Change in BA requirements

sbinh said:
Question for guru out there... :D .. PG ends BA because:

- it is a piece of garbage?
- it is just a bait to get "addicted" folders to upgrade their rigs, then use those rigs for SMP later on?

what do you think?
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Too early for tinfoil hat. For me, I just don't like the drama. I recall similar activities coming up in the past(GPU project last year), and it appears they are employing some current management techniques I do not agree with: wait and do nothing, the problem will no longer be a problem.

I don't want to be the bitter guy that screams GPUS are the future, but at the same time, the lack of engagement from the other end has lead me to believe its time to collect my belongings and find greemer grass. I agree with Grandpa on the project, however the management(lack of) of the organization has turned me off.
 
Just found this post over at EVGA, for those that don't know proteneer, he is the developer of core 17. This was posted in their BA changes thread.....


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Re: Major bigadv change (death of the ankle biters)• 2 days ago (permalink)


you ain't see nothing yet if you think this is a big change."
 
Statements like this one don't work exactly in Folding@Home's favor...
 
maybe, unless he is talking more along lines of core development - avx support would be a good start
 
Since it was in the "death of the ankle biters" thread and he said "you ain't see nothing yet if you think this is a big change."

Maybe it is the death of GPU folding too.
 
He's like a kid saying: "I know something you don't and I'm not telling".
I'm failing to see the point in his content-less message.
 
or rather in the direction that the days of CPU based simulations are ending "soon". Not factually but from an efficiency/performance perspective.

In a world of limited dev resources, there might be a point in time, where it makes sense to move available dev resources to drive performance in the new core 17 environment. A 20% performance increase in core 17 multiplied by the number of available GPUs contributing, might probably provide more scientific results for FAH in total than a few hundreds large BA machines - seen overall.

Combined with the next generation of GPUs around the corner and probable some currently non-publicly visible developments in the JIT part of GPU drivers might drive the acceleration of throughput seen from an overall perspective much faster than the current dev and support structure spread between GPU and CPU development.

Wasn't there a hint by proteneer that JIT would provide a significant boost to core17 on CUDA cards? (Not sure how much it was, but somehow 2.5x got stuck in my memory).Combined with a 4x power efficiency improvement Maxwell is said to have against Kepler is a speed of progress I would call significant (if it materializes). The impact of QRB on these improvements not to forget as well.

no facts, just a personal perspective,
Andy
 
Just a note, Core 17 can run on CPUs as well as GPUs, it can run on anything that supports OpenCL
 
Most of the new WUs that have been released lately have been SMP
Does not look like they can move SMP WUs to GPU very easily.
SMP will be around a long time.
 
Bill1024 said:
Most of the new WUs that have been released lately have been SMP
Does not look like they can move SMP WUs to GPU very easily.
SMP will be around a long time.
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SMP is around because of fear and laziness...

A researcher that was writing a paper and switched methods of simulation during the project has to support both methods as valid.

GPU would get the science done faster but fear and laziness is holding back the project.
Or say making the SMP runs longer and giving them to BA clients ...
All ways of making the research take less time... all not given the light of day due to fear and laziness.
 
There are any # of things, it could be proteneer finally has made a 1,000,000 atom core 17 WU that works, it could just as easily be he has finally figured out how to run multiple cards on a single WU, I know he had that working but it did not scale worth a crap. It could be the new smp core kasson was working on kicks ass. Might be the new points system, and it could be none of the above.

Without more info it is nothing, just a comment with no meaning, hopefully Vj will release something soon that tells us what it is if anything at all.
 
Maybe they are finally getting around to using the next gromacs core which combines large smp cpu with gpu's for more performance vs openmm which is gpu only....
 
Looks like Grandpa had the last say on the FF thread, well sort of. Some mod, sort of a mod edited the post then locked the thread. Looks like the same old treatment all over again. Amusing really they insist the path they take is righteous and some of the believers are turning back or taking other forks in the road.
 
Ahh yes, evidently the bit about rudeness and moving rigs to other projects did not go down too well.
 
I did read that post and mentioned that over on our forum. I resent the fact that Grandpa was censored because of his passion. Meanwhile... I'd like to deliver a few expletives towards the less than friendly FF folks but I fear it would only encourage them more.
 
Looks like the same old treatment all over again.
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Yup. It's not really surprising any more.
It's the same (if not worse) it was back in the middle of last decade.

The bed has been made with Pande's (be it implicit or explicit) approval and no hypothetical
explanation or empty declaration will buy it for me any more.

I'm ceasing all Folding@Home-specific software development, effective immediately.

P.S.
Grandpa may very well take advantage of the red phone he's got on his desk -- I know he's
done so on couple occasions so far...
 
Sortofageek got me too (a post or so above Grandpa's). What I said was not any more off-topic that many other things that have arisen in the course of that 47-page thread. Seems he did not like my paragraph about "PG poorly managing donors" since that was the section he clipped in my post. What an off-topic offense that was! What was I thinkin'?

I'm done posting at FF or caring what the heck PG does with donors. As Grandpa was sharing just today "they did it to themselves".
 
Wow ... just wow.
All of sudden, there is another "site admin" appears and "killed the dead horse"
 
Nah, she's been around for a while, and I caught her on censorship spree once before (couple
years ago or so).

Bruce has been reported on quite a lot lately so she must have felt, erm, obligated to pick
up the baton. So to speak.
 
I think I'll PM VJ... I'm not sure if it's worth it though. Grandpa has far more pull (bows down) then I do. Maybe I'll just let Grandpa whup dat boy in the woodshed.
 
Hah, she must have realized that after removing "off topic" statements (her impressions), that she would be there the rest of the month editing all the other "off topic" contributions. So, she just focused on the last page instead. Must have triggered her inner Mod-ego today. :rolleyes:
 
Viper97 said:
I think I'll PM VJ... I'm not sure if it's worth it though. Grandpa has far more pull (bows down) then I do. Maybe I'll just let Grandpa whup dat boy in the woodshed.
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I'm fairly certain he's more likely to read an e-mail.

Hearing concerns/criticism from different directions is more likely to draw his attention
so I wouldn't hold myself back.
 
VJ does not seem to care as long as hey can get the flops.

https://foldingforum.org/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=25623#p257701

I posted bellow in case it is Mod censored

Well I took a look and wrote this at EVGA forum earlier today.

So today they show 171,493 active CPU on the folding stats page (which they still are not updating to the front page for whatever reason)

The more interesting number is the number of active donors.

Kakostats lists this as 33,891

For reference, the last time I checked (a year or so ago, it was something like 60,000)
digging a little further, it shows my team AMDZONE as having 27 active members.
But looking at Extreme OC stats (Which I have always followed) shows only 17 active members.

So, the difference must be how many days they use to consider active.

Flipping through the pages of 24 hour averages at Extreme OC ...I come up with 14,000 donors with a 24 hour daily average of 30 points or more.

My point? There are currently only something like 20,000 active donors.

When you go from something close to 500,000 active donors at the peak some years ago, to 20,000...you are just not doing something right.

When I point this out, 7im launches into a rant about how you can not attribute the reduction to administration...there are so many variables...etc. etc.

Well, at the end of the day...someone better figure out how to reverse the trend, or all those extra labs that keep joining...thinking they can tap into the resource will find that there is nothing to tap into.

Sorto****eek, says lets move on, nothing to see here...He is right. If PG doesn't respond with anything but cancelling projects that they failed to administer...there will indeed be nothing to see or comment on.



PS and before the BA thread was locked and purged.

Interesting. Apologist flame baits, and actual donors respond and the moderators response is to censure the donors and not the instigator (7IM).

You will not have any luck reversing this trend with tactics like this.
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And banned from the forum.

Apparently speaking the truth is against the forum rules....

Well good luck guys...Sorry about the loss on your investment...

pity it came to this...so many times they could have salvaged donor relations by just doing the obvious right thing.

I guess ego and pride won out over what is best for the project.
 
Viper97 said:
Looks like Grandpa had the last say on the FF thread, well sort of. Some mod, sort of a mod edited the post then locked the thread. Looks like the same old treatment all over again. Amusing really they insist the path they take is righteous and some of the believers are turning back or taking other forks in the road.
Click to expand...

Yeah it was edited O-Well here is a screenie of it. Damn screenie’s anyway, guess I need to edit it to match what is at the FF now since it does not match for some reason now :D By the way there will be 4 bigadv rigs on F@H when I get home tonight :mad:


x20t.png
 
I think I'm gonna be next for having a very frank couple of PMs just now with the Sortofageek (admin) over at FF. It began with her sending me a PM of my original post (that she edited) and telling me that it was edited because (in her opinion) I was "showing disrespect for the Moderator". Apparently, I have offended "the queen"...:eek:

Waiting for the next shoe to drop and I will consider it a "badge of honor" if she wants to ban me. :cool: At least I will go down attempting to honestly wake up PG with no other agenda in mind. That is a hill that apparently can't be climbed.
 
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