I was like...WTF!!!! I would never in a million years have thought to do that, but not only that, I had to squeeze the honey out first which then left the wax and THAT was what was used to plug the hole.

It was stupid I thought, but to finish the game, the makers of the game (I think Sierra) got another 10 bucks outta me.

And now, these days, the guide can cost as much as the game cost, and in some cases, more.
 
I noticed this in Lost Odyssey as well. The highest rank spells were in invisible chests, and the only way you could see these chests was through an obscure sidequest. Even after you got the item, there was no way you would go back through the starting zones where these spells were found without a guide. The saddest part was that the hidden dungeon couldn't even be completed without one of the spells.
 
I noticed this in Lost Odyssey as well. The highest rank spells were in invisible chests, and the only way you could see these chests was through an obscure sidequest. Even after you got the item, there was no way you would go back through the starting zones where these spells were found without a guide. The saddest part was that the hidden dungeon couldn't even be completed without one of the spells.

Its not the same though, since you get hints to get those chests, its not completely random like dodging 200 lightning bolts. There is nothing at all that points to dodging 200 lightning bolts. At least I never found it.

I can honestly say, this is NOT something new. Game developers have, for a long time now, made content in their games obscure and not make alot of sense at times....on purpose. Its all about marketing, im sure. "Hey, we can make this game, sell it for x amount and then, make additional profit by creating a "guide" that people will HAVE to buy to complete parts of the game".

Back in the ol 5 1/4 floppy days, this was going on too. I recall playing a Kings Quest game. I think it was number 5, I dunno....anyhoo......I was playing thru it and I came across this canoe that I needed to use to get across a lake/river. But it had a hole in it and I had to "USE" something to patch the hole.

I had all sorts of items in my inventory, but nothing made any sense to be used as a "plug" for the hole. I couldnt figure it out and since these games were linear, I couldnt do any more till I crossed the lake. I finally gave in and had to go buy THEIR guide.

After looking it up, I found out that I was supposed to use a honey comb to plug up the hole. I was like...WTF!!!! I would never in a million years have thought to do that, but not only that, I had to squeeze the honey out first which then left the wax and THAT was what was used to plug the hole.

It was stupid I thought, but to finish the game, the makers of the game (I think Sierra) got another 10 bucks outta me.

And now, these days, the guide can cost as much as the game cost, and in some cases, more.

Yep, thats KQ5. I personally thought that game was genius on wheels, then written into a game! My only quirk with KQ games is that if you mess up one thing, you're more than likely to be screwed for good in the later parts. And they won't tell you that til you reach it. If you don't save the rat, you're screwed later on, you don't get the honey, you're screweed later on. You don't get the crystal, you're screwed later on.

Know what's mindblowingly amazing? I have a copy of Suikoden II coming to me through the mail from a Goozex user. It cost me 1000 points, which is the price for an in-demand newer used game (like Lost Odyssey, or Heavenly Sword, etc..). Haha, too bad the guy who's sending it to me doesn't know what it's worth :D.

Can't wait to start playing through the game.

You lucky lil............ bah.... I wish I owned that game. But when I got the PSX the game was already sold out.
 
I noticed this in Lost Odyssey as well. The highest rank spells were in invisible chests, and the only way you could see these chests was through an obscure sidequest. Even after you got the item, there was no way you would go back through the starting zones where these spells were found without a guide. The saddest part was that the hidden dungeon couldn't even be completed without one of the spells.

Eh? You don't really need any of the hidden spells to beat Fu or the Immortal One.

FFX takes the cake for the worst minigames and side quests for the best weapons......
 
The only minigame or for that mater about the only thing I liked in FFX was the blitz ball and the Anama summon. FF6, FF7 and FF8 are my favs.
 
And all of this guidebook business is in addition to the fact that Square is now making games that have a lot of special weapons that can only be unlocked by multiplayer (like in FFT: War of the Lions). I think that's even more annoying.
 
I can honestly say, this is NOT something new. Game developers have, for a long time now, made content in their games obscure and not make alot of sense at times....on purpose. Its all about marketing, im sure. "Hey, we can make this game, sell it for x amount and then, make additional profit by creating a "guide" that people will HAVE to buy to complete parts of the game".

Back in the ol 5 1/4 floppy days, this was going on too. I recall playing a Kings Quest game. I think it was number 5, I dunno....anyhoo......I was playing thru it and I came across this canoe that I needed to use to get across a lake/river. But it had a hole in it and I had to "USE" something to patch the hole.

I had all sorts of items in my inventory, but nothing made any sense to be used as a "plug" for the hole. I couldnt figure it out and since these games were linear, I couldnt do any more till I crossed the lake. I finally gave in and had to go buy THEIR guide.

After looking it up, I found out that I was supposed to use a honey comb to plug up the hole. I was like...WTF!!!! I would never in a million years have thought to do that, but not only that, I had to squeeze the honey out first which then left the wax and THAT was what was used to plug the hole.

It was stupid I thought, but to finish the game, the makers of the game (I think Sierra) got another 10 bucks outta me.

And now, these days, the guide can cost as much as the game cost, and in some cases, more.
haha kings quest, I tried playing one of those games once and it was impossible to figure out what to do, I remember one part you had to literally serach for a needle in a haystack, I hate those kq games!!!
 
i remember Castlevania 2: simons quest had a really obscure thing you had to do. like crouching against a wall WHILE holding a red crystal and waiting for 5 seconds. I can't remember if I had to call the nes hotline or if I figured it out, but I don't think it was mentioned anywhere that I remember.
 
Some of the older adventure games had obnoxious things involving item collection, but a lot of that came down to literally clicking everywhere on every screen and just using everything in sight on everything in sight. It's lame, but not *quite* as bad.
Some of the random stuff they toss into RPG's today is just ridiculous. I think it was Final Fantasy #8 where there were numerous summons and spells that you had to get in individual battles by doing specific things or you never got the item. You pretty much had to have a hint guide or GameFAQs permanently open while playing that game or you'd miss something important. Even the whole gameplay mechanic of draining things to get stronger was never explained well in the game.
We've seen more and more stuff like that in recent years.
I miss the days of Final Fantasy 6 (or 3 as it was for us back then). There was a TON of hidden stuff, but nothing you really needed a guide for. You could pretty much stumble upon anything with a little effort and you never really permanently missed anything.
 
i remember Castlevania 2: simons quest had a really obscure thing you had to do. like crouching against a wall WHILE holding a red crystal and waiting for 5 seconds. I can't remember if I had to call the nes hotline or if I figured it out, but I don't think it was mentioned anywhere that I remember.

Yup, that was a horrible offender, too. That was a game where Nintendo Power saved me a ton of time. Once you knew what to do in that game it was insanely short and easy, but figuring that stuff out was just retarded. There was a few clues, but not enough.
 
Some of the older adventure games had obnoxious things involving item collection, but a lot of that came down to literally clicking everywhere on every screen and just using everything in sight on everything in sight. It's lame, but not *quite* as bad.
Some of the random stuff they toss into RPG's today is just ridiculous. I think it was Final Fantasy #8 where there were numerous summons and spells that you had to get in individual battles by doing specific things or you never got the item. You pretty much had to have a hint guide or GameFAQs permanently open while playing that game or you'd miss something important. Even the whole gameplay mechanic of draining things to get stronger was never explained well in the game.
We've seen more and more stuff like that in recent years.
I miss the days of Final Fantasy 6 (or 3 as it was for us back then). There was a TON of hidden stuff, but nothing you really needed a guide for. You could pretty much stumble upon anything with a little effort and you never really permanently missed anything.
8 was the first FF that I hated, I hated the main character and the story for the most part. Anyway, I remember that battle system was explained very very poorly and when you finally understood what to do you were basically unstoppable, get like 99 bio and that was it or something like that.
 
Some of the older adventure games had obnoxious things involving item collection, but a lot of that came down to literally clicking everywhere on every screen and just using everything in sight on everything in sight. It's lame, but not *quite* as bad.
Some of the random stuff they toss into RPG's today is just ridiculous. I think it was Final Fantasy #8 where there were numerous summons and spells that you had to get in individual battles by doing specific things or you never got the item. You pretty much had to have a hint guide or GameFAQs permanently open while playing that game or you'd miss something important. Even the whole gameplay mechanic of draining things to get stronger was never explained well in the game.
We've seen more and more stuff like that in recent years.
I miss the days of Final Fantasy 6 (or 3 as it was for us back then). There was a TON of hidden stuff, but nothing you really needed a guide for. You could pretty much stumble upon anything with a little effort and you never really permanently missed anything.

I loved FF8, though I will conceed the having to draw the spells instead of learning them was a bit of a pain so was having to draw the GF the Guardian Forces. If you didn't draw them from the enemies, usally bossed when you faced them you were screwed. I thought the idea of junctioning spells to stats to raise them and add status effects to attacks or deffend against them was an intersting concept. There were also to hidden GFs that could only be obtained by using a pocket station, they where the Cocobo and the Momba GFs. Never did get my hands on one of things.

It also took a page from FF7 making the secret boss/es MUCH HARDER to beat then the end game boss. Man I remember the first time that I fought Omgea Weapon in Ultima's Castle. He would open with lvl. 5 death. Practially every move he had was a near or instant death move not mention he had over 1 MILLION HP and absorbed all elemental magic espcially loved the fire attack from the phoniex, stupid bird never resurected the party anytime before Omega and at Omega 18 times!!!!

The card game was a good way to the good stuff early in the game if you had the paience to do it. Then the plus and random rules would rear their ugly heads and I would waste countless hours trying to get one blasted card. Blitz Ball from FFX was pretty sweet too.

I throughly enjoyed the plot line.. wow this is getting to be a long post...
 
Blitz Ball sucked imo. I found it utterly boring, I don't know how anyone can find it fun.
 
For some reason I actually got EVERYTHING in FF8. I had all the cards, summons, and killed the weapons, too. No clue why. I think I actually just enjoyed the setting for that game even if I did hate draining enemies over and over again for the same spell. That was made worse by making the actual spells worthless, but they also powered up your stats.
I actually beat Omega with Zell (alone). I can't recall how it went, but I remember that I was actually using his limit break (the combo one) over and over in combination with getting hit and using elixers. From what I recall of it, I ended up in a pattern where I could do a version of his limit break that hit repeatedly for minimal damage over and over and over.

Agreed that Blitz Ball sucked. It was a card game in disguise!
 
If you guys want the most serious offenders, look at the "Tales of..." series.

Miss talking to some random guy in a town? Sidequest gone for the whole game. Reach a certain point? Multiple sidequests gone for the whole game.

In Tales of Symphonia, if you wanna get everyones alternate costumes, you gotta play through the game at least 3 times using New Game+ mode.

The games are good, but I won't play through them without a guide.
 
For some reason I actually got EVERYTHING in FF8. I had all the cards, summons, and killed the weapons, too. No clue why. I think I actually just enjoyed the setting for that game even if I did hate draining enemies over and over again for the same spell. That was made worse by making the actual spells worthless, but they also powered up your stats.
I actually beat Omega with Zell (alone). I can't recall how it went, but I remember that I was actually using his limit break (the combo one) over and over in combination with getting hit and using elixers. From what I recall of it, I ended up in a pattern where I could do a version of his limit break that hit repeatedly for minimal damage over and over and over.

Agreed that Blitz Ball sucked. It was a card game in disguise!

I did too! The only thing I didn't do was the chocobo summon, and beating omega. The other thing I did like once, was the chocobo searching thing. it was just dumb. Aside from that FF8 was phenomenal imo. I actually don't mind the drawing, since I found most enemies a cinch without the drawing anyway.

I didn't beat Omega, but I'm pretty sure you used the fan called Armageddon fist. Which is Zell doing Booyah and punch rush (i think those are the names) in rapid succession, which can let you do a million or 2 dmg if you're good enough.
 
I have never played a single player final fantasy game (was more of an Ultima fan), but I recently got ffxi online and I am enjoying it a lot and like the community so far.
 
I loved Tales of Symphonia...

But if I remember, Skies of Arcadia was bad about this. As well as Chrono Cross and Chrono Trigger.

The whole FF franchise has taken a steep drop after 7, which I am now replaying. The battle systems are getting worse, the stories less gripping, and the characters just plain dull. And 11 online... give me an effin break, worst waste of money in my life. I think the community just sucked in 11. I do have high hopes for FFCC on the PSP.

e_t
 
I think the steep happened after 9. 10 had good music though, and the battle system wasn't too bad, either. The ability to switch characters mid battle was a good idea.
 
I think the steep happened after 9. 10 had good music though, and the battle system wasn't too bad, either. The ability to switch characters mid battle was a good idea.

I will agree that 9 was very fun. It may have recaptured some of the fun, but all that was lost with 10. At least in 10 some of the characters were interesting. No characters will ever be as great as Vincent.

e_t
 
I loved Tales of Symphonia...

But if I remember, Skies of Arcadia was bad about this. As well as Chrono Cross and Chrono Trigger.

The whole FF franchise has taken a steep drop after 7, which I am now replaying. The battle systems are getting worse, the stories less gripping, and the characters just plain dull. And 11 online... give me an effin break, worst waste of money in my life. I think the community just sucked in 11. I do have high hopes for FFCC on the PSP.

e_t

not really, 8 sucked, havent played 9 but 10 was a lot better than a thought but starts very very slow for the first 6 hours. 12 started slow as well but was great once you got into it, I love the new live battle system, I hope they never go back to loading screens and random encounters.
 
For some reason I actually got EVERYTHING in FF8. I had all the cards, summons, and killed the weapons, too. No clue why. I think I actually just enjoyed the setting for that game even if I did hate draining enemies over and over again for the same spell. That was made worse by making the actual spells worthless, but they also powered up your stats.
I actually beat Omega with Zell (alone). I can't recall how it went, but I remember that I was actually using his limit break (the combo one) over and over in combination with getting hit and using elixers. From what I recall of it, I ended up in a pattern where I could do a version of his limit break that hit repeatedly for minimal damage over and over and over.

Agreed that Blitz Ball sucked. It was a card game in disguise!
Its funny what people prefer, in my eyes i hated that stupid card game and loved blitzball. I think the thing was that they took blitz ball as a total side game, there was only one major item you could get from playing it that made a big difference. The card game as I recall had way too many extra items assigned to it. Not to mention it was kinda fun playing blitzball, building your stats and getting wedge and that other guy kickin ass.
 
I hate it when hidden quests/items are a one time only deal.

It's like you customize your group and put so much into them only to find out that you missed X great thing and you'd have to restart the game to experience it.
 
I know lately I've been sitting in front of the TV with a game on trying to figure something out and eventually going to Gamefaqs and finding the solution only to yell out loud to myself, "HOW THE HELL AM I SUPPOSED TO JUST FIGURE THAT OUT ON MY OWN!?"
 
In all older RPG's there are a ton of sidequests and optional content which I love. There are usually clues or other things that you can figure out for yourself, ultimate weapons etc.

Then I played through Final Fantasy 10, it was a fun game but one thing I noticed is they are adding a lot of secrets that are near impossible to figure out without a guide. I remember looking up how to get a characters ultimate weapon and it included randomly avoiding 200 lighting bolts in a row as well as a bunch of other complex things you would never ever figure out by yourself, has anyone else noticed this?

I just started playing 12 and was told by someone to get the leads ultimate weapon you have to not open some certain random chests in the beginning. There is no way to no this without a guide and I hate using guides. Is this some way for them to increase strategy guide sales or is it just some move they think is good?

Well if you compare this to early games it was just about as difficult to ge the answers to secrets, maybe they are compensating for the availability of information on the internet these days?
 
woot for mentioning Xenogears -- one of the best RPGs

+1 for xenogears... as for Xenosaga series.. well, I'm disappointed after playing the first one. I heard the 2nd one was good though, don't know about the 3rd.
 
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