Facebook worried upcoming iOS privacy settings will ruin ad targeting business

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odditory

Supreme [H]ardness
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Facebook is warning developers that privacy changes in an upcoming iOS update will severely curtail its ability to track users' activity across the entire Internet and app ecosystem and prevent the social media platform from serving targeted ads to users inside other, non-Facebook apps on iPhones.

The changes requiring users to opt in make the IDFA essentially useless, Facebook warned developers today. Facebook apps on iOS 14—which includes Facebook, WhatsApp, Instagram, Messenger, and a host of others—will no longer collect users' IDFA.

"Despite our best efforts, [the changes] may render Audience Network so ineffective on iOS 14 that it may not make sense to offer it on iOS 14 in the future," Facebook further explained in a blog post. "Our ability to deliver targeted ads on iOS 14 will be limited... as a result, some iOS 14 users may not see any ads from Audience Network, while others may still see ads from us, but they'll be less relevant."

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...ll-tank-ad-targeting-business-facebook-warns/
 
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FrgMstr said:
Only is you do not delete that from your phone.
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Certainly it is worse to have it on your phone, but it is getting to the point where even rather extreme preventative measures (VPNs, piholes, 3rd party tracker blockers, etc.) are not sufficient to maintain privacy.

Almost every site out there has third party trackers, almost every app that is made for a phone has as a primary function to collect your data, and a secondary function to provide you with the service it claims to provide. ISP's even tag every TCP packet leaving your network with a unique identifier so they can keep track of you.

Facebook is a customer of this data as well, and builds interrelated profiles on people who have never even had a Facebook account.

Heck, now you even need a Facebook account to use an Oculus Rift...

It's gotten to the point where the only way to avoid this shit is to live in the forest and drink your own piss.

Most people just don't realize how pervasive and universal data collection from just about any and all hardware and software we own or use has become. Venture Capital investors have been known to shut down business plans if they don't have a way of collecting and monetizing data, or do so insufficiently.

Opting out just isn't feasible anymore, unless you are willing to give up just about everything modern tech has to offer, which is wholly unrealistic.

Only hope we really have for putting an end to it is draconian regulation, and that would be fought tooth and nail by an army of lobbyists.

George Orwell would love it :p
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Certainly it is worse to have it on your phone, but it is getting to the point where even rather extreme preventative measures (VPNs, piholes, 3rd party tracker blockers, etc.) are not sufficient to maintain privacy.

Almost every site out there has third party trackers, almost every app that is made for a phone has as a primary function to collect your data, and a secondary function to provide you with the service it claims to provide. ISP's even tag every TCP packet leaving your network with a unique identifier so they can keep track of you.

Facebook is a customer of this data as well, and builds interrelated profiles on people who have never even had a Facebook account.

Heck, now you even need a Facebook account to use an Oculus Rift...

It's gotten to the point where the only way to avoid this shit is to live in the forest and drink your own piss.

Most people just don't realize how pervasive and universal data collection from just about any and all hardware and software we own or use has become. Venture Capital investors have been known to shut down business plans if they don't have a way of collecting and monetizing data, or do so insufficiently.

Opting out just isn't feasible anymore, unless you are willing to give up just about everything modern tech has to offer, which is wholly unrealistic.

Only hope we really have for putting an end to it is draconian regulation, and that would be fought tooth and nail by an army of lobbyists.

George Orwell would love it :p
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Basically this, between all the different entities tracking “anonymous” data out there Facebook is more than capable of filling in the data of just about anybody based on the hole they leave behind. So much so that even if you only had a landline and no computer their systems are accurate enough that they could still sell your profile to the people out there still sending out physical junk mail with a degree of accuracy that they to date are happy with the results.
And data they haven’t got in their system can also legally be filled in by the public data leaks from all those hacked entities out there. Once that data is leaked online there are no actual laws preventing them from using it as that data is public domain.
 
FrgMstr said:
More brilliant. Delete Facebook.
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Absolutely, already done. But I appreciate any company that can actually give FB heartburn. And in the era of trillion-dollar megacorps, Apple is the rare case that actually has enough F-You money to perhaps be immune to bribes from FB to look the other way.
 
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Lakados said:
Basically this, between all the different entities tracking “anonymous” data out there Facebook is more than capable of filling in the data of just about anybody based on the hole they leave behind. So much so that even if you only had a landline and no computer their systems are accurate enough that they could still sell your profile to the people out there still sending out physical junk mail with a degree of accuracy that they to date are happy with the results.
And data they haven’t got in their system can also legally be filled in by the public data leaks from all those hacked entities out there. Once that data is leaked online there are no actual laws preventing them from using it as that data is public domain.
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Yep. On one hand, we can just roll over and lament "oh well, all is lost, everything's tracked anyway so come one come all, every company just help yourself to all my data"; or we can choose the least worst option at any opportunity. And Apple seems like they're creating that opportunity with these small steps toward putting the slightest bit of privacy control back in user hands. Yes maybe it's a marketing gimmick. But Google isn't. Microsoft isn't. So it's at least something.
 
odditory said:
Yep. On one hand, we can just roll over and lament "oh well, all is lost, everything's tracked anyway so come one come all, every company just help yourself to all my data"; or we can choose the least worst option at any opportunity. And Apple seems like they're creating that opportunity with these small steps toward putting the slightest bit of privacy control back in user hands. Yes maybe it's a marketing gimmick. But Google isn't. Microsoft isn't. So it's at least something.
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Yeah it’s like the people at Apple get off on telling the add companies what they can go do with themselves. I mean it may not be my Kink but who am I to judge. Apple is the only company of the group that doesn’t run an advertising or search platform, they just straight up sell content and they push what people have paid them to push in it regardless of who’s looking.
 
Obviously their data on me is so off based, I rarely get anything blinking at me of interest, mostly irritations. Our data should have a time limit as well as license for use, as in, if you want to use my data, you pay me :D.

The other aspect is I want to know exactly the data that so pertain to me on any organization that think it can own my information to ensure it is not corrupted, misleading, damaging (who to say for political reason your data is not manipulated to harm you). What makes an organization right to keep forever anything they think they have on you? Hopefully laws will catch up to the data age we live in now. Some form of disclosure for your information should be your right in order for you to maintain your good name and for any possible corrections. Hell you don't even know if you are being targeted for what ever reason since you have no idea what information is suppose to represent your activities.

Google keeping track of my locations, GPS coordinates and time of day leads to my schedule, that schedule can then be shared to some other entity that can use that information to successfully rob me as an example. Insurance companies keeping track of you driving speed etc. -> Your local police department uses that information for speeding fines and catching you on their cameras. Of course all for your safety:
I don't think anyone or group as clearly defined where this new technology can lead to if abused, most politicians I think are utterly clueless or could careless.
 
noko said:
Google keeping track of my locations, GPS coordinates and time of day leads to my schedule, that schedule can then be shared to some other entity that can use that information to successfully rob me as an example. Insurance companies keeping track of you driving speed etc. -> Your local police department uses that information for speeding fines and catching you on their cameras. Of course all for your safety:
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When Google started monthly emailing me a cute google Maps timeline showing a graphic of all the places I'd visited that month, I thought "yeah this is probably a red line, and I should probably start planning my escape from the platform -- very slowly, no sudden moves". Yes I realized I could dig in to a setting somewhere to turn that "off", but that wasn't really the point, there was that switch-flip moment like when you realize you're tired of being in a bad relationship.
 
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What alternative is there?

Live out in the woods and kill snakes for food? No computer, no phone, no internet, no online shopping, buy everything local with cash?

I mean, I guess it's possible but wouldn't be really worth living like that.
 
cybereality said:
What alternative is there?

Live out in the woods and kill snakes for food? No computer, no phone, no internet, no online shopping, buy everything local with cash?

I mean, I guess it's possible but wouldn't be really worth living like that.
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You can follow the steps in this link to delete your endless locations with your mobile device, auto delete anything over 3 months old. This also goes for your searches you have done for years on end, what YouTube videos you watch etc...

https://www.wired.com/story/google-location-tracking-turn-off/
 
cybereality said:
What alternative is there?

Live out in the woods and kill snakes for food? No computer, no phone, no internet, no online shopping, buy everything local with cash?

I mean, I guess it's possible but wouldn't be really worth living like that.
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Exactly. So that hopefully leaves organizations like Apple that are willing to put themselves on the line and choose to be against tracking. It's a shame that I have to live in a world where I have to use a cookie manager (littlesnitch) and a VPN to at least alleviate a 1984 tracking scenario. I hope more organizations push back and give more security and privacy.
I realize there is a lot of Apple critisism. At the same time that this thread is running, there is another thread about Epic and Apple and their impending lawsuit. That has drawn a lot of lines and lot of opinions. I haven't bothered to coment again as I realize there just isn't much point (people can think whatever they want to think). But here there isn't much room for interpritation. Apple is worth more than any other company in the world (at least in terms of stock value) and they are one of the very few interested in privacy. And I'm thankful for that. Microsoft has baked in telemetry. Google's whole buisness is user data. I'm glad I can use an ecosystem that gives me the smallest footprint possible.
 
UnknownSouljer said:
Exactly. So that hopefully leaves organizations like Apple that are willing to put themselves on the line and choose to be against tracking. It's a shame that I have to live in a world where I have to use a cookie manager (littlesnitch) and a VPN to at least alleviate a 1984 tracking scenario. I hope more organizations push back and give more security and privacy.
I realize there is a lot of Apple critisism. At the same time that this thread is running, there is another thread about Epic and Apple and their impending lawsuit. That has drawn a lot of lines and lot of opinions. I haven't bothered to coment again as I realize there just isn't much point (people can think whatever they want to think). But here there isn't much room for interpritation. Apple is worth more than any other company in the world (at least in terms of stock value) and they are one of the very few interested in privacy. And I'm thankful for that. Microsoft has baked in telemetry. Google's whole buisness is user data. I'm glad I can use an ecosystem that gives me the smallest footprint possible.
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If you use googlemaps or google software on your IOS, you are most likely being tracked fyi. Automatically.
 
noko said:
If you use googlemaps or google software on your IOS, you are most likely being tracked fyi. Automatically.
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Indeed. I avoid basically anything with Google API’s and manually block more or less every 3rd party tracker I can. Doubleclick is everywhere.

I use DuckDuckGo and Apple Maps just FYI.
 
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Am I the only one that likes a targeted user experience across the web? I don't get ads or use social media but I enjoy my Google Timeline and being told there's a delicious burger nearby.
 
Good.

Still doesn't make Apple a hero by any stretch, but... Good. Apple already charges ludicrous sums for their product, I think a layer of protection and an agreement to keep ALL of a customer's data private should be a minimum.

Not that I think that will ever happen.
 
will severely curtail its ability to track users' activity across the entire Internet
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Good fucking lord do they even hear themselves? The whole Zuckerberg is an android bit is sounding more and more true. They're complaining that they can't fucking track you across the entire internet... like that should be a valid complaint. That's akin to me saying "these series of laws and restraining orders curtails my ability to have sex with anyone I want!"
 
1_rick said:
Facebook helps the dozens of people in my extended family start in touch. Do you have a constructive replacement to suggest?
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Decide what's important to you, and live with that decision. Me personally, I drew a line in the sand, and sure don't get to see all the activities of family members, etc, but it is what it is. My wife uses Facebook, and it sure as fuck tracks everything she does to the point where I'm convinced it actually listens to what she says as she's had conversations with me about something she's never searched for them BAM, targeted ads about it. I damn sure know it reads "private" messages she sends to people too, it's kind of like the good ol days where you'd sign up to a site or something, and then within 24 hours you're getting all sorts of spam, pretty obvious to know who did it.

That said I'm with Zarathustra on this, there needs to be laws to stop this shit. But with more and more people moving to cell phones and apps asking for permission to access literally everything on your phone and if you say no to any of it the app won't work at all, "really local weather app, you need access to my camera and contacts?", there just is no hope, unless... laws get inacted that make the collecting of data illegal. I've noticed quite a few sites out there throwing pop ups at me asking for my cookie preferences, apparently some law in California I guess... is it effective? probably not as I'm sure sites will claim that "necessary information" that is going to be stuff they can make money off of, but it's a start. And if a change with iOS restricts the ability of Facebook to track you ACROSS THE ENTIRE FUCKING INTERNET (as they complain they might have trouble doing), then good, it's a start, maybe whatever it is that does this ends up going through other services as well (since I use Android not iOS... but fat chance considering Google owns it)
 
Twisted Kidney said:
Good.

Still doesn't make Apple a hero by any stretch, but... Good. Apple already charges ludicrous sums for their product, I think a layer of protection and an agreement to keep ALL of a customer's data private should be a minimum.

Not that I think that will ever happen.
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I like to think of Apple's model as pretty simple. It charges a premium, but it only really wants one thing: to have you pay for its hardware and services. Even its ads are very limited in what they collect and where. It doesn't need to track you all over the web, or see your location; it doesn't need to bundle third-party bloatware; it doesn't even slap an ugly Intel/AMD sticker on its computers. Its products are expensive because there's no one else getting their fingers in the pie, and that's valuable to some people.
 
It's probably not going to happen, but it would be nice if the Tech Giants all got into a legal free-for-all that winds up making them all fair dealers by court mandate.

Ha, I'll go do something smart and play the lotto instead.
 
I wonder how this ties into the rumours that Apple is going to launch its own search provider. Apple states over and over that they aren’t in the advertising business and I don’t think they want that revenue but I can see them being the kind of dicks who are happy to take it away from others.
 
Lakados said:
I wonder how this ties into the rumours that Apple is going to launch its own search provider. Apple states over and over that they aren’t in the advertising business and I don’t think they want that revenue but I can see them being the kind of dicks who are happy to take it away from others.
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So by that definition DuckDuckGo are dicks?
 
UnknownSouljer said:
So by that definition DuckDuckGo are dicks?
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Well duck duck go has been around forever and sits quiet in the corner and does their thing. Apple has the kind of brand power that when they announce something they do it with all the tact and grace of the Kool-Aid man. They will make a big showing of it and get in your face about it, the average person out there has no clue what DuckDuckGo is and most probably assume it’s a sketchy cesspool. But if Apple gets on stage and announces that they have a search engine that doesn’t track you and won’t try to sell you to advertisers than by the sheer point of not being Microsoft or Google I could see it doing well.
 
cybereality said:
What alternative is there?

Live out in the woods and kill snakes for food? No computer, no phone, no internet, no online shopping, buy everything local with cash?

I mean, I guess it's possible but wouldn't be really worth living like that.
Click to expand...

Maybe we can elect government officials who aren’t retarded and actually enact halfway-decent privacy legislation?
 
blackmomba said:
Group chat, private and intimate.
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Or a private blog on aws or other server provider, or your own servers. You could even go one step farther and not register a public domain, make them accessible by vpn only, or etc.. Give all your friends an auth device and require it to access the server.
 
HockeyJon said:
Maybe we can elect government officials who aren’t retarded and actually enact halfway-decent privacy legislation?
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oiu5RfD.gif
 
UltraTaco said:
Question, mates..
Maybe related, maybe not relatee.

How come not all requests go through when you opt out through DAA? It seems like some of them just never accept requests? Taco got like 67 out of 133 denied. Why?!😥💔🖤

https://optout.aboutads.info/?c=2&lang=EN
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Some of them, IIRC, just won't use it, even though they're listed there, and supposedly you have to individually go to their sites to opt out.

Or you could just adblock them in various ways instead of jumping through their stupid hoops.
 
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