Fear And Loathing In Lost Business - Editorial @ [H] Consumer

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Chris_Morley

Former [H] Consumer Managing Ed.
Joined
Jul 5, 2000
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[H] Consumer has a new editorial up for your perusal. If you're in a position to recommend a custom integrator, or are looking for one yourself, be sure to check this out.

The custom integration market is overflowing with companies fighting for your hard earned money. Many integrators are simply missing the mark when it comes to earning your business and delivering a fantastic custom experience. We take a look at why some are getting it wrong.
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i guess I never thought about too many options as being a problem.

...untill now that is.
 
While this doesn't relate entirely to the article, I really want to thank [H], and you especially Chris, for the consistant quality that is seen in the Consumer articles. They've been helpful many times over and are the only online reviews that I've come to actually trust, with the recent Monarch review demonstrating the honesty of the review process. Keep up the amazing work!

 
Some pretty good insights, on the whole, especially on tech support.

The only thing I disagree with, and this is a personal opinion, really, is:

"Being able to configure a system from every single computer component known to man is a bad thing."

I had my computer custom-built by MCS, because they had a large variety of components to choose from. I did this, because I knew exactly what I wanted, but I was spending several thousand dollars and I had never actually built a computer before. I didn't want to royally screw up something because I forgot one little thing that anyone who'd built a computer before would know, or something like that. I knew the chance was pretty low, but I still didn't want to take that chance for the kind of money I was spending. :p

I had looked at VM, Maingear, ABS, etc., but I went with Monarch because I could get almost exactly what I wanted. Would I do it again? No, because a few weeks later I built my sister's computer (she wasn't very happy that it was my first time ;)) and I didn't have any problems, so from now on, I'll be able to build my computer myself.

EDIT: Maybe you could expand on:

"Stay away from companies that offer endless options unless you are fully willing to do their work for them."

What exactly does that mean? The PSU was dead the first time I received my computer; when I got it back after sending it back to them, I didn't have to do any hardware changes or software tweaking, besides the usual getting Windows the way I want it.
 
General Crespin said:
Some pretty good insights, on the whole, especially on tech support.

The only thing I disagree with, and this is a personal opinion, really, is:

"Being able to configure a system from every single computer component known to man is a bad thing."

I had my computer custom-built by MCS, because they had a large variety of components to choose from. I did this, because I knew exactly what I wanted, but I was spending several thousand dollars and I had never actually built a computer before. I didn't want to royally screw up something because I forgot one little thing that anyone who'd built a computer before would know, or something like that. I knew the chance was pretty low, but I still didn't want to take that chance for the kind of money I was spending. :p

I had looked at VM, Maingear, ABS, etc., but I went with Monarch because I could get almost exactly what I wanted. Would I do it again? No, because a few weeks later I built my sister's computer (she wasn't very happy that it was my first time ;)) and I didn't have any problems, so from now on, I'll be able to build my computer myself.

EDIT: Maybe you could expand on:

"Stay away from companies that offer endless options unless you are fully willing to do their work for them."

What exactly does that mean? The PSU was dead the first time I received my computer; when I got it back after sending it back to them, I didn't have to do any hardware changes or software tweaking, besides the usual getting Windows the way I want it.
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The point I laid out was that often, the configuration possibilities go beyond what a company has done proper and prior R&D on. This requires, like in the situation you just described to me, doing your own research. You said you went to a company knowing exactly what you want. I'm saying that's great, but beginners and novices should stay away unless they know exactly what they're buying. And since it could be a company's first time to use the parts in the configuration that you bought, there is a greater possibility that they will screw it up, and it can be a support nightmare to have that many different platforms in the field.
 
Chris_Morley said:
The point I laid out was that often, the configuration possibilities go beyond what a company has done proper and prior R&D on. This requires, like in the situation you just described to me, doing your own research. You said you went to a company knowing exactly what you want. I'm saying that's great, but beginners and novices should stay away unless they know exactly what they're buying. And since it could be a company's first time to use the parts in the configuration that you bought, there is a greater possibility that they will screw it up, and it can be a support nightmare to have that many different platforms in the field.
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Chris said it a lot better than I can in my current state. (Coffee-zombie. Beaaaaaaaans.)

This is a simple fact of hardware and software stability. Why the hell would I want to sell and support a system I've not tested at all? Answer; I sure as hell don't, and won't. No, you can't have ATI FireGL V7350's in an nForce2200/2050 board! Why? Because there is no way in hell I am going to support a configuration that even if I DO get it working acceptably, I know full well nVidia's going to break.

How am I supposed to be able to tell a bad card from a driver issue when you call up screaming about BSODs? You are not sitting there with a PCI bus analyzer, PCIScope, and an OS with full or even partial debug capability. You are sitting there yelling at me because the system you bought from me broke, and I can't tell you to do steps X, Y and Z to fix it.

I'll grant you that everyone's disk options utterly suck, though. It's an old throwback to the "visible drive" display days. Gotta play favorites with the vendor of the week, even if their products SUCK. And they love to dictate how you can and can't sell their junk in your systems. :rolleyes:
 
I purchased a pre-built system awhile back maybe in 2001 from a California company, I think who are now called eWiz.com. But before purchasing, I highly suggest researching the components and reading reviews because sites who do put together components just simply list them, they don't really say "Hey, this matches up well with this." I researched various components of mine and ended up choosing

P4 2.8ghz
Radeon 9800 Pro 128mb
Super Talent Aluminum Case
Abit IC-7 Motherboard
1GB Corsair TwinX 400mhz
Western Digital 32mb Raptor 10krpm
Western Digital 120gb 7k rpm
And a Plextor CD-R/W Drive

I forget the power supply, but the system was built and shipped, they alerted me as to the stages and also had some debit card problems but called them and they told me exactly what was wrong, and even replaced something since they were out of stock.. I forget exactly what it was, maybe the hard drive. But it arrived well packaged and worked out of the box. The only problem was my Radeon's fan stopped working, to which I RMA'd it back to them and they gave me a replacement (have since upgraded the card to a beefy X800XT PE AGP) but the experience was pretty good. Especially for people who are conscios of the DIY aspect of building a computer. My friend also ordered a computer recently from digitalstormonline.com who does high end gaming computers, they even test them and run benchmarks, ala Alienware or Falcon. My friend spent a week of researching just various components and computer-related things, since he didn't know much about them. His system is gonna blow mine away, and they're pretty fairly priced. Checking the background of the company is definately important too. All in all, I'd likely buy another pre-built system if I don't get the courage to just fish for the parts and try to put them together.
 
Your article was well written and very much to the point. Anyone who has seen "both sides of the coin".....ie ordered pre-built and then built themselves from the ground up certainly understands your excellent advice.

Your bottom line advice is well taken.....look for quality,through testing,reputation and support that is from the builder.....

I very much enjoyed the article and it mirrors your reviews nicely.
 
Chris_Morley said:
You said you went to a company knowing exactly what you want. I'm saying that's great, but beginners and novices should stay away unless they know exactly what they're buying. And since it could be a company's first time to use the parts in the configuration that you bought, there is a greater possibility that they will screw it up, and it can be a support nightmare to have that many different platforms in the field.
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Point taken. :)
 
Pkirk618 said:
i guess I never thought about too many options as being a problem.

...untill now that is.
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Yeah if you think about it, consider what happens on a lot of forums.

"Cookie cutter" builds. Why do we do this? B/c we use combinations of parts that, with experience, have worked together. I think of when I built by A7N8X box...or my current DFI box.

Cookie cutter builds are the best =D.
 
I have to agree, too many configurations is a bad thing. First it can confuse the casual consumer, someone who wants a new system, make a few choices, and have it backed up with support. Usually this means selecting a component or two they have read about on message boards and seeing reviews.

I consider myself very well versed in the various parts available, I know where to get the information I don't have, and have been building systems for nearly 20 years off an on. Yet I have found some system builders whose site just confuses me to no end. Worse are sites that allow obviously incorrect configurations.

If you look at three or four of your recent reviews one thing did stand out, those who standardized on the important parts (m/b proc video) tended to return the best results. What some people don't understand that limiting selection in the key areas does not limit the overall possibilities. For the most part differences in performance between motherboards is minimal. The same can be said about most memory choices and hard drives as well. The few items the customer should select are items which directly affect the performance level of the system they are buying, this would be processor, video card, and the type of hard drive configuration. Heck, a lot can be said for standardizing the cases used!


Anyway, good write up. Perhaps some integrators will take note that reducing choices in some areas actually make for more meaniful choices elsewhere.
 
Your editorial could have easily been titled " How Not To Grab Your eAnkles".:D Maybe Kyle will aprove this title for your next one.:D

Thank you so much for your focus on tech support. It will help so many consumers see through the tech support claims(BS) vs. reality.

My previous employer used the same business model as Monarch and some others . Which is basically to do everything possible to get your money, but once they have it, you are virtually on your own. The nice, patient salesman that you once talked to is NOW unavailable. My ex manager hired, trained and maintained an entire sales force. But had a untrained skeleton crew that was called, yep you guessed it "customer service".

As far as Margins are concrened, if the pre-builder is building and testing like they advertise, then there will be few RMAs in the 1st place. But when the number one priority/focus is $money$ (get more units out the door right now or or are fired) and quality is further down on the list. Well of course the need for tech support or RMAs multiplys.
 
Thank you for an excellent Editorial! I found myself sitting here nodding in agreement over and over, as I am in the process of going to sites and configuring my "wish list" atm new computer -- build from scratch and me would never be in the same sentence.

I have found, just from my visits to many of these sites that after a few minutes of trying to just navigate the site my head is spinning. Clutter, too many choices (whoever thought that would actually be a bad thing? but it is), not enough information on what will and either might not or will not work together, sketchy support details and a high price tag just don't cut it for me.

I found just buying a name brand once that tech support is an area that gets a big fat F, along with some warranties. Just not worth the paper they're written on. I may not know alot about computers, but I sure do know when a PSU or hd fails -- and to have someone on the other end of the phone tell me there is nothing wrong with it, that they won't honor their on-site tech support and finally having to write to the state's attorney general and BBB to finally get a failed hd replaced is inexcusable. It's even moreso with the boutique higher end, high priced "custom" computers. If people are laying out that kind of money, they deserve good, reliable and prompt attention to any problems.

I was going to actually lay out the money for an ABS, then read some of the tales of woe on this forum and a couple of others on the horrors of dealing with customer service/tech support when something went wrong or was DOA. I wish these companies would get it together and think past just getting our money, then letting us twist in the wind.
 
Pkirk618 said:
i guess I never thought about too many options as being a problem.

...untill now that is.
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Oh, it definitely is.

From a logistics standpoint, offering 50 Athlon motherboards means stocking (or ordering) 50 different Athlon motherboard.

From a support standpoint, it becomes far more difficult to troubleshoot something quickly with such a wide selection.

And of course, there's always the consumer. The smart thing to do is offer consumers only products which are well-reviewed from manufacturers you and your customers trust.

Of course, you could always take special requests. If someone comes to you wanting a specific build, charge a small extra fee to find and order the parts they want rather than using your normal wares.
 
Chris and Crew - great editorial. You were spot on with your assessment of the current custom PC builder scene.

This thread should be a sticky - it's definitely relevant and would be a great place to post readers' questions and reviews of past purchase and support experiences.

I know you guys can't play favorites, but I would love to know who you think meets all your criteria best. Of course, I already have a good idea from reading your reviews over the last year. Great editorial - keep 'em coming and please sticky this thread.
 
Thanks for the feedback guys, and truly, I appreciate the support, as does everyone else here.
 
That lookes like something the manufacturers could read over also, not just the consumer.
 
Velocity_Micro said:
I'm hoping my competitors don't see this...but then again, they probably won't bother.
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Congratulations! you guys at [h] really are hitting the audience you were hoping for. It's cool to see that these companies are paying attention. I've always noticed that vm responds to reviews and questions in the forum (unlike some builders recently, ahem)

How about it? What other companies are out there reading this? Show us who's taking this to heart.
 
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That was really an exceptional article that has real relevance to alot of people. I can't think of any other site that provides this kind of information to its users on such a regular basis. I especially agree with the warnings about web sites that are cumbersome to navigate or offer too many options.
 
macguy said:
That was really an exceptional article that has real relevance to alot of people. I can't think of any other site that provides this kind of information to its users on such a regular basis. I especially agree with the warnings about web sites that are cumbersome to navigate or offer too many options.
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We really appreciate it.
 
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