DAN A4-SFX: The smallest gaming case in the world

Black5Lion

Limp Gawd
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Jan 1, 2013
Messages
325
Hey this is kind of off/on-topic:

I live in Saudi Arabia, but I order most of my computer parts from Amazon in the US and have it shipped to me (even after shipping it's cheaper than getting them here, not to mention there's not much of a selection locally).
I was thinking since Dan in not in the US, that means shipping to the US would be considered international.
I was wondering, would it be better to ship to US then to me, or straight to KSA? (The problem is if it's shipped straight to KSA, I don't know who's going to ship it. If it lands in the hands of the Saudi Post, I'm afraid I'll get it broken, if I get it at all.)
 

babadook

Weaksauce
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Jan 12, 2015
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98
As I understand, you could do all of these w/o going to retail, so you can start crowdfunding company at any time and send cases.
Where do you get that idea?

Dan is doing business out of Germany, thus he's bound by German law. Under German law, he's considered commercial. The A4 with its prototyping stage, a crowdfunding campaign and a volume of 300 cases would never be accepted a hobby.*

If he's commercial, he has to follow usual laws and regulations. If he doesn't, it's considered an unfair competitive advantage over other case vendors. And they can then send an "Abmahnung". That's a unique German legal construct, basically it's a cease-and-desist-and-pay-us-for-our-trouble letter.

*For reference:
Somebody sold off stuff from their grandma after she passed. About a hundred items or so. An antiques trader thought they were gaining an unfair advantage, because they didn't offer the usual 14-day-return policy. So they send an Abmahnung. The ebayers weren't accepting it and took it to court. The court found that selling about a hundred items in a month on eBay, even just once, should be considered commercial.

Another time, a private blog was considered commercial because they made like 5 bucks off Google ads.
 

Diverge

Gawd
Joined
Nov 22, 2005
Messages
536
Does Lian LI have options to handle the shipping? Drop shipping orders... then you wouldn't need to worry about all that stuff, since they'd have that covered. Didn't ncase m1's come that way?
 

CarbonVirus

Weaksauce
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May 9, 2007
Messages
66
First off I want to say I've been following this build since page 4 and I have to say: whatever the end product is, I will buy it smiling!
That said, I was wondering if I could dredge up the side panel design one more time. I remember seeing a user (sorry I have forgotten your name :( ) that had suggested placing a vertical snap piece at the back of the case above the PCI slots; this wouldn't work with large cooler cards which is why it was dismissed.
My suggestion is to place it BELOW the PCI slots (I am sorry for the horrible MS paint job I have done) as shown in the below image. This would allow you to not rely on screws for the side panel (as previously stated) and would allow for an overall cleaner case.
As for the mobo side of the case: there shouldn't be anything inhibiting an above or below placement as the I/O cutout should be the max hight allowed already.
Again, this is probably so late in the conversation that it will be overlooked/disregarded, but it would be amazing if @dondan were to take a look and consider it a possibly viable V2 addition (I am willing to pay an extra $50 just for this feature alone).
qUe1TC7.jpg
 

dondan

[H]ard|Gawd
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Apr 15, 2013
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1,751
The problem is not the GPU side, the real problem is the CPU side. You can't install the board if I make the back bend wider for the clip. Furthermore you can use the actual version also without screwing the panel. The sidepanels will move down for max 0.5mm without screws and will fit perfectly in every situation with screws.
E.g. I use the case without screwing the panels.
So as you can see it works very good with the actual solution and there is no need to changig it.
 
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CarbonVirus

Weaksauce
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May 9, 2007
Messages
66
You can't install the board if I make the back bend wider for the clip.
Would it be possible to to place the clip in the middle of the rear column for the Mobo side and only making the column wider for the clip where it is? That way it doesn't block the screws. Or is it an issue with inserting the motherboard into the space itself? If that is the case, I have had cases that I had to rotate the board into position to fit it into the case; would that be a viable option?
Sorry if this is redundant. :(
Either way, with the clips at the front of the case it would seem you could get away with a single screw in each side (in the further back position in the latest prototype); I would most likely just replace the included screws with thumb screws and be perfectly content.
Thanks for the reply @dondan, glad to see you care!
 

Xan-Z

Weaksauce
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Jun 11, 2015
Messages
89
Well, this seems the perfect case for an itx build. I just love this concept.

I'm getting hyped with this project and i want to thank you so much for all the effort.

U are doing an incredible job with this case!

I just sing on the forum mostly for this case, i'm waiting for the crowdfunding phase,

but take ur time, u need it!

:D
 

AxMi-24

n00b
Joined
Feb 12, 2015
Messages
9
As I understand, you could do all of these w/o going to retail, so you can start crowdfunding company at any time and send cases. When you ready to go retail you could go retail. I mean that this processes not tied to each other.

Please, please, please make a NAS one. 10 hotswap (lian Li has them) places would be awesome :)
 

Black5Lion

Limp Gawd
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Jan 1, 2013
Messages
325
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goodbyegalaxy

Weaksauce
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Jan 7, 2015
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116
https://youtu.be/w02VXo4cBm0?t=8m3s

Someone's taken inspiration. It's not quite the same, but I'm glad someone realized having the GPU parallel to the motherboard saves space.

Interesting motherboard placement - a huge disadvantage with that is that the CPU doesn't have direct access to cool air outside the case. It also looks like it would be harder to work with; you'd have to remove the video card any time you wanted to do anything.
 

Aibohphobia

[H]ard|Gawd
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Nov 16, 2013
Messages
1,340
Someone's taken inspiration. It's not quite the same, but I'm glad someone realized having the GPU parallel to the motherboard saves space.

Dondan wasn't the first to come up with this layout, DrakonSan proposed something similar back in November 2013 (here's my mockup of his layout idea) and I'm not sure that's the very first instance of this layout either.

Not knocking Dondan in any way though, there's only so many ways to arrange parts without going custom everything.
 

Aircoookie

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 6, 2015
Messages
375
Hello guys,

we all can't wait to get our hands on an A4, so I basically turned on my 3D printer and printed a shrinked down version, the ACD A4-DUE. It's 1/3 the size and fits an Arduino Due microcontroller board. You can find out more on my website:
http://acdev.jimdo.com/acd-a4-due/
Please note that this is a parody, please don't take it seriously! :)
image.jpg

@Necere well they ripped off Dans design and took your case name :( jk, thats actually funny :D A4 is still better, not that stupid plastic gaming look and proper PSU support...
 

iFreilicht

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 23, 2014
Messages
1,348
The MSI case doesn't even have the board flipped so the CPU is going to get boiling hot in there unless they have a clever solution for airflow.
Also it seems to be quite large. 1U PSU at the bottom increases the height of the case as compared to the A4 quite a bit. Not sure if it's even smaller than the real M1.

To be fair about the naming, so often has the scheme of one to two letters plus one to two numbers been used, so you may give them the benefit of the doubt and say that it was a coincidence.
 

wreckem

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Nov 12, 2011
Messages
113
The MSI case doesn't even have the board flipped so the CPU is going to get boiling hot in there unless they have a clever solution for airflow.
Also it seems to be quite large. 1U PSU at the bottom increases the height of the case as compared to the A4 quite a bit. Not sure if it's even smaller than the real M1.

To be fair about the naming, so often has the scheme of one to two letters plus one to two numbers been used, so you may give them the benefit of the doubt and say that it was a coincidence.

Case naming/numbering is eventually going to end up like how it is with cars.
 

Black5Lion

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
325
Dondan wasn't the first to come up with this layout, DrakonSan proposed something similar back in November 2013 (here's my mockup of his layout idea) and I'm not sure that's the very first instance of this layout either.

Not knocking Dondan in any way though, there's only so many ways to arrange parts without going custom everything.
Yeah I know, I the first time I saw this layout was some dude over on OCN. I meant they're the first company to take inspiration.
That's strange, they already have a M8 so they're going backwards :rolleyes:
I think it's ASRock that have the M8 ;)
 

DrakonSan

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Feb 8, 2005
Messages
340
Dondan wasn't the first to come up with this layout, DrakonSan proposed something similar back in November 2013 (here's my mockup of his layout idea) and I'm not sure that's the very first instance of this layout either.

Not knocking Dondan in any way though, there's only so many ways to arrange parts without going custom everything.
I totally didn't influence the A4 in the general direction of the design I wanted... not at all! :D
<3 u Dondan
 

dondan

[H]ard|Gawd
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Apr 15, 2013
Messages
1,751
Looks like MSI using a radial fan for the cpu. The U1 psu will be also not very quiet. The design is ok but looks a bit cheap. I think the volume is arround 10-12L. The real advantage is the optical drive. By the way he first one with this design was LiHeat early 2013. They have also the patent for this design in China. But I got the ok from the to use it also for china.

5efb3e3b-5afc-4fc3-b67d-addafc3718a5_01_201300013717_L.jpg


@Aircooki: The arduino case you made is very cool thank you for this tribute.
 
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Ca11idus

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 9, 2012
Messages
495
Dondan, what is the normal wait time for the electronic waste certification?

"In Germany dataserv operates a nationwide compliance scheme (“Systembetreiber”) under the German WEEE regulations (“ElektroG”) and all recycling facilities are licensed waste facilities and also certified Waste Specialists under the German law (“Entsorgungsfachbetrieb”) which includes a European-wide waste broker license for a wide range of waste codes."

Is this what you have to abide by?
 

Xan-Z

Weaksauce
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Messages
89
SFX psu: Three (3) 2.5'' hard drives
SFX-L psu: Two (2) 2.5'' hard drives.

Right?
 

Ca11idus

Limp Gawd
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Jan 9, 2012
Messages
495
Well, Cpu is here, system is built and I just need to install an OS to test the temps. I know someone asked if the Dynatron T318 would interfere with the m.2 sata and the answer is now. The only problem is that the base of the cooler's lip will touch the heatsink on the ram sticks so it will push on them a little. Idle temps are 27-30C

(my incredible photography skills make it look like the ram sticks are touching...they are not, the bend is slight)



All in all I'm looking forward to seeing how this little puppy performs. I also jumped the pwr button to start her up and it booted just fine.

 
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Skelett666

n00b
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Mar 2, 2015
Messages
18
The MSI case doesn't even have the board flipped so the CPU is going to get boiling hot in there unless they have a clever solution for airflow.
Also it seems to be quite large. 1U PSU at the bottom increases the height of the case as compared to the A4 quite a bit. Not sure if it's even smaller than the real M1.

It's got a 350W PSU. Useless.

The real advantage is the optical drive.

The real advantage is the power led! :D
 

Black5Lion

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
325
Well, Cpu is here, system is built and I just need to install an OS to test the temps. I know someone asked if the Dynatron T318 would interfere with the m.2 sata and the answer is now. The only problem is that the base of the cooler's lip will touch the heatsink on the ram sticks so it will push on them a little. Idle temps are 27-30C

(my incredible photography skills make it look like the ram sticks are touching...they are not, the bend is slight)


All in all I'm looking forward to seeing how this little puppy performs. I also jumped the pwr button to start her up and it booted just fine.

Awesome!
Can't wait for results! :D
 

Mackan

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
379
Well, Cpu is here, system is built and I just need to install an OS to test the temps. I know someone asked if the Dynatron T318 would interfere with the m.2 sata and the answer is now. The only problem is that the base of the cooler's lip will touch the heatsink on the ram sticks so it will push on them a little. Idle temps are 27-30C

(my incredible photography skills make it look like the ram sticks are touching...they are not, the bend is slight)



All in all I'm looking forward to seeing how this little puppy performs. I also jumped the pwr button to start her up and it booted just fine.


I'm very interested in seeing how it performs. Do you think the system can be quiet? Or maybe that fan needs to be on 2000rpm to cool the Dynatron.
 
D

Deleted member 222586

Guest
So, when is the crowdfunding campaign launching? I hope in a few weeks 'cause I'm saving :)
 

Xan-Z

Weaksauce
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Jun 11, 2015
Messages
89
I'm waiting to the crowdfunding phase too,

i want to build my first mini itx computer rig but we must be patient!
 

Ca11idus

Limp Gawd
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Jan 9, 2012
Messages
495
Here's the result of an hour of OCCT.



CPU has a slight overclock to 3.75Ghz running at 1v and the memory is running at its rated 3000mhz. Temps peaked at 76.5 from 74 degrees when I decided to place my hand directly above the fan for a few seconds at around 40 minutes in.

I did try running it at 4Ghz but it hit OCCT's thermal limit of 87C in a matter of 5 minutes. The motherboard also set the vcore at 1.2v when left on auto so I bumped it down to 1.1v and then 1v. I might run some more tests with a slightly lower voltage at a later time. Right now I think I'm just going to wait till the Dan A4 is ready or probably get a temp case before I do anymore screwdriver jumped power on.
 

Ca11idus

Limp Gawd
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Messages
495
Oh, almost forgot. Idle temps are in the low 40s during low cpu load usage/web browsing. I think the OCCT readings of 35-38C were right after the test as I let the temps settle down. The psu is dead silent with no ticking or any odd noises (YES!) and the gamerstorm 120x20mm fan sounds like it's pushing a lot of air. Not too noisy...maybe comparable to a corsair sp120 at around 80%.
 

Black5Lion

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
325
Here's the result of an hour of OCCT.


CPU has a slight overclock to 3.75Ghz running at 1v and the memory is running at its rated 3000mhz. Temps peaked at 76.5 from 74 degrees when I decided to place my hand directly above the fan for a few seconds at around 40 minutes in.

I did try running it at 4Ghz but it hit OCCT's thermal limit of 87C in a matter of 5 minutes. The motherboard also set the vcore at 1.2v when left on auto so I bumped it down to 1.1v and then 1v. I might run some more tests with a slightly lower voltage at a later time. Right now I think I'm just going to wait till the Dan A4 is ready or probably get a temp case before I do anymore screwdriver jumped power on.

Oh, almost forgot. Idle temps are in the low 40s during low cpu load usage/web browsing. I think the OCCT readings of 35-38C were right after the test as I let the temps settle down. The psu is dead silent with no ticking or any odd noises (YES!) and the gamerstorm 120x20mm fan sounds like it's pushing a lot of air. Not too noisy...maybe comparable to a corsair sp120 at around 80%.

Good to know it works! :D
Thanks for the test! You just reassured me :)

I'm thinking I'll put a 5820k + Fury in my A4 :D

One more thing just to be extra sure, the PSU you're using is the SX500-LG right?
Hmm, we need a short version of the A4 for the AMD Fury Nano :)

Where would the PSU go? Unless you're talking external like the original A4.
 

Ca11idus

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 9, 2012
Messages
495
It is a SX500-LG.

The psu can set up like the kimera nova's psu placement but that would only make it a few inches shorter at best. That, or, the gpu riser could be moved up a bit and you could try and fit a server class psu like the found in the hadron. But that's too much work and it might just be better to redisgn the whole case for size.
 

LTHB

n00b
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Jun 8, 2015
Messages
2
You can design a A4-SFX-GPUSFX for SFX GPUs at 6.67 L by flipping the GPU 90°.
However it would be ~129 mm wide and therefore support CPU coolers up to 63 mm in height.
 
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