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duby229

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I feel like I need to write a short and sweet post that explains my presence here on this forum. First I do --NOT-- work for AMD in any capacity at all period. I certainly wish that I did. But I dont.

Second. This is the AMD forum for a popular enthusiast fan site. I am an enthusiast, and an AMD fan. I think most of you can guess that. I contribute to this forum by posting help to others and offering a differing views on topics.

Ever since Intel; took the performance crown I've been labelled every nasty thing you can think of. I dont care. Think what you want to think. But dont attack my integrity.

Whenever I hear baseless claims that AMD is going to die, or that AMD will never compete again, or that AMD will go back to being a copycat, or that AMD should start using INtels platforms, or any other BS I do my part and offer a different view.

I dont contribute to every thread on this forum, But becouse I --KNOW-- full well that I am biased, I stay here. I dont go trolloing in the Intel forum. Those folks can feel free to think whatever they ant to think. And I dont go over there and cutting them down, or tellingthem how much I think Intel sucks.

I think it is BS that the same curtesy cant be extended over here either. When I am called out by name, and made fun of becouse of my preferences. Something is wrong. Not with me, but the accusers. I am open in what I believe. I never said any of you have to believe what I do.

Howvever once the BS gets rolling, I'll be the first to offer a different view. That is what a public discussion is supposed to be. If you guys can leave it at that, then you need to get a life. Dont call me out on my beleives becouse where I live, we are free to express it when we wish and how we wish.

Intel isnt God, they dont give a care about you. Niether does AMD or any other company. Get used to it, and stop making personal attacks in a public forum over something that means nothing in real life.
 
BRAVO... since intel has the lead at the moment (might i add the first time in quite a while this has happened) everyone thinks they are perfect and the only cpu you should buy. im an amd fan. the only computers ive personally owned are amd. let me say amd has had there turn for asskicking and now its intels turn. its the way the market goes. healthy competition. the intel cpus do have there flaws. i still respect people who own intel, theres nothing wrong with it. i just have a preference. AMD is not dieing, its just not in the lead, was intel dieing during the p4 and a64 days, no, it just wasnt in the lead. i wouldnt put it as harsh as duby but i agree.

my 2 cents
 
mpcamer1220 said:
I've never had a problem with you.. I honestly don't see why others do though.
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seconded. i mean hell, i've even made peace with donnie, with whom i've had several heated debates with in the past. it's all about getting to know your opponent and understanding where he comes from :D
 
Exactly, plus it's the AMD forum. Who cares if he likes AMD? It's the AMD forum!

I have 28-30 AMD shirts at the moment, call me a *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*! if you want.

edit - lol *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!.
 
Thanks guys. I got a little riled up there. I just read that post for the first time, and it came out sounding a little meaner then I intended.

So for those of you who made reading it this far, just to let you know, It wasnt intended to come out so harsh. Though I do mean every word of it.
 
yeah, i know exactly what you mean. the forums are separated for a reason. i don't understand how some of the discussions that occur here actually happen without several warnings/temp bans :confused:

because of it, i've largely stayed out of the amd forum for the last month or so. :(
 
I do not post very much, but I do have a question or two, but I would first like to explain one thing, I am here to learn more than I can on my own, and in doing so I feel that debate between forums is necessary.

I am not talking about comments that refer to AMD beats Intel or Intel beats AMD, but some of the long debates amongst people here have a great ability to provoke more thoughts and to also widen a persons view. I like the feeling that I get when someone defending there opinion or feeling sparks the realization of "I didn't think of that".

With all that being said, here are my questions...

1. Do you feel that having a debate about AMD and Intel in the AMD forum, or Intel and AMD in the Intel forum is wrong?

2. If you feel it is wrong, are you not here for debate and a further understanding of the technology that surrounds us, be it from Intel or AMD?

Thanks, and I hope it all made sense.
 
enumae said:
1. Do you feel that having a debate about AMD and Intel in the AMD forum, or Intel and AMD in the Intel forum is wrong?
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it's not wrong until people start telling other people that their opinions are wrong, flamebaiting and other nastyness. then it turns from a debate to an argument or pissing match
 
enumae said:
1. Do you feel that having a debate about AMD and Intel in the AMD forum, or Intel and AMD in the Intel forum is wrong?

2. If you feel it is wrong, are you not here for debate and a further understanding of the technology that surrounds us, be it from Intel or AMD?
Click to expand...

(cf)Eclipse said:
it's not wrong until people start telling other people that their opinions are wrong, flamebaiting and other nastyness. then it turns from a debate to an argument or pissing match
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I agree whole heartedly with Eclipse. I have no problem being presented with FACTS about the product but when people start name calling and telling me opinions are wrong I get a little testy

mpcamer1220 said:
I've never had a problem with you.. I honestly don't see why others do though.
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I like what you do I may not always agree with it but its nice to read something besides Intel Rules AMD sucks. Alot of the time I do find myself agreeing with you though.

In fact I just wrote a rant of my own over in Kyle's thread in Gen Hardware about just about the same thing.
 
enumae said:
1. Do you feel that having a debate about AMD and Intel in the AMD forum, or Intel and AMD in the Intel forum is wrong?
Click to expand...

No its not wrong...

Its just that most conversations go like this.....

Me: "I think AMD is doing better then some people give them credit for"
someone: "link to q1 results"
someone else: "link to q1 results"
someone: "link to Conroe benches"
Me: I know Intel is in the lead right now, I just dont think AMD is as bad off as others think."
someone else: "You didnt post a link"
someone: "you dont know what your talking about troll"
Me: "Ok, then why did AMD buy ATi?"
etc
etc
etc
etc
 
duby229 said:
No its not wrong...

Its just that most conversations go like this.....

Me: "I think AMD is doing better then some people give them credit for"
someone: "link to q1 results"
someone else: "link to q1 results"
someone: "link to Conroe benches"
Me: I know Intel is in the lead right now, I just dont think AMD is as bad off as others think."
someone else: "You didnt post a link"
someone: "you dont know what your talking about troll"
Me: "Ok, then why did AMD buy ATi?"
etc
etc
etc
etc
Click to expand...

That is the exact reason I've stop reading the forums as much lately
 
duby229, you're all right man. Even like the OS forum posts. Don't let a few trolls drag you into their game.

When you do get a job at AMD, throw in a good word for me too. Thanks! :D


Edit: Like Eclipse, I have also been avoiding this subforum for quite some time now. It feels like there are more AMD bashers and shitstarters than AMD enthusiasts here. Once AMD takes the lead again, all the trolls will shut the fuck up and go back to their own subforum.
 
I don't have a problem with people being fan of a certain brand, or being biased.
I suppose everyone is biased in some way, whether they want to or not. After all, what is 'neutral' is very subjective. Heck, I've been called biased in the past aswell... In fact, I've even been called biased to a certain brand, while I actually preferred another brand at that time. I suppose it's just a different frame of reference.

Anyway, where I think you sometimes cross the line, duby, is where you counter misinformation about AMD with misinformation about other things.
I recall two recent discussions where I also took part, where this happened.
 
duby229 said:
No its not wrong...

Its just that most conversations go like this.....

Me: "I think AMD is doing better then some people give them credit for"
someone: "link to q1 results"
someone else: "link to q1 results"
someone: "link to Conroe benches"
Me: I know Intel is in the lead right now, I just dont think AMD is as bad off as others think."
someone else: "You didnt post a link"
someone: "you dont know what your talking about troll"
Me: "Ok, then why did AMD buy ATi?"
etc
etc
etc
etc
Click to expand...

That is quite disingenuous. Somebody will talk about how well AMD is doing and often someone else will post actual links to information that says otherwise. Then you'll say that the information means nothing and to look at the technology. Then you'll pass of statements such as "AMD has better prefetchers." Someone will then ask you why they have better prefetchers and you'll say "If you don't know, Google it." Someone will Google it and provide links to a technical analysis that show that Intel has a superior prefetchers and benchmarks to prove it. Then you'll say you can't be wrong because it's just your opinion. When someone has a differing opinion than you, you'll say...

duby229 said:
You guys are ignorant... Look at the slide.... It does not offer a definition. Suggesting that it does is retarded.

You can twist and wiggle and curve all you want but you cant change what a platform is.
Click to expand...

Then you'll post something that directly contradicts an earlier post of yours. When someone (such as myself) calls you on that direct contradiction of opinion, you won't explain your actual position, you'll simply accuse them of slander.

Although there is a great deal of *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!ism here, and that's fine, simply stating that you are a *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*! does not excuse you from self-contradiction and misrepresentation of facts. One cannot excuse themself of this behavior by simply stating that their misrepresentation is only an opinion and can therefore not be incorrect.

I do not believe you should act so innocent when you make accusations.
 
BigDH01 said:
Then you'll pass of statements such as "AMD has better prefetchers." Someone will then ask you why they have better prefetchers and you'll say "If you don't know, Google it." Someone will Google it and provide links to a technical analysis that show that Intel has a superior prefetchers and benchmarks to prove it. Then you'll say you can't be wrong because it's just your opinion. When someone has a differing opinion than you, you'll say...
Click to expand...

that given statement is not an opinion though. the way it's worded, it is fact, and is easy to prove/disprove ;)
 
(cf)Eclipse said:
that given statement is not an opinion though. the way it's worded, it is fact, and is easy to prove/disprove ;)
Click to expand...

Which we did. It's then that duby invoked the "opinion" routine. When asked why he felt Athlons had some superiority to the Core 2 he stated:

duby229 said:
The crossbar switch. Exclusive L2 cache. MOESI. Better prefetch logic. I can keep going if you like..

Intel has some major advantages in SSE, as well as some specific advantags in how instructions are scheduled. But overall I think AMD has a much more modular architecture that will allow them to continue working with it for quite some time. Intel will have to replace their existing architecture do to cache contention within the next 2 years at most. Adding more cache will just make contention even worse.

I think Intel is on the right track though, it's just that they have some work to do before they get cought up.
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He's also stated that:

duby229 said:
Yes that is true, but what I mean is that I think AMD has an all around better platform. Faster SATA controller. Faster ethernet, with lower latency. Much more functionl PCIe.
Click to expand...

These things can be proven false. I posted some links that refuted what he had said and did so with analysis and evidence. Instead of just repeating that entire convo you can go here:

http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1163479&page=4

I don't care if duby expresses favor to one company. I just have a problem when he states things such as "AMD platforms have much more functional PCIe." That's not a statement of opinion, that's statement of fact, and it's wrong. Duby does this constantly and that's why many have a problem with him. When duby is asked to support his statement he simply responds with:

duby229 said:
Google my friend. It's a good search engine, and can find anything you ask it to.
Click to expand...

After debating with him in this manner for a great deal of time you come to understand that his *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!ism stretches to the extreme.
 
i agree with bigDH

i read the whole "amd is selling half of its soul" thread, and everytime duby would say just about anything to try and win the debate, even if it means going up against stated facts or his own opinions

on the matter of TDP he ended up criticizing Intel for being unable to produce a 3.0 GHz 65 w TDP desktop part. Intels X6800 (2.93, practically 3.0) is at 75 watts, yet amds own 3.0 part (which performs significantly worse) clocks in a good 125 watts

now saying you dont care about TDP and prefering the 6000+ is OK imho, but dont go flaming Intel for failing at something AMD fails even worse at when you try to defend AMD


i dont mind *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!s, but dubby imho crosses the line, its OK to have a slightly illogical bias towards some company (i used to be the same way for AMD), but huffing up continous bugous in the face of facts just ruins everyones day

as for accusations of Dubby being on the AMD payroll, i hope to god for AMD that if they ever do venture into viral marketing they have the brains to pick out someone with half a brain, blind *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!ism != effective viral marketting
 
Holy God, the little children don't know when to man up and admit they're nothing but fangirls. The ignore list keeps getting bigger.

Duby, for as much as I tend not to read your threads, I think you're getting a bum rep from these obnoxious children.

Mods, do what you want to do. It's been out of control for months. There is no point in reading the AMD forum any more because the mindless, childish trash continues unabated.
 
mwarps said:
Holy God, the little children don't know when to man up and admit they're nothing but fangirls. The ignore list keeps getting bigger.

Duby, for as much as I tend not to read your threads, I think you're getting a bum rep from these obnoxious children.

Mods, do what you want to do. It's been out of control for months. There is no point in reading the AMD forum any more because the mindless, childish trash continues unabated.
Click to expand...

QFT
 
I guess this is what happens when the under-dog finally gets beaten....
 
duby229 said:
Howvever once the BS gets rolling, I'll be the first to offer a different view. That is what a public discussion is supposed to be. If you guys can leave it at that, then you need to get a life. Dont call me out on my beleives becouse where I live, we are free to express it when we wish and how we wish.
Click to expand...

A different view is good, needed even otherwise the forum becomes a very boring place. The problem is that when you express your view you present it as fact or at least based in facts which you proceed to refuse to support with evidence, and when others do the work to refute the claims you use to bolster your view you routinely dismiss them as 'opinion,' regardless of the source.

I do not believe you to be a troll, as I do not think you post what you do for the purpose of antagonizing people here, but at the same time I have participated in and witnessed multitudes of threads where you don't contribute anything of value to the discussion.
BigDH01 has your modus operandi perfect, you jump into a thread negative about AMD and claim the opposite. When presented with experts and facts that contradict your view of the world you dismiss them as opinion all the while refusing to present a shred of independent evidence to support yourself.

If you truly wish to support AMD here, to counter the Intel trolls that may pop up from time to time and show the upside to market you should be doing so with an honest and support argument. Where you and I have had discussion, where I have followed your arguments in a thread, you have not done that. You post opinion and accusastion without evidence and you dismiss out of hand anything contrary to your view of the matter. That does not add anything useful to the discussion.
 
(cf)Eclipse said:
seconded. i mean hell, i've even made peace with donnie, with whom i've had several heated debates with in the past. it's all about getting to know your opponent and understanding where he comes from :D
Click to expand...

http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1030992328&postcount=66

It's more fun to talk than shout and flame. I messed up, you corrected me and I was happier I learned something than I was pissed off that I mess up.

What AMD chip is equalivant to the e6600 Intel chip?

So how do you just talk about AMD in a thread like that? All of us are in trouble of being banned for there to be any substance in that discussion. Or does being in the AMD portion of the forum mean only positive News, Views and Opinions count?

Please notice I've NOT posted in the Very Pro AMD threads like "Love Your AMD ______" threads;) I saw where folks pointed out something that was a just bad info and gave links to correct and it was seen being off topic. A guy gave 4 links to prove his point and was promptly called a Troll.
 
mwarps said:
Holy God, the little children don't know when to man up and admit they're nothing but fangirls. The ignore list keeps getting bigger.
Click to expand...

Typical "I'm taking my ball and going-home" ism from someone who can't admit he's wrong. Keep on adding people... when Barkie shows up and doesn't shock the world maybe everyone on the forum will be on your list.

Duby, for as much as I tend not to read your threads, I think you're getting a bum rep from these obnoxious children.
Click to expand...

It's "rap", but I wouldn't expect you to know that given that you don't know how to search Google.
 
Heh - I received an [insult/compliment - you fill in the blank] just the other day from a fellow here in the "Disgruntled s939 Owners" thread comparing me to you, Duby. I thought it was a little over the top and unnecessary since I hadn't done that to my erstwhile opponent. It seems like we have lost the fine art of debating here on the forums. I have found other forums more fun to be on because we talk about overclocking, tech tips and so on. Everyone stays within their own areas of interest and we don't have all this bickering. And even when someone does "cross over" to ask about comparisons the conversations are civil and in good manners. We've lost that a lot here.
Its like arguing over which company makes the better car; GM, Ford, Diamler-Chrysler, etc. Who cares? They all get the job done.
Everyone is a *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*! to one degree or another. Some are just not as dogmatic about it as others. There are those *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!s who are dedicated to one manufacturer, then there are those *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!s who are "camp followers" who switch from one manufacturer to another. I hate to tell you but those of you who "vote with your wallets" are *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!s too - just not dogmatic ones. You are fans of the best performing product and that's fine. Viva la differance!
When we start promoting our point of view by denigrating someone else's don't be surprised if that someone else gets offended. Arguments are inevitable when you have a mix of opinions. Just remember: "opinions are like noses - everone has one." If we could all just be a little more civil it would be a bit more refreshing oround here. Now pardon me while I go apply the maxim "physician heal thyself."
 
The original post in this thread is about the best damn anti*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*! post I have ever read.

Duby pretty much sumed up why being a *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*! is really really stupid. Good job.

And something I think alot of people forget is that AMD systems are not a bad deal. AMD lowered the prices on their stuff to compete with Intel's prices. Right now, its a good time to build a system as you can get a lot of performance for a very good price with either Intel or AMD.
 
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