Engadget: This double-height keyboard puts a numpad above the letters

Snowdog

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 22, 2006
Messages
11,267
I've never been a fan of Tenkeyless boards, because I want my damn keys, but I did like the width savings. A solution?:

https://www.engadget.com/2019/05/30/double-height-keyboard/

The C1000 is a keyboard that, rather than putting the numpad and extra keys to the right of the keyboard, stacks them above the letter rows.


dims?resize=2000%2C2000%2Cshrink&image_uri=https%3A%2F%2Fs.yimg.jpg
 

Derangel

Fully [H]
Joined
Jan 31, 2008
Messages
19,785
That is really stupid looking. Why is there a giant ass hole in the middle? How do you effectively use those top keys? If people are space limited on their desk I doubt they have room for a double-height keyboard. I just don't get it. Also, this fucking line from the article "Keyboards are infuriating, right? With their long, thin layouts require you to move your hands left and right in order to hit specific keys." What? Just, what?
 

Armenius

Fully [H]
Joined
Jan 28, 2014
Messages
28,921
That is really stupid looking. Why is there a giant ass hole in the middle? How do you effectively use those top keys? If people are space limited on their desk I doubt they have room for a double-height keyboard. I just don't get it. Also, this fucking line from the article "Keyboards are infuriating, right? With their long, thin layouts require you to move your hands left and right in order to hit specific keys." What? Just, what?
To carry it?
Good question.
Agreed.
Agreed.
It's Engadget, so I guess the author is trying to connect to their normie readers.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Extremely [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
33,109
Interesting for sure, but I think it might just be confusing with such a dense mass of keys.

The spacing between the clusters of keys is valuable, IMHO.
 
  • Like
Reactions: otg
like this

Snowdog

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 22, 2006
Messages
11,267
Interesting for sure, but I think it might just be confusing with such a dense mass of keys.

The spacing between the clusters of keys is valuable, IMHO.

The execution may not be ideal, but I think the concept has merit, they could still put some space around the block, and eliminate that window or whatever it is.

I only touch type the bottom part of the keyboard. The keypad, arrow, paging and Fn key are all hunt and peck. I don't think I would have any issue finding them even on this design.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Extremely [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
33,109
The execution may not be ideal, but I think the concept has merit, they could still put some space around the block, and eliminate that window or whatever it is.

I only touch type the bottom part of the keyboard. The keypad, arrow, paging and Fn key are all hunt and peck. I don't think I would have any issue finding them even on this design.


I mean, it's not for me, but someone may wind up liking it.

Personally I am completely tied to the standard IBM Enhanced Layout at this point. You know, this one:

Keyboardlayoutusstandard.gif


I use an unusual set of controls and keyboard binds in games that dates back to the early Doom/Quake days, and has been tweaked, modified and added to by me over the years such that I use the numpad, arrow keys and the navigation block all based on "touch type" when playing games.

I don't think I could change it at this point, so no condensed keyboard layout could ever work for me.

If anyone is curious, my typical FPS controls look something like this (but are customized per title)

Mouse Y axis Inverted
Move Forward: Up Arrow
Move Backwards: Down Arrow
Move Left: Left arrow
Move Right: Right Arrow
Fire: Mouse1
Jump: Mouse2
Run/Sprint: Right Shift
Duck: Right Ctrl
Use: Enter
Reload: Del Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Drop: End Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Aim/Scope: PgDn (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Melee/ Instant Grenade: KP_ins
Next Weapon/Previos Weapon: Mouse Wheel
Quick Weapon Selection binds: Keybapd numbers
 

5150Joker

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 1, 2005
Messages
4,569
I mean, it's not for me, but someone may wind up liking it.

Personally I am completely tied to the standard IBM Enhanced Layout at this point. You know, this one:

View attachment 164311

I use an unusual set of controls and keyboard binds in games that dates back to the early Doom/Quake days, and has been tweaked, modified and added to by me over the years such that I use the numpad, arrow keys and the navigation block all based on "touch type" when playing games.

I don't think I could change it at this point, so no condensed keyboard layout could ever work for me.

If anyone is curious, my typical FPS controls look something like this (but are customized per title)

Mouse Y axis Inverted
Move Forward: Up Arrow
Move Backwards: Down Arrow
Move Left: Left arrow
Move Right: Right Arrow
Fire: Mouse1
Jump: Mouse2
Run/Sprint: Right Shift
Duck: Right Ctrl
Use: Enter
Reload: Del Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Drop: End Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Aim/Scope: PgDn (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Melee/ Instant Grenade: KP_ins
Next Weapon/Previos Weapon: Mouse Wheel
Quick Weapon Selection binds: Keybapd numbers

I know what you mean as I used a weird setup from the early quake days and never thought I could transition to wasd since I'd built up muscle memory over 20 years but I recently did it when Blackout 4 was released. I initially had a lot of trouble and my competitiveness dropped off drastically but now I'm back to where I used to be as wasd is in my muscle memory. So you can teach an old dog new tricks, you just have to be willing to put the work in. I'm glad I did because I hated setting up custom binds for every single game.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Extremely [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
33,109
I know what you mean as I used a weird setup from the early quake days and never thought I could transition to wasd since I'd built up muscle memory over 20 years but I recently did it when Blackout 4 was released. I initially had a lot of trouble and my competitiveness dropped off drastically but now I'm back to where I used to be as wasd is in my muscle memory. So you can teach an old dog new tricks, you just have to be willing to put the work in. I'm glad I did because I hated setting up custom binds for every single game.

Setting up the key binds doesn't bother me too much.

What does bother me - however - is in many poor console ports, some keys are hard coded, and other keys cannot be assigned. I went for almost a couple of decades without having this problem, but recently I went back nad played some older titles (catching up on the Far Cry series for instance) and have had a plethora of these issues.

Since I use a dedicated Windows 10 install just for games, I have actually considered remapping all of my keys to their standard WASD locations in the registry so I never have to deal with this again :p
 

defaultluser

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jan 14, 2006
Messages
14,365
I mean, it's not for me, but someone may wind up liking it.

Personally I am completely tied to the standard IBM Enhanced Layout at this point. You know, this one:

View attachment 164311

I use an unusual set of controls and keyboard binds in games that dates back to the early Doom/Quake days, and has been tweaked, modified and added to by me over the years such that I use the numpad, arrow keys and the navigation block all based on "touch type" when playing games.

I don't think I could change it at this point, so no condensed keyboard layout could ever work for me.

If anyone is curious, my typical FPS controls look something like this (but are customized per title)

Mouse Y axis Inverted
Move Forward: Up Arrow
Move Backwards: Down Arrow
Move Left: Left arrow
Move Right: Right Arrow
Fire: Mouse1
Jump: Mouse2
Run/Sprint: Right Shift
Duck: Right Ctrl
Use: Enter
Reload: Del Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Drop: End Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Aim/Scope: PgDn (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Melee/ Instant Grenade: KP_ins
Next Weapon/Previos Weapon: Mouse Wheel
Quick Weapon Selection binds: Keybapd numbers


I use almost the same key binds. I tried WASD, but can't reliably hit the keys in the mess of surrounding keys. I like my separation between my movement keys, and the rest of my controls.

This means I can't stand keyboards with half-height arrows/arrows pushed right next to other keys, or weird-as fuck layouts like this.
 

Grimlaking

2[H]4U
Joined
May 9, 2006
Messages
3,246
I really love that you can't even use regular 10 key knowledge. Want to do a divide or multiply. It's way the fuck off over to the left. Want to subtract? want to subtract. It's where you think the plus key is and the plus keyis where you thought the minus key should be and there isn't even a fucking enter key for fast keyboarding.

Yea this layout fucking sucks. It's only good if you want to learn to use the wrong kind of fucking keyboard compared to the rest of the computing world.
 

Nolan7689

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jun 5, 2015
Messages
1,694
Hmmm. Well this is awful.

I hear doubleheight though and it makes me think of a two tiered keyboard with the numpad literally above the main keys.
 

drescherjm

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 19, 2008
Messages
14,927
I prefer a more standard layout being that I use several different keyboards each day.
 

acquacow

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 7, 2016
Messages
451
Good for narrow desks as long as your monitor is on an arm and not a stand...though even with a stand, I think it would work out just fine.
 

Armenius

Fully [H]
Joined
Jan 28, 2014
Messages
28,921
I really love that you can't even use regular 10 key knowledge. Want to do a divide or multiply. It's way the fuck off over to the left. Want to subtract? want to subtract. It's where you think the plus key is and the plus keyis where you thought the minus key should be and there isn't even a fucking enter key for fast keyboarding.

Yea this layout fucking sucks. It's only good if you want to learn to use the wrong kind of fucking keyboard compared to the rest of the computing world.
Dvorak is the only way to fly.
 
  • Like
Reactions: otg
like this

sharknice

2[H]4U
Joined
Nov 12, 2012
Messages
2,670
The reason hardcore gamers get small keyboards isn't because it takes up less space, it is because it allows you to have your mouse hand and your keyboard hand closer together. It's more ergonomic allowing you aim better.

Just move all that extra crap to the left side of the keyboard and it's fine. No need for this weird layout.
 

Jagger100

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Oct 31, 2004
Messages
7,687
full size keys in a laptop/tablet form factor

The 'asshole' is probably for ventilation allowing the fan an exit path it can blow around the keys and get in/out there
 

Krazy925

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Sep 29, 2012
Messages
6,504
I mean, it's not for me, but someone may wind up liking it.

Personally I am completely tied to the standard IBM Enhanced Layout at this point. You know, this one:

View attachment 164311

I use an unusual set of controls and keyboard binds in games that dates back to the early Doom/Quake days, and has been tweaked, modified and added to by me over the years such that I use the numpad, arrow keys and the navigation block all based on "touch type" when playing games.

I don't think I could change it at this point, so no condensed keyboard layout could ever work for me.

If anyone is curious, my typical FPS controls look something like this (but are customized per title)

Mouse Y axis Inverted
Move Forward: Up Arrow
Move Backwards: Down Arrow
Move Left: Left arrow
Move Right: Right Arrow
Fire: Mouse1
Jump: Mouse2
Run/Sprint: Right Shift
Duck: Right Ctrl
Use: Enter
Reload: Del Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Drop: End Key (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Aim/Scope: PgDn (on navigation cluster above arrow keys)
Melee/ Instant Grenade: KP_ins
Next Weapon/Previos Weapon: Mouse Wheel
Quick Weapon Selection binds: Keybapd numbers

I use almost the same key binds. I tried WASD, but can't reliably hit the keys in the mess of surrounding keys. I like my separation between my movement keys, and the rest of my controls.

This means I can't stand keyboards with half-height arrows/arrows pushed right next to other keys, or weird-as fuck layouts like this.
What. The. Fuck. Is. Wrong. With. You. People.

Only kinda kidding. Are you too good for WASD?!??
 

defaultluser

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jan 14, 2006
Messages
14,365
What. The. Fuck. Is. Wrong. With. You. People.

Only kinda kidding. Are you too good for WASD?!??


I'm not good ENOUGH for WASD. I also can't touch type, because I lack the fine motor skills.

I found a way to work around the problem, so my clumsy fingers have plenty of room to make a mess as I splay them every which way while changing directions.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Extremely [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
33,109
What. The. Fuck. Is. Wrong. With. You. People.

Only kinda kidding. Are you too good for WASD?!??


I don't know man.

There I was playing games on the PC for YEARS and all of a sudden someone decided to change the controls from the perfectly good arrow keys intended for directions to some stupid WASD lettered layout.

Why should I change if they are the stupid ones? :p
 
  • Like
Reactions: otg
like this

DrLobotomy

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 19, 2016
Messages
6,736
That hole is their so when you are sitting in your EZ chair with the keyboard on your lap it allows EZ access for a quick nut scratch and lets the heat escape from same said nuts when having long gaming sessions.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Extremely [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
33,109
That hole is their so when you are sitting in your EZ chair with the keyboard on your lap it allows EZ access for a quick nut scratch and lets the heat escape from same said nuts when having long gaming sessions.

Or, it could be a handle?
 

rudy

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 4, 2004
Messages
8,704
The reason hardcore gamers get small keyboards isn't because it takes up less space, it is because it allows you to have your mouse hand and your keyboard hand closer together. It's more ergonomic allowing you aim better.

Just move all that extra crap to the left side of the keyboard and it's fine. No need for this weird layout.

This is only a half truth, it can be both, the main point is that most high level gamers use low sensitivity which requires more space. Whether you use that space savings to push your keyboard closer or to get even lower sensitivity is up to you, the truth is most are doing a little of both. Regardless almost no one is running a 9 inch mousing area any more.

What this keyboard offers people is all of your keys available plus space savings for more mouse room and or ergonomics. The problem is it might only work well if you have lots of space between you and the monitor
 
Top