Cyborg R.A.T. Mouse

Hi guys,

Just an update for you all, I got the RAT 7 for christmas, and I felt I should give you my fisrst impressions.

Gorgeous piece of kit, certainly not flimsy, and very well built. Does not feel plastcy at all, and is very heavy (Im used to a first gen diamondback. I may remove the weights to couter this.

I recieved a pinkie rest WITH a teflon pad, and I get no lag while it syncs when I lift and put down, although the cursor does jump down and to the right. I'm using the control side of the razor exact mat.

When using the speed side, the sync issue DOES occur. It takes about half a second for the mouse to respond when it is put back on the mat from lift.

Hope this helps some of you.
 
Just a couple of things....

I do indeed have the lift problem....but don't see it as an issue because I rarely have to lift my mouse.

Second thing....the wireless interferes with my speakers and sends a INSANELY annoying high pitched buzzing over my speakers. I have a set of budget logitech speakers (2.1) however never had this issue before. It is most definitely the mouse as I can easily play jingle bells in a high pitched buzz by moving the mouse.

I haven't tried putting a ferrite collar on the speaker volume wire or moved it to the other side of my desk...but damn it is annoying...I have to turn off my speakers or I get a major headache.
 
Really looking forward reading from somebody having used the R.A.T 9 for more than a week, if possible =P... don't know you, but I'm not going to pay a hundred bucks for a mouse that gets unresponssive / displaces to the southeast / is proven to have a crappy sensor / etc so easily.

I mean, ''hi I'm Logitech G9, I'm around $30 cheaper and proven to have great quality and good lookingness''
 
Odrackyir, I've had my RAT9 for a couple weeks now, And it is very responsive (This is very subjective btw). I've had no problems with the cursor moving around (I'm using a black cooler master CM storm pad atm).

There are a few things that piss me off though. The thumb scroll wheel has a "sticky" spot, Which gets hard to turn and makes me miss my keybind sometimes D: The batteries can be a real bastard to get out of the mouse and the charger base, You have to grip and pull so hard, It feels like you're going to break something. Once i stuck a fully charged battery in, And it read it as @ 13% capacity and started blinking, So i reinserted it a couple times, and zing 100%...WTF! I have to replace the batteries about once a day...the 9 hours of battery life is BS btw, I'm not sure exacty how long it lasts, Depends on what you're doing i guess. And last but not least the pad on the bottom of the "big" pinky rest attachment apparently does not line up with the other pads, And makes a scraping feeling on my mouse pad......SOOOOOO aside from all that crap, yeh it's a pretty good mouse.
 
Just a couple of things....
I do indeed have the lift problem....but don't see it as an issue because I rarely have to lift my mouse......

Well, to me, the lifting issue is a HUGE FRAKKIN' PROBLEM! I mean, it's a GAMING mouse for gawd's sake. If you're playing a game, then you're gonna be lifting the mouse.

I just can't believe someone makes a 'gaming' mouse and it has this lifting issue. It defies all common sense and logic. The Cyborg team responsible for this oversight should be forced to play FPS games 24/7/365 using this crappy mouse. It's just unreal that a product like this could make it all the way through development and into the marketplace.

When they fix the lifting issue, then I'll be a buyer. Until then, I'll be a complainer. :mad:

-
 
The problem I have is that i cant get myself to sell the one I have . I just wouldn't feel right selling a mouse that may or may not work for that person. I guess it would be dependent on what mouse pad they had
 
I've had this mouse for a couple of days now and so far I haven't noticed the lifting issue, but it does move about a quarter inch towards the bottom of the screen but every mouse I've ever owned has done that. I'm using a cheap freebie razer mouse pad, and there is only one spot it won't track correctly on (were it has the razer logo in white against black) but it's in the corner so I don't ever go over it while gaming. Lastly the only gripe I have is the software for one is kinda difficult to use and get set up and every time I restart I have to go in and manually reload the profile I created. But besides those few problems I think it's a great mouse.
 
Wacko117, Go down in your taskbar click the cyborg icon then right click on your profile, And choose "set as startup profile".
 
Okay, so is this all on the same desk? I'm wondering if your desktop if creating a vibration effect (you have got a lot of powerful kit in there) that is being picked up by the mouse? Where is your desktop case situated? On the desk or under it? Does moving the case so it's not in contact with the desk make any difference?

Or am I barking up the wrong tree here?

The case is on top of the desk and pretty much about 20cm away from where the mouse pad is ... If there was a vibration effecting the mouse would it not effect my G500 aswell and the X8?

I have had PCCG accept an RA so its not in my house anymore but I am also unable to recall wether I tried the mouse on the pad near the desktop while plugged into the laptop so I cant say if that was an issue or not ...

I guess just have to wait and see if it does come back as faulty or if not might have to move my setup around to acoomodate for these new PTE mice ...

Thanks for replies tho mate
 
This is a follow up post for my Rat 7 after a few months of use and wanted to add some insight regarding my experience with the hot topics here...

Rocking/click movement:
I had to "bend" the thumb pad a bit until all the feet were perfectly level. Kind of lame, I know, but now there is no extraneous movement or rocking. I believe I had to bend the forward edge downward. Perfectly stable. I am not using the pinky shelf, but am glad to hear it has a slider now.

Lifting:
I've changed the way I lift the mouse. By lifting the front of the mouse first (by just a little bit), the drift is minimized and is now undetectable, even in fast paced FPS.

Axis lockup:
I have only really experienced this once, and it was after the computer had been running for weeks on end. It happened twice for a split second, but I can't recreate it. Also, the mouse has been hit with static discharge about half a dozen times as the winters here in Denver tend to leave the air very dry. A quick unplug/plug in resolved the lockup and it hasn't come back since.

Accuracy:
After getting accustomed to the unique shape and fine tuning the ratio between Windows pointer speed and Rat 7 axis speeds, I'm very happy with the accuracy compared to my G9x. I'd now say the Rat 7 is on par with the G9x. Both mice feel best with Windows pointer speed turned down to 20-30%, and higher mouse sensor sensitivity (4000dpi+). This is with a 1920x1080 resolution, settings will vary at different res.

Tray Icons:
I understand the Cyborg icon, but why the hell is this mouse appearing under the "Safely Remove Hardware" icon??? Nobody responded the last time I asked his question so I'll pose it again.
 
<snip>

Lifting:
I've changed the way I lift the mouse. By lifting the front of the mouse first (by just a little bit), the drift is minimized and is now undetectable, even in fast paced FPS.

<snip>

Accuracy:
After getting accustomed to the unique shape and fine tuning the ratio between Windows pointer speed and Rat 7 axis speeds, I'm very happy with the accuracy compared to my G9x. I'd now say the Rat 7 is on par with the G9x. Both mice feel best with Windows pointer speed turned down to 20-30%, and higher mouse sensor sensitivity (4000dpi+). This is with a 1920x1080 resolution, settings will vary at different res.

<snip>

At 4000+ dpi on a non eyefinity resolution (1920 x 1080) why would you ever need to lift? Just curious.
 
Habit? I used to be a high-sens gamer a few years ago and I would re-center the mouse given the opportunity. Bad if you're caught off-guard, probably should have tried to break that habit.
 
I lift mostly out of old habit and some slight OCD tendencies.

According to Razer's site, I use a "fingertip" grip style. The base of my palm rarely moves, and the edges of my pinky finger and ring fingertip touch the mouse surface for positional reference. I'm 6'1 and have rather large hands.

Turning down the windows sensitivity to a low setting improves the sub-pixel accuracy within the OS, but kills overall speed.

I compensate by turning up the mouse sensor sensitivity to a very high level. It helps maintain a nice responsive cursor speed, but (thanks to the windows speed being so low) still maintains sub-pixel accuracy (great for Photoshop).

I'm not using the high sensitivity to achieve screen-wide coverage in 1/2" of physical mouse movement. My settings require approximately 1.5" to cover 1920 pixels.
 
I have the rat 3 and in OS X sometimes the cursor flies off to one side when lifting the mouse. Why is this?
 
How high is the lift of tracking for everyone? I like the design of this mouse but I hate mice that track too far off the surface as I pick my mouse up a lot.
 
When I lift up, it isn't anymore than my Logitech G7. It will move the cursor up and to the left about 100 pixels.
The battery life on the RAT9 is not great, about a 1 day worth of gaming. Worse than the battery life is trying to get the stupid battery out to change it. I can't get my fat fingers in it without removing the palm rest all together. Even then its a pain. Getting it out of the charger also a pain.
 
rebel if you pick up your mouse alot you will hate the rat. the sensor is infamous for the lift problem (lift and replace displaces it to the right.
 
Finally a decent, very detailed video review of the R.A.T 9. Enjoy :) :

Saitek Cyborg R.A.T.9

I have to say there are few things about this guys review I disagree.
1. The thumb scroll wheel on my sucks. it is very hard to hit unless I lift my hand and its incredibly stiff. I think it is useless, and the one on the MxRevolution is 100 times better.
2. Its really not that large. I don't have giant hands I take a size large glove and its not big enough. Its a little bit smaller and not nearly as ergonomically shaped as the Revolution.
3. The pinkie rest I sort of agree, but the mouse isn't actually large enough, so I use my ring finger on it, which I like, and I actually put my pinkie UNDER the raised area to give myself a little extra control. Here is an idea...if you don't like it..it is removable! It doesn't even come attached from the factory.
4. That click tracking problem he has...is absolutely not a problem on mine. He must have gotten a bad one. I have tried to duplicate it for half an hour and it's fine.
5. Never had any issues with the level-ness of the feet.
6. The mouse does go to sleep, however a single click revives it within a second. This is slightly annoying but I can't imagine how bad battery life would be without it.

Things I agree...
1. Battery life sucks
2. pinkie rest isn't really a pinkie rest but I like it as a index finger rest
3. getting the battery out is a huge pain. you do have to remove the palm rest.
4. If you rest your hand on the mouse, he is right there isn't a great deal of support. If you are used to the high curved arch of a logitech mouse then you might be disappointed.

The only other thing people have talked about...which I have seen is the lifting issue. When you lift the mouse it does move the cursor. However....I have tested this on every optical mouse I have and I get some movement on every one. All but one are Logitech, the G7, MxRevolution, Mx1000, and a Mx600. The higher the dpi of the mouse the more the movement. The Rat9 is the highest, followed by the G7, the mx 1000 an mx revolution are about the same and the of the logitechs the 600 is the least. The one that has next to no movement is a mouse I got as a spare with a $15 mouse/keyboard/speaker kit from newegg.

I think this guy hates this mouse...because he got a defective one not because it is a bad mouse.
 
I have to say there are few things about this guys review I disagree.
1. The thumb scroll wheel on my sucks. it is very hard to hit unless I lift my hand and its incredibly stiff. I think it is useless, and the one on the MxRevolution is 100 times better.
2. Its really not that large. I don't have giant hands I take a size large glove and its not big enough. Its a little bit smaller and not nearly as ergonomically shaped as the Revolution.
3. The pinkie rest I sort of agree, but the mouse isn't actually large enough, so I use my ring finger on it, which I like, and I actually put my pinkie UNDER the raised area to give myself a little extra control. Here is an idea...if you don't like it..it is removable! It doesn't even come attached from the factory.
4. That click tracking problem he has...is absolutely not a problem on mine. He must have gotten a bad one. I have tried to duplicate it for half an hour and it's fine.
5. Never had any issues with the level-ness of the feet.
6. The mouse does go to sleep, however a single click revives it within a second. This is slightly annoying but I can't imagine how bad battery life would be without it.

Things I agree...
1. Battery life sucks
2. pinkie rest isn't really a pinkie rest but I like it as a index finger rest
3. getting the battery out is a huge pain. you do have to remove the palm rest.
4. If you rest your hand on the mouse, he is right there isn't a great deal of support. If you are used to the high curved arch of a logitech mouse then you might be disappointed.

The only other thing people have talked about...which I have seen is the lifting issue. When you lift the mouse it does move the cursor. However....I have tested this on every optical mouse I have and I get some movement on every one. All but one are Logitech, the G7, MxRevolution, Mx1000, and a Mx600. The higher the dpi of the mouse the more the movement. The Rat9 is the highest, followed by the G7, the mx 1000 an mx revolution are about the same and the of the logitechs the 600 is the least. The one that has next to no movement is a mouse I got as a spare with a $15 mouse/keyboard/speaker kit from newegg.

I think this guy hates this mouse...because he got a defective one not because it is a bad mouse.


As far as the lifting issue or z-tracking problem goes, you will likely only notice it with the Philips Twin-Eye sensor; Logitech mice don't have this problem because (4 now) they all relly on Avago sensors, which in the g9x and maybe the g700 and in the Roccat Kone[+] perform basically flawless, due to good implementation and driver optimisation.

As for your consideration on points 4. and 5. (which imho, are to be considered major design/production flaws, because theoretically permanent once product is assembled) that you don't agree, I would like to remember the fact that this mouse is aimed at a pretty selected tipe of users, since average gamers will not spend 90 cash (or euros) on a mouse;
with that in mind, models that come with these problems should be as rare as a nun in a bikini! To make things even worse the rat 7 also had these same issues, therefor basically zero issues fixed on this new model...I think it's just frustrating as hell.

Now I know what you might wanna say "Well it's not like other brands/companies release perfect 0 flaws gaming peripherals on the market all the time..." Well that's also true...but the R.A.T line of mice, as far as I understand, is the result of 3 brands/companies : Saitek, CyborgGaming and MadCatz ...so what could I say? Hey, if this is what their "team work" has to offer...I AM NOT IMPRESSED ...pretty awesome ideas and concept on the paper, I'll give you that...but somethin got quite f*cked up on the way from the drawing board to the shelfs.
 
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Logitech mice don't have this problem because (4 now) they all relly on Avago sensors, which in the g9x and maybe the g700 and in the Roccat Kone[+] perform basically flawless, due to good implementation and driver optimisation.
I hear what you are saying here, but my experience with all 4 of my logitech mice does tell me differently. Lifting the G7, MX-Revolution, MX1000 and MX600 as straight up and down as I possibly can all result in some cursor displacement. Whether this is my inability to lift the mice straight up or sensor issues, I honestly can't be sure. I am certainly willing to say it is me...if it is however then a I would also have to say that the same cursor movement in the rat 9 is at least partially my fault. It wouldn't explain why the cursor on the craptastic bargain mouse had no lift issues...but hey. Either way it is not an issue for me because quite honestly I am not good enough at games that I would even notice the 50-100 pixel cursor shift in game. That coupled with the fact I can easily scroll across all three of my screens (5280px) on a single swipe without lifting make this a moot issue...for me. Other people it may be a deal breaker.

As for your consideration on points 4. and 5. (which imho, are to be considered major design/production flaws, because theoretically permanent once product is assembled) that you don't agree
Actually I would agree that those are major flaws. I guess I wasn't aware that this was a widespread issue with the R.A.T.x series. My disagreement was based on the product that I actually have was not flawed in this manner and because I thought his was a more isolated case. The QC issues are there in the mouse I have though. Watching the video and seeing how easily his thumb scroll wheel spins it is apparent mine is defective and wasn't designed that way.

Bottom line based on the product I have and have been using for a month, I am pretty happy with this mouse, I find it comfortable responsive and the two major flaws, the thumb wheel and the battery issues are livable. I guess I am happy I got the apparently "rare" good one. Would I re-spend $90 on this mouse after having used it for a month....and guaranteeing I would get a "good one"....yes I would.
 
After adjustment, how small is the RAT 7 compared to other gaming mice? Basically how small can it go?

Below are mice I've used recently. Most palm style mice are to tall and long for me. The G9x was almost spot but the mouse wheel too hard to click. That brings up the question is the mouse wheel of the RAT 7 easy to click? The Xai was good to but I didn't like the tracking in FPS.
Logitech g9x, G500
Razer Deathadder, Lachesis, Imperator
Steelseries Xai, Ikari optical
 
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After adjustment, how small is the RAT 7 compared to other gaming mice? Basically how small can it go?

Below are mice I've used recently. Most palm style mice are to tall and long for me. The G9x was almost spot but the mouse wheel too hard to click. That brings up the question is the mouse wheel of the RAT 7 easy to click? The Xai was good to but I didn't like the tracking in FPS.
Logitech g9x, G500
Razer Deathadder, Lachesis, Imperator
Steelseries Xai, Ikari optical

You can adjust it to be extremely small. Smaller than any other desktop mouse I've used. I have small hands and most mice are way too big. I tried a deathadder and it was almost unusable. I'm using my RAT7 on the second smallest length setting and it's perfect. The width can't adjust nearly as small which makes it look kind of weird shaped, but it's still very comfortable.

The wheel is a tiny bit stiffer than most mice. Not enough to make it hard to click, but a little more than necessary to keep it from being clicked accidentally.
 
Hello.. I've been following this thread for a long time, and I am really interested in this mouse. However I do acknowledge about the issues, but I have seen Mad Catz's attempt at fixing those.
This review by Kitguru was published yesterday, and it has some interesting pictures. From there I see a teflon pad beneath the pinky rest, which fixes the wobbling problem. There is also a ring around the twin eye laser, and I think that's also what razer did with their products? Not sure about that, but I do really want to see an user review of this revision which supposedly fixes most, if not all the issues.
 
Hello.. I've been following this thread for a long time, and I am really interested in this mouse. However I do acknowledge about the issues, but I have seen Mad Catz's attempt at fixing those.
This review by Kitguru was published yesterday, and it has some interesting pictures. From there I see a teflon pad beneath the pinky rest, which fixes the wobbling problem. There is also a ring around the twin eye laser, and I think that's also what razer did with their products? Not sure about that, but I do really want to see an user review of this revision which supposedly fixes most, if not all the issues.

The pad under the pinky rest is new. The pad around the laser is not, and in fact is part of the problem. The adhesive for the pad picks up hair and dust which interferes with the sensor. I have to clean mine off regularly.
 
So yours has the pad around the laser? Does it actually help with the z-axis tracking?
 
Well this is going to be interesting. I saw this mouse, thought it looked cool. Touched one in a local computer store (The salesman didn't really want to open the package for me, but did after some insisting on my part). And since they had a 30 dollar rebate, decided to go for it. I had to order it as they no longer had any in stock, but I'll be sure to post my thoughts on the mouse. (I ordered along with it the Cyborg v5 solid aluminium gaming surface, but I've got a softer pad as well, so I'll see if the tracking issues hold for both pads or not.

I'm glad the store has a 30 day return policy (just in case, but I really hope that I don't have to use it.)
 
2. Its really not that large. I don't have giant hands I take a size large glove and its not big enough. Its a little bit smaller and not nearly as ergonomically shaped as the Revolution.
Are you using the Revolution full time then? I don't have giant hands either but I do wear large gloves and really liked the size of the MX1000 back in the day. Trying to find a replacement and was looking at the RAT though there's been a lot of negative feedback for a $150 mouse (I'd get the 9 if I were to buy one) so I probably won't buy the RAT. Just looking for what other folks with larger hands do.
 
I had to order it as they no longer had any in stock, but I'll be sure to post my thoughts on the mouse. (I ordered along with it the Cyborg v5 solid aluminium gaming surface, but I've got a softer pad as well, so I'll see if the tracking issues hold for both pads or not.
I'm interested to see if you have any compatibility issues with the Cyborg v5 gaming surface. I haven't been able to find a list of compatible mouse pads/gaming surfaces. My Icemat and old Func Industries mats don't work with the RAT7 (the Icemat is useless with this mouse). I've been using my bare desktop with no issues.

I wanted to get another mouse for work, but for that desk I'd need a pad/gaming surface. I wouldn't mind getting the Cyborg v3 gaming surface, and they SHOULD be compatible considering the "Cyborg" line, but I've learned that you can't really take marketing at face value.

Let us know how your Cyborg v5 gamins surface works with your RAT mouse.
 
Are you using the Revolution full time then? I don't have giant hands either but I do wear large gloves and really liked the size of the MX1000 back in the day. Trying to find a replacement and was looking at the RAT though there's been a lot of negative feedback for a $150 mouse (I'd get the 9 if I were to buy one) so I probably won't buy the RAT. Just looking for what other folks with larger hands do.
I am using the rat9 full time at home. I have and still use the MX1000 at work. I really think the MX1000 is my favorite mouse of all time. It is a really comfy mouse, has amazing battery life (minimum 5 days) and has a good heft to it. I have the MX-Revolution at home, and still use that on my Hackintosh. I am getting used to the rat9, or have gotten used to it I should say. I really am not a fan of the software included with it. I find that logitech's setpoint is much easier and more intuitive to use. One thing, I don't tend to rest my hand on the mouse, I rest my palm on a gel wrist rest and tend to maneuver the mouse with pinkie/ring finger on the right and thumb on the left. If you rest your hand on the mouse and take a size large glove I think the rat will actually be too small/not supportive enough.
I will take a couple of pictures comparing it to the MX-revolution...which is a bit smaller than the MX1000, but not much so.
 
ok...pictures. I am sorry about the craptastic over-exposed camera phone pictures. It's what was handy. Also sorry about the rather disgusting appearance of my desk and mouse. Doesn't look that bad to me in person...but...ewww...going to break out the cleaning supplies after I post this.
In all of these pictures the rat9 really does look larger than the mx-rev. The wings on the side certainly make it wider, and the sliding palm rest make it longer, but it really does feel much smaller because there is no arch. Anyway...pictures for those that might care.
rat-1.jpg

rat-2.jpg

rat-3.jpg

rat-4.jpg

rat-5.jpg
 
I'm interested to see if you have any compatibility issues with the Cyborg v5 gaming surface. I haven't been able to find a list of compatible mouse pads/gaming surfaces. My Icemat and old Func Industries mats don't work with the RAT7 (the Icemat is useless with this mouse). I've been using my bare desktop with no issues.

I wanted to get another mouse for work, but for that desk I'd need a pad/gaming surface. I wouldn't mind getting the Cyborg v3 gaming surface, and they SHOULD be compatible considering the "Cyborg" line, but I've learned that you can't really take marketing at face value.

Let us know how your Cyborg v5 gamins surface works with your RAT mouse.

Sorry for taking so long, I had to get my rat9 to work with ubuntu, ( a difficulty with the mod button being mapped as 3 separate keys, it makes sense to have it done this way, just not for ubuntu.)

Anyways, the v5 works great unfortunatley I find it flexes a bit ( > 0.5mm) so if I put a few fingers on the "rat9" logo and push, the pointer wiggles a bit. Keep in mind this is not a realistic thing to do with a mouse, so I don't think it very effective. I have a feeling that I will only be using the "fast" red side, so I might take the rubber feet on the red side, and place them on the blue side to try and reduce the minimal flex.

As for the mouse, it seems to work well with my I think claw grip. (I keep my palm more or less in the same place, and let my fingers move the mouse.

I'll put up more thoughts on the mouse in a few days after I've used it for a bit.
 
After killing my 6 year old Microsoft Explorer mouse, I bought the R.A.T. 7, and absolutely love it.
However, it does get a bit funky. When using it on my wood desk, occasionally the cursor will only move up and down, and I have to lift it up a few times for it to work again. Never had that problem in a game.
The side scroll wheel on mine doesn't work, annoying because I paid for it, but I don't use it so its not an issue.

The other problem is that the mouse is very flat. I have to take the palm rest and screw driver off the mouse to make it fit my smallish hands right.

Whenever I go to a LAN, everybody trys it out and changes it up, they love it. I would recommend the second generation if they fix the sensor issues.
 
I just want to quickly say that I was given the RAT7 at Quakecon 2010, and it is the best mouse I have ever used. I do wish that some of the better features of the logitech mice would have carried over, but I understand that they are different manufacturers. The customization is incredible, and i seriously have become very dangerous in many games that I sucked at. It is a natural pointer, and your "snap shot" accuracy can be incredible. The pinky rest is invaluable. It makes the mouse IMO.
 
I tried a Rat 7 briefly at Microcenter in Richardson TX. It didn't have any tracking issues or anything with it. The thing feels odd in the hand though. I wasn't wild about all the button locations, but it's nice. I noticed a lot of room for adjustments but I didn't get a chance to mess around with it too much.
 
I just got this mouse, but I'm having trouble downloading the software from the website. It'll download very slow, taking 15-20 minutes, then freeze at 57.3/57.3mb.
 
I'm also having a problem where after a minute or so, my windows pointer speed setting keeps moving back to default (5), but I want it down two clicks to 3.

Solution?
 
All the small and miscellaneous problems I'm seeing in these threads about this mouse, shouldn't be happening with something which should be as simple as well..........a mouse. In my short time with one of these, just messing around on a display computer at Microcenter, I didn't really experience these issues but living with one of these things and spending five minutes or less with one are different.

The only thing I can confirm is that the lifting problem wasn't a problem for me.
 
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