Does this deserve a neutral heatware?

[Gillbot]

Exactly, and someone refunding it does not change the fact that it was sent....

I'm going by what I was told. Feel free to do as you feel right.

EDIT: Personally, I don't think it's right to leave a neutral or negative if I get a full refund because I'm out nothing. Furthermore, this is a case of he said/she said and one cannot confirm anything except the original parties involved in the deal. I would have to believe the person refunded because they needed to so the reason behind it really doesn't matter to me. The only thing I see in this case is the fact that someone is pissed they missed out on an excellent deal. When things like this happen, those parties go on my DNT list and I move on.

 

[andrewsmc1]

I'm going by what I was told. Feel free to do as you feel right.

EDIT: Personally, I don't think it's right to leave a neutral or negative if I get a full refund because I'm out nothing. Furthermore, this is a case of he said/she said and one cannot confirm anything except the original parties involved in the deal. I would have to believe the person refunded because they needed to so the reason behind it really doesn't matter to me. The only thing I see in this case is the fact that someone is pissed they missed out on an excellent deal. When things like this happen, those parties go on my DNT list and I move on.

This.

 

[Crosshairs]

I'm going by what I was told. Feel free to do as you feel right.

EDIT: Personally, I don't think it's right to leave a neutral or negative if I get a full refund because I'm out nothing. Furthermore, this is a case of he said/she said and one cannot confirm anything except the original parties involved in the deal. I would have to believe the person refunded because they needed to so the reason behind it really doesn't matter to me. The only thing I see in this case is the fact that someone is pissed they missed out on an excellent deal. When things like this happen, those parties go on my DNT list and I move on.

I understand that's what you were told, but that's not what it says ......its not even debatable as its written.


as for my comment about it, I'm not speculating on what happened in this case, just stating what I would do if it were to happen to me and I knew the circumstances surrounding the whole thing....if you jerk me around, you can expect me to post about it on your heatware page.......that is after all the whole purpose of feedback....and I'm not one to worry about retaliatory feedback, any intelligent person would see it for what it is.

 

[Slufa111]

Ladies and gentlemen, lets beat a dead horse. If you want to leave me feedback do so, if not, stop talking about it.

1. I was paid
2. Deal had circumstances
3. I refunded money
4. Someone got mad
5. Here we are.

THE END

 

[Gillbot]

I understand that's what you were told, but that's not what it says ......its not even debatable as its written.


as for my comment about it, I'm not speculating on what happened in this case, just stating what I would do if it were to happen to me and I knew the circumstances surrounding the whole thing....if you jerk me around, you can expect me to post about it on your heatware page.......that is after all the whole purpose of feedback....and I'm not one to worry about retaliatory feedback, any intelligent person would see it for what it is.

Feel free to interpret as you wish, I'm going by what I was told from Mr. Heat himself as well as some of his admins. I will take that over what YOU believe you are reading.

Case in point: If I refund someone their money because I believe there was a defect in an item being sold though I later determine there wasn't an issue, are they right if they feel wronged in some way? I truly did believe I was acting in their best interest in refunding, yet they may be mad over that.

Does it make it right if they leave me a negative? I don't believe so, yet I would have to prove myself even though immediately issuing the refund made the transaction null to begin with.

 

[Crosshairs]

Feel free to interpret as you wish, I'm going by what I was told from Mr. Heat himself as well as some of his admins. I will take that over what YOU believe you are reading.

LMAO...really dude......what I believe I'm reading ???? its not that hard to interpret...maybe he should change the language if its actually different than what it states ..its written in plain English....and it states

If one party backs out of the deal even after a verbal agreement has been made, NO evaluation can be given to either party.

in this case, no deal has been made.....verbal agreements do not count....

and then it says

If no goods or money was exchanged, the "deal" is not eligible for evaluation

I dont think you have to be a genius to figure out when I send you a PayPal payment, money was exchanged, and thus, we have a deal going

Case in point: If I refund someone their money because I believe there was a defect in an item being sold though I later determine there wasn't an issue, are they right if they feel wronged in some way? I truly did believe I was acting in their best interest in refunding, yet they may be mad over that.

maybe you should test your items before listing them for sale, so you dont waste people time..or in your example, how about you determine there is no defect before you issue the refund and not after

 

[kcmastrpc]

I dont think you have to be a genius to figure out when I send you a PayPal payment, money was exchanged, and thus, we have a deal going

But no goods were transferred, and with the money being returned, there is really nothing to leave feedback on. The details behind the refund, as long as it doens't take an excessive amount of time, aren't really relevant imo.

The rules are no goods or money, since goods were never exchanged, and the full sum of money is back in your account, the deal isn't eligible. I understand how you're trying to spin it, and in your head it makes perfect sense. I suppose in the end, we can only guess what the guys @heatware will do. Anyone have any experience with that?

*shrug*

 

[Crosshairs]

But no goods were transferred, and with the money being returned, there is really nothing to leave feedback on. The details behind the refund, as long as it doens't take an excessive amount of time, aren't really relevant imo.

The rules are no goods or money, since goods were never exchanged, and the full sum of money is back in your account, the deal isn't eligible. I understand how you're trying to spin it, and in your head it makes perfect sense. I suppose in the end, we can only guess what the guys @heatware will do. Anyone have any experience with that?

*shrug*

I see how your trying to "spin it" also so let me ask you this.....when I send you a payment, when does that count as money being exchanged...does it have to be in your account for 5 minutes? 10 minutes?...overnight?....whats the time frame that we use to count it as "money being exchanged..because in the world I live in, once its out of my hands and into yours, its been exchanged.

 

[Gillbot]

maybe you should test your items before listing them for sale, so you dont waste people time..or in your example, how about you determine there is no defect before you issue the refund and not after

I do, but sometimes things happen. I guess you never dropped something during or after packing it? You've never put something in the cabinet that worked fine, yet after you offer it up to someone in need you decide to check it out to be sure and you aren't 100% confident? I typically make every effort to verify items before I accept a payment but sometimes shit happens.

But no goods were transferred, and with the money being returned, there is really nothing to leave feedback on. The details behind the refund, as long as it doens't take an excessive amount of time, aren't really relevant imo.

The rules are no goods or money, since goods were never exchanged, and the full sum of money is back in your account, the deal isn't eligible. I understand how you're trying to spin it, and in your head it makes perfect sense. I suppose in the end, we can only guess what the guys @heatware will do. Anyone have any experience with that?

*shrug*

This is what those @ heatware advised me and I argued the same case Crosshairs is, however I was overruled. Now I understand it, the transaction is reversed so in essence there is no deal. The basis of heatware is that a full transaction needs to take place and BOTH parties need to make an exchange of sorts.

I believe this is to prevent people from leaving an eval in such cases like this where someone is mad because they didn't get the better side of a deal. It is also to protect those who want to cry foul on a deal that was refunded and they ultimately are upset for some various reason. If one issues a refund, who is to say they didn't do everything in their power to rectify the situation and yet would unfairly get a negative anyway.

 

[Crosshairs]

This is what those @ heatware advised me and I argued the same case Crosshairs is, however I was overruled. Now I understand it, the transaction is reversed so in essence there is no deal. The basis of heatware is that a full transaction needs to take place and BOTH parties need to make an exchange of sorts.

Gillbot , I have nothing but respect for you as a trader, so I guess at this point I will bow out and just accept that this is how it is.....I do not however like it...and I think you understand why

 

[Gillbot]

Gillbot , I have nothing but respect for you as a trader, so I guess at this point I will bow out and just accept that this is how it is.....I do not however like it...and I think you understand why

Oh, I completely agree with you. I'm just advising you what I was told. I will cease myself, as you are a mod for this forum and you can decide what rules you see fit here. I'm not trying to sway opinions, just advising what I was told when I inquired about nearly this exact scenario.

 

[Crosshairs]

I do not make the rules, I just enforce them

were just 2 guys talking here......my moderator status has no bearing on my feelings as a trader.....

 

[DPOSCORP]

My thought is this: If someone pays, that is a transaction and heat can be applied by either party.
A refund does not ERASE the first transaction; it is a second transaction.

I look at it like that for a few reasons.

Does a partial refund mean partial heat can be applied? Of course no; part of the deal is not "erased."

What if the refund took a long time; or what if the refund was in two parts, when original payment was all at once?
Should I not be allowed to leave heat? No, I should be allowed.

Those were the thoughts in my mind when I started this thread; it wasn't so my anything against this particular seller, although I have doubts about they way things went down, it was more about the above questions.

Heatware and other kinds of feedback only work well if everyone is honest when leaving it, and leave it at the right time in the right way.

Cases like this selling and refunding, as well as the other guy I caught who kept claiming damage items so he could get partial refunds or "borrow" parts to test with are the most important types of deals to think about leaving heat for, because it is not always cut and dry.