Developer 'Disappointed' On-Disc DLC Being Hacked

sfsuphysics

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Not my type of game, but the concept of what this fucker did is the same

producer Tomoaki Ayano is disappointed that hackers are already playing with the dozen fighters planned as downloadable content for his game.
And I'm mother fucking disappointed that the levels of greed that are done by producers nowadays, they obviously put the time in already, they made it work, hell they got so fucking lazy they included it on the disc itself so they don't need to spend money on bandwidth later on. They charge a full price for a game that they intentionally cripple, then charge another $20 to uncripple it later.

Originally DLC wasn't DLC, it was an expansion pack, where you have the whole game initially and you simply add more levels, a further story, etc. Diablo, Neverwinter Nights, hell even the Sims did it to a degree since you got a significant amount of crap and more importantly this was done AFTER the project was finished, it represented a much larger undertaking after the release of the game.

Then DLC came about and this added nothing to the game play experience at all except maybe some cosmetic changes, you get a new gun for preordereing, or a particular character, etc. however often this is done before the game is released, so basically the company spends resources to produce a tiny addition, but then decides they can ala carte you the game by selling you a full priced game then adding options.

Although I guess one should be somewhat happy with Capcom for at least charging you only $20 for a few extra characters, I mean this is the company that came out with Street Fighter 2, Street Fighter 2: Championship edition, Street FIghter 2: Hyper Fighting, Super Street Fighter 2, Super Street Fighter 2: Turbo.... which added a few extra characters but they charged you for an entirely new game.
 

dd0512

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Not my type of game, but the concept of what this fucker did is the same


And I'm mother fucking disappointed that the levels of greed that are done by producers nowadays, they obviously put the time in already, they made it work, hell they got so fucking lazy they included it on the disc itself so they don't need to spend money on bandwidth later on. They charge a full price for a game that they intentionally cripple, then charge another $20 to uncripple it later.

Originally DLC wasn't DLC, it was an expansion pack, where you have the whole game initially and you simply add more levels, a further story, etc. Diablo, Neverwinter Nights, hell even the Sims did it to a degree since you got a significant amount of crap and more importantly this was done AFTER the project was finished, it represented a much larger undertaking after the release of the game.

Then DLC came about and this added nothing to the game play experience at all except maybe some cosmetic changes, you get a new gun for preordereing, or a particular character, etc. however often this is done before the game is released, so basically the company spends resources to produce a tiny addition, but then decides they can ala carte you the game by selling you a full priced game then adding options.

Although I guess one should be somewhat happy with Capcom for at least charging you only $20 for a few extra characters, I mean this is the company that came out with Street Fighter 2, Street Fighter 2: Championship edition, Street FIghter 2: Hyper Fighting, Super Street Fighter 2, Super Street Fighter 2: Turbo.... which added a few extra characters but they charged you for an entirely new game.

Pretty sure EA is mostly responsible for this
 

FndTheRver

Gawd
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DLC content should not be on the disk, just cheap way of getting money

If it's already on the disc, then it doesn't need to be downloaded at all... Therefore it really can't be called DLC. Maybe they should just call them add on characters. Or rip you off characters.
 

WorldExclusive

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If you have the "DLC" done in time to put it on the game disc then it should have been part of the game to begin with and not DLC. The consumers didn't want to be milked/suckered again, how is this shocking?

I agree. On disc DLC is a str8 up scam.
 

lilbabycat

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Capcom is (somehow) the worst abuser of DLC / Similar screwing these days.

-Resident Evil 5 DLC already on disk
-Resident Evil 6 Pre-Order DLC
-Street Fighter 4, Super Street Fighter 4, Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Editions (milking content 3x)
-Marvel vs Capcom 3 Pre-Order DLC
-Super Marvel vs Capcom 3 announced just 6 months after MvC3, original MvC3 "abandoned"
-Alternate Costume DLC for all of these games at less than "fair" pricing
-SF vs TK DLC in the news now

How could they NOT expect backlash ?
 

MavericK

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Capcom is (somehow) the worst abuser of DLC / Similar screwing these days.

-Resident Evil 5 DLC already on disk

How could they NOT expect backlash ?

Yeah, I remember paying $5-10 or whatever it was for RE5 Versus multiplayer on PS3 and then being pissed when I saw the download was like a 50 Kb unlock key. :mad:
 

Jorona

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To the Developers:

I understand you need to keep people working during final QC, testing, and Publisher QA. You accomplish this by making DLC. I'm all for keeping people employed. Just hold the cards alittle closer. Don't put the DLC on the disc. People WILL exploit it, and people WILL get butt hurt about it. Also, give yourself 2 weeks before releasing real DLC. Preorder exclusives and retailer exclusives no one gives a shit about. Real DLC needs to not be available Day 1. It just leaves a bad taste in everyone mouth. Not as bad as DLC on disc, but still not good. Other then that, keep on keepin on. Consumers are whiners, just make sure you're not the one being whined at loudest, and you'll be good.

To the Consumers:

We did this. We wanted support for games after release. We got it. We wanted more content for our block buster games. We got it. Who here remembers the good old days of carts that if the game had issues, it ALWAYS had issues? Hell, I remember atleast 50 times where I had to start Zelda over again because the save feature was a friggan MESS. Damn stupid little switch on the cart. We expect so much more support after the release and multiplayer servers, and more levels, and blah de blah de blah. You are going to pay for it guys. If you want it to change, you need to vote with your wallet. Don't want day one DLC? Don't pay for it. Don't want games with DLC on the disc? Don't buy it. Companies listen to the sound of money, and will move to its whim quickly. Whining about it after paying for it? Thats just gonna get you labeled a whiner, and no one likes whiners. Don't Buy Ultimate MvC3 if you don't like that they dumped the original. don't like that they made three different versions of Street Fighter? Don't buy them. Its not hard people. If you want the pre-order DLC, then pre-order it. Don't whine about how you didn't get something for nothing because you didn't jump at the opportunity. You didn't pre-order it, why should they give you the pre-order content?

TL;DR version. We, the consumer, made this. We can change it, but not by whining. You need to vote with your wallet.
 

Xee

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Basically, it greatly annoys me when people the word "basically" too much, basically.
 

ir0nw0lf

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next your going tell me there is no Easter Bunny and Santa Claus :rolleyes:

Wait, wut? What is this life altering revelation you make? :eek: :D

They should have known that there are determined people out there with way too much time who can and will unlock/hack this kind of stuff. Hot Coffee anyone?
 

Ur_Mom

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If you have the "DLC" done in time to put it on the game disc then it should have been part of the game to begin with and not DLC. The consumers didn't want to be milked/suckered again, how is this shocking?

Yup. DLC should be for additional content done at a later date, not for stuff that should be already in the game (and is, for all intents and purposes).
 

ballistic90

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The only reason I can think of for having DLC on the disc is if the DLC is NOT fully completed as of launch, but they leave the bulk of the content on the free space on the disc and the developers finish the rest of it and release the final portions of the DLC to make it work. That's the only way it makes sense to me, to save space on the user's hard drive.
 

sfsuphysics

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The big issue here I think developers want to aim for is a series of microtransactions like many online games do, however they just can't justify the expense of production without charging an arm and a leg up front, they simply want one model, but can't let go of their old model. It unfortunately comes off as greed.

Now if they had SF vs TK... FREE* You only get Ryu & (whatever Tekken popular character is) for free. Games are server locked as far as characters you can use, and you pay $2 a character additional (there's what like 50 characters?) or you buy everything as a wholesale CostCo package for $60.
 

vicsrealms

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Did people forget about the Hot Coffee mess that Rockstar went through years ago over San Andreas. Someone found the game on the disc, and then distributed a means of playing it. Then some old granny got pissed and ruined the game for everyone because she purchased the game for her 9 year old grandson.

Maybe they shouldn't put this stuff on the disc. Even more important why are you buying the GTA series for your 9 year old grandson?!!!

~grin~
 
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I remember the days when 60 dollars got you the full single player game, full multiplayer game, and years of post release patch support+occasional maps. Developers who wanted to make more money down the road released full featured expansion packs for 15-30 dollars. Those were the days.
 

Jorona

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I remember the days when 60 dollars got you the full single player game, full multiplayer game, and years of post release patch support+occasional maps. Developers who wanted to make more money down the road released full featured expansion packs for 15-30 dollars. Those were the days.

Sounds like today.
 

lilbabycat

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To the Consumers:

We did this. We wanted support for games after release. We got it. We wanted more content for our block buster games. We got it.

Umm, last time I checked the playtime for the "blockbuster" games these days floats under 10hrs and the multiplayer isn't "complete" until 6-12 months later when the game has gotten all it's "DLC".

We aren't getting more content, we're getting same amount if not less, even after DLC.

Sounds like today.

He meant for free. And "expansion packs" back in the day would be considered entirely new titles today. "expansion pack" gets used these days to describe 3 maps, 2 weapons, and a few new textures .... certainly not the same thing.
 

Stone Cold

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What difference does it make? Isn't it just as easy to download unauthorized content it is to download the crack for on-disk content?
 

RooK

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"I was really surprised at how skillful the hackers were, basically."

You're surprised? You haven't been paying attention to the last 30 years of software piracy? Are you surprised when you walk outside and the sky is blue?

I think he lives on mars - so yea... red would be what he's apparently used to. I just about busted up laughing at the stupidity of the statement itself.
 

Jorona

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Umm, last time I checked the playtime for the "blockbuster" games these days floats under 10hrs and the multiplayer isn't "complete" until 6-12 months later when the game has gotten all it's "DLC".

We aren't getting more content, we're getting same amount if not less, even after DLC.



He meant for free. And "expansion packs" back in the day would be considered entirely new titles today. "expansion pack" gets used these days to describe 3 maps, 2 weapons, and a few new textures .... certainly not the same thing.

I'll agree that games have gotten shorter. Back in the day though, 50 bucks bought you a single player game with no updates, patches or multiplayer. The expantion pack bought you MAYBE another couple hours of game play and some new weapons.

What I'm getting at is, we pay nearly the same amount of money, and expect all this shit to just be given to us. Old multiplayer games, the servers where hosted by gamers. Now the servers are hosted by the game company. Thats money. The game has to be patched. Thats money. The game gets new guns/cars/levels/characters. Thats money.

If you don't like the amount you're getting for your money, then DON'T SPEND IT. Don't bitch about your shitty end of the stick. You're the one that put it there.
 

MavericK

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I'll agree that games have gotten shorter. Back in the day though, 50 bucks bought you a single player game with no updates, patches or multiplayer. The expantion pack bought you MAYBE another couple hours of game play and some new weapons.

How far "back in the day" are we talking here? Pretty sure games from Quake and onward had patches, updates, and multiplayer. Expansion packs provided quite a bit more gameplay as well. For example, the Quake expansions added a dozen or more new SP levels, new weapons, new enemies, and new powerups. I can't recall how much it was...I think something like $30? Nowadays $30 gets you like 8 maps, if that, and generally no additional content.

If you are talking pre-Quake, then it makes sense that there were few patches/no MP because the internet was not as prevalent as it is now, and dial-up speeds were crappy.
 

bbf

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Best QUOTE EVAR from Gamespot comments thread:
bojox3m said:
Moral of the story: Gamers are not cows. We don't have milks, Do not milk us for we will turn to a BULL.

It's my new "All Your Base Are Belong to Us" unintentional skewering of the English Language.
 

fattypants

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Someone accessed content on the disc they bought. Truly a tragedy that gamers should be allowed to play a complete game without paying extra.
 

lilbabycat

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If you don't like the amount you're getting for your money, then DON'T SPEND IT. Don't bitch about your shitty end of the stick. You're the one that put it there.

Ahem. First off f*ck you. There are effectively only two things I can do to help prevent this from becoming the norm in the industry: one not buy the junk and two voice my concerns against it. So you just take that "don't bitch about it" mantra and shove it. The people who just sit there idly and take it are the ones who deserve it, not I.

Second, I don't want game companies to run the servers. I never asked for this. Ever. I don't want to have to log in to some specialized 'stat' server for specifically that one game just to be able to play on a completely different server. Again, I've voiced my concerns against, as have others on this.

Third, games that need to be patched because they're broken at release simply don't factor into this discussion at all.

Lastly,
The game gets new guns/cars/levels/characters. Thats money.
It was already mentioned that this content was free "back in the day", it is no longer. In fact it's the opposite, content is yanked to be later sold in addition to the purchase price. I clearly didn't ask for that.

Just by my own baseless guess, wasn't even born in my "back in the day". Tell the truth, your first fps, was it Halo? Or no, you're probably legit, it was Goldeneye wasn't it?

Now go back to being a consumer sheep / whore, dude.
 

MrLonghair

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On-disc DLC in an online game that otherwise would force other players to download the DLC data is a must have because of Microsoft's rules for doing anything even related to the 360.
 

sfsuphysics

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GTA5, you can drive 3 cars, and 1 motorcycle, weapons are a knife, and 9mm gun. For an extra $5 you can unlock the 10 new cars, and 3 weapons! For another $5 unlock 5 bikes, 6 more weapons. And another $5 unlock new clothes *snicker*
 

Poik

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I remember the days when 60 dollars got you the full single player game, full multiplayer game, and years of post release patch support+occasional maps. Developers who wanted to make more money down the road released full featured expansion packs for 15-30 dollars. Those were the days.

So true.
This was one of the reasons I really liked Valve. They weren't always trying to eek every last penny out of you. For the most part they're still pretty good tho I'm not a fan of the free to play TF2.

I think this is a result of the COD generation. MW2/3 and BLOPS are all little more than expansion packs with a small single player added in. Then they have map pack DLC because the mindless minions just can't help themselves.
 

dr.kevin

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fuck the dev for trying to nickel and dime.

i don't support charging, especially $20, for unlocking small shit like characters and weapons.

if it were an extra few hours of gameplay, I would more likely support it
 

m_isom

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365
Your sense of entitlement is incorrect.

What about the studios' sense of entitlement?


$60 for a 3-5 hour game? Not gonna pay it. I liked Mad World for Wii, but not at release price. Rented once and finished it... but I did pick it up when I found it for $12 on newegg.


$15 for Alan Wake: American Nightmare? Finished in 3 hours exploring for all the radios and pages. Well worth the cost. Please bring out more.


Guessing that is the American Nightmare... the zombies with wallets are feeling remorse and are tired of being burned.
 

mope54

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isn't modeling one of or the most labor intensive portions of game development?
 

evilsofa

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Just call it ODC (On Disk Content) instead of DLC (DownLoadable Content) because there's no downloading involved with it. "On Disk Downloadable Content" is a stupid oxymoron.
 

Jorona

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Ahem. First off f*ck you. There are effectively only two things I can do to help prevent this from becoming the norm in the industry: one not buy the junk and two voice my concerns against it. So you just take that "don't bitch about it" mantra and shove it. The people who just sit there idly and take it are the ones who deserve it, not I.

Second, I don't want game companies to run the servers. I never asked for this. Ever. I don't want to have to log in to some specialized 'stat' server for specifically that one game just to be able to play on a completely different server. Again, I've voiced my concerns against, as have others on this.

Third, games that need to be patched because they're broken at release simply don't factor into this discussion at all.

Lastly,
It was already mentioned that this content was free "back in the day", it is no longer. In fact it's the opposite, content is yanked to be later sold in addition to the purchase price. I clearly didn't ask for that.

Just by my own baseless guess, wasn't even born in my "back in the day". Tell the truth, your first fps, was it Halo? Or no, you're probably legit, it was Goldeneye wasn't it?

Now go back to being a consumer sheep / whore, dude.

Yes, I'm a sheep because when I don't like what a company is doing, I don't BUY FROM THEM.

You may not have asked for the companies to run the servers, but everyone that plays on consoles DID. Thats the fact of the matter. There is no arguing this. Xbox Live changed everything.

Also, many games back in the day had game altering or breaking bugs, that many of us simply exploited. Hell, I remember fucking with Chrono Trigger to give myself all the trade goods for the prehistoric area. Or Breaking the item system in Super Mario World to get inifinite lives. We all did it. Nowadays that would get patched. All the ways to play bootleg discs on old playstations, would have been patched. Back in the day, they finished a game, and it was finished. Thats it, unless they wanted to do an expantion. Now we expect to be supported for 12 months. That costs money people. Keeping a team of coders on just to squash bugs that pop up when people start playing and doing everything they can to mess with the game costs money. You can't possibly expect Rockstar to know your going to see what happens when you line up a row of 18 different cars in a particular order and when you hit it with a baseball bat it makes the 9th car fly into the sky permanantly, thus causing the save file to try and locate that car, and ruining your save game. No one is perfect. Shit happens. Now they can fix that after the fact, but it costs money.

What game just gave you new items? If your about to source valve games, most of the time it was user created first and then Valve added it officially. User created content is free to the publisher, so sure, they're gonna give that to ya. There have always been expantions though. Today they are smaller. DLC is expantions now. The Atomic Edition was 30 bucks for Duke Nukem. It added alot of content. Most DLC is less then 10 dollars, and adds less content. I don't see the problem. Hell, Return to Karkand for BF3 is only 15 bucks. More Maps, More Guns, More Gamemodes. Whats not to like?

I'm 27. I started on Wolfenstein 3D. Infact I still have it on the IBM P60 Portable PC that I played it on when I was 5. So get off it. Also, GoldenEye was awesome, don't deny it. It even had game ending glitches, like picking up items with mines on them and then detonating the mine. Yup, lock your shit right up.
 

swalters

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"DLC on-disk" is not DLC. you might as well sell that content in a seperate package like an expansion pack. or how about you include that content in the origional game and price the whole thing accordingly.

Agreed. Developers shouldn't feel butt-hurt about hackers gaining access to content they locked away on the retail disc. It's their own damn fault if they're going to be greedy and lazy about it.
 

travanx

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Makes me miss buying speech add on packs back in the day.

I was thinking of buying this game on release until I saw they were doing this stupid DLC. I completely erased it out of my head until now. I think this will remind me to not buy another Capcom game.
 

Ocellaris

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I am all for DLC (and usually not buying it myself), however this trend of ON DISC DLC is just stupid. The whole point of DLC was extra content that was released after the primary game, not "spend money to use more of the disc". Nobody wants to pay $5 and then download a 10K file that unlocks characters already on a disc. Looks much worse than paying $5 and then downloading a 100MB character download that gets installed.
 

stop!theradio

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Correct me if I'm wrong - but didn't it turn out that the character itself was on the disc but not the actual missions? The way it was explained was that they were working on DLC before the game shipped but the game as a whole was completed and pressed BEFORE the DLC was completed and thus they couldn't have possibly included the DLC missions in the final products? I mean if that's the case then it makes sense to me in a way - because in order to include the completed missions in the final press, they would've had to delay the release of the game.

Still, though, they should have just delayed the release for a week so they could include important story elements from the DLC. Day one DLC seems pretty stupid to me.
 
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