Building HD HTPC, need suggestions/help

T

titaniumone

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Jul 11, 2007
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Hello! I'm parting together an HD HTPC after the July 22nd Intel price drop, and I need your advice. My primary source of content will be downloaded 720p MKV files (x264 / h264, in the range of 5000kbps to 10000kbps -- my 3800+ X2 desktop struggles with the higher end ones).

I'll be sending the video signal to a 720p DLP projector (Mitsubishi HD1000) using a DVI->HDMI cable from Monoprice (which I already have). I've tried this on my roommate's PC which has an 8600GT video card and it works great, so I know I won't have problems here.

I'll be sending the audio signal from the motherboard's onboard COAX S/PDIF to Logitech Z-5500 speakers. I plan on using S/PDIF passthrough so that the HTPC either sends a stereo PCM signal or a Dolby Digital signal to the Z-5500's, and they do all the decoding themselves. Is this right, and will it work OK? I've never used S/PDIF before, and I want to make sure stereo sound comes out in stereo (so I can set the Z-5500's to use ProLogic) and AC3 encoded files come out in 5.1 so the Z-5500's automatically know what to do and don't need ProLogic on.

As for the actual parts, how does this look? I intend to try overclocking the CPU a little bit. I don't need to get it very high since this will be an HTPC only, and not for serious gaming. I wouldn't mind getting a little extra power from it though. I also don't want to spend a boatload of money on it; I just want a sufficiently fast system that looks good in the living room. I don't need to worry about storage because this machine will be networked and I have loads of storage space on my network.

Updated July 22 (prices in CAD):

Antec NSK2400 New Solution mATX Desktop Case 2X5.25 2X3.5INT 380W ATX12V V2.0 Silver Black
$108.63

Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 500GB SATA2 3GB/S 7200RPM 16MB Cache NCQ Hard Drive
$99.99

Crucial Ballistix PC2-6400 2GB 2X1GB DDR2-800 CL4-4-4-12 240PIN Dual Channel Memory Kit
$134.99

ASUS P5K-VM mATX LGA775 G33 DDR2 1PCI-E16 2PCI 1PCI-E4 SATA2 Video Sound GBLAN 1394 Motherboard
$125.99

Intel Core 2 Duo E6550 Dual Core Processor LGA775 Conroe 2.33GHZ 1333FSB 4MB Retail
$184.99

EVGA E-GEFORCE 8500GT 450MHZ 256MB 128BIT DDR2 PCI-E Dual DVI-I HDTV Out DIRECTX10 Video Card
$83.99

Liteon SHD-16S1S-05 16X Black SATA DVD-ROM Drive OEM
$27.74

Total $847.67

For software, I haven't completely decided. I've tried a lot of programs, but most seem rather unpolished. I'm used to XBox Media Center, and those of you who have used it know how professional and well-done it is.

I'm considering either using Windows XP and MediaPortal (which is similar to XBMC in some ways), or using Windows Vista's Media Center. I'm not a big fan of XP MCE, but Vista's looks nice. I have licenses for both XP and Vista through my school, so cost isn't an issue at all; I just need to find out which I'd be better off using.

Suggestions on my hardware, software, or connection choices? I want to make sure this entire thing goes smoothly and I don't end up hitting my head on my desk trying to make things work. Thanks!
 
You should have no problem with a lower end cpu like a e4300 or x2 3600. I'm guessing right now your x2 3800+ is struggling because you are using inefficient codecs. Try using CoreAVC + Haali + AC3 Filter + Media Player Classic. Even my file server with a A64 3400+ can playback most of the higher bitrate 720p stuff without struggling. A dual core most definitely handles it. My brother's PC with a x2 3800+ plays back all the 1080p content I've tried on it without breaking a sweat over 70% CPU usage with no hardware acceleration. (excluding HDDVD)

Oh, on the OS choice, go with Vista. You'll probably be impressed. I use it and it handles HD content MUCH better than XP does. Less glitches/crashes, smoother playback, more software support through purevideo hd, etc..
 
w1retap said:
You should have no problem with a lower end cpu like a e4300 or x2 3600. I'm guessing right now your x2 3800+ is struggling because you are using inefficient codecs. Try using CoreAVC + Haali + AC3 Filter + Media Player Classic. Even my file server with a A64 3400+ can playback most of the higher bitrate 720p stuff without struggling. A dual core most definitely handles it. My brother's PC with a x2 3800+ plays back all the 1080p content I've tried on it without breaking a sweat over 70% CPU usage with no hardware acceleration. (excluding HDDVD)

Oh, on the OS choice, go with Vista. You'll probably be impressed. I use it and it handles HD content MUCH better than XP does. Less glitches/crashes, smoother playback, more software support through purevideo hd, etc..
Click to expand...

I'm currently using VLC, which isn't super efficient, but isn't awful either. I've tried MPC and it uses about 1/4 the CPU time VLC does, but does a horrible job at playback in comparison. I get a visibly lower framerate in MPC; I'm not sure by how much, but it isn't even nearly as 'smooth' as in VLC.

I don't want to buy a processor which is just fast enough with certain codecs, because then I have to restrict my player choices. For example, if MPC+Haali+CoreAVC is the only thing that can play my media with no frames dropped, I can't use Vista Media Center, since it won't use the exact same codecs/settings and might drop frames. I'd end up boxing myself into a corner with what software I could use. I want to make sure I can choose any software and still have it run the video fine. Right now since I don't have an HTPC I just use my roommate's computer and navigate to the folder where media is stored, right click, and open with VLC, then choose Fullscreen from the menu bar. This works as a temporary solution, but sucks as an interface for a 'real' HTPC. I'd like to use something nice and clean, like Media Center. And being a Microsoft product, it isn't exactly open to change or configuration of codecs and such. How much configurability is there for controlling what it uses?

Also, when talking about playback, you really need to give bitrates for the video and audio as well. My 3800 X2 has no problem with Apple's 1080p HD trailers, because they are at a hilariously low bitrate (something like 4000kbps). Most of the 720p video I have is over 7000kbps; if I were to get 1080p video it would be over 12000kbps, just for the video. The audio is 500kbps and up for AC3.

Also note I won't be using HD-DVD or Blu Ray. I will only be watching downloaded content for now, all of which is h264 or x264 in Matroska containers. That influences my choices as well, since I know there isn't really any hardware support by most players that will play those files.


Comments?
 
I'm currently at work unable to check the bitrates of my movies, but they are the best encoded quality for the resolution without an excessive file size. Almost all of my 720p's are DVD9's, and 1080p's range from 9GB to 15GB. Some are x264, some are mpeg2. Audio is in the format of 5.1, either DTS or AC3 full original bitrate.

As far as integration into a media center application, I haven't done it yet. Support for ANY media center interface isn't all that great from what I've experienced in the past. I am in the process of building my HD HTPC right now with Vista Home Premium, so I'll see how it goes as far as codecs integrating into the media center portion of it. Right now on my main PC I'm running Vista Business with the CoreAVC + Haali + Xvid + AC3 Filter + MPC. Quality is great and playback is smooth. I have control over all the codecs and can change/tweak what I want. My brother is using the same setup, but on a X2 3800+. He experiences the same playback I do. All is well.
 
Processor is overkill IMO. I would focus on something cooler/slower. Also, I would rather focus on more drive space (After all, this is a HTPC right?!). Also, I would suggest VISTA media center for a host of reasons, that will definitely be my next OS build (currently using MCE05)
 
10,000 kbps 720p x264 is overkill imo. I'd guess your quants are in 'excessive' range (ie, beyond being visible). 'Scene' is like ~3,000 kbps, good HD is like 4,500 to 6,000 kbps.
 
w1retap said:
As far as integration into a media center application, I haven't done it yet. Support for ANY media center interface isn't all that great from what I've experienced in the past. I am in the process of building my HD HTPC right now with Vista Home Premium, so I'll see how it goes as far as codecs integrating into the media center portion of it.
Click to expand...
Exactly, and that is why I'm going a bit overboard on the CPU. If I can't get the right filters to be used by my chosen media center, I can just overcome the poorness of the filter by brute strength. At least, that's the plan.


Ockie said:
Processor is overkill IMO. I would focus on something cooler/slower. Also, I would rather focus on more drive space (After all, this is a HTPC right?!). Also, I would suggest VISTA media center for a host of reasons, that will definitely be my next OS build (currently using MCE05)
Click to expand...
What CPU would you recommend instead? I don't think going down a few steps would help much for temperature, since all of the processors are 65nm, and they run pretty cool at stock speeds. The system is networked, and I have a lot of harddrive space on other machines on the network, so I don't need the HTPC to store everything locally.

disc said:
10,000 kbps 720p x264 is overkill imo. I'd guess your quants are in 'excessive' range (ie, beyond being visible). 'Scene' is like ~3,000 kbps, good HD is like 4,500 to 6,000 kbps.
Click to expand...
Most scene releases I've seen (ESiR, SEPTiC, iLL) are anywhere from 4800 at the low end to 9100 at the high end. Action movies tend to be pretty high or else you get some serious macroblocking in high motion scenes (water, explosions, etc).


edit: I appreciate the feedback so far. I'd really like if anyone would be able to tell me if I'm making any major mistakes with other components aside from the CPU, and if the SPDIF audio should work OK, as I hear a lot of conflicting information on how well SPDIF works for people. Also, software suggestions, if people happen to know of some small application which happens to be great but isn't well known.
 
ESiR and company exceed 'scene' standards and are what I would call good HD. Given that, I'm not sure I've ever seen a 9,100 kbps x264, but I certainly don't watch everything.

Back on topic, as w1re said, x264 support just sucks right now. There are a couple of ways to hack it, but as far as I know, no major front end supports it well. I achieve my x264 viewing by using MPC (with CoreAVC + Haali). I use HIP to map my remote control buttons to keypresses, so I can do everything in MPC (one button to bring up the 'open file' dialog, two buttons to navigate etc). It's far from slick, but it does work, and doesn't require lifting my ass off my sofa.

As far as SPDIF, I've used AC3Filter with MPC with no problems. My Onkyo receives the signal without any trouble.
 
That's good news, then.

I'm considering using Vista Media Center now, as it looks pretty polished. I'm going to set it up in VMWare so I can see it first-hand and decide if I like it or not.

How much of a pain will it be to get Vista MCE to use the codecs I want, and to output bit-perfect audio? Stereo PCM when it's a stereo file, and Dolby Digital or DTS when the file contains that data? I know this whole area is apparently a pain in the ass still; I'm hoping it will work well when I set it up.
 
I tested Vista MCE last night in VMWare. Although it doesn't run very well since it's being emulated, it still gave me a decent feel for it -- I didn't like it much. It still didn't feel even close to as well thought-out or put together as XBMC does.

I may end up using it though since my options appear to be pretty limited. I will be using a wireless keyboard and mouse (not a remote) so I can get away with pretty much any interface, but I'd really like to use a 'real' media center UI.

How difficult is it to get Vista MCE to play things like x264 video, do proper SPDIF bit-perfect output, etc? I didn't bother trying it in VMWare because it was struggling just on XviD.
 
Updated first post with some component changes. Suggestions, and any ideas on where I could cut some corners to save some cash? The case is pretty pricey but I can't find any small-yet-HTPC cases other than it.
 
titaniumone said:
Updated first post with some component changes. Suggestions, and any ideas on where I could cut some corners to save some cash? The case is pretty pricey but I can't find any small-yet-HTPC cases other than it.
Click to expand...
Why not go with the NSK2400 then?
 
titaniumone said:
The color, actually. The only thing I really like about the Fusion over the NSK2400 is that it is black. Although, honestly, paying ~$85 for a black faceplate is pretty stupid.
Click to expand...

Anyhow, you can easily paint/dye the NSK2400 faceplate black. It all comes apart super easy with a few screws.
 
titaniumone said:
The colour, actually. The only thing I really like about the Fusion over the NSK2400 is that it is black.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, I forget that they just started releasing the Fusion in black.
Although, honestly, paying ~$85 for a black faceplate is pretty stupid.
Click to expand...
Anyhow, you can easily paint/dye the NSK2400 faceplate black. It all comes apart super easy with a few screws.
Click to expand...
Wiretap speaks the truth, get some spray paint and take that thing apart and paint it black, theres no need in spending $10+ on a case if the only difference is the color.
 
Allright I'll have a go at this.


In no particular order:


1. Why not consider another case? That thing is a bit expensive imho, and doesn't cool as well as some other options.

This case:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811190088http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811190049

Is 60 bucks and by far my favorite desktop atx case. Why? It's nice and sleek, AND it has 2x120mm fand that blow across the length of the mobo. It fits a full size power supply, and has a cpu vent.

It's not as nice as some of the Ahanix datx cases I've had, but it cools a HELL of alot better.

2. Processor:
Why not get an E4400 for ~120 bucks. You can get it to do 3ghz on voltages, and it will decode whatever you through at it with ease. That extra cache is not worth 70 dollars.

3. Memory:
Don't spend all that money on that ballistix. Go get the 2gb ocz kit at clubit for ~60 bucks AR. It'll server you just fine.

4. Think carefully about the mobo. Make sure it's digital outputs work correctly, it is passively cooled and runs cool, and sleep works flawlessly.

5. Vcard:
You're on the right track. You want an 8500gt if you're doing no gaming. Get the passively cooled gigabyte though, here:
http://clubit.com/product_detail.cfm?itemno=A9630946

6. Optical:
You can get a sata dvd burner for <40 shipped. I'd spend the extra few bucks to get it. I have a few reasons why.

7. PSU:
Get a seasonic if you can find it cheap enough. Otherwise, get the 520W Corsair (seasonic). You can find it for ~80. Another good choice is the ocz guys with the 120mm fans.

8. I like VMC, but that's just me.

9. How to setup codecs:
In this order:
1. FFDShow . . . disable 264/mpeg2
2. powerdvd
3. coreavc
4. haali media splitter . .disable ts
5. use .reg script to enable mkv/mp4/ogg/ts VMC recognition
6. use vmcd.exe to set default mpeg2 decoder to Powerdvd

Trust me on this. I've tried alot of different things.

10. On decoding your stuff - 720p should be no problem with the above and your current setup. With the new, you can get 1080p playback fine as well.

11. Z5500's. Great bang for buck.
Get them here if you don't have them:
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=A0405790

12. Tuners? You didn't mention anything about tv tuners. I like the hdhomerun for hd content, and the ATI offerings for analog.

13. I'm serious about the case. Those matx cases will get hot in a hurry. I am picky about my stuff, and I like it to be nice and cool. VERY FEW htpc cases cool that well. The link I gave you cools GREAT.

That's all I've got . . . .


Ahh . . and a pic of my secondary mce box that's in the case above. I know it's not superclean . . but you'll get the point.

 
Done. I'll get the NSK2400 instead. List updated. Any thoughts on the remaining parts? I'm hoping to overclock the E6550 a bit (hopefully to 2.6ghz or so).
 
Good feedback, thanks. That case is really nice [edit: ..removed comment about PSU; I see it's standard AT, and thus replacable]. How's the build quality? I've never heard of Athenatech before, and my two Antec cases are built like tanks. [edit 2: wait, I think you linked the wrong case. The PSU/backplane position on your case don't match the images on Newegg that you linked.]

The processor I'm worried about skimping on in case I can't overclock it well or it runs hot when OC'd. It's more of just a 'buffer' than anything else. Would I definitely be able to OC the E4400 without any issues?

If I get the E4400, what speed RAM should I get? 667 or 800? I was intending to go with the 1333mhz FSB CPU (E6550) and pair it up with 800, as recommended in the SFF thread "First look at P5K-VM".

The motherboard I'm still mulling over, but the P5K-VM seems to be a hit around here, so I feel confident in it.

I'm mainly going with the E-VGA card because it's cheaper and has a rebate, making it about $40 cheaper than the gigabyte card.

I already have a burner in my desktop, so I only need a reader in the HTPC.

The Z-5500's I already own, and have been very happy with for some time. I'm looking forward to using them with the projector.


And thanks for the codec advice!
 
:)

Sorry guys, I fixed the link. Sure as hell looked the same.

Link fixed, check it out now. The case is an Athenatech EVO

It's built "ok". It's not like a tank. That said, you take care of it and it'll take care of you.

1. Check out the new case link. You can probably find it cheaper than that. Look around.

2. I have built 7 boxes around the E4400 for different folks. My htpc has one in it. The E4400 has a 200mhz bus and a 10x multi. That means that it'll do 3ghz at 300fsb. You shouldn't have any problems getting a board to do that. I typically use badaxe 2's because I love how stable they are when cared for properly. I've NEVER seen an E4400 that wouldn't do 3ghz on stock volts. With a good cooler your temps will be just fine - especially since you can get that on stock volts! Trust me on this, use a good board and you'll be just fine.

3. I don't know much about the P5K. Remember that you can use full atx boards in that case. I like the 975x boards just because they run quite a bit cooler than anything nvidia has come out with in a long time. The P35 boards seem to be hotter than even the 680i boards.

4. Shop around and you might be able to find that gigabyte card cheaper. It's a htpc, it's should be quite, and a passive card goes a long way at doing that.

5. Most of my burners have a higher media compatability than the pure readers I have. . . . who knows.

6. Yep . . . just wanted to make sure you weren't paying 300 for those speakers.

7. Yep . . the codecs work a very nice trick.


P.S. Sorry about linking you to a super gay case. rofl
 
That case looks pretty good, but it's large. I'm trying to get the smallest case I can get (without getting something really awkward to work with like an X-Pack or whatever that popular cube case is called).

I've revised my list again, shaving over $200 off the price. How does this look now? Will it be able to handle downloaded HD content (say x264, 720p, 8000kbps) without dropping any frames at all?

Should I be able to overclock the CPU with this motherboard/ram combination?

Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 160GB Hard Drive SATA2 7200RPM 11MS 8MB Cache 5YR MFR Warranty
$57.99

Corsair XMS2 TWIN2X2048-5400C4 2GB 2X1GB PC2-5400 DDR2-667 CL 4-4-4-12 240PIN Dual Channel Memory
$99.99

ASUS P5K-VM mATX LGA775 G33 DDR2 1PCI-E16 2PCI 1PCI-E4 SATA2 Video Sound GBLAN 1394 Motherboard
$125.99

Intel Core 2 Duo E4400 Dual Core Processor LGA775 Conroe 2.00GHZ 800FSB 2MB Retail
$129.99

XFX GeForce 8400GS 450MHZ 256MB 64BIT 800MHZ DDR2 PCI-E VGA DVI-I HDCP HDTV Out DIRECTX10 Video Card
$65.99

Antec NSK2400 New Solution mATX Desktop Case 2X5.25 2X3.5INT 380W ATX12V V2.0 Silver Black
$108.63

Liteon SHD-16S1S-05 16X Black SATA DVD-ROM Drive OEM
$27.74

Total $616.32
 
Some component suggestions:

E4400 for 118 shipped:
http://clubit.com/product_detail.cfm?itemno=A1938430

2gb PC6400 OCZ Ram for 62 bucks

http://www.clubit.com/product_detail.cfm?itemno=CA4308301
with coupon code: WEB07234308301

or 80 shipped with no rebate:
https://shop4.outpost.com/product/5008315?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

or 66.9 after rebate
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=85236

Trust me on the ram. The top one will do you great and save you a load.

HD:
If you have just a touch of patience you could get a 320gb 7200.10 Seagate from Frys.com for 59.99. You can also ALWAYS get some form of 500gb drive for 99.

I don't know how much storage space you need, but getting 320gb w/ 16mb cache is better than that 160gb for the same price.

If you need storage space the 500gb drives are the best deal right now imho.

Videocard:

That thing is a little gimped. I'd go with the 8500gt personally. It's slow and it only has a 64bit memory interface. Off the top of my head I don't even know if it supports the full 264 acceleration that the 8500/8600 series do. I kiind of doubt it. Don't skimp here, it's too important.

Case:

In the end the only thing that matters with the case is that you are able to fit it where it needs to go, and it cools quietly and efficiently. If you think that EVO is too big for you, then get something else.

I just had a look at that case. It looks like Antec took a que from EVO and put those nice fans in it. That's good.


Mobo:

I don't claim to know much about 775 matx boards. At one time none of them overclocked worth a damn. Cruise over to the small form factor section and make sure it will overclock for you. I'd say that you want it to be able to do 300mhz FSB on stock settings. If it won't, think about getting a bigger case so you can go full atx.


Depending on your setup, a deep desktop atx case might not be an issue. Also, you havn't mentioned any tuner cards. If you don't have any, then the Qpack or Microfly would work a charm and be much cheaper.


For instance, you can get the Micro Fly for 40 bucks here:
http://shop4.outpost.com/product/4898990

If you don't need more than a single pci card and that videocard, it'll work like a charm for you. If size is of consideration, it wins hands down. I personally like the EVO though, as it gives you more options, and better cooling.


I'm just trying to help you out. Take my suggestions as just that, in the end it's your money.
 
Thanks, but all of my prices are in CAD. Most of them are comparable to the ones you posted, and most of those places won't ship to Canada :(

I've got over 1.5TB of storage space on my network, so I'm okay for space overall, but I did change the drive to a better one for price/GB.

According to the SFF forum, the P5K-VM can hit >400FSB, so I think I should be able to overclock to around 3GHZ with no problem and still have my RAM running OK.

I don't need a TV tuner card for now. I may add one later, but I don't even have cable, let alone HD of any sort. The internet is my video source.

Updated parts list:

ASUS P5K-VM mATX LGA775 G33 DDR2 1PCI-E16 2PCI 1PCI-E4 SATA2 Video Sound GBLAN 1394 Motherboard
$125.99

EVGA E-GEFORCE 8500GT 450MHZ 256MB 128BIT DDR2 PCI-E Dual DVI-I HDTV Out DIRECTX10 Video Card
$83.99

Liteon SHD-16S1S-05 16X Black SATA DVD-ROM Drive OEM
$20.04

Antec NSK2400 New Solution mATX Desktop Case 2X5.25 2X3.5INT 380W ATX12V V2.0 Silver Black
$103.91

Western Digital SE16 320GB SATA2 7200RPM 16MB 8.9MS Hard Drive OEM 3 Year MFR Warranty
$78.99

Corsair XMS2 TWIN2X2048-5400C4 2GB 2X1GB PC2-5400 DDR2-667 CL 4-4-4-12 240PIN Dual Channel Memory
$95.18

Intel Core 2 Duo E4400 Dual Core Processor LGA775 Conroe 2.00GHZ 800FSB 2MB Retail
$129.99

Total $638 CAD
 
Looks good, throw Vista Premium (or just reuse an XP license) and your good to go.
 
Even though it's a bit more expensive, I think I'm going to go with the passively cooled Gigabyte, since it also supports HDCP.

And with that, I think I am good to go. I'm still looking for a smaller case, but I doubt I'll find one -- the NSK2400 is probably what I'll end up going with. Thanks for the advice.
 
Will the 8500GT fanless + P5K-VM + NSK2400 all fit? The 8500GT has a pretty big heatsink and the PCI-E slot is right next to the RAM on the P5K.
 
They fit. I've got a 8500GT in mine as well as an Asus mobo with a similar layout.
 
CrimandEvil said:
They fit. I've got a 8500GT in mine as well as an Asus mobo with a similar layout.
Click to expand...

Awesome, thanks.

Should I be OK with the Corsair XMS2 memory for overclocking? It's a fair bit less than the Ballistix. I know Corsair makes good components, but I don't know about this type of memory specifically.
 
Find out what you want your HTPC to do. I think you need a good remote, software to configure what you want your remote to do.

MyHTPC
 
The Tech Report just posted this review of the new barebones Shuttle: http://www.techreport.com/reviews/2007q3/shuttle-sg33g5/index.x?pg=1

It actually looks pretty damn good, and it's under $300 at Newegg. Considering you get a case, powersupply, and motherboard with video built-in, it's about the same price as the components I was planning on buying, and you get a much smaller form factor. The FSB easily goes over 300 as well, meaning I could get an E4400 (10x mult) up to 3GHZ without any real problems! The only downsides are of course expandability later since it's a Shuttle. I do like how small it is though.

Any thoughts?
 
It does everything, BTW, get a 750Gb hard drive and you're all set. Since it has eSATA, you can always add more storage. The case is a little bulky to me. I like the ones that look like a receiver or dvd player.

Cheers,
 
How are they for reliability and such? I can't get one in Canada (any retailers have the price jacked WAY up and are little fly-by-night places... nowhere I trust).

I could potentially get someone to buy it from Newegg and bring it up to me, but then if it breaks I'm screwed.
 
Thanks to veras for pointing out to me that NCIX does carry that Shuttle. I'm trying to get in touch with them now to cancel my order so that I can remove my P5K-VM and 8500GT from the order, and get the Shuttle instead, to give me:

SG33G5
E4400 cpu
2GB corsair ram
500GB WD hdd

Should be a good little system!
 
Yeah, I'm probably going to order one this week too... I just hope the IGP is up to the task.
 
veras said:
Yeah, I'm probably going to order one this week too... I just hope the IGP is up to the task.
Click to expand...

I know the IGP isn't. It doesn't do any sort of acceleration. I'm going to be relying on the CPU entirely, which I know will be fast enough for my needs. YMMV.
 
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