Dotcom’s Extradition Hearing ‘Ambushed’ With New Evidence

HardOCP News

[H] News
Joined
Dec 31, 1969
Messages
0
Oh come on, everyone loves moments like this in a high profile court case. Well, as long as you are a spectator and not the defendant. :D

After being scheduled for no more than a month, Kim Dotcom's extradition hearing has dragged on for almost 10 weeks. Expected to wrap up during the next two days, there's yet more uncertainty after the prosecution attempted to introduce new evidence at the 11th hour.
 

rabidz7

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 24, 2014
Messages
1,312
Incredible. Just incredible.

Dotcom was in a foreign country without US ties, ran a file host that was not intended for piracy but was (ab)used for that purpose. The US really thinks that they are the world's policeman. Makes me want to run a pirate site or start a biotech company in Cuba (with approval of Cuban authorities, of course)! Legally disobeying Monsanto and Hollywood's draconian IP laws would be great.
 

CreepyUncleGoogle

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
6,871
I don't see anything wrong with introducing new evidence if its relevant to the case. Either side should be allowed to do it, but I guess it's unjust because the defense side doesn't have any meaningfully useful evidence to present at all let alone stuff that's uncovered towards the end of the hearing. I don't see why New Zealand's government is even wasting their time with giving that guy a hearing at all. They should just box him up in a pet carrier (a really, really big one), shove him into the cargo hold of a plane, and fly him back to the US where he can go to jail for his multitude of heinous crimes against the people of the world.
 

Mut1ny

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 4, 2013
Messages
1,854
What I find funny about all this is how blatantly this shows the "ties" the entertainment industry has with the government. Like, unless government officials are being paid boat loads of money for "political contributions" then why the fuck do they care SO GODDAMN MUCH?! Was he a threat to American National Security™? No? Who was he a threat to? Oh, the MPAA and RIAA? So our government goes the way of EXTRADITING someone in a completely different country that doesn't follow our laws? Seems right!

Say what you want about Kim but this whole thing has been incredibly sketchy from the beginning.
 

rabidz7

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 24, 2014
Messages
1,312
I don't see anything wrong with introducing new evidence if its relevant to the case. Either side should be allowed to do it, but I guess it's unjust because the defense side doesn't have any meaningfully useful evidence to present at all let alone stuff that's uncovered towards the end of the hearing. I don't see why New Zealand's government is even wasting their time with giving that guy a hearing at all. They should just box him up in a pet carrier (a really, really big one), shove him into the cargo hold of a plane, and fly him back to the US where he can go to jail for his multitude of heinous crimes against the people of the world.

Nobody cares.
 

Mut1ny

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 4, 2013
Messages
1,854
Not only the above but I find it funny how we put so much effort and money and time towards someone like him but all the warlords in Africa that are slaughtering innocent people by the millions can just continue doing so and our government doesn't give a fuck. Talk about "priorities"!

Some dude that runs a hosting site like the 100's out there that do the same shit = Evil (or if you're a idiot troll you'd say something like "crimes against the people of the world") but the people that are actually committing mass atrocities and slaughter children = Fuck'em!

It's such garbage really.
 

CreepyUncleGoogle

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
6,871
Nobody cares.

[H] forum readers do as they've viewed and commented on this thread (including you :p). New Zealand does. The US does. Businesses do too. Media outlets are reporting on it. I think you're just being a Mister Pouty-Pants because it doesn't fit your ideology.
 

turdhat

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 29, 2004
Messages
161
All evidence is supposed to be out in the open before the discovery phase is completed. This gives both sides equal time to prepare their case with all cards on the table. Could cause the evidence to get tossed. Up to the judge when this happens.
 

CreepyUncleGoogle

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
6,871
Not only the above but I find it funny how we put so much effort and money and time towards someone like him but all the warlords in Africa that are slaughtering innocent people by the millions can just continue doing so and our government doesn't give a fuck. Talk about "priorities"!

Some dude that runs a hosting site like the 100's out there that do the same shit = Evil (or if you're a idiot troll you'd say something like "crimes against the people of the world") but the people that are actually committing mass atrocities and slaughter children = Fuck'em!

It's such garbage really.

Well since this thread is about that super fat guy and his piracy site, I don't think the focus of the conversation is on what's happening in Africa or a "think of the children" anything kinda argument which generally ignores the fact that multiple people live on the planet and can be concerned with multiple thingies at the same time. It's not an either-or thing-y. :p
 
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
645
he can go to jail for his multitude of heinous crimes against the people of the world.

What crimes against people of the world? You're continuously on about this. The recent attacks in Paris, a downed airplane in Egypt, those are heinous crimes against the people of the world.

Every single one of your posts are nonsensical bullshit.
 

CreepyUncleGoogle

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
6,871
What crimes against people of the world? You're continuously on about this. The recent attacks in Paris, a downed airplane in Egypt, those are heinous crimes against the people of the world.

Every single one of your posts are nonsensical bullshit.

There topic of the thread is about that big fat Kim guy and new evidence for the hearing for him to be sent to the US. What does that have to do with France or Egypt?
 

tungt88

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Messages
2,099
Wasting lots of money on the likes of Kim Dotcom in the wake of terrorist attacks in Paris and other locales this year? (Not to mention other things that are going on as well ...) Sounds like yet another poor investment from the US government.

After all, it's a hard sell for the government to convince many that Kim deserves more of the government's attention than lots of murderers, rapists, bank robbers, gangs, drug dealers (in terms of money the government has spent on Dotcom). I understand that the US government believes that, by aggressively going after Kim, they will send a "message" to the file-sharing community, but by bungling up the whole job, they have made fools of themselves, and there are more file sharing sites than ever before ...
 

Gorankar

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 19, 2000
Messages
10,918
What crimes against people of the world? You're continuously on about this. The recent attacks in Paris, a downed airplane in Egypt, those are heinous crimes against the people of the world.

Every single one of your posts are nonsensical bullshit.

Use ignore. Really, just do it. You will miss out on nothing, unless being trolled is a secret pleasure of yours.

On one hand, screw Dotcom, he made a lot of money off of piracy. There are no two ways about that. We can pretend it was just a file host that was misused, but Kim and crew knew that, and it seems they did nothing because the cash kept rolling in.

On the other fuck the government with a rusty pipe. The response to Kim's crimes has been excessive in the extreme. The guy has been treated like a terrorist responsible for bodies, when he is little more than a white collar criminal. Not even a particularly heinous one. The guy was not swindling money from old ladies, it's debatable he was even costing the RIAA and MPAA any significant amount of money. Yeah, he should lose some coin and maybe spend some time in jail in NZ under NZ law for whatever crimes he committed in NZ.
 

viscountalpha

2[H]4U
Joined
Oct 16, 2011
Messages
2,618
Not only the above but I find it funny how we put so much effort and money and time towards someone like him but all the warlords in Africa that are slaughtering innocent people by the millions can just continue doing so and our government doesn't give a fuck. Talk about "priorities"!

Some dude that runs a hosting site like the 100's out there that do the same shit = Evil (or if you're a idiot troll you'd say something like "crimes against the people of the world") but the people that are actually committing mass atrocities and slaughter children = Fuck'em!

It's such garbage really.

This is the really screwed up part about all of this. We put our time and focus into things that don't really matter that much.
 

Mut1ny

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 4, 2013
Messages
1,854
Every single one of your posts are nonsensical bullshit.

Everyone already knows this...get with the times! ;)

Seriously though, don't ever take him seriously. I've only just recently started being more active here and even in my short time I've already figured this one out. As frustrating as it is just remember that you aren't the sad person that must not have anything better to do that literally have an account purely for trolling and bullshit.

In other words, no matter how upset you may get by what he says just remember that you'll always be the better person! :D
 

CreepyUncleGoogle

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
6,871
I'm thrilled that I can be here to bring you pirates together against a common enemy that lets you guys unite in the spoogy love of complimenting the moral fiber and personal character of each other. Now if there was just some way you could hug one another over the internets, it'd be photo-purrfect. :)
 

Methadras

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 19, 2000
Messages
6,132
There are times when prosecutorial overreach should become a criminal event. These people have no shame. How much has the US spent on trying to get this guy here? And for what? These prosecutors are clearly trying to pad their win/loss column for their own vanity and the DOJ clearly does not care.
 
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
645
There are times when prosecutorial overreach should become a criminal event. These people have no shame. How much has the US spent on trying to get this guy here? And for what? These prosecutors are clearly trying to pad their win/loss column for their own vanity and the DOJ clearly does not care.

I agree, but I reckon the price of this case is a non-issue solely because of the type of case it is. Once the DOJ utterly destroys this guy in court (if this happens), it'll set a serious precedent for file-lockers going forward.
 

Mut1ny

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 4, 2013
Messages
1,854
How much has the US spent on trying to get this guy here? And for what?

This is my biggest issue and the one that I most want answered. The DOJ isn't the MPAA or the RIAA. They aren't losing anything from what Kim and Co. did...so what's with this major strike?

I don't see the US in China or Spain or India where piracy is absolutely rampant! Why is that? Is that because they aren't pussy countries that will bend over when we tell them too?

To me this case is an EXACT example of the government being "paid off" and being made to be the entertainment industries bitch. Let's worry about what Kim is doing and ignore allllllll the other mass pirates and all the other file sharing sites because they're some place that won't allow us to slap our dicks on the table and say "suck it bitch!".

Yeah, this has nothing to do with right or wrong or the laws in place (which again are AMERICAN laws, NOT NZ laws)...this has everything to do with bribery and corruption. Period.

I mean, what has the piracy scene actually lost because of this? I'll tell you...not a goddamn thing. Only thing that's being lost is tax payer money and focusing on shit that isn't important (or at the very least way less important than other shit we could be spending our time and money on).
 

Gorankar

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 19, 2000
Messages
10,918
I think we can see this is just an example. Kim was trying to compete with them. The response was the full might of the US government brought to bare on him. I don't think this was about piracy at all. It was making an example out of someone that tried to cut them out of the picture. If too many quality musicians start to self publish, the big studios become powerless. They had to make an example of anyone willing to try an end run around them. Self publishing can not be allowed to maintain the status quo.
 

Ducman69

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 12, 2007
Messages
10,542
What I find funny about all this is how blatantly this shows the "ties" the entertainment industry has with the government.
And how selective the government is with what they will and won't enforce in general.

I was so amazed that for Hillary Clinton they even bothered to inform her first, and didn't just send the FBI in with a SWAT team in a no-knock warrant raid on her premises to take the server before she had a chance to delete evidence... that's what they would have done for any of us peons, and they would have shot our pets in the process, even if it was just for downloading Justin Bieber's Greatest Hits online rather than national security that affects hundreds of millions.
 
Joined
Jul 29, 2004
Messages
2,134
This is just the way a legal system works. It isn't making relative value judgments all day long about which crime is bigger or smaller. You are tasked with enforcing a particular set of laws. You become aware of a violation of those laws. You collect evidence and confirm that there has been a crime committed. You prosecute that crime, as the phrase goes, "to the fullest extent of the law." Because that's your job. That's what the rule of law looks like.

You don't wring your hands and ask yourself, "Is this worth the time and the money?" How are you supposed to make that judgment? On what scale do you decide if it's "worth it"? Besides, you are comparing and contrasting crimes that are in no way related. That stuff over there? There's a whole other group of guys whose job it is to enforce those laws. They do their job, I do mine.

Why extradition? It's not about bullying, or bribery. The crimes were committed in one place, but the damage affected people in another. We don't let people get away with that crap. Otherwise you could stand just inside the border of one place and shoot people in another place, and shrug and say, "Hey, I'm not over there, I"m over here. Nyah nyah nyah." New Zealand may not have exactly the same laws we do, but they and we share a common enough set of values that respect for each other's laws is granted. This is how civilization and an international community functions. They have a hearing to weigh the value of mutual respect and support against the rights of the affected individual, and decide which should take precedence. Extradition is good, and a hearing before granting it is good. The system is functioning as it should for the benefit of all.

Why not enforce things the same way in China, India, or Eastern Europe/Russia? Because their values, laws, and attitudes toward the rule of law are not closely aligned with ours, at least not at this time. We may hope that they will move closer.

Why are murderous warlords running rampant in some places, and why do we do less about it? Because those places have virtually no rule of law, and have virtually no mutuality with our civilization and international community. We have no leverage with them other than outright military force.

Be thankful, among the things you give thanks for this season, for the rule of law and for civilization. Without it, the murderous warlords might be named Cletus and Chad, and be rolling down our streets. Even if Kim.Com has a very un-merry Christmas, it's worth it.
 

Player911

n00b
Joined
Oct 10, 2013
Messages
4
I have to totally agree that this whole thing is total crap.

For starters, it is a file hosting company. File Hosting is a NEEDED INTERNET SERVICE. You cannot control what users are uploading. There were piracy protocols in place (and were bypassed by pirates) and were effective. The company removed tons and tons of piracy. But when 1 movie it broken down into 100 pieces, with weird names, compressed, and encrypted... how are they to know what is what. It could be a legit file or it could be a movie.

The problem here is the business providing the service is not providing an illegal service. They have a legit business. They did what they could to keep things in order.

This is basically like trying to sue UPS for shipping you a stolen iPhone that you bought off eBay.

The problem here is these morons got involved where they shouldn't have. The country they originated from does not even have any laws for illegal file sharing. Why are they even in court? That is like driving a car in the right lane (verse the left like in some countries). How can I get taken to court by doing something that is legal in my country? The country of France cannot take me to court for wreckless driving because I am driving in the "wrong" lane as they do.

This whole thing is 1 big screw up/cover up. They should have backed off a long time ago but they don't want to take the loss. So they are going and going and going and going and hoping that they drag it out enough to tire out everyone or that by throwing tons of money at it, they will take the win.

And it just isn't about a Win. If they win, they will have some horrible self entitlement and start to just go after everyone. This "company" needs to be shut down. This is a perfect example of how a company isn't evolving with the times and going sue crazy. They complain about "we lose so much money due to piracy" yet turn around and spend hundreds of millions on petty court cases.

Honestly I hope they just disappear off the face of the earth. Join Blockbuster in business hell because they wouldn't evolve either. Services like Pandora, Netflix, and online services are the way of the future.
 

Kalabalana

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 18, 2005
Messages
1,313
I find it funny how others have muted uncle Google, I have as well
It's rare for me to mute someone
 

BloodDonor

Limp Gawd
Joined
Dec 5, 2009
Messages
315
I don't see anything wrong with introducing new evidence if its relevant to the case. Either side should be allowed to do it, but I guess it's unjust because the defense side doesn't have any meaningfully useful evidence to present at all let alone stuff that's uncovered towards the end of the hearing. I don't see why New Zealand's government is even wasting their time with giving that guy a hearing at all. They should just box him up in a pet carrier (a really, really big one), shove him into the cargo hold of a plane, and fly him back to the US where he can go to jail for his multitude of heinous crimes against the people of the world.

The raid on his place was done 20 January 2012...

As a New Zealander, I find it incredible that 'new evidence' was just discovered :rolleyes:

I'm not a fan of the guy, but he deserves a fair hearing, and as his lawyer pointed out previously:

the US govt claims copyright infringement fraud, however the US Supreme Court has previously ruled that "that copyright infringement can not be considered fraud"... also "New Zealand legislation does not recognize copyright infringement as fraud either and the extradition treaty between the two countries does not hold copyright infringement as being an extraditable offense."
 
Top