confirmed: AMD's big Navi launch to disrupt 4K gaming

Lakados said:
well even just running the fins lengthwise down the card and keeping everything else the same would help. I get the aesthetic they were aiming for, but with this design all that is going to happen is anybody who puts it in a case capable of showing off the pretty card is going to have a big old caked on dust layer right over it. Filters be damned it is gonna happen, I have no doubt that any decent degree of case fans will vent this out so its mostly a non issue but still.... Given the hate so many AMD users have given the 3000 cards for blowing that heat back into the case why are they praising these cards for doing the same thing.
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I've been on a small case run for... a decade, probably. Not ITX necessarily, but as compact as ATX can get. A lot of that was budget; since I wasn't willing to pay up for the top-end heat-belching CPUs and GPUs, I could get away with something smaller, and smaller cases with decent airflow, noise control, and even dust filtering had become available.

I'm over it.

With more cores and GPU die size going up, more volume is needed to strike a good balance between top-tier performance, noise, and maintainability.

As for the GPU showcase mount most cases include these days, well, I'd rather have an AIO anyway, so non-issue here :).
 
Ready4Dis said:
It doesnt' even have the PCIe bracket on it.... seems like a pretty important detail for a card ;). Two 8-pins just means you can turn it up, doesn't mean it has to draw that at stock. In theory 2 8-pins is 375watts... but i've seen plenty of cards with much lower power draws include more than they needed to in order to allow overclocking.
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That is certainly true it can be under 300 watts, I am just basing it since it is using two 8 pins instead of one 8 pin and one 6 pin, that it could be a 300+ watt card. Regarding the PCIe bracket, it looks like 2 slots but height is taller if I were to believe the Fortnite pictures.

 
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KazeoHin said:
nearly all AIB designs use this 2-3 fan open-vent design, and dust is not a significant issue because of the surface area for the fans to directly cool is quite small per fan, meaning the air is not in contact with the fins for a long time. Blower fans get REALLY bad dust because the the air is funneled down a long fin tunnel with tons of opportunities for the dust to get stuck.
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but that's my point the dust won't get stuck on the fins but on the glass its blowing onto on the case and possible on the motherboard behind it unless they have the back side sealed off. Granted I personally use ITX cases so if I am not running an EKWB block the cards are usually mounted vertically so up and out but I just see so many pretty RGB glass cases with this one long caked on dust line.
 
Lakados said:
but that's my point the dust won't get stuck on the fins but on the glass its blowing onto on the case and possible on the motherboard behind it unless they have the back side sealed off. Granted I personally use ITX cases so if I am not running an EKWB block the cards are usually mounted vertically so up and out but I just see so many pretty RGB glass cases with this one long caked on dust line.
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That's just irresponsible PC maintenance. Part of owning a PC (or any product) is keeping it clean and tidy. I keep a dry paintbrush next to my PC and once a week or so I give it a once-over to sweep away the tiny layer of dust that builds up. Keeps it looking nice.
 
KazeoHin said:
That's just irresponsible PC maintenance. Part of owning a PC (or any product) is keeping it clean and tidy. I keep a dry paintbrush next to my PC and once a week or so I give it a once-over to sweep away the tiny layer of dust that builds up. Keeps it looking nice.
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I've gone years without cleaning inside a case, and pulled parts out with only a thin layer of dust. Filters and positive pressure do wonders!

Of course, they also stifle airflow, and I'm tossing between moving to a more 'open' airflow oriented case myself.
 
Chimpee said:
That is certainly true it can be under 300 watts, I am just basing it since it is using two 8 pins instead of one 8 pin and one 6 pin, that it could be a 300+ watt card. Regarding the PCIe bracket, it looks like 2 slots but height is taller if I were to believe the Fortnite pictures.

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Yeah, just saying i've seen dual 8-pins on cards under 375 watts before, so I wouldn't put to much though into that. Yeah, I was going by the "rendering" that was posted, it doesn't even have the bracket. The fortnite model has it included, kind of sad that the fortnite easter egg is more representative than the official rendering they announced with ;).
 
LazyGamer said:
I've gone years without cleaning inside a case, and pulled parts out with only a thin layer of dust. Filters and positive pressure do wonders!

Of course, they also stifle airflow, and I'm tossing between moving to a more 'open' airflow oriented case myself.
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If you have pets or like to keep doors open in good weather, DONT. Filters and brute-force airflow FTW.
 
Marees said:
Going by this rumor from Moore's Law Is Dead, it looks like AMD will be leading with 256gbps width memory bus and not the 384gbps memory bus width that is widely expected?

Is this another jebait ploy to counter the 20gb 3080 ti 🤔

https://www.mooreslawisdead.com/post/nvidia-s-ultimate-play
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Redgamingtech speculates that 256gbps memory bus could be sufficient for big navi, because AMD could be using an infinity cache to boost memory width.


RedGamingTech (@RedGamingTech) Tweeted:
#AMD #RNDA 2 Memory & Bus Info | Clock Frequency & More | EXCLUSIVE #RDNA2 #Exclusive

https://t.co/w8RlZgpxUK
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https://twitter.com/RedGamingTech/status/1305564708070666241?s=20
 
LazyGamer said:
Kind of only get three real choices though, right?
  • It's a blower, and exhausts outside
  • It's an AIO, and exhausts outside
  • It exhausts some, most, or all inside
At least if it's efficient at venting inside, you can give it some space and make sure internal airflow is generous, and it can at least be cooled quietly, right?
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I mean there is no other way cards can possibly come.

Vent in
Vent out
Vent in and out

or using water

Vent in
Vent out
Vent in and out
 
LazyGamer said:
I've gone years without cleaning inside a case, and pulled parts out with only a thin layer of dust. Filters and positive pressure do wonders!

Of course, they also stifle airflow, and I'm tossing between moving to a more 'open' airflow oriented case myself.
Click to expand...

Get a leaf blower
 
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KazeoHin said:
That's just irresponsible PC maintenance. Part of owning a PC (or any product) is keeping it clean and tidy. I keep a dry paintbrush next to my PC and once a week or so I give it a once-over to sweep away the tiny layer of dust that builds up. Keeps it looking nice.
Click to expand...

I do exactly the same paintbrush and all
 
Marees said:
according to a rumor from Coreteks, the Radeon RX 6900 XT will feature boost clocks in the 2,100 MHz range. Specifications are supposedly being finalized next week, so expect plenty of fun leaks in between now and AMD’s official Radeon unveil event on October 28.

https://www.thefpsreview.com/2020/0...-vram-6-gb-more-than-nvidia-geforce-rtx-3080/
Click to expand...

More rumors

Tipster @_rogame recently revealed VRAM specs for two upcoming AMD Big Navi GPUs. The Navi 21 GPU is set to feature 16GB of VRAM, while Navi 22 sports 12GB.

erek said:
"... recent VRAM spec leak indicates that, at least on the video memory front, Big Navi GPUs will enjoy a considerable advantage over the GeForce RTX 3080. With 20GB variants of the GeForce RTX 3080 planned, however, this advantage could evaporate before Big Navi cards make it to market.
What we're looking forward to seeing now is concrete benchmarks at 4K. If the RX 6900XT can at least match the GeForce RTX 3080 in rasterized workloads, while costing less, it should make for a compelling high-end product.


Source(s)
@_rogame"

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Big-N...h-GeForce-RTX-3080-and-RTX-3090.494835.0.html
Click to expand...


https://hardforum.com/threads/big-n...d-with-geforce-rtx-3080-and-rtx-3090.2001541/
 
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Marees said:
More rumors

Tipster @_rogame recently revealed VRAM specs for two upcoming AMD Big Navi GPUs. The Navi 21 GPU is set to feature 16GB of VRAM, while Navi 22 sports 12GB.




https://hardforum.com/threads/big-n...d-with-geforce-rtx-3080-and-rtx-3090.2001541/
Click to expand...

The 16GB of GDDR6 memory is coming from Samsung, and will reportedly be on a 256-bit memory bus.

Not only that, but there is also the Navi 22 GPU that should power a slightly slower card that should materialize into the Radeon RX 6800 XT, or possibly the Radeon RX 6700 XT. This card will reportedly have 12GB of GDDR6 on a 192-bit memory bus.

Read more: https://www.tweaktown.com/news/7529...vi-21-gpu-with-16gb-could-cost-499/index.html
 
Manny Calavera said:
https://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-rx-6700-6800-series-rdna-2-navy-flounder-gpu-specs-revealed/
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Marees said:
40 CUs was what Redgamingtech's source referred to as the Nvidia Killer (Navi 23)

Big Navi is supposed to have 80 CUs !!! (Navi 21)

cc erek cybereality Schro Snowdog
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A user on r/AMD has shared alleged data pertaining to AMD’s Navi 22 or Navi 23 GPU, “Navy Flounder.”

“The number of CUs can be found by multiplying the first three values (so 40 for Navy Flounder),”
“Another interesting value is gc_num_tccs, which is the number of texture channel caches and is generally related to the memory bus width (for Navy Flounder it would mean 192-bit), though there are exceptions.”
Click to expand...
~stblr noted.

the parameters allude to a lower-ranged Radeon RX 6000 Series graphics card that features 40 Compute Units and 2560 stream processors.

https://www.thefpsreview.com/2020/0...y-has-same-cu-core-count-as-current-flagship/
 
Marees said:
A user on r/AMD has shared alleged data pertaining to AMD’s Navi 22 or Navi 23 GPU, “Navy Flounder.”


~stblr noted.

the parameters allude to a lower-ranged Radeon RX 6000 Series graphics card that features 40 Compute Units and 2560 stream processors.

https://www.thefpsreview.com/2020/0...y-has-same-cu-core-count-as-current-flagship/
Click to expand...

Details for two GPUs codenamed Sienna Cichlid (Navi 21, or Big Navi) and Navy Flounder (Navi 22 or 23) were revealed. Of most interest here is the fact that Big Navi does appear to confirm the rumours that it will be a 80 CU (Compute Unit) chip, while Navy Flounder appears to have 40 CUs. Multiply the top three numbers in the table to get the CU count. According to the document Big Navi will have a 256-bit memory bus, while Navy Flounder appears to have a 192-bit memory bus.

https://hardforum.com/threads/big-n...rtx-3080-and-rtx-3090.2001541/post-1044737689

erek said:
https://www.pcgamer.com/amp/a-linux-update-may-have-let-slip-amd-big-navis-mammoth-core/
Click to expand...

How does the pricing work? Since big navi is double the size of small? navi, the price also should be double or more right !! 🤔🤔

I assume small navi will beat 2080ti (& hence 3070) as it was nicknamed as nvidia killer (as per Redgamingtech's source)

This means small navi (6700XT) should cost in the range of $400 to $600

Which means the big Navis (6800XT, 6900, 6900XT, 6900XTX etc), should cost in the range of $700 to $1300 !?
 
I'm just getting a chubby that we are getting RDNA2 leaks from LINUX code submissions, price and performance be damned.
 
Wasn't there rumors of a ~120ish cu part as well? Or is that the vega based non gaming card?
 
So far, I haven't seen anything solid suggesting that the 120 rumor is anything but. However, people are using "Big Navi" to mean both "Big Navi" and "Biggest Navi" pretty interchangeably. So there's something else in there we don't understand well.
 
Marees said:
Details for two GPUs codenamed Sienna Cichlid (Navi 21, or Big Navi) and Navy Flounder (Navi 22 or 23) were revealed. Of most interest here is the fact that Big Navi does appear to confirm the rumours that it will be a 80 CU (Compute Unit) chip, while Navy Flounder appears to have 40 CUs. Multiply the top three numbers in the table to get the CU count. According to the document Big Navi will have a 256-bit memory bus, while Navy Flounder appears to have a 192-bit memory bus.

https://hardforum.com/threads/big-n...rtx-3080-and-rtx-3090.2001541/post-1044737689



How does the pricing work? Since big navi is double the size of small? navi, the price also should be double or more right !! 🤔🤔

I assume small navi will beat 2080ti (& hence 3070) as it was nicknamed as nvidia killer (as per Redgamingtech's source)

This means small navi (6700XT) should cost in the range of $400 to $600

Which means the big Navis (6800XT, 6900, 6900XT, 6900XTX etc), should cost in the range of $700 to $1300 !?
Click to expand...
The 3070 die size is 392 mm² while even the Navi 10 with 40 CU is 251 mm². It was dubbed Nvidia killer because of how AMD will counter Nvidia and gain marketshare. Essentially, AMD is going to slowly raise up their arm, and quickly bring it sideways, connecting the back of their hand to the side of Nvidia's cheek.
 
Could this be the RDNA 1.1 refresh of the 5700 XT to be rebranded as 6500 XT !?

Continuing with AMD's tendency for fishy codenames, the chipmaker (via @Komachi Ensaka) has added support for a Dimgrey Cavefish graphics card to Mesa 20.3-devel. Much like Sienna Cichlid and Navy Flounder, Dimgrey Cavefish is presumed to be a RDNA 2 graphics cards that'll surely unsettle the gaming graphics card hierachy as we know it.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-dimgrey-cavefish-reportedly-points-to-navi-23-gpu


cc erek Schro
 
Marees said:
Could this be the RDNA 1.1 refresh of the 5700 XT to be rebranded as 6500 XT !?

Continuing with AMD's tendency for fishy codenames, the chipmaker (via @Komachi Ensaka) has added support for a Dimgrey Cavefish graphics card to Mesa 20.3-devel. Much like Sienna Cichlid and Navy Flounder, Dimgrey Cavefish is presumed to be a RDNA 2 graphics cards that'll surely unsettle the gaming graphics card hierachy as we know it.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-dimgrey-cavefish-reportedly-points-to-navi-23-gpu


cc erek Schro
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By the way, Dimgrey is a color like this .
Sienna is like this .
Navy is like this .

https://translate.googleusercontent...efish/&usg=ALkJrhg6lYaQ5h3GaphttUglOGwx9w2hvQ
 

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LazyGamer said:
I've been on a small case run for... a decade, probably. Not ITX necessarily, but as compact as ATX can get. A lot of that was budget; since I wasn't willing to pay up for the top-end heat-belching CPUs and GPUs, I could get away with something smaller, and smaller cases with decent airflow, noise control, and even dust filtering had become available.

I'm over it.

With more cores and GPU die size going up, more volume is needed to strike a good balance between top-tier performance, noise, and maintainability.

As for the GPU showcase mount most cases include these days, well, I'd rather have an AIO anyway, so non-issue here :).
Click to expand...
I'm not sure why these things are exclusive, but whatever works for you. I guess it depends on how small you go, but mine's 10.1L and if I keep the drive tray I can fit a 290mm GPU, if I remove the drive tray and just use the NVME and a single SATA drive, I can fit a 390mm GPU. I currently have an AIO but am looking at doing a full custom loop. I have 360mm of rad space available (can't use thick rads). No reason you can't stick with small cases and still get some pretty good hardware in there. That said, it takes a LOT more patience and planning and a bit more creativity and time, so it for sure isn't for everyone ;). I often debate if I want to build in an ITX or just get a nice large case that's super simple to throw stuff in and be done. Out of my 6 desktops, 2 are mITX, and 4 are ATX, just depends on the use case and how much I want to spend/deal with it. Looking forward to seeing what these new RDNA2 cards can do though. All signs are pointing to a pretty decent uplift in performance/competition. Hopefully they are on point for this release, after the nvidia launch, they can really score some points with the community if they do a little better.
 
Marees said:
How does the pricing work? Since big navi is double the size of small? navi, the price also should be double or more right !! 🤔🤔
Click to expand...

Really depends on a lot of things, like binning/defect rate for one (bigger chips means more chance of a defect). That said, the CPU die is only part of the cost. You have the board costs as well (memory chips, vrms, etc), which aren't to dissimilar between the two boards. Although, you will need better vrm and cooling on a large chip as well as more lanes routed to the memory chips with a wider bus, but in the end, the board costs are going to be closer together (not double the cost). Also, volume makes a large difference as well. If you plan to see 10 6900xt and 1,000,000 6700xt, then there can be a large difference in price just due to recouping your fixed costs (tooling, design, taping out the new die, etc). There are so many thing that go into pricing that it's really hard to just say based on it being double the size and a lot of information that we don't (and never will) have.
 
Ready4Dis said:
No way, we can see the reviews before they are sold out :). Things are looking good already, lol.
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We got to see 3080 reviews before they sold out too, but that didn't help most people actually bag a card successfully.

But let's not worry to much, we still have no real indication how good or bad these amd card will actually be, and my gut keeps telling me this will be another mid-tier release.
 
Ready4Dis said:
Really depends on a lot of things, like binning/defect rate for one (bigger chips means more chance of a defect). That said, the CPU die is only part of the cost. You have the board costs as well (memory chips, vrms, etc), which aren't to dissimilar between the two boards. Although, you will need better vrm and cooling on a large chip as well as more lanes routed to the memory chips with a wider bus, but in the end, the board costs are going to be closer together (not double the cost). Also, volume makes a large difference as well. If you plan to see 10 6900xt and 1,000,000 6700xt, then there can be a large difference in price just due to recouping your fixed costs (tooling, design, taping out the new die, etc). There are so many thing that go into pricing that it's really hard to just say based on it being double the size and a lot of information that we don't (and never will) have.
Click to expand...
They also have NVidia to consider even if their cost was 1/2 of Nvidias they only have to price themselves relative to NVidias. If they were to undercut them and find themselves where they weren’t able to meet 100% of the demand and any fraction of their buyers over the course of a year were to be found buying the cards from scalpers at a higher price their share holders would riot and AMD would be smacked with a lawsuit they would loose.
 
ZeroBarrier said:
We got to see 3080 reviews before they sold out too, but that didn't help most people actually bag a card successfully.

But let's not worry to much, we still have no real indication how good or bad these amd card will actually be, and my gut keeps telling me this will be another mid-tier release.
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Well, with 80cu's, I can't imagine they are going to be horrible. 5700XT is 40 CU's, so even with 80% scaling (with ZERO architectural improvements), it'll be 3080 level. The only thing that I'm not sold on yet, is the narrow bus width with the infinity cache system. Its the biggest unknown at the moment. We can extrapolate (to an extent as there are a lot of unknowns) what kind of core performance doubling the CU count will give, but the change in memory architecture is something we really haven't seen yet. My guess is the cache system will do better at lower resolutions where memory usage is lower. As memory usage goes up, so does cache misses. They are employing this in xbox/ps5 though, so I'm guessing it at least works decent. Time will tell I guess :).
 
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