If it says Mopar, AC Delco or Motorcraft on it but isn't made by one of those actual companies it sure as hell is.
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DHS Seizes Aftermarket Apple Laptop Batteries from Independent Repair Expert
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motomonkey
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For those that want the TLDR on that video...
"I'm pissed because customs seized my knock-off batteries"
He carefully dances around the question, "are these real batteries" and chooses to get justifiably angry about Apple's repair policy.
That's fine, but customs seized the batteries because they were fake, not because they give a damn about a two-bit repair shop.
Edit: guy assumes Apple has him on a hit list because he was critical of Apples planned obsolescence policy for its products on a podcast.
"I'm pissed because customs seized my knock-off batteries"
He carefully dances around the question, "are these real batteries" and chooses to get justifiably angry about Apple's repair policy.
That's fine, but customs seized the batteries because they were fake, not because they give a damn about a two-bit repair shop.
Edit: guy assumes Apple has him on a hit list because he was critical of Apples planned obsolescence policy for its products on a podcast.
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Master_shake_
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apple wouldn't fix the computer because it's vintage?
wow.
wow.
M76
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It's not that simple. Companies that do shitty things shouldn't be supported even if you like their products. Apply the same logic to say meat from animal torture factories. If you don't like it don't buy it, but if you like it buy it? Hell no. Be the better person, don't just go by what is good for you. Go by what is sustainable, and what is right. Apple's business practices are not right, and not sustainable.
He has done videos since this happened. What has happened is he hasn't done a lot of videos since he got a concussion from a biking accident.
D
Deleted member 243478
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So does that mean he videos will get even stupider?
Go and ask that dumb ass question on one of his videos.
DejaWiz
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Rossman is conflating two separate issues here:
1. Apple's discontent on R2R for 3rd party shops.
2. Apple trying to uphold its QA standards by preventing counterfeits or gray market products bearing their logo that they did not commission to be manufactured and/or shipped to the US from getting dumped into the market.
...either has jack shit to do with Apple calling a 4 or 5 year old product EOL.
I would almost guarantee that these batteries are 100% China counterfeits bearing the Apple Logo, because that's how Chinese electronics manufacturers operate.
1. Apple's discontent on R2R for 3rd party shops.
2. Apple trying to uphold its QA standards by preventing counterfeits or gray market products bearing their logo that they did not commission to be manufactured and/or shipped to the US from getting dumped into the market.
...either has jack shit to do with Apple calling a 4 or 5 year old product EOL.
I would almost guarantee that these batteries are 100% China counterfeits bearing the Apple Logo, because that's how Chinese electronics manufacturers operate.
D
Deleted member 243478
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Please dont try to divert this back on Apple...
A. Try a 7yr old laptop
B. We have 5yr old Macbooks at work and have had no trouble getting them serviced.
C. Apple is not trying to stop 3rd parties making batteries for old Macbooks, they are stopping them producing batteries bearing the Apple logo. The solution is simple, print non-genuine on the batteries instead.
D. Rossman is so full of shit, I’m surprised no one has tried to flush him down the crapper.
DejaWiz
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I said Apple's "discontent", not "prevent".
Your point C is exactly my point - Apple is making efforts to stop counterfeit products bearing their Logo without their authorization from entering the market.
And I absolutely agree with your point D.
Not about repair, it's about counterfeit Apple products, batteries that are knockoffs.
What is the man actually being charged with?
Lay says it's OK, even with the logo in place, as long as the parts are clearly marked either "Refurbished" or without the logo and marked as third party parts. The problem here is that the parts bear the logo and no additional markings making them appear as if they are intended to be sold as new condition original parts.
It can be done, if it's done right.
The law is clear one what he must do in order to legally import batteries for repair service. All he must do is follow those requirements and if he wishes to stray then he does so at his own risk. The same is true for everything else.
https://www.dmv.org/motorcycles/motorcycle-helmet-laws.php
If you buy a non-DOT approved motorcycle helmet and you ride in a state where this is the law, can you bitch when you get a ticket?
Sure you can, just like Mr. Rossman is .......
I think that while you ask this question that you must also at least deal with the possibility that although the laptop itself may no longer be being serviced by Apple and it's authorized service centers, the batteries may be used in other models that are still current and under support.
A part number would likely tell the tale. Remember, a whole lot of what we are going on here is Mr. Rossman's story and not a whole lot of it is being confirmed by other parties.
Actually, the earliest right to repair bills started showing up in 2001 and throughout Bush and Obama there was no headway at the Federal Level toward establishing a right to repair, not until the Supreme Court, under Donald Trump's administration, ruled in favor a short time ago.
It would seem that if the man sitting in the big chair has any impact on this issue, it's only under someone like Trump that we'll see an improvement.
And then there is also this;
https://hardforum.com/threads/libra...egally-hacking-drm-to-repair-devices.1970397/
Are you sure that Trump and the current administration is as bad as you think?
I recommend that you pay more attention to what they are actually doing, and less to what people who don't like him say he is doing.
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It is immaterial because the law has specific requirements for how things must be marked in order to enter the US.
If the parts are OEM parts, they must be marked and sold by an authorized manufacturer to an authorized reseller or repair shop. That is the "company" supply channel. These supply channels are monitored.
If the products arrive in any other manner then they must be marked appropriately for what they are and how they are being sold and to whom.
If an importer fails to follow the law on this, their goods are subject to seizure, and it doesn't matter if they were actually OEM parts or not.
It's not only about what the parts are, it's also about who the seller is, who the buyer is, and are they properly marked.
Look, run it through the "sniff test", are their any other repair facilities that are able to repair these specific laptops? If so, how are they getting their batteries? I bet there are, I bet they are, and I bet it's because they are doing it the right way so their batteries are not in a DHS holding yard awaiting disposal.
This guy Rossman has an authority problem. He likes to buck that authority because he wants the world to work his way.
He frequently looses
Doesn't learn very quickly either.
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BloodyIron
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The parts were ordered for the intent of repairing devices, it is completely relevant...
That’s your opinion. Nothing based on fact. They don’t sell ads and destroy privacy and that’s what’s really unsustainable at least in my opinion. Right to repair might be an issue. But if we are really talking here if apple isn’t right then you have no phones left to buy.
I think the assumption here that Louis 'knew' the batteries were counterfeit is a little unjustified. Yes, he does, oddly, dance around the topic of 'are these batteries legit' - However, it sounds like he wants to make this a legal matter so it's not in his interests to say too much on the internet regarding the products in question.
Personally, I believe if Louis actually knew for certain the products were counterfeit he wouldn't have made the video in the first place. Secondly, if the batteries we're actually counterfeit and Louis knew they were counterfeit, Louis would not be proceeding with legal action against US customs/Apple.
What I think is the supplier of the batteries either:
A - Had surplus stock 'from somewhere' of genuine batteries that they are selling, which in itself is not illegal. Or:
B - Recondition genuine batteries using the genuine plastic carriers/housings and simply replace the cells with items that could be just as good if not better than OEM quality.
If the supplier uses option 'B', it is not illegal to recondition anything and in doing so I see no reason to remove the logo as the product was technically still originally supplied by Apple and as long as the retailer makes it perfectly clear that these batteries are 'genuine batteries reconditioned by a third party and not Apple' I see no issue here.
If you replace the muffler on your Honda with an aftermarket muffler, your car does not cease being a Honda and you are not required to remove the Honda branding/badging as a result of your aftermarket muffler replacement.
This is out of control US capitalism at it's finest at this point in time until Louis provides an update. Nothing more, nothing less.
Personally, I believe if Louis actually knew for certain the products were counterfeit he wouldn't have made the video in the first place. Secondly, if the batteries we're actually counterfeit and Louis knew they were counterfeit, Louis would not be proceeding with legal action against US customs/Apple.
What I think is the supplier of the batteries either:
A - Had surplus stock 'from somewhere' of genuine batteries that they are selling, which in itself is not illegal. Or:
B - Recondition genuine batteries using the genuine plastic carriers/housings and simply replace the cells with items that could be just as good if not better than OEM quality.
If the supplier uses option 'B', it is not illegal to recondition anything and in doing so I see no reason to remove the logo as the product was technically still originally supplied by Apple and as long as the retailer makes it perfectly clear that these batteries are 'genuine batteries reconditioned by a third party and not Apple' I see no issue here.
If you replace the muffler on your Honda with an aftermarket muffler, your car does not cease being a Honda and you are not required to remove the Honda branding/badging as a result of your aftermarket muffler replacement.
This is out of control US capitalism at it's finest at this point in time until Louis provides an update. Nothing more, nothing less.
D
Deleted member 243478
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A. You cannot dismantle factory cells without destroying the exterior. They are sealed in a black plastic film with markings on it.
B. If somehow they managed to “rebuild” the guts of a factory Apple battery then they have no right to use the Apple logo. The battery has been tampered with and is no longer an Apple product due to 99% of it being replaced with unknown parts.
M76
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So, planned obsolescence level 9000 is not unsustainable. that's your opinion? Apple engages in planned obsolescence, fact. They do everything in their power to prevent user repair, fact. How much more factual can you get? Not supporting such companies is a moral decision. What facts am I missing?
Who cares about sustainable business? What is important is what is sustainable in terms of resources. Eg. not wasting them for short term profits.
I have no phones left to buy, period. That's why I had to replace the screen on my old phone myself when it broke. And that's a good thing, because I spared the economy from one more throwaway device. Buying a new phone every year or so is the very definition of unsustainable.
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Lunas
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Btw the batteries in question are for the 2015 MacBook that apple now refuses to service because it is over 2 years old and hit legacy status.
YeuEmMaiMai
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non issue - counterfeit goods can be seized by customs. maybe he should source 3rd party parts that do not have apple's logo on them :/
he's in a bad spot but it is not Apple's fault...
he's in a bad spot but it is not Apple's fault...
SixFootDuo
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Maybe I watched a different video but where does it say that he says they were knock off batteries? An incredible amount of e-waste goes to China ... I could have sworn he said they were legit batteries. The facts are, no one knows.
I guess the safe assumption is that a lot of fake shit comes out of China no doubt but these could have bee legit recycled batteries. But, who really knows.
Regardless, I hate Apple. Overpriced and under-performing and a locked eco-system. No thanks. I could give a rats ass if the iPhone has a powerful CPU. All the cool kids have Android.
D
Deleted member 243478
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That is utter BS, we have had Apple service laptops far older. Yes it is legacy as it is no longer in production but parts are stockpiled.
I dont know where people get this planned obsolescence crap from with Apple... they support the iPhone far more than any other manufacturer does with their phones. Laptops, well we have no issues up to 5yrs at least and its no different to any PC counterpart with parts not being produced anymore.
No, it is not.
Did you not read the post just before this one?
Here, I'll link it for you.
https://hardforum.com/threads/dhs-s...-repair-expert.1970049/page-2#post-1043902887
The were not seized because of anything that has to do with repair. They were seized because they did not meet the requirements for importation.
Had they met import requirements he would have a bunch of batteries and be repairing systems. You got to do things the right way whether you agree or not. Deviate at your own risk.
I bet he could have applied for an exception and it might have been granted had he asked for it in advance, before they were shipped for the states.
1.) They did you can argue, but have changed. They have 5 year old phones that are better now than when it was introduced, no other OEM has supported to my knowledge a phone for that long. They have publicly stated they want phones to last longer and they generally always did. Fact not true.
2.) They recycle more than any other phone maker (they actually advertise a program for that), they actually try to be sustainable and they release data about it generally every year.
If anything OEMs makers with poor ass software optimization and ram management that absolutely trash your phone and cause constant need to upgrade. You dislike them I can see that but you can't even be objective about this.
Lunas
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yet officially they have a EOL status 2 years and you get put out to pasture for updates and you will be lucky to get security updates. So they back pedaled and changed the track to 3 or 4 maybe 5 for pro products the point of the matter is once your product gets over 3 years old you will not easily get OEM parts to fix it when it breaks down due to shoddy construction. Apple is not rolex dont make them out to be something they are not.
Zumino Zufeilon
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a 2015 MBP is still supported, not sure what crack you are smoking.
The "newest" computer on the Apple Legacy list (i.e. no longer repairable at all) is 2010 MBP's.
The 2011 MBP's are Vintage (so only valid for repair in CA due to CA requiring it by law for 7 years).
This is straight from Apple's website.
So, these are either batteries for old ass laptops.
OR
They are cheap aftermarkets' that are trying to be passed off as OEM.
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201624
BTW, from a clarity and transparency perspective. Good luck even FINDING that list from any other PC Manufacturer.
I get it, this is [H]ardforum, and the Apple hate is strong here, but at least make it Apple hate that has some actual validity. There is plenty to disagree with Apple about, without having to make shit up.
The "newest" computer on the Apple Legacy list (i.e. no longer repairable at all) is 2010 MBP's.
The 2011 MBP's are Vintage (so only valid for repair in CA due to CA requiring it by law for 7 years).
This is straight from Apple's website.
So, these are either batteries for old ass laptops.
OR
They are cheap aftermarkets' that are trying to be passed off as OEM.
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201624
BTW, from a clarity and transparency perspective. Good luck even FINDING that list from any other PC Manufacturer.
I get it, this is [H]ardforum, and the Apple hate is strong here, but at least make it Apple hate that has some actual validity. There is plenty to disagree with Apple about, without having to make shit up.
Zumino Zufeilon
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Where are you getting 2 year EOL status?
Like, can you actually point to something? Maybe I missed it.
Hell, even the whole B.S. about the batteries was because Apple implemented a software fix to allow older phones, with failing batteries, to keep working longer, by slowing down the powerdraw (and thus the phone) when it was in a state that would cause a shut down.
Kinda argues against planned obsolescence.
Lunas
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quoting you radio shack training documents from when i worked for them
in the radio shack training documents
iphones had a 2 years support cycle and either 3 or 4 year security update cycle anything older than 3 or 4 years had no value and could no be repaired 2 year.
here are links to current practice
http://iossupportmatrix.com/
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201624
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Zumino Zufeilon
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Umm, you realize that "both" of those links show you as being wrong, yes?
You actually read the links, yes?
Never said they were. But 5 years is extraordinarily long compared to anyone else. Anything above 1.5 years is exceptional for the vast majority of the market. Also they still repair the 5S and SE they are really old. Point to me any other OEM that has supported any phone for 3 or 4 years with constant software updates?
Most here discredit everything apples does blindly and turn the other way when others do something.
Lunas
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yeah i did and did you read my part about quoting you training from a company that went under in 2015 i did also fail to mention my training was valid in 2010
and CURRENT support is now 5 years since product line was manufactured 7 years where mandates require longer support
So the documents you quoted saying that since the oringinal iPhone almost every single one got 3 years worth of updates and then since the 4, 4-5 years so far? Is that what you are saying? And apple will support repairs for 7 years?
Did you even read my post? I said they changed their stance and everything you post proves they did. The iPhone 4 came out 8 years ago.
so all apple needs to do is shape the main battery connector into the shape of a trademarked apple and they would win the war on counterfits.
Wow, some of you guys ^
If the parts are imported for Apple through their normal supply chain all is well for them.
No matter who makes the parts, or who they are being imported for, they must be marked properly. If they are not, then if found, they will be confiscate by Customs.
Parts that are third party products must be marked properly.
OEM parts must be marked properly.
All of them must be marked properly and shipped properly and if someone decides to cut corners and looses their shit, I suppose they can just cry about Apple and Corrupt Government organs and they'll get plenty of sympathetic face time.
Did I really say corrupt government organs
If the parts are imported for Apple through their normal supply chain all is well for them.
No matter who makes the parts, or who they are being imported for, they must be marked properly. If they are not, then if found, they will be confiscate by Customs.
Parts that are third party products must be marked properly.
OEM parts must be marked properly.
All of them must be marked properly and shipped properly and if someone decides to cut corners and looses their shit, I suppose they can just cry about Apple and Corrupt Government organs and they'll get plenty of sympathetic face time.
Did I really say corrupt government organs
A battery is an assembly made up of a chassis and one or more cells, it is entirely possible to replace the cells within the chassis and resell the assembly as a re manufactured battery with Apple markings and such assemblies do exist. The fact that a cell was replaced as a matter of normal ageing and failure doesn't in any way indicate that the assembly didn't originally come from an Apple factory.
D
Deleted member 243478
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Sigh...wrong wrong WRONG. All companies have EOL. It simply means the device is out of production, nothing more.
My 4yr old Macbook was just upgraded to Mojave (for free mind you). Everyone keeps crapping on about planned obsolescence with Apple but it is simply BS. The facts are the facts. Phonesas I said before are supported well beyond any other maker on the market.