California Adopts First U.S. Energy-Saving Rules For Computers

Umm, no he is saying to use more power and let volume keep costs down.

If you use less power, you won't be a prime consumer, you won't get discounts for volume, you will pay more per kilowatt hour. That is what he is saying. That is the problem he is highlighting.

That by trying to be frugal in your power usage, you are raising your cost per unit. That doesn't mean you have to actually waste power, but you should use what you need to use and let normal demand speak for your service needs.

But the goal is lower electricity usage. Both due to infrastructure, power plant construction and the ability to use saved power for something else. Cars for example.

What you say is pretty much the equal of everyone should drive a Hummer to get cheaper gas.

The delta here should be non existent.

In 2015, the average annual electricity consumption for a U.S. residential utility customer was 10,812 kilowatt hours (kWh), an average of 901 kWh per month. Louisiana had the highest annual electricity consumption at 15,435 kWh per residential customer, and Hawaii had the lowest at 6,166 kWh per residential customer.

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=97&t=3
 
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But the goal is lower electricity usage. Both due to infrastructure, power plant construction and the ability to use saved power for something else. Cars for example.

What you say is pretty much the equal of everyone should drive a Hummer to get cheaper gas.

The delta here should be non existent.



https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=97&t=3


Not "what I say", I was explaining what I understood someone else as saying.
 
The entire DoD has had energy saving rules in place regarding lights and automation equipment for over 20 years. California is far far behind the Federal Government in this regard.
Yeah, and it isn't that well enforced. I've been installing HVAC controls for various projects on a military installation for over four years and the Station Order (based on two executive orders and two directives from the DoD on energy saving rules) goes right out the window the very moment someone bitches about lighting and temperature controls...that is, if the Marines aren't fucking things up to try to get things to work how they want it to. I'm waiting to see how the Army behaves with the work on one of their bases.
 
Let's see, tons of unbridled engery consuming datacenters... and they want to restrict your Xbox? Right? Only in California. Oh... and I'm guessing that you can no longer plugin your Tesla. Just saying...
 
knock knock Penny, knock knock Penny, knock knock Penny!

Did you know the Libtards that run the Socialist Republic of CA are about 147 billion in the red? A slight miscalculation over the years they say. I know lets raise everybody's taxes, well those that pay any tax. We have a real bunch of really really stupid people that run this state. I know lets spend billions and build a train that goes know where!
 
So what happened to energy star... I remember growing up having the logo the front of every piece of computer equipment. That was the last time someone mandated power saving. We got suspend to sleep and few other things that most people don't use. Having living in cali, I can tell you ninety percent of the power load comes from two things one the power grid in cali powers the neighboring states and air conditioning. Every time there was a brown out the state told everyone to turn their thermostats up to eighty degrees. I used fans so this did not bother me but they had a lot of deaths due to old people dieing of heat exhaustion when they went from sixty degree air inside to a hundred degree weather outside or their ac turned off in the middle of the night and their bodies could not handle the swift change. Slow moving blood to fast moving blood to cool them off busts their hearts.

Most medication is targeted as seventy to eighty degree temperature, the changes are hard on people who have bad diets and worse health habits. The saving in power is a good thing but simply having people replace ac units with things like swamp coolers and people living more in tune with the climate they are living in is far better for their health in the long run. As far as fossil fuels go coal is one of the dirtiest pollutants and the department of energy has alternatives but they cost money and effort to build new power plants and then divvy up the areas that the power companies get to charge for power from... so say every major city has a power plant with in fifty miles instead of one company setting the price of electric from Sacramento to San Diego it might be five or ten companies dumping power onto the grid and each only getting a fraction of the money. So when some one needs to build a data farm in annaheim it costs thirty cents they look around and say their is a town five miles away that has a trunc(I have no idea why they spelled fiber connections to larger lines trunc) that has almost the same ping but the company is charging ten cents.
 
[...]bad habits[...]
I agree. Plenty of people around me running their A/Cs down to 70F during the summer, which is just mind boggling to me. None of them could be bothered to just wake up a little earlier and air out their houses, which does absolute wonders for keeping houses cool all day during the summer (plenty willing to stay up playing video games deep into the early morning...). Maybe not 70F cool, but still better than wasting so much power just so they could bundle up a bit more in ridiculous outfits.

Does this mean I get a tax break for updating my CPU and GPU?
If means you get to pay more for the privilege of upgrading your HW. Nothing CA does results in normal people paying less.
 
Give sfsuphysics some room, I was having fun poking at his home State. We can let him flex a little, it's all in fun.

Don't take him so serious, he doesn't (y) :ROFLMAO:

I had too mate, really just playing :notworthy:
Yeah pretty much this, don't take me so serious :)

it's kind of hilarious to see how riled up people get over shit that California MAY do. Doesn't both me if people poke fun at my home state, I'll live in my agony of a socialistic system while enjoying the relatively nice weather year round :)
 
Maybe it would be better if CA just fixed all the power generation problems they've created in order to "save people money". We pay 30 to 40 cents a kw/h out here while places such as Texas pay 8 cents. In CA if you use more power you get penalized, in TX if you use more power you get a discount. Basically everything in the world, if you buy in volume or bulk you get a discount. CA somehow managed to go the other way. Great job California!!!

Sir that's a blatant over exaggeration! I pay 6 cents up to 2Kwh and then 5.3 cents everything after here in Texas. 8 cents?!? What do you think this is, California???
 
Yeah pretty much this, don't take me so serious :)

it's kind of hilarious to see how riled up people get over shit that California MAY do. Doesn't both me if people poke fun at my home state, I'll live in my agony of a socialistic system while enjoying the relatively nice weather year round :)
I live in CA. "Nice" weather is overrated (especially if approaching half the state will never drink the benefits of "nice" weather). But it helps attract all the wrong people away from the other 49 states, and I have no real complaints as a result.
 
Fairly in effective regardless, as the world can't cater to CA's specific needs. I suppose they do not understand that computers use parts built by a multitude of companies in various countries. And in a lot of areas there just is not much competition; Intel and AMD for one. The idea of a manufacture making specific CA computer products is laughable. It just isn't practical and manufactures are already trying their hardest to reduce power over anything else.

Unfortunately, most of the US eventually ends up being subject to the PRC's (People's Republic of California) whims -- the assinine CARB compliant gas cans make an excellent example.
 
Unfortunately, most of the US eventually ends up being subject to the PRC's (People's Republic of California) whims -- the assinine CARB compliant gas cans make an excellent example.

To hell with those damn cans and useless spring loaded spouts!!!!! Work of the devil I tell you!!
 
We already have a mechanic for taxing high power usage PCs and well anything really. It's called charging per KWh or a standard power bill.
A tax on top of that kinda falls into the realm of double taxation.
Add onto governments proclivity for being lobbied in 20 years youll have the law only apply to non apple PCs or something equally absurd.
 
I am betting that is whole idea is being driven by money and NOT by CA actually caring about people saving $8 a year on their power bill.

1. Increase cost of each computer - check
2. Increase amount of profit for computer mfgs - check
3. Increase amount of TAXES being paid per computer - check

If anybody has any solid evidence to suggest otherwise, I am all ears.

How does this increase profit for a computer manufacturer? If my customer has a budget of $500 for a new computer and this stupid tax raises the price by $14, I would have to LOWER the price of my computer to still move the exact same amount of units.
 
Sir that's a blatant over exaggeration! I pay 6 cents up to 2Kwh and then 5.3 cents everything after here in Texas. 8 cents?!? What do you think this is, California???

HAHAHA. Sorry. I am from California but I had a meeting with the CEO of Calpine and he said TX average was 8 cents so that's where I got my number. I am even more jealous now. Although I do believe he said average so I will make the assumption Austin is pulling the state average up since they're just California Light over there.
 
I live in CA. "Nice" weather is overrated (especially if approaching half the state will never drink the benefits of "nice" weather). But it helps attract all the wrong people away from the other 49 states, and I have no real complaints as a result.
Well it depends upon your range of what you can do. Yes half the state doesn't enjoy it, but something like 90% of the population does enjoy it since they live along the coast (well ok maybe more since Sacrapmento is getting more and more popular). But when I go to Tahoe to snowboard... 2 days top and I'm ready to come home. I can't imagine living somewhere where there is a snow season.

But then again I was born and raised in this area, and my parents, and their parents actually bought houses instead of rent, so the high cost of housing never affected me at all.
 
Yeah, and it isn't that well enforced. I've been installing HVAC controls for various projects on a military installation for over four years and the Station Order (based on two executive orders and two directives from the DoD on energy saving rules) goes right out the window the very moment someone bitches about lighting and temperature controls...that is, if the Marines aren't fucking things up to try to get things to work how they want it to. I'm waiting to see how the Army behaves with the work on one of their bases.

No one claimed they were effective, only that they existed.

Look, there was a day when they made us turn everything off. Then someone invented this thing called "The Enterprise" and we had to leave our computers on so they could push patches to them. The latest I have seen is that they have worked out how to shut the machines off remotely after pushing the patches and the updates finish. Day to day it's a hit or miss thing when I come to work, maybe my machine will have rebooted and maybe not. I think it's cause I have to leave it up for the patch push and they don't do that every day, therefore it's not every day that the machine gets shut off.

I think they need to look at pushing a "ghost update" that forces the shutdown cycle even if the patch isn't really patching anything.

But don't tell anyone I suggested that shit cause I don't want these goobers to think I want to be in charge of this shit.
 
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Yeah pretty much this, don't take me so serious :)

it's kind of hilarious to see how riled up people get over shit that California MAY do. Doesn't both me if people poke fun at my home state, I'll live in my agony of a socialistic system while enjoying the relatively nice weather year round :)

I'm guilty, I really am.

I'll admit it, If anyone needs to unwind and loosen up it's me.

But I'm trying, I really am.
 
How does this increase profit for a computer manufacturer? If my customer has a budget of $500 for a new computer and this stupid tax raises the price by $14, I would have to LOWER the price of my computer to still move the exact same amount of units.


Shhhh !

That's just crazy talk.

Stop that right now mister.

No one wants to hear the truth unless it fits in with what they already believe, some people :ROFLMAO:
 
When can California fall into the pacific ocean? I wouldn't mind taking those 55 electoral votes for the working class.
 
Will any computer manufacturer pull a "VW" and make models that detect when they are under test and downclock to reduce power usage and pass the test? :)

They should. All VW was doing was saving customers money in the long run. The regs CA and the EPA etc have are insane.

I'm sure if CA would build more power plants instead of importing it they would lower costs but hey, let other states pollute themselves. Then CA gets all preachy and pushes their standards on everyone else thru the feds to feel good about themselves.
 
WTF is with all the regressive Neanderthals in this thread?
 
Having living in cali, I can tell you ninety percent of the power load comes from two things one the power grid in cali powers the neighboring states

Uh, thats not what I've heard bub. Last I read, Oregon exports about 25% of its Hydro generated juice elsewhere, including CA. Southern CA gets half or more of its power from coal plants in AZ, UT and NM.
 
When can California fall into the pacific ocean?

When the faults in California magically change to a totally different type?
tard.gif


I realize that many who hate California latch onto that fantasy, but really, talking about California falling into the ocean is like using a bullhorn to announce that you are a retard who couldn't handle 2nd grade geology.
 
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California is such a butthole state. All these feel good laws that have zero impact in the real world

<sarcasm>

Can't wait for the "approved" list of computers and monitors (and whether you can have 2 SSDs or only 1).

</sarcasm>

Ask California gun owners about that...
 
When the faults in California magically change to a totally different type?
tard.gif


I realize that many who hate California latch onto that fantasy, but really, talking about California falling into the ocean is like using a bullhorn to announce that you are a retard who couldn't handle 2nd grade geology.

How can I help push California quicker into the pacific ocean? Liberal tyranny has gone on for far too long. Please spare me the hypocrisy. :joyful:

I try very hard not to spend $ in california. I came from a blue state. Moving to a red state made me realized how much freedoms I lost living in the former blue states.

You see? I am not compatible with liberals. I am just tired of hearing lies repeatly.
 
When are they going to make Mall's and such stop keeping ALL of their lights on all dam night...
 
How can I help push California quicker into the pacific ocean? Liberal tyranny has gone on for far too long. Please spare me the hypocrisy. :joyful:

I try very hard not to spend $ in california. I came from a blue state. Moving to a red state made me realized how much freedoms I lost living in the former blue states.

You see? I am not compatible with liberals. I am just tired of hearing lies repeatly.

Blah blah blah. If you hate it so much, why bother even reading a thread about it? Let alone responding.
 
California's high electricity costs are the result of a failure to build up enough capacity during the 90's. It's possible for them to keep their emissions targets, but they either need to suck it up and build more nuclear plants or massively expand their hybrid gas/wind/solar operations.

As I understand it, the evidence shows that efficiency standards really do save a lot of money overall while also reducing power consumption (California has managed to keep their peak summertime loads below where they were 10 years ago), but better efficiency isn't going to make up for the fact that California is importing more than 25% of it's power.
 
California's high electricity costs are the result of a failure to build up enough capacity during the 90's. It's possible for them to keep their emissions targets, but they either need to suck it up and build more nuclear plants or massively expand their hybrid gas/wind/solar operations.

As I understand it, the evidence shows that efficiency standards really do save a lot of money overall while also reducing power consumption (California has managed to keep their peak summertime loads below where they were 10 years ago), but better efficiency isn't going to make up for the fact that California is importing more than 25% of it's power.
So you are saying CA needs to regulate AZ, NV, and Oregon in order to ensure its power is clean? :D
 
What a cop out, when you can't come up with a good reason, throw the troll.

Cop out? Geez?

Okay, let me tell you why your state is a shit state? Cool? This is not personal or any insult towards you personally.

California used to be the beacon of freedom and prosperous economy. Everyone wanted to go to California, including me as well. Slowly over decades your state has adopted liberal, communist, marxist and closet democrats as marxists. Your state is being suffocated under the rule of liberal tyranny. Business are fleeting in droves from your state to avoid taxation and regulations. California embraces to dream up laws for everything your legislature can think up of. It is so comical watching your state hang a rope over your own necks. Your state is embracing slavery and tyranny in all forms of restrictions. If you can't understand these statement, it is like me telling you to stop smoking 24/7. California is demonstrating to be the capital of human moral decay. Your state has turned into a 3rd world shit hole with massive deficits and continuing to embrace failed policies that have proven track of failure. What really irritates me is that you have californians moving into AZ and not changing their voting habits. CA voting habits are fucking up my state and turning it into a blue hell hole. Democrats have been nothing but the party of the KKK, Slavery, Globalist, and Marxists. These are facts, deal with it.

If it was up to me, California will be forced to leave the union and walled off with nukes standing by if the state got out of control. Fuck Liberal Tyranny!!!!
 
Ah when I lived there in 2009 to 2014 they said the draw was on the other states and someone hear it was the other way around but looking here
http://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=ca#tabs-4
I can see power transmission lines that cross the border but that most of the rest of the information looks like most of the power is generated in state, and "In 2014, California’s per capita energy consumption ranked 49th in the nation; the state's low use of energy was due in part to its mild climate and its energy efficiency programs." tends to suggest that per person/company/corporation the use is less than almost every other state in the country. My guess is that the electric heaters and oil refineries in Louisiana and the cold states are the reason each entity in those states uses a lot of power per entity but the odds are good that snow birds in Arizona that don't migrate back to the colder states are what drive up the demand plus las vagas is likely to use more energy between attempting to air condition the strip by leaving the doors open to the casinos and just powering all those lights... a swamp cooler in Arizonia costs a couple dollars a month to run but an air conditioning unit uses three thousand watts and hour to cool temperature thirty degrees. Once the temperature is down less energy is needs if the insulation is up to code but every time you open a window or door that air has to be cooled off and any heat inside above the target temperature needs to be cooled down. Plus you have to bring in air from outside or die of carbon monoxide poisoning since the air inside is being replaced with the air that is breathed in converted to a mix of natural air and carbon dioxide.

I know los angles draws a lot of power but it looks like cali generates the fourth most power and uses at most the 36th most energy. That is for transportion sector the commerical and residencal is down at the 50th or pretty less energy most of the rest of the country.

http://www.eia.gov/state/rankings/?sid=CA#series/51
 
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