DAN A4-SFX: The smallest gaming case in the world

Yesterday all parts arrived (except the liquid metal for delid) so I built my system:
i5-7600k
Asus z270i
32GB Corsair Vengeance LPX 3000
Noctua NH-L9i with NF-A9x14 fan
EVGA GTX 1080 FTW ACX 3.0
Two Samsung EVO 960 m.2 (265GB + 1TB)
Corsair SF450

First of all, those parts are small! (except the GTX) It's my first ITX build and I am realy amazed.
Building the system was not as easy as in a big case, but it was no big deal. Needed to remove the PSU cage to install the mainboard. The advantage is, that there are not many cables (as I dont have SSDs).
I installed the mainboard io shield, but I am going to remove it as soon as I delid my CPU. Undervolting is also on the todo list.
I run ARK survival evolved for a few minutes as the pc will mostly be used for gaming and there are my first impressions (closed sidepannels, io shield on, no delid, no undervolting, NH-L9i fins parallel to ram):

- in windows (2d) the SF450 fan runs most of the time, not only while/after gaming. The air blowing out of the PSU feels like having the same temperature as the room. I don't realy know why the fan is spinning, but it is silent and I can only hear it very close. I had a look if it is the problem with the GPU backplate heating the PSU. My GPU looks like beinig a little bent, it almost touches the PSU. I put some spacers (small piece of PSU package foam, not covering the PSU/GPU back much) and let the GPU fan spin. The PSU fan was still most of the time spinning. I might try to do a better job with the spacers and see if it makes a difference
- in games this case is much loader than my old big tower. The GPU is by far the loadest part and spinns about 20% faster than in my old case. Using a power target of 70% helped a bit, but not very much. But the noise it produces is not realy annoying.
I would recommand for those who only use the pc for gaming without OC, just use the Noctua or C7 with the Noctua fan. Disabling turbo boost didn't make any noise difference, but I did not run a stress test.
- The Asus boad looks great and has many features (like the 2 m.2), but the mosfet heatsinks cover most of the heatsink. There is not much space for air to get through. If you dont mind having only one m.2 I would recommend a mainboard with much space (or as much as possible) around the CPU.
- To the case ventilation itself: While gaming it gets hot on the back top and buttom (I think the GPU heat heats those parts). It could use as much space as possible to blow air out, I think that's why removing the io shield will benefit. I think an additional fan at the top blowing out doesn't make any difference. Maybe a bigger mesh on the top would help with that a little, but maybe won't look that good
- I replaced the feet with the hifi feet suggested pages back. Putting the case on a mousepad or something similar would also reduce sliding.
- I still need to figure out where to turn off Asus auto OC, but the OC is very minimal (about 20 MHz for each core). Did not have the time to take a closer look.

So far I like the case because its so small and has much power. I think Dan did the best he could for the small format! I don't want to go back to my tower! Good work Dan, thank you for the case!
I hope there will be improved parts in the future those wo already have the case (and thereby help improving it) will also have the possibility to benefit.

Dan, maybe you can make a collection of tipps and tricks on your homepage?
 
Fhe
I'm curious about this. My Ncase M1 gets quite hot on top and by the motherboard, but it is cool where the intake fans are. Is your case cool where the intake fans are?
The only intake is the CPU cooler. On mine, yes you can feel cooler air immediately surrounding the CPU cooler intake area on the side panel.
 
Removed the Strix IO heatsink tonight and tried a Scythe 120mm 12mm fan. Conclusion: stick with the Noctua A9x14, and remove the heatsink if you're using the LP53 with the fins running perpendicular to your RAM. Removing the mosfet heatsink provided a 10c or so improvement in Prime95 temps for me.

The Scythe looks bad ass and really cools the rest of the mobo, RAM, and SSD well. My RAM was about 15c cooler, in fact. But it is pretty loud and offers no increase in CPU cooling performance over the Noctua. It sits about 42mm tall once installed, but it has to rest on the wifi card module of the z270i and the RAM, or just the wifi module depending on how you want it, since it is so large. I.e. even once secured to the heatsink it sits about 1 or 2mm above it. The version you can buy separately is also not PWM, sadly. (Do they sell a slim 120mm 12mm fan with any of their CPU coolers?)
What were the temps without the Mosfet?? At what's oc?
 
In your awesome cooler overview Meccabolix i seem to have missed the orientation of your fans. I have just installed the LP53 with Noctua a9x14, vertical orientation and used your YouTube video as reference - this have left me with the fan pushing air towards the CPU. Is this the correct "optimal" setup? You other lovely guys are also welcome to tune in on this.

Oh, and if anyone is interested I also removed the I/O shield, and used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. Overall a 10c reduction in idle and on load from my Cryorig C7. However, noise feels like 80 000 dB reduction.
 
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Yeah! That's great!

Has anyone used a pico PSU to power your Dan A4 SFX?
And maybe use the space left to put AIO cooler or more fans?
 
What were the temps without the Mosfet?? At what's oc?

I am using a laser thermometer to check the mosfet temps, but none of them went higher than 115F during prime95. They are naked right now too, I have not received my replacement low profile heatsinks. I may not even put them on... FYI my laser thermometer has a pretty big error window of about 10f just in testing around the house, but even with that they are well within their thermal limit. This is all at stock.

By the way I noticed that once in the case and with the heatpipe bends of the LP53 at the bottom of the case, fins facing out the IO panel, I am noticing a decent improvement in temperature. About 10c lower at idle vs open air and Max temp of Prime95 went down to 86c in the case, from 91c in open air! I added all of this to the spreadsheet. (What happened to that, it looks like a ton of measurements got cut?)
 
Also, I can confirm 300mm for the PCIE and CPU cables (if you're using the Asus Z270I) is plenty long. 150mm for the ATX cable is also perfect for this motherboard. You could probably get away with 250mm for the CPU power on the Strix motherboard actually. And, don't be a moron like me and only order one PCIE cable if you're using the 1080ti....:(
 
In your awesome cooler overview Meccabolix i seem to have missed the orientation of your fans. I have just installed the LP53 with Noctua a9x14, vertical orientation and used your YouTube video as reference - this have left me with the fan pushing air towards the CPU. Is this the correct "optimal" setup? You other lovely guys are also welcome to tune in on this.

Oh, and if anyone is interested I also removed the I/O shield, and used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. Overall a 10c reduction in idle and on load from my Cryorig C7. However, noise feels like 80 000 dB reduction.

Yup i put mine so it blows towards the cpu.
 
the vcore on the strix board. if I put manual at 1.26v it doesn't stay like that and goes all the way to 1.386v when the cpu is at 4400mhz. I was wondering if I could use it to lower my temps... anybody with a strix board has insight on this?
 
GPU mounting hole cover second try:

cover2yyldc.jpg


What do you think?
 
Like a few others said, this hole doesn't bother me. But if you are looking for ideas here is how Lian Li does it on my old Q11. They like thumbscrews...

1bo7HFs.jpg
I like this solution. And i think the other thing to improve as already said is remove the bar between 2 expansion slot and put with the case a double bracket already mounted and a spare single bracket for a low profile GPU, or Simply 2 single bracket
 
there is no benefit to CPU temps with a 120mm fan

only a 120mm heatsink will benefit from a 120mm fan. most of the air moved out of the fan is at the edges, not the center, so a bigger fan (with a bigger hub and edges that don't hit the heatsink) could actually be worse

Case also got extremely hot lol.

that's normal for an aluminum case with hot stuff inside it. think of it acting as a very big, very weak heatsink

The GPU is by far the loadest part and spinns about 20% faster than in my old case.

unfortunately EVGA is not known to make the best coolers. try MSI next time, they have a long record of being the quietest. now you can help the sound with undervolting and underclocking the card
 
only a 120mm heatsink will benefit from a 120mm fan. most of the air moved out of the fan is at the edges, not the center, so a bigger fan (with a bigger hub and edges that don't hit the heatsink) could actually be worse

If the Scythe I tried just wasn't so dang loud, I would have kept it in there. I cooled the whole system down well.
 
only a 120mm heatsink will benefit from a 120mm fan. most of the air moved out of the fan is at the edges, not the center, so a bigger fan (with a bigger hub and edges that don't hit the heatsink) could actually be worse

Thats right! and its a double blow in the context of this case, a natural forced exhaust is possible if a low profile LP53/ L9i heatsink is used, fins orientated horizontally, no VRM heatsink on the motherboard, and no IO shield installed, then a 92mm fan will blow the hot air directly out of the case.

A 120mm disrupts that flow by mixing up the air, weakening the directed flow out the back, and increasing the chance of re-circulating that hot air.

Motherboard temps do benefit significantly though, and this would apply to a top mounted SSD if applicable.
 
Hey Dan,

If you're thinking about options for V2 of the case, a fan mounting option on the GPU side panel near the power supply would be great. It doesn't have to be much -- just screw holes.

Reason being that with shorter video cards, there's empty space there. The fan could be used as another exhaust or an intake.

I saw someone do a ghetto rig with double-sided tape, but a proper mount would be much better. If you want to get fancy, you could probably hide the screw mounts so they're only on the inside of the case.

I really like the second cover design. Much better colour ;). I think the Lian Li design is a better way to go, however. Maybe a slightly shorter screw adjustment slot.
 
I'd just like to say that building in this case was an absolute pleasure. The easiest ITX build experience I have ever had, by far. 5 stars to Dan for this case. I wish I could say the same for ASUS motherboard engineers...
 
so you just randomly drop that into this thread?! your modem is probably locked down because you owe them money.

mods should move this to a more appropriate thread
 
I have some occasional boot problems with that RAM at its XMP profile on the Strix mobo.
 
I have some occasional boot problems with that RAM at its XMP profile on the Strix mobo.

yep I had that too. disable xmp, imput manual settings and undervolt the ram to 1.2738v instead of 1.35v

now has been rock steady in aida64 stress test, prime 95 and tombraider benchmark.

took me a whole week of testing to figure it out. the ram was overheating real fast on the cramped mobo because of the cpu heatsink. the joys of troubleshooting. enjoy.

ram bros now lol.


btw do you think that would fit in the strix heatsink's place? http://www.zalman.com/contents/products/view.html?no=421
 
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I am using a laser thermometer to check the mosfet temps, but none of them went higher than 115F during prime95. They are naked right now too, I have not received my replacement low profile heatsinks. I may not even put them on... FYI my laser thermometer has a pretty big error window of about 10f just in testing around the house, but even with that they are well within their thermal limit. This is all at stock.

By the way I noticed that once in the case and with the heatpipe bends of the LP53 at the bottom of the case, fins facing out the IO panel, I am noticing a decent improvement in temperature. About 10c lower at idle vs open air and Max temp of Prime95 went down to 86c in the case, from 91c in open air! I added all of this to the spreadsheet. (What happened to that, it looks like a ton of measurements got cut?)

can you post a link to the replacement low profile mosfet heatsinks you've ordered?
 
btw do you think that would fit in the strix heatsink's place? http://www.zalman.com/contents/products/view.html?no=421
It's 93mm so probably too long. The Strix VRM heatsink (the tall one) is about 2.5" long, or 65mm. The screw holes look about 62 mm apart. The thermal pad is about 2 inches or 50.8 mm, and that's representative of the mosfets that need to be covered. I haven't taken the other one off but it's roughly the same size, possibly smaller lengthwise. Philfreeze has a picture of what is under both of the sinks in this thread somewhere. You could probably just cover each individually with some small mosfet heatsinks + sticky thermal pads.

can you post a link to the replacement low profile mosfet heatsinks you've ordered?

Check out this post from Philfreeze, he links a bunch of choices. I have the small (3.65mm tall aluminum) ones on the way.
 

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Yesterday all parts arrived (except the liquid metal for delid) so I built my system:
i5-7600k
Asus z270i
32GB Corsair Vengeance LPX 3000
Noctua NH-L9i with NF-A9x14 fan
EVGA GTX 1080 FTW ACX 3.0
Two Samsung EVO 960 m.2 (265GB + 1TB)
Corsair SF450

First of all, those parts are small! (except the GTX) It's my first ITX build and I am realy amazed.
Building the system was not as easy as in a big case, but it was no big deal. Needed to remove the PSU cage to install the mainboard. The advantage is, that there are not many cables (as I dont have SSDs).
I installed the mainboard io shield, but I am going to remove it as soon as I delid my CPU. Undervolting is also on the todo list.
I run ARK survival evolved for a few minutes as the pc will mostly be used for gaming and there are my first impressions (closed sidepannels, io shield on, no delid, no undervolting, NH-L9i fins parallel to ram):

- in windows (2d) the SF450 fan runs most of the time, not only while/after gaming. The air blowing out of the PSU feels like having the same temperature as the room. I don't realy know why the fan is spinning, but it is silent and I can only hear it very close. I had a look if it is the problem with the GPU backplate heating the PSU. My GPU looks like beinig a little bent, it almost touches the PSU. I put some spacers (small piece of PSU package foam, not covering the PSU/GPU back much) and let the GPU fan spin. The PSU fan was still most of the time spinning. I might try to do a better job with the spacers and see if it makes a difference
- in games this case is much loader than my old big tower. The GPU is by far the loadest part and spinns about 20% faster than in my old case. Using a power target of 70% helped a bit, but not very much. But the noise it produces is not realy annoying.
I would recommand for those who only use the pc for gaming without OC, just use the Noctua or C7 with the Noctua fan. Disabling turbo boost didn't make any noise difference, but I did not run a stress test.
- The Asus boad looks great and has many features (like the 2 m.2), but the mosfet heatsinks cover most of the heatsink. There is not much space for air to get through. If you dont mind having only one m.2 I would recommend a mainboard with much space (or as much as possible) around the CPU.
- To the case ventilation itself: While gaming it gets hot on the back top and buttom (I think the GPU heat heats those parts). It could use as much space as possible to blow air out, I think that's why removing the io shield will benefit. I think an additional fan at the top blowing out doesn't make any difference. Maybe a bigger mesh on the top would help with that a little, but maybe won't look that good
- I replaced the feet with the hifi feet suggested pages back. Putting the case on a mousepad or something similar would also reduce sliding.
- I still need to figure out where to turn off Asus auto OC, but the OC is very minimal (about 20 MHz for each core). Did not have the time to take a closer look.

So far I like the case because its so small and has much power. I think Dan did the best he could for the small format! I don't want to go back to my tower! Good work Dan, thank you for the case!
I hope there will be improved parts in the future those wo already have the case (and thereby help improving it) will also have the possibility to benefit.

Dan, maybe you can make a collection of tipps and tricks on your homepage?

I need to correct myself having a closer look yesterday. The PSU fan is running at 100% and is a little bit louder than the GPU. I don't know why, as the air coming out of the PSU is not realy warm. Will test if the GPU backplate is heating the PSU Backside (and the PSU fan cannot efficently cool that part). If this is not the case I think I will rma my PSU or try the SF600.
Anyone have another PSU as the corsair or silverstone which is silent in the case?
 
If anyone else with a silver case is wondering whether to get the black or silver feet: (don't mind the loose usb or power cable)
These feet, unlike the original ones, are very grippy and aluminium as well. They are a bit higher and the front feet do overlap with the aluminium panel though. Shouldn't be an issue even if it scratches.
The original feet are hard plastic and I can't even press the power button without having to hold the case, does Lian Li seriously use those on more of their cases?
Just attached with a simple screw so easily replaced.

Thanks Pagold for posting the link! https://www.amazon.de/dp/B01G1J5U7Q/ref=olp_product_details?_encoding=UTF8&me=
(they don't come with nuts and bolts)
View attachment 18844 View attachment 18845 View attachment 18846

What size nuts/bolts did you use to attach the hifi feet?
 
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I need to correct myself having a closer look yesterday. The PSU fan is running at 100% and is a little bit louder than the GPU. I don't know why, as the air coming out of the PSU is not realy warm. Will test if the GPU backplate is heating the PSU Backside (and the PSU fan cannot efficently cool that part). If this is not the case I think I will rma my PSU or try the SF600.
Anyone have another PSU as the corsair or silverstone which is silent in the case?

Try putting in some insulating material between GPU and PSU? Like the foam packaging that came with the PSU. The back of the GPU does get pretty hot. Someone did it earlier and I tried it as well, although I have the SF600.
 
the vcore on the strix board. if I put manual at 1.26v it doesn't stay like that and goes all the way to 1.386v when the cpu is at 4400mhz. I was wondering if I could use it to lower my temps... anybody with a strix board has insight on this?
I do not have the strix, but somewhat the same issue (BIOS shows correct vcore, HWmonitor/CPU-Z/AIDA64 and so on shows the "high" vcore) But I have significantly lowered temperatures by lowering vcore and disabling multicore enhancement.
 
Try putting in some insulating material between GPU and PSU? Like the foam packaging that came with the PSU. The back of the GPU does get pretty hot. Someone did it earlier and I tried it as well, although I have the SF600.

I know that solution, but I don't like that the GPU backplate is partly covered and heat isolated (the EVGA backplate gets very hot). I am going to test if this is the problem in my case the next days.
 
Oficially:

Height
From bottom of the PCIe-Slot to top: 144 mm

Width
Without backplate: 40 mm
Including backplate: 45 mm


Length
Complete card incl. bracket: 306 mm
Without bracket: 295 mm



Now, i have a MSI 980ti installed in my A4 which is 277 x 140 x 40. I can see some clearance left but will measure it and update.
 
I understand that it is normal for 1 core to run hotter than the rest but I am getting up to 16degree difference. Any advice???
 

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I understand that it is normal for 1 core to run hotter than the rest but I am getting up to 16degree difference. Any advice???

What cooler are you using? If it doesn't have known issues, then it's time to reseat the cooler. If that doesn't work, you either can decide to live with the issue or delid your processor.
 
Two questions:

Even if it was nearly unused, why remove the possibility for a drive there? Was it causing issues with noise / vibration?

Why use stamped standoffs? It's a tiny issue, but it means they couldn't be replaced with shorter ones if the (happily risk-taking) user wanted to.
 
1.) Because you can also use the drive bay to mount single drives.

2.) v1.0 use glued screwed stand offs. If you screw the motherboards screws too hard the stand offs will go out while unscrew the motherboard screws.

I have to use 7mm stand offs to be in ATX specs and left enough space for riser, m.2 ports and big cpu backplates.
 
V2 is underwelming. Considering all the feedback that has been given. No options for a taller heatsink... like alternate screw holes for mounting the motherboard plate deeper in the case to allow more space if using thinner gpu. Or something...

Even if it's not feasible at least the 3 following things should be IMO.

1)Fan mount Bellow motherboard
2)Fan mount above motherboard
3)Fan mount above psu.

That's not hard to implement. Don't care about ATX or mitx specs. Give us the choice.
 
I understand that it is normal for 1 core to run hotter than the rest but I am getting up to 16degree difference. Any advice???

I also have 15degree between two cores - both in my ncase with h100 and now in dancase with lp53+a9x14 - 4790k. :) will soon order deliddiemate2 and clu
 
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