Cryptocurrency Prices Plummet Even More

PeaKr said:
You can blather on for paragraphs but it doesn't change the facts. Maybe you believe in Fake Facts or Fantasy Economics. Currencies around the globe are losing value, especially in emerging markets. The $ has lost 98% of its value, the same as Rome before its collapse. The $'s been trending down since being taken off the gold standard, a much better anchor of trust than some nebulous FULL FAITH horseshit. CPI doesn't mean anything to the common person. Prices of things you need to live are skyrocketing while prices of shit you don't need like electronics go down. Need examples? Remember how big a box of cheerios was in the 80's for that matter what about groceries in general, maybe your not old enough. What about the cost of HEALTHCARE, remember 4$ gas, the cost of running a website, internet, car insurance? I remember 1$ gas, 35$ shoes and Levis that didn't wear out in 6 months. I still have a pair, much thicker than todays jeans. These trends do not favor your argument. Maybe you make enough money that it doesnt matter. Wait till the real estate market rolls over, surprise, its in ANOTHER bubble and surprise, sub prime mortg are showing up again. For most people, watching their house lose 30-40% of its value like in the late aughts will hurt them for decades and push back their retirements. Once the wealth of the middle class has been pilfered the mob will come for the rich. Interest rates on bank accounts don't even come close to making up for the mandated 2% inflation target, which destroys savers or forces them into risk assets to be robbed by 10% draw downs. Most of these asset bubbles have been created by the idiots who caused the problems in the first place, their answer, print mo money and blow mo bubbles. Is that your answer, it won't work when the average joe hasn't had a raise in years or their jobs been replaced by automation. What about the stock market? Stock buybacks and non-gaap earnings are the order of the day, you don't even need a fucking product anymore. Just issue some junk bonds like GE and buy your own stock up, it looks great on cnn and the exects and holders get rich, not sustainable. Intel just announced another 15B stock buyback. What do you think is going to happen when the next financial crisis occurs compounded by all this debt? Who will bail out the CBs and what will be the cost because this time around it'll take a lot more than 200T. Do you even know why BTC was created in the first place? I suspect NOT. So bury your head in the sand, blow your trumpet and rally your fans but the sun rises in the east, every day, FACT!
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Sigh. Check your rage before it wrecks you, I made no directed personal attacks, and that is what you are doing.

Do you understand inflation?

Do you understand the impact of population on inflation?

The problems we are facing in society today is one of population pressure, growth of prior third world economies, growth of demand on goods by that population, causing the cost of your every day goods to increase. This is a factor of limited resources, not of currency. I Agree, its a huge problem, the cost of everyday goods is increasing and will continue to increase, this is not some conspiracy of banks and money markets. We are 7.7 Billion people, we where 5.2 billion in 1990, when gas was cheap and cheerios cheaper. That number is set to increase to 8.6 Billion by 2030.

This is the root of our problems, our consumption is outstripping our ability to produce, and thus the cost is going up. How does BTC solve that?
 
So much WOKE in this thread. The big block of text above with "paragraphs" six words in is golden. :ROFLMAO:
 
IcePickFreak said:
So much WOKE in this thread. The big block of text above with "paragraphs" six words in is golden. :ROFLMAO:
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I love the attempt to educate on Rome, I am a historian by education, his understanding of the Roman collapse is limited.

I guess I missed automation in his block of text, but I don't have any idea how to solve that, we just need to keep trying, I'm an entrepreneur by trade so I hire people and employ them. Automation and the loss of jobs is a problem, but again, not sure how BTC even addresses that at all.
 
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There seems to be a lot of butthurt among the blockchain kids, that no one gives a fuck if crypto crashes to zero value.

Spoiler alert : NO ONE CARES.

Its arbitrary value at best. There is nothing backing it except empty, anonymous promises: Like "God" or "Santa"


Those who promote investing in blockchain shit, sound like a cross between Sidewalk Preachers and Vegans, or that long lost friend that invites you to Panera for coffee, then asking you to start selling AMWAY with him.

Pathetic and glad to see the SEC inquiries have started to work.
 
Aireoth said:
Sigh. Check your rage before it wrecks you, I made no directed personal attacks, and that is what you are doing.

Do you understand inflation?

Do you understand the impact of population on inflation?

The problems we are facing in society today is one of population pressure, growth of prior third world economies, growth of demand on goods by that population, causing the cost of your every day goods to increase. This is a factor of limited resources, not of currency. I Agree, its a huge problem, the cost of everyday goods is increasing and will continue to increase, this is not some conspiracy of banks and money markets. We are 7.7 Billion people, we where 5.2 billion in 1990, when gas was cheap and cheerios cheaper. That number is set to increase to 8.6 Billion by 2030.

This is the root of our problems, our consumption is outstripping our ability to produce, and thus the cost is going up. How does BTC solve that?
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It sounds like your heavily biased Keynesian Econ 101 class forgot to teach you about Austrian economics or any of the other classic models, of course every model is susceptible to corruption(printing too much). Maybe you never learned that America has had a dozen or more currencies over its lifespan, most failing for the same reasons, like the dollar is now. Maybe you're unaware of the move away from the dollar as a reserve currency or how the petro $ is sinking fast as middle east nations finds other ways to complete transactions(why was the petro $ was created in the first place?). Maybe you weren't instructed on the estimated 1+ QUADRILLION derivatives market and where the debt disappears to when a CB fails. More and more nations are fed up with sanctions by the Swift clearing system and they are making alternate plans. Blockchain has many benefits like eliminating middle men who take a cut for doing nothing (Western Union, Paypal-dont' forget smart contracts) or that blockchain can complete transactions in minutes/seconds instead of days. Sounds to me like your mind is closed off to any new form of exchange. Blockchain is evolving over time. It was created to solve big problems, it has growing pains, like criminal elements and the ponzi schemes but I think these problems will be solved. The tech will evolve out of a need to be free from the criminality of banksters, politicians and hyperinflation. The banksters are sweating. Its been a topic at davos for a few years now and the negative propaganda has been dialed up to 11, the sheep parrot it back in forums.
 
PeaKr said:
It sounds like your heavily biased Keynesian Econ 101 class forgot to teach you about Austrian economics or any of the other classic models, of course every model is susceptible to corruption(printing too much). Maybe you never learned that America has had a dozen or more currencies over its lifespan, most failing for the same reasons, like the dollar is now. Maybe you're unaware of the move away from the dollar as a reserve currency or how the petro $ is sinking fast as middle east nations finds other ways to complete transactions(why was the petro $ was created in the first place?). Maybe you weren't instructed on the estimated 1+ QUADRILLION derivatives market and where the debt disappears to when a CB fails. More and more nations are fed up with sanctions by the Swift clearing system and they are making alternate plans. Blockchain has many benefits like eliminating middle men who take a cut for doing nothing (Western Union, Paypal-dont' forget smart contracts) or that blockchain can complete transactions in minutes/seconds instead of days. Sounds to me like your mind is closed off to any new form of exchange. Blockchain is evolving over time. It was created to solve big problems, it has growing pains, like criminal elements and the ponzi schemes but I think these problems will be solved. The tech will evolve out of a need to be free from the criminality of banksters, politicians and hyperinflation. The banksters are sweating. Its been a topic at davos for a few years now and the negative propaganda has been dialed up to 11, the sheep parrot it back in forums.
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Edit: goddamn phone

Couple of points:

A) still does nothing to address the underlying issues of supply and demand. This exists regardless of economic model, it's just how that model attempts to deal with it.

B) cutting out the middle man is good, but also has consequences. The middle man is more like middle people, it's an industry that employs people.

C) I said crypto is useless, block chain is useful.

D) so some people collect a massive, disgusting amount of wealth, you refer to them as criminal bankers. On paper it's disgusting, and their influence is way out of proportion to their input, but their base level of consumption is not so high as to have a direct impact on inflation. They are a boogie man that it is easy to pin all the world's Ills on, they are a problem, but not the root of all evils.

I am all for solving problems, but in order to actually solve them, or at least move forward, everyone needs a better and broader understanding of the surface and underlying issues.

I can see your dislike for standard currency markets run deep, but cyrpto presents it's own challenges, one of them is inherient instability of being deregulated. I don't see this 'currency' as the White Knight you do, it isn't, it won't fix the underlying problems because it's not designed too, it's designed to dethrone the USD as the international currency of trade.

You talk about criminality, yet refuse to aknowledge that cyrpto allows for criminals and rogue states to freely move cash around legitimate international sanctions. Maybe you don't believe they are legitimate, but if we have lost that much faith in the states that fostered us, our peers, and parents, again that is a different problem and that road is frought with peril.

Revolution is not bloodless, nor is its outcome guaranteed.

Edit 2: You seem to think I've been brain washed into some giant conspiracy. Far from it, I pay little attention to the news other than for basic facts, I went to an extremely left leaning university for 10 years as I though I would be a professor at that point in my life, and I've lived around the world out a a base desire to be in touch with people and their problems so I could gain a better understanding of reality.

I think for myself, weaving experience, taught knowledge, and gained knowledge. I rarely admit that I am wrong, but I do read everything against me, and it has/does impact my process, it goes into that web of knowledge I have spent the dominant majority of my life building.
 
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Aireoth said:
I love the attempt to educate on Rome, I am a historian by education, his understanding of the Roman collapse is limited.

I guess I missed automation in his block of text, but I don't have any idea how to solve that, we just need to keep trying, I'm an entrepreneur by trade so I hire people and employ them. Automation and the loss of jobs is a problem, but again, not sure how BTC even addresses that at all.
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One of my pals is a history buff and teaches history at a high school level. I also study history for fun. We have had this argument a few times. He is on your side but I think both of you fail to factor in the way people thought and felt at the time. Why would roman soldiers risk their lives against the barbarians. I think it was about glory and wealth for most(especially in pagan times). Money makes the world go round. It's usually the cause for war despite what politicians and religious leaders say. For some it was about the glory but at the end of the day when you look at your paycheck you have to ask yourself, is it worth risking your life in a losing battle and for a corrupt gov. that didn't give a shit about its military? Of course it wasn't the only factor, there were many over a period of time, but I think( and I'm not the only one) it had far more significance than people think. Maximus looked forward to life on his farm with wife and kid. Motivation is everything to a soldier.
 
PeaKr said:
One of my pals is a history buff and teaches history at a high school level. I also study history for fun. We have had this argument a few times. He is on your side but I think both of you fail to factor in the way people thought and felt at the time. Why would roman soldiers risk their lives against the barbarians. I think it was about glory and wealth for most(especially in pagan times). Money makes the world go round. It's usually the cause for war despite what politicians and religious leaders say. For some it was about the glory but at the end of the day when you look at your paycheck you have to ask yourself, is it worth risking your life in a losing battle and for a corrupt gov. that didn't give a shit about its military? Of course it wasn't the only factor, there were many over a period of time, but I think( and I'm not the only one) it had far more significance than people think. Maximus looked forward to life on his farm with wife and kid. Motivation is everything to a soldier.
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If you want to talk Rome I am game, but this isn't the spot, pm would be better. Your not wrong, but your not right, you are high school right, there is a large gap between that and PhD.
 
Aireoth said:
Couple of points:
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I've already addressed these points. Supply and demand can take care of themselves in a free market clear of monopolies and crony capitalism, insurance can be a problem without a backstop. In general asset bubbles are destroying the world's wealth(created by money printing), unless you have a great deal of money. I think even health care could be fixed if you took all the regulation out of it, allowed hospitals to post their prices and compete. I read an article a few years back on a few that did this and showed profit for the first time in decades. I don't want to talk about drug companies, too heinous.

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Your discounting the human suffering it causes by letting the market fully regulate itself. Like 50$ gas, 1000$ bread, you supposition only works if resources are infinite.

There are limits to a free market, and factor in geographic, and geopolitical issues and things get more complex. That is why we have the complicated system of international currency that we have. Reducing that system to a simplistic one like BTC cascades those problems to other areas.
 
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Because population is infinite? It's more the amount of regulation. More and more regulation comes in when fucking idiots try to fix things they don't know how to fix.
 
PeaKr said:
Because population is infinite? It's more the amount of regulation. More and more regulation comes in when fucking idiots try to fix things they don't know how to fix.
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Population is growing massively, and shows no signs of abating. How this was dealt with historically was through catastrophic death, by war, plague and famine. Regulations come in as an attempt to decrease the immediate human suffering, we basically kick the ball down the road, but the reality is we can only deal with the problems of today, and hope that people can deal with the problems of tomorrow.
 
Etherium @ $123 and dropping. My estimate is $99 by Monday.
LOL
 
BCH (Bitcoin Cash - not Bitcoin) forked to two separate chains. If you had 10 coins BCH now you have 10 coins in one chain and 10 coins in the other - how is that not counterfeiting? That would be one regulation I think is needed, not duplicating an already established blockchain making it really a double spend for the same previous coin.

There are way too many different coins and tokens as it is, if this is a clearing of the worthless ones (I don't think all are worthless), the better. From over 2000, let it sink to less than 100 and let the best useful ones survive. Bitcoin is too limited to really be an currency. Ethereum has many BS Tokens tied to it's blockchain. Some coins are not able to be regulated.

Some coins/tokens are backed by something tangible, DGX token ( Digix Gold Token) is each Token represents 1 gm of Gold. TrueUSD is back by dollars, 1 = $1 for example. There are plenty of good uses I do believe Crypto will work well in. There are coins that are 100% able to be regulated with strict KYC requirements being meant, meaning it would be rather hard for criminals to hide using those coins plus the record would basically be forever unless the coin fails. Meaning 100% trail for prosecution years later is possible.

There is a very large population of unbanked people, especially in 3rd world countries which do have access to mobile phones, Crypto will allow those folks to participate in the world economy - even if a little and it grows with that many potential people it would be very huge in the end. Many areas do not have banks or a government that can safe guard a currency, Crypto will allow the people to store value that is tradable to other currencies including fiat of another country.

It is not all good or all bad, I would say most will not make it, as in 98%+. Good for those that pick the right 2% in the end.
 
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