Buzzing Interference Noise (Related to GPU Activity)

[deadman_uk]

Hi,

I've very recently purchased an Asgard 3 amp (no DAC) to replace my Magni 2 Uber amp, which I believe is no longer functioning. I’m very pleased with the Asgard 3’s sound quality - it's a noticeable improvement, and I have significantly more power at higher volume levels. However, I’m encountering an issue that I’d like your assistance with: I’m experiencing an electronic buzzing/interference noise that seems to correlate with GPU (video card) activity.

Here’s my setup:

• Amp Connection: The Asgard 3 (previously the Magni 2 Uber) is connected to my Creative X-Fi Titanium HD PCI-E sound card via 1m shielded RCA cables.
• GPU: NVIDIA RTX 4090 in the PCI-E slot furthest from the sound card.
• Headphones: Audio Technica ATH R70x plugged into the amp’s headphone port.
• Speakers: Razer Mako 2.1: Plugged in to the amp's pre-amp ports (Rarely used)

With the Magni 2 Uber, I never experienced interference noises, even at high gain and maximum volume. With the Asgard 3, an interference noise is present and appears to increase with GPU activity. For example:

• On static screens (e.g., webpages), the noise is minimal or absent.
• On my animated desktop wallpaper (via Wallpaper Engine), the GPU becomes more active, and the interference noise becomes significantly louder.
• Moving my mouse pointer can introduce noticeable interference if the amp volume is medium/high.
• The interference noise is most extreme during gaming when the GPU is at full load.

Observations:

1. Volume Settings:
   • On low gain, interference is less noticeable, and at around 5 o'clock on the volume dial, it’s inaudible. However, the audio is too quiet for my preferences. At max volume (6 o'clock), the audio level is more satisfactory, but there’s no further headroom.
   • On high gain, interference becomes apparent at 12 o'clock and worsens progressively as the volume increases. A satisfactory audio level at this gain would be 2 or 3 o'clock.
     
2. With RCA Cables Disconnected:
   • Unplugging the RCA cables at either the amp or sound card eliminates the interference entirely but then I (obviously) have no sound at all.
   • Unplugging the speakers from the pre-amp ports and using headphones only does not improve matters.
     
3. Other Tests:
   • I’ve tried changing RCA cables, plugging the amp into a different electrical outlet, and moving the amp further from the PC. None resolved the issue.

The noise doesn’t occur in the BIOS/UEFI, but it begins faintly as Windows begins to boot up and becomes more pronounced once the desktop has loaded and GPU activity increases. During gaming or high GPU usage, the interference is extremely audible. I’ve read online that this issue has been reported with the Asgard 3, even when using its internal DAC (e.g., ES9028 or Multibit). Here is a post from someone with an Asgard 3 and the same sound card as myself experiencing similar issues. Switching to his internal DAC didn't help. I’d prefer though to continue using my sound card as the DAC due to its excellent quality and EAX features for gaming.

The only difference between my previous setup and the current one is the amp. One key observation:

• The Magni 2 Uber used an external power adapter (with an aux/phono-style connector), while the Asgard 3 has an internal linear power supply (with a kettle-style plug, similar to a PC PSU). Could this internal supply be more prone to picking up interference from nearby components like GPUs or motherboards? The physical separation provided by the Magni’s external power supply might have prevented the interference.

I’ve also considered the possibility of a ground loop issue. However, I'm not knowledgeable with this, I understand they are difficult to diagnose and I’ve read that ground loop isolators can reduce sound quality, making them a less-than-ideal solution.

I’d greatly appreciate any advice or insights you can provide on resolving this issue.

 

[GoldenTiger]

Buy a ground loop isolator off of Amazon and put it between the Amp and the pc. That is the most common solution to this kind of problem and it should only run about $12 .

Here is one that I've used with similar problems that solved them: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B001EAQTRI

 

[deadman_uk]

Buy a ground loop isolator off of Amazon and put it between the Amp and the pc. That is the most common solution to this kind of problem and it should only run about $12 .

I agree it's worth a try but wouldn't that reduce sound quality though? I hear it does. My headphones and amp cost several hundred each so sound quality is something fairly important to me (I understand my setup is not super premium but it's pretty decent) I do find it interesting that everything is exactly the same apart from the switch in the amp. The previous amp had no issues.

EDIT: The link you posted is for a 3.5mm AUX connection. I'm using RCA. Something like this? but what about sound quality? A few of the reviews said it reduces sound quality.

 

[GoldenTiger]

I agree but wouldn't that reduce sound quality though? I hear it does. My headphones and amp cost several hundred each so sound quality is something fairly important to me (I understand my setup is not super premium but it's pretty decent) I do find it interesting that everything is exactly the same apart from the switch in the amp. The previous amp had no issues.

I don't know on the sound quality effect as my stuff for my PC is much lower end than yours. I do find it a little odd though given what you've said re: the two amps.

 

[deadman_uk]

I don't know on the sound quality effect as my stuff for my PC is much lower end than yours. I do find it a little odd though given what you've said re: the two amps.

Yes, it's odd but just to mention again, my previous amp is a lot less powerful and also: "The Magni 2 Uber used an external power adapter (with an aux/phono-style connector), while the Asgard 3 has an internal linear power supply (with a kettle-style plug, similar to a PC PSU). That may play a part in it too. I am going to try my amp at my uncles house on his PC later in the week if things go to plan so it would be interesting if I experience the same issues there (I think I would to be honest)

 

[toast0]

Some quick things to try:

a) use the motherboard's sound output (probably need a 3.5mm -> 2 rca adapter

b) hook up a different source (cd player? phone? dvd player) and see if that picks up noise, even if the gpu is running?

 

[deadman_uk]

Some quick things to try:

a) use the motherboard's sound output (probably need a 3.5mm -> 2 rca adapter

b) hook up a different source (cd player? phone? dvd player) and see if that picks up noise, even if the gpu is running?

Some good ideas there. I don't have a 3.5mm > RCA adapter and according to ChatGPT, this can increase interference not reduce it. If i had one, I would give it a try though. Your second suggestion is worth trying too but my soundbar and TV don't have RCA connections so can't try that. My phone certainly doesn't and I don't own a DVD/CD player. I am going to take my amp to my uncles home in a few days perhaps, that should be interesting and eliminate a few extra things.

 

[toast0]

I don't have a 3.5mm > RCA adapter and according to ChatGPT, this can increase interference not reduce it.

Well, they certainly can, but if there's an interaction between your sound card and gpu, it might not affect the motherboard sound card (or it might be worse!), and you might be able to use that kind of adapter with your phone too (unless your phone maker was too brave to include a 70 year old standard connector).

They're pretty handy in the right situation anyway.

 

[deadman_uk]

Well, they certainly can, but if there's an interaction between your sound card and gpu, it might not affect the motherboard sound card (or it might be worse!), and you might be able to use that kind of adapter with your phone too (unless your phone maker was too brave to include a 70 year old standard connector).

They're pretty handy in the right situation anyway.

My phone has no 3.5mm aux port micro usb-c only lol. I'll ask my uncle if he has one of these I can borrow when I see him but it's not a fix for me whatever happens. My sound card and motherboard have an aux port each. I'll give them both a try if I ever get this adapter.

 

[deadman_uk]

I got a reply from Schiit support. Not very helpful:

Sorry to hear you are having an issue,

I do have quite a few issues with computers and audio outputs this is all due to the way they output the audio signal and also due to the switch mode power supply use.
You could try a ground loop isolator but most of the time this doe not work as the noise is sort of built in and some units are more susceptible than others.

I honestly do not think there is much we can do other than offer you a refund as this is what it normally comes to.

Regards
www.electromod.co.uk

 

[DoubleTap]

This is a common problem with computer based sound systems and the best way to fix it is by using an optical output from your PC (either from your sound card if your sound card has software features or DSP that you use or, if not, just a $20 USB to Toslink dongle)

Either add a DAC to your Asgard or get one of their integrated headphone amps like the Gunnr:

There is a decent chance that getting the USB DAC card for your Asgard will also work but optical is basically fool proof.

I sympathize as I just got a Wiim Ultra which I'm using as a preamp/streamer but I can't use the HDMI ARC input without getting terrible hum/noise and there is no way to break the galvanic connection to an ARC input so it's just unusable....

 

[djstarfox]

While you're getting the ground loop situation solved, as a workaround you can enable vsync in all games. This will reduce GPU power usage and should reduce the level of noise.

 

[deadman_uk]

This is a common problem with computer based sound systems and the best way to fix it is by using an optical output from your PC (either from your sound card if your sound card has software features or DSP that you use or, if not, just a $20 USB to Toslink dongle)

Either add a DAC to your Asgard or get one of their integrated headphone amps like the Gunnr:
View attachment 701979
There is a decent chance that getting the USB DAC card for your Asgard will also work but optical is basically fool proof.

I sympathize as I just got a Wiim Ultra which I'm using as a preamp/streamer but I can't use the HDMI ARC input without getting terrible hum/noise and there is no way to break the galvanic connection to an ARC input so it's just unusable....

If this is a common issue with computer based sound systems, why did I not experience this with my Magni 2 Uber amp? Is it due to one of the possible reasons I gave above?

My sound card has an optical toslink connection but my Asgard 3 amp does not. Not using my sound card and using an external DAC (either inside the Asgard 3 or standalone unit) may or may not solve my issue. In the forum post I linked to here, the guy had the same issue I did even with using a DAC inside his Asgard 3. I am really pleased with the performance of the Asgard 3, it's dramatically improved the sound over the Magni 2 Uber. I'd rather not return it if I can help it.

Can I not use a RCA to Toslink converter? like this (RCA from the Asgard going into the converter and then the converter going into the Toslink in my sound card)?

Another option is to buy a Modi Multibit 2 DAC and connect this via Toslink to my sound card and then RCA from the new DAC to my Asgard 3. Obviously the downside is, this costs more money. Would this solve the issue? But then how would I use the EAX features of my sound card during gaming? Can I emulate it via software? Creative ALchemy software? EDIT: According to ChatGPT: "If you use optical out, the soundcard processes the audio (including EAX effects) before sending the digital signal to the DAC. This means EAX effects would still function."

While you're getting the ground loop situation solved, as a workaround you can enable vsync in all games. This will reduce GPU power usage and should reduce the level of noise.

I am not sure I even have a ground loop situation. It does sound possible but the Schiit support guy isn't 100% confident that I do. I am going to try this at my uncles house sometime soon. Thanks for the suggestion. I actually can't hear the interference while I am gaming. I tend to only hear it at high volume and when a game has quiet moments.

 

[toast0]

Can I not use a RCA to Toslink converter? like this (RCA from the Asgard going into the converter and then the converter going into the Toslink in my sound card)?

This is all the wrong direction, including the linked converter.

You want toslink from your sound card going out to a converter that goes out via rca to your amp. You can buy a fancy DAC for this, or use a cheap converter (be careful around power supplies with a cheap converter though).

 

[DoubleTap]

If this is a common issue with computer based sound systems, why did I not experience this with my Magni 2 Uber amp? Is it due to one of the possible reasons I gave above?

It's common but that doesn't mean every config will have it.

My sound card has an optical toslink connection but my Asgard 3 amp does not. Not using my sound card and using an external DAC (either inside the Asgard 3 or standalone unit) may or may not solve my issue. In the forum post I linked to here, the guy had the same issue I did even with using a DAC inside his Asgard 3. I am really pleased with the performance of the Asgard 3, it's dramatically improved the sound over the Magni 2 Uber. I'd rather not return it if I can help it.

The DAC for the Asgard is USB so if he did have a ground loop, it would likely persist but the post you linked to is poorly written and lacks detail so it's hard to say what the real issue is.

Can I not use a RCA to Toslink converter? like this (RCA from the Asgard going into the converter and then the converter going into the Toslink in my sound card)?

I would buy a quality DAC ($50-$150) and run the optical from your sound card to the DAC, then RCA from the DAC to your Asgard. This will almost certainly eliminate the computer noise as your sound will stay in the digital domain until it exits your PC and won't become analog until it is a few feet away from your GPU

Another option is to buy a Modi Multibit 2 DAC and connect this via Toslink to my sound card and then RCA from the new DAC to my Asgard 3. Obviously the downside is, this costs more money. Would this solve the issue? But then how would I use the EAX features of my sound card during gaming? Can I emulate it via software? Creative ALchemy software? EDIT: According to ChatGPT: "If you use optical out, the soundcard processes the audio (including EAX effects) before sending the digital signal to the DAC. This means EAX effects would still function."

I have the Modi Multibit 2 (the silver version is $329 plus tax/shippinig) - this DAC is overkill for your purposes but the basic $119 Modi might be a good option. I don't use sound cards but in yes, you should have EAX effects available even when you use the optical out but you might check the manual

I am not sure I even have a ground loop situation. It does sound possible but the Schiit support guy isn't 100% confident that I do. I am going to try this at my uncles house sometime soon. Thanks for the suggestion. I actually can't hear the interference while I am gaming. I tend to only hear it at high volume and when a game has quiet moments.

It sounds more like EMI from your PC (GPU) that the analog stage of your sound card is picking up through induction before the sound leavs the card. A ground loop sounds unlikely but using an optical connection should solve both EMI and Ground Loop noise.

 

[deadman_uk]

It's common but that doesn't mean every config will have it.

The DAC for the Asgard is USB so if he did have a ground loop, it would likely persist but the post you linked to is poorly written and lacks detail so it's hard to say what the real issue is.

I would buy a quality DAC ($50-$150) and run the optical from your sound card to the DAC, then RCA from the DAC to your Asgard. This will almost certainly eliminate the computer noise as your sound will stay in the digital domain until it exits your PC and won't become analog until it is a few feet away from your GPU

I have the Modi Multibit 2 (the silver version is $329 plus tax/shippinig) - this DAC is overkill for your purposes but the basic $119 Modi might be a good option. I don't use sound cards but in yes, you should have EAX effects available even when you use the optical out but you might check the manual

It sounds more like EMI from your PC (GPU) that the analog stage of your sound card is picking up through induction before the sound leavs the card. A ground loop sounds unlikely but using an optical connection should solve both EMI and Ground Loop noise.

Thanks for your comments, very helpful. Can you explain why the Modi Multibit 2 would be overkill for my needs compared to the Modi+? I've watched reviews of the Modi Multibit 2 and while it's no Bifrost 2/64, there difference is not much. I hear very good things about it.

 

[DoubleTap]

Thanks for your comments, very helpful. Can you explain why the Modi Multibit 2 would be overkill for my needs compared to the Modi+? I've watched reviews of the Modi Multibit 2 and while it's no Bifrost 2/64, there difference is not much. I hear very good things about it.

It's a $300+ DAC that is designed to sound closer to an old school diode/ladder dac. I use it with a roughly $6000 setup and it's barely perceptible - also, it can add a slight click between tracks when you listen to music. I didn't really see it as better than the DAC built into my integrated amplifier - it's a fun curiosity but I'm simplifying my system and may end up posting it for sale. For general PC use, I would just get the regular Modi - or if you want a nicer dac, maybe the Modius? It's purely a budget and discretion call though.

I agree with this review https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/schiit-modi-multibit-2.26253/reviews

The click sounds like a tiny little relay inside the unit - it gives it some character but you should be aware of what you're getting into...

I'm migrating to a Wiim Ultra for preamp/streaming/eq/bass management/room correction/etc. It doesn't really support an external DAC but I love it - see below

 

[deadman_uk]

It's a $300+ DAC that is designed to sound closer to an old school diode/ladder dac. I use it with a roughly $6000 setup and it's barely perceptible - also, it can add a slight click between tracks when you listen to music. I didn't really see it as better than the DAC built into my integrated amplifier - it's a fun curiosity but I'm simplifying my system and may end up posting it for sale. For general PC use, I would just get the regular Modi - or if you want a nicer dac, maybe the Modius? It's purely a budget and discretion call though.

I agree with this review https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/schiit-modi-multibit-2.26253/reviews

The click sounds like a tiny little relay inside the unit - it gives it some character but you should be aware of what you're getting into...

I'm migrating to a Wiim Ultra for preamp/streaming/eq/bass management/room correction/etc. It doesn't really support an external DAC but I love it - see below

I'm not a general PC use person. I really enjoy music listening and gaming. I want to lean towards something more premium than just an average user. Isn't the Modius / Modius E for balanced audio? I don't have a balanced setup so why would I go for that? and doesn't the Modius use a ES9028 DAC? which some people say is worse than the DAC in the Modi Multibit 2? I guess it's down to opinion. I'll check out the review, thanks for sharing and cool photo but that's way above my understanding of audio

 

[michalrz]

https://allegro.pl/oferta/izolator-portu-usb-2-0-na-adum4160-15272809891
(look at the pictures)

(Edit: one picture pasted here for those not wanting to venture out of H)

Something like this, placed between the computer and the DAC (assuming it's a USB DAC, sadly OP's situation is a bit different there being a PCI-e X-FI), is one of the end-all solutions.

What you'd be looking for is something based on the Adum4160 chip, and the rest of the implementation possibly varying (for example - being able to use both USB power or an external supply - like a linear power supply powered by a battery - for the purists).

It's just an idea, I plan of grabbing something along these lines some time.

 

[deadman_uk]

https://allegro.pl/oferta/izolator-portu-usb-2-0-na-adum4160-15272809891
(look at the pictures)

(Edit: one picture pasted here for those not wanting to venture out of H)
View attachment 702289

Something like this, placed between the computer and the DAC (assuming it's a USB DAC, sadly OP's situation is a bit different there being a PCI-e X-FI), is one of the end-all solutions.

What you'd be looking for is something based on the Adum4160 chip, and the rest of the implementation possibly varying (for example - being able to use both USB power or an external supply - like a linear power supply powered by a battery - for the purists).

It's just an idea, I plan of grabbing something along these lines some time.

Thanks for posting. I am a bit confused what this is. My sound card is PCI-Express, my amp is RCA, I have no USB connections on either these two devices so how would this be relevant? Or is this just an example?

I did get another response from Schiit which I will share below:

"The only way I have cured this is basically going crazy low noise PSU in the computer and a PS Audio filter system on the mains so please do not go down that route.

I think the next thing is try it in different locations to see if this help and on different systems ( or even take the computer out and run a phone to it to see ) once we understand where the noise is coming from we can attack.

My idea is at the moment to send you a Dac to try (topping, schiit) whatever I have here lying around to see if this helps and take it from there.

Let me know how you get on with trying it in different location and input and then we can go from there

Regards
www.electromod.co.uk"

 

[michalrz]

Thanks for posting. I am a bit confused what this is. My sound card is PCI-Express, my amp is RCA, I have no USB connections on either these two devices so how would this be relevant?

Yeah, your case is sadly different :< but this problem gets brought up often, and often left unsolved.

If you feel it's out of place, I can remove that.

USB isolators (for example optical) are transparent bridges for the Data+ and Data- lines of USB, and you bring your own power. It's in theory the only way to absolutely get rid of the buzz for USB-based soundcards.
The PC doesn't even see it, it just sees the soundcard as if nothing happened (so, no additional drivers required for the isolator).

In your case (PCI-based), I would try a long list of experiments, some of which are:
- mute inputs in soundcard panel
- try a thicker power cord for your PSU
- try toggling spread-spectrum in BIOS
- re-seat all connectors between the PSU and mobo/GPU (making sure the wires themselves are pushed in, not just the plastic)
- try powering your setup from a different outlet

^ this might work, depending on the specific cause.
I don't envy you, I once had to change the motherboard because it would buzz with an Audiotrak Prodigy PCI-E card also (changing mobo helped).

 

[criccio]

Moving to TOSLINK from USB on my old Modi DAC was the best move I ever made. No flaky USB connections, no noise.

 

[deadman_uk]

Yeah, your case is sadly different :< but this problem gets brought up often, and often left unsolved.

If you feel it's out of place, I can remove that.

USB isolators (for example optical) are transparent bridges for the Data+ and Data- lines of USB, and you bring your own power. It's in theory the only way to absolutely get rid of the buzz for USB-based soundcards.
The PC doesn't even see it, it just sees the soundcard as if nothing happened (so, no additional drivers required for the isolator).

In your case (PCI-based), I would try a long list of experiments, some of which are:
- mute inputs in soundcard panel
- try a thicker power cord for your PSU
- try toggling spread-spectrum in BIOS
- re-seat all connectors between the PSU and mobo/GPU (making sure the wires themselves are pushed in, not just the plastic)
- try powering your setup from a different outlet

^ this might work, depending on the specific cause.
I don't envy you, I once had to change the motherboard because it would buzz with an Audiotrak Prodigy PCI-E card also (changing mobo helped).

No need to remove that but yes, I don't think it's relevant to me unless I had a USB connection.

My motherboard has both clock spread spectrum and vr spread spectrum set to auto. I disabled them (one at a time) and when I booted windows, not only did I have the usual buzzing interference noise, I now also have a constant hissing sound. Unplugging the right RCA cable from the Asgard 3 stopped the hissing (buzzing interference noise still present though). When I set them back to auto and rebooted, the hissing sound continued (with the electronic buzzing) but thankfully after a few minutes, the hissing sound faded away and hasn't returned (buzzing sound still present though).

I've already tried a different electrical outlet as I stated in my original post. A thicker PSU power cord? I didn't know such thing existed, ok that's something to try down the road if I can source one (I'm using the one that came with the PSU). I've tried muting different sound devices in the Windows sound output. I'm going to test this amp on my uncles PC hopefully this week sometime so that should help narrow things down a bit.

 

[deadman_uk]

Moving to TOSLINK from USB on my old Modi DAC was the best move I ever made. No flaky USB connections, no noise.

I'm not using USB though. Toslink would be the ultimate connection. If I ever go down the road of getting a new DAC, I will ensure it's toslink.

 

[deadman_uk]

I wanted to provide update. Today I tested the Asgard 3 at my uncle's home and on his PC.

My uncle's setup includes a PCI-Express sound card (the ASUS Essence STX II) as his DAC, which differs from my sound card (Creative X-fi Titanium HD). His card additionally uses an external 4-pin Molex power connector for power, while mine relies solely on the PCI-E slot of the motherboard. Both cards have shielding, but according to ChatGPT, the shielding on the ASUS Essence STX II is superior. His PC has a much more modest GPU compared to my Nvidia RTX 4090.

Using the same cables and headphones, I noticed the following during my tests:

- On low gain, I don't hear any interference or buzzing noise until the volume is turned up to around 100%, and even then, it is extremely faint and barely noticeable.

- On high gain, the buzzing noise is greatly reduced and only becomes apparent at near-maximum volume.

The interference noise is greatly reduced at my uncle's home, to the point where it wouldn’t bother me. However, what stood out even more was the difference in volume levels:

- On low gain, I had to turn the Asgard knob all the way to 100% to achieve an almost satisfactory volume level at my home, whereas at my uncle's, much less volume was needed for the same loudness. At 100%, the volume was significantly louder there.

- On high gain, the difference in loudness was even more pronounced. At my uncle's, I only needed to turn the knob to around 50% to achieve the same loudness I would get at 100% at my home.

I’ve told Schiit that I'd like to take up their offer to provide a DAC for testing. Ideally, I would like to test the Modi Multibit 2, as I’m considering purchasing it to replace my sound card if it resolves my issue.