Building New $2k Rig - Trying To Finalize Video Card Decision, Need Your Expertise!

SlapShot

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 31, 2004
Messages
167
As the title says, I'm building a new rig based around an i5 2500k, an Asus Z68 board, and 8gb memory. Its intent is to be able to play Skyrim on 11/11 with all settings maxed. My curent monitor is 1920x1080, but I will likely upgrade to 2560x1440 within the next six months.
I now have all of the parts in hand except the video card(s), and keep going back and forth on the best overall option. Looking for the absolute best bang and performance for the buck. I would also prefer a reasonably quiet video solution.

This was what I would choose if I go 6950 in Crossfire (but, Newegg has been out of stock on the video card I wanted for a week, and none in sight anytime soon and the alternative places that do have it are $30.00 more, each, minimum.)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127575

A total cost for for two of those = $579.98 with rebate

The only other alternative I was considering in 6950's would the Sapphire Toxic cards which have a good chance of flashing to 6970 status = $560.00 with rebate (but I have had Sapphires die on me before, and the warranty is only two years)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102951


Or am I better off with, all things considered, with two of these top rated 560Ti's instead = $480.00 with rebate

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121425


Or maybe two of these well reviewed 6870's = only $354.00 with rebate, would they deliver?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127545


I would appreciate your thoughts, expertise and recommendations. Thanks in advance.

JC
 
If you will be upgrading your monitor soon, then I would go with the 6950s with their 2GB memory, or 2GB 560Ti's or 580's.
 
If you have $2000 to spend, want the best bang for the buck and will likely be using 2560x1440 in the near future, it might make sense to get mid-range cards now like two 6850/6870 and then reconsider when you get the new monitor.

Obviously, it makes sense to wait till the game is released to get a good idea of videocard(s) to pick
 
Just FYI, you really don't want two non-reference video cards in a case. Gives people difficult heat issues with the thermals of today's cards.
 
The sapphire toxic and dirt 3 6950's unlock to 6970 with the simple flip of a switch. Already pre-flashed from the factory.
 
The sapphire toxic and dirt 3 6950's unlock to 6970 with the simple flip of a switch. Already pre-flashed from the factory.

I was giving these serious thought to purchase, but I need a relatively quiet card, and many users report they are very loud when pushed. Note these comments from owners on Newegg:

Cons: Pricier for a 6950, 6970 shader unlocker switch makes this moot. Sounds like a ****ing banshee if you put it under very high stress.

Cons: Runs hotter than my 5850. Sounds like a vacuum cleaner while its under load as the rpms increase

Cons: Fan @ 60% manual sounds like a jet

JC
 
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If you have $2000 to spend, want the best bang for the buck and will likely be using 2560x1440 in the near future, it might make sense to get mid-range cards now like two 6850/6870 and then reconsider when you get the new monitor.

Obviously, it makes sense to wait till the game is released to get a good idea of videocard(s) to pick

Given that its predecessors were extremely demanding, I have no doubt this one will be too.


JC
 
i donno if i would be too high on amd cards with the recent driver troubles that rage has and still have, just something to think about.
 
I love my 6870s and I game @ 1920x1200. Never had an issue, power draw is less than 6950s, and yes I notice, my electric bill is about 20 bux more when I am running them in crossfire, but that also means I am gaming more usually so it may not be that much.

I ran a dual monitor setup which was 2 x 1920x1200 and I wasn't unhappy with the performance, just upgraded to a 28 inch monitor with a 1920x1200 resolution and was really happy with no bezels and a big ass monitor.
 
If you're dead set on maxing out Skyrim, you may want to consider that two 6950s will be a stop-gap. When the new cards come out in a few months time, you'll want to upgrade to them, as I doubt two 6950s are going to max out Skyrim at 2560x1440.
 
Its intent is to be able to play Skyrim on 11/11 with all settings maxed. My curent monitor is 1920x1080, but I will likely upgrade to 2560x1440 within the next six months.

Looking for the absolute best bang and performance for the buck. I would also prefer a reasonably quiet video solution.

Gaming at resolutions higher than 1920x1080 your best option is to go for a selection with higher memory. For Radeon that means 2GB and for Nvidia that means 2GB 560's, 2.5GB 570's. You wouldn't need the 580's and I wouldn't recommend it as you would be breaching the price/performance barrier.

If you're dead set on maxing out Skyrim, you may want to consider that two 6950s will be a stop-gap. When the new cards come out in a few months time, you'll want to upgrade to them, as I doubt two 6950s are going to max out Skyrim at 2560x1440.

Skyrim is a beautiful game. It's can't be denied. However, Skyrim isn't going to push current graphic cards to their limit. I foresee it as being more Witcher 2 than Crysis 2. At the most somewhere between the two until Bethesda decides to enhance the quality at a later time like Crytek did with Crysis 2. Anyone with Crossfire 6950 or higher/SLI 570 or higher should overkill on frames with Skyrim and see similar results later on in future patches as to like when Crysis 2 got tessellation patched.

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/04/19/t...ectx-9-game-directx-11-support-a-possibility/

http://www.ausgamers.com/news/read/3049109

I was giving these serious thought to purchase, but I need a relatively quiet card, and many users report they are very loud when pushed. Note these comments from owners on Newegg:

Cons: Pricier for a 6950, 6970 shader unlocker switch makes this moot. Sounds like a ****ing banshee if you put it under very high stress.

Cons: Runs hotter than my 5850. Sounds like a vacuum cleaner while its under load as the rpms increase

Cons: Fan @ 60% manual sounds like a jet

JC

I wouldn't completely trust newegg comments. Sure, there are some good ones. Overall, I don't find the 6950/6970 loud unless your running them in Crossfire but that is a result of some current poor motherboard designs as they knew current graphic cards were taking up two spaces causing poor air flow between the cards which also resulted in louder noise with some cards. The Nvidia cards handle temps slightly better and don't have much noise issues.

Overall it depends on what you want to do with your cards.

I recommend the Sapphire 6950 Dirt 3 for better cooling and BIOS flashing to 6970.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102945

I recommend the Sapphire 6950 Toxic for decent cooling, BIOS flashing to 6970, and overall better overclocking potential (Factory OCed at 880 to 935MHz versus the Dirt 3 ranging 840 to 910).
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102951

I recommend the MSI N560GTX-Ti Twin Frozr II 2GB for the memory, cooling, and PhysX in gaming.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127608

I recommend the EVGA GTX570 2560MB for the memory, PhysX in gaming, and Warranty.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130687
[CON is pushing the price limit however, "absolute best bang and performance for the buck" as you put it.]


I know quite a few of the users here bought the Dirt 3 6950 and recommend it over the toxic, but between the two I'd prefer the toxic edition. Now I know I said the Dirt 3 card had better cooling while the Toxic had decent cooling however, while the Toxic runs hotter and louder the temp difference really isn't much and the same is said for the noise. If it made more of a difference than I would honestly prefer the Dirt 3 over Toxic despite the less clock speed. That's not the case and I don't.

As for Nvidia obviously you would look and choose the MSI 560 over the EVGA 570 for price however I thought I would toss it in for perspective. While you would be future proofed for some years gaming in Ultra Quality at 2560x1440 using the EVGA 570 in SLI your still pretty set using the MSI 560 in SLI.

So, me personally, throwing out the Dirt 3 and the EVGA 570 it comes down to either two Sapphire 6950 Toxic cards or two MSI GTX560 cards. After the Toxic's rebate you would end up spending about the same amount of money for which ever cards you choose.

Now I have to apologize. I could and wanted to go on about the choice between a 6950 versus a 560 when buying a new card but it's 4:30 am for me here and I'm tired so I'll just cut it short and say go with the 6950. It has more potential over a 560 and the only games worth having PhysX for at the moment are the Batman Arkham and Metro games. 4 good games with a feature not had in a slew of other great games isn't worth it unless investing in a higher Nvidia card with a long warranty to cover the cost.

I'm sure anyone can help you further if your still on the fence after reading my post.
 
MetaKnight said:
Skyrim is a beautiful game. It's can't be denied. However, Skyrim isn't going to push current graphic cards to their limit. I foresee it as being more Witcher 2 than Crysis 2.
That's not exactly promising as The Witcher 2 is both more demanding than Crysis 2, and the most demanding game I have ever seen tested.
 
That's not exactly promising as The Witcher 2 is both more demanding than Crysis 2, and the most demanding game I have ever seen tested.

Crysis 2 with DX11 and texture pack is definitely more demanding than Witcher 2... unless you use ubersampling for Witcher 2.
 
I consider all games at their maximum detail, even if there's something you can remove to reduce the demand substantially, most demanding games have one - AA for BF3, DX11 for Crysis 2, Ubersampling for The Witcher 2 and Depth of field for Metro 2033. Considering this, The Witcher 2 is far more demanding than Crysis 2. Even two GTX580s at 1080p can't manage a minimum of 30fps in the Witcher 2 maxed out, whereas in Crysis 2, even in DX11 mode they routinely run 45-50.
 
MetaKnight,


Thanks VERY much for your thoughtful and exceptionally well thought out information. I agree about the memory being an important factor, especially down the road. I'm leaning heavily towards the 6950's now, I think.......just torn by the best option there. I'm really being motivated by the ability to unlock the Sapphire Toxic cards with a switch (although some people have seen that fail to work). That said, the build quality of the Twin Frozrs is supposedly military grade, significantly exceeding the level of the Sapphires, and I'm still a bit concerned about the possible noise levels of the Sapphire. Of course, the Twin Frozr III is still out of stock, and has been for over a week, and my timeline to finish the build is getting tight, which doesn't help at all.

Again, thanks for taking the time for such a comprehensive commentary at so late an hour.

JC


Gaming at resolutions higher than 1920x1080 your best option is to go for a selection with higher memory. For Radeon that means 2GB and for Nvidia that means 2GB 560's, 2.5GB 570's. You wouldn't need the 580's and I wouldn't recommend it as you would be breaching the price/performance barrier.



Skyrim is a beautiful game. It's can't be denied. However, Skyrim isn't going to push current graphic cards to their limit. I foresee it as being more Witcher 2 than Crysis 2. At the most somewhere between the two until Bethesda decides to enhance the quality at a later time like Crytek did with Crysis 2. Anyone with Crossfire 6950 or higher/SLI 570 or higher should overkill on frames with Skyrim and see similar results later on in future patches as to like when Crysis 2 got tessellation patched.

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/04/19/t...ectx-9-game-directx-11-support-a-possibility/

http://www.ausgamers.com/news/read/3049109



I wouldn't completely trust newegg comments. Sure, there are some good ones. Overall, I don't find the 6950/6970 loud unless your running them in Crossfire but that is a result of some current poor motherboard designs as they knew current graphic cards were taking up two spaces causing poor air flow between the cards which also resulted in louder noise with some cards. The Nvidia cards handle temps slightly better and don't have much noise issues.

Overall it depends on what you want to do with your cards.

I recommend the Sapphire 6950 Dirt 3 for better cooling and BIOS flashing to 6970.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102945

I recommend the Sapphire 6950 Toxic for decent cooling, BIOS flashing to 6970, and overall better overclocking potential (Factory OCed at 880 to 935MHz versus the Dirt 3 ranging 840 to 910).
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102951

I recommend the MSI N560GTX-Ti Twin Frozr II 2GB for the memory, cooling, and PhysX in gaming.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127608

I recommend the EVGA GTX570 2560MB for the memory, PhysX in gaming, and Warranty.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130687
[CON is pushing the price limit however, "absolute best bang and performance for the buck" as you put it.]


I know quite a few of the users here bought the Dirt 3 6950 and recommend it over the toxic, but between the two I'd prefer the toxic edition. Now I know I said the Dirt 3 card had better cooling while the Toxic had decent cooling however, while the Toxic runs hotter and louder the temp difference really isn't much and the same is said for the noise. If it made more of a difference than I would honestly prefer the Dirt 3 over Toxic despite the less clock speed. That's not the case and I don't.

As for Nvidia obviously you would look and choose the MSI 560 over the EVGA 570 for price however I thought I would toss it in for perspective. While you would be future proofed for some years gaming in Ultra Quality at 2560x1440 using the EVGA 570 in SLI your still pretty set using the MSI 560 in SLI.

So, me personally, throwing out the Dirt 3 and the EVGA 570 it comes down to either two Sapphire 6950 Toxic cards or two MSI GTX560 cards. After the Toxic's rebate you would end up spending about the same amount of money for which ever cards you choose.

Now I have to apologize. I could and wanted to go on about the choice between a 6950 versus a 560 when buying a new card but it's 4:30 am for me here and I'm tired so I'll just cut it short and say go with the 6950. It has more potential over a 560 and the only games worth having PhysX for at the moment are the Batman Arkham and Metro games. 4 good games with a feature not had in a slew of other great games isn't worth it unless investing in a higher Nvidia card with a long warranty to cover the cost.

I'm sure anyone can help you further if your still on the fence after reading my post.
 
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If you're spending that kind of money, do you have an older card or cards you can migrate to the new build until the HD 7000 series comes out in a month or two?
 
If you're spending that kind of money, do you have an older card or cards you can migrate to the new build until the HD 7000 series comes out in a month or two?

I appreciate the thought, but current word, at least what I have seen, is that the 7000 series now won't likely be out until sometime in the 1st quarter. Also, upon release, cards are usually priced at max levels and that doesn't change for a number of months.

I do have a reference 5850 and could add a second one for less than $150.00, and run them in Crossfire to get me by, just not thinking it would make sense to go that route. Anyone else's thoughts on this?


JC
 
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Will SLI/CF be necessary for Skyrim @1080P? It's a DX9 console port and the recommended specs werent anything demanding. I"d say get a 2GB 6950/70 first and see if that will satisfy your needs, then get a second when you upgrade monitors.
 
Will SLI/CF be necessary for Skyrim @1080P? It's a DX9 console port and the recommended specs werent anything demanding. I"d say get a 2GB 6950/70 first and see if that will satisfy your needs, then get a second when you upgrade monitors.


Agreed.


JC
 
Talk about irritating, I just went to Newegg to finally order a card, as my time was essentially up. With the MSI Twin Frozr III 6950 2gb out of stock for over ten days I decided finally go go with the Sapphite Toxic, and it's just now gone out of stock. So I decide to default to a pair of Twin Frozr 6870's, which would only have run me $319.00, total, with the two $35.00 rebates, and I find out that the rebates expired on the 31'st, and given that its after midnight, no deal. Further, all rebates on MSI and Asus cards expired on the 31'st.

I am incredibly frustrated!


JC
 
Talk about irritating, I just went to Newegg to finally order a card, as my time was essentially up. With the MSI Twin Frozr III 6950 2gb out of stock for over ten days I decided finally go go with the Sapphite Toxic, and it's just now gone out of stock. So I decide to default to a pair of Twin Frozr 6870's, which would only have run me $319.00, total, with the two $35.00 rebates, and I find out that the rebates expired on the 31'st, and given that its after midnight, no deal. Further, all rebates on MSI and Asus cards expired on the 31'st.

I am incredibly frustrated!


JC

Order the sapphire dirt 3 edition then. A good choice IMHO.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102945&Tpk=sapphire dirt 3 6950
 
I just went back to Newegg to order this card, which has been very well reviewed, and now it's out of stock too.......unbelievable


HIS IceQ X Turbo X H695QNX2G2M Radeon HD 6950 2GB


JC
 
I thought only the Toxic was made on 6970 pcb, and had the switch to flip it into a 6970, which made the Toxic THE card to get?


JC

Negative :) The dirt 3 also has a switch and simply flipping it gives you 1536 shaders just like the toxic. The only difference between the 2 cards is the coolers where the dirt 3 edition has a dual fan vapor cooler vs a single fan on the toxic and the toxic having a higher GPU frequency out of the box.

Here is a pic of the well hidden switch on the dirt 3 edition

IMG_1913.jpg
 
I just went back to Newegg to order this card, which has been very well reviewed, and now it's out of stock too.......unbelievable


HIS IceQ X Turbo X H695QNX2G2M Radeon HD 6950 2GB


JC

Hurry before the dirt 3 gets sold out on you, it's definitely the next one to go. :D

In fact I'm about to place a order for 30 in

10, 9, 8, 7....
 
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