BenQ releases XL2410T, their first 120 Hz monitor

Discussion in 'Displays' started by mistar, Sep 20, 2010.

  1. UnrealChrisG

    UnrealChrisG n00b

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    I was wondering if the instant mode works through HDMI/VGA, or is this a DVI only feature?
    Posted via Mobile Device
     
  2. Serzhas

    Serzhas n00b

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    100% brightness will introduce ghosting for sure. 30% is golden average, IMHO.
    Pollaxe, could you please (if it is possible) check your display in 3D mode with Resident Evil 5? The very first level is very contrast, and I'm experiencing incredibly high ghosting in it. Especially if I'm looking up to the sky and some wires is visible on the screen.
    Thank you :)
     
  3. pollaxe

    pollaxe [H]Lite

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    oqvist & Serzhas:

    I'm not using 3D with it, I'm afraid and no real plans to do so - I don't have a copy of Resident Evil 5, either, sorry chaps.

    I am due at a LAN tonight and will be using the monitor so I can report back over the weekend. I'm not a 100% brightness fan, generally. I set the profile to Movie I think, last night when I was doofing around but I've not had much chance to tweak or test it beyond the 10 mins of L4D2 last night. Currently at work, so quite far away from it too!
     
  4. UnrealChrisG

    UnrealChrisG n00b

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    I think I am going to pick this monitor up on my lunch break. It would be nice to know if the Instant Mode works in HDMI, because if it doesn't I'll be returning it as soon as I find out. So does anyone know if the instant mode works in HDMI? :confused:
     
  5. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I don´t know if it works but I have had a blast playing williams pinball classics in my PS 3 on it. I didn´t sense any input lag whatsoever. Being so used to my Sony TV it often felt like the flippers read my mind and acted on their own. I never chacked if instant mode was great out or not though but input lag is surely not an issue through the HDMI port either way.

    Pinball is an excellent test for bost ghosting and input lag. Ghosting is still visible but it´s still very admirable for a slow LCD panel I would say.

    pollaxe no sane person would use 100 % brightness if you are not in 3D mode. But it´s a good test to see how much backlight bleed you got. Even if it´s not visible on a black background you can still see how it causes colour banding nd such issues using less brightness. Hopefully your is better then mine. I sent mine back to rma but I don´t have that high expectations. A friend has a triple monitor setup of these and he also got quite some backlight bleed on them.

    Still its the 3D monitor currently available that ticks my boxes. Really crossing my fingers the backlight bleed can be improved by firmware or getting a golden sample :D
     
  6. UnrealChrisG

    UnrealChrisG n00b

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    Dang, well I didn't get a chance to go get it at lunch. But I plan on doing so on Monday, I REALLY don't want to buy this and then have to return it if I find out INSTANT MODE doesn't work with HDMI.

    I read on a review website that the average inputlag without the instant mode was 20ms, with it on it was around 5-6ms average. That's a pretty huge difference
     
  7. pollaxe

    pollaxe [H]Lite

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    Sanity is overrated anyway! :D I tend to like the brightness pretty high on my tvs but not *that* bright, obviously but certainly in the higher reaches as a rule.

    Anyway, when I got to the LAN last night I'd set it to Movie mode previously and it was at 100% brightness as default but time was pressing so I dropped it down to the 50ish mark and set off playing. It was good throughout, my mate's Samsung (a B2230H, I think) was next to it and it looked a better, far more even picture than on his. On a few occasions we were in total blackness (Left4Dead2 trying not to scare a witch with our flashlights!) and the backlight bleed on his monitor (another TN panel I believe?) was far more noticeable than mine. Though of course this may be a subjective experience and we were moving around quite a bit and all impressions were based on a quick glance basis.

    Now, I didn't get this monitor for 3D but I did buy it for another reason, I'm a sufferer with both motion sickness and migraines and both can easily set in with FPS games at LANs. Anecdotally, I'd heard from someone I know (though not well) with similar problems who'd found that 120hz monitors seemed to lessen those effects and I have to say that I survived last night with nothing more than feeling over full from too much Coca-Cola and too many Kettle Chips.

    We finished around 4 a.m. and I have to say I was very happy with the monitor in terms of even picture, smoothness in game and the backlight. Maybe I'm easily pleased or maybe I've just been lucky and got a monitor from a good batch, I don't know!
     
  8. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Nice... As for motion sickness the BenQ has a very good control for simulating a 17", 19" monitor etc. Smaller monitor generally helps in that regard as well :)

    I generally run 30 % on brightness and it´s still a bit bright when not using 3D vision. I preferr not to overdo brightness because it destroy colours and the sense of depth I feel.

    @UnrealChrisG about 20 ms input lag is not that noticable anyway either if it´s the average. It´s about the same as on my BenQ G2400W. It´s pretty much a non issue and I hate input lag :)
    6 ms is better for sure but I doubt you will find it a deal breaker if it doesn´t work through HDMI.
     
  9. UnrealChrisG

    UnrealChrisG n00b

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    Alright I bought it, it works great! Instant mode works through HDMI! After adjusting some of the settings the monitor looks way better than my last one


    Almost NO backlight bleeding either, I got one manufactured in JAN 2011. So they may have possibly fixed all the issues with it
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2011
  10. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Have you tried 100 % brightness?
     
  11. UnrealChrisG

    UnrealChrisG n00b

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    No, as soon as I got it I changed all the settings, I am using standard mode with

    38 brightness, 50 contrast, 2.2 gama, 99red 100 green 99 blue, looks pretty sweet, and the 120hz is freakin amazing, looks so unreal
     
  12. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Try 100 % brightness and come back regarding backlight bleed. It´s greatly reduced as you lower the brightness.
     
  13. UnrealChrisG

    UnrealChrisG n00b

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    I cranked it up, I notice some light bleed towards the bottom, but even at max brightness it wouldn't be enough to ruin the monitor for me. Max brightness hurts my eyes anyways so I prefer to use something below 50
     
  14. Serzhas

    Serzhas n00b

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    Hello guys. I need your help, badly...
    Yesterday I received my XL2410T back from service after firmware update. Now it's latest available version - 005. However, this brought me NO JOY AT ALL, since I cannot get my display to work in 3D anymore... Prior to service it was perfectly possible to select any resolution with either 60Hz or 120Hz refresh ratio. Now it's only 60Hz available for "HD, SD" section in nVidia control panel, and only 100Hz in "PC" section. The only resolutions for with 120Hz is available is 1440x900 and lower... When I start 3D Wizard I'm getting warning "attempt to run Stereoscopic in non-stereo display mode, please change to a acceptable mode" and 3D doesn't work. If I check display information via OSD, it reports that current resolution: 1920x1080x100Hz, suggested: 1920x1080x120Hz
    I have tried almost everything I could think of - reinstalling all the drivers (video/display/3D vision), disabling all unwanted software, resetting XL2410T settings - nothing helps. At the end I decided to reinstall my Windows 7 (64bit), and guess what? That doesn't help either! :(
    Does anybody in there have had something similar to my problem? Is there a solution for it?
    Thanks in advance, guys.
     
  15. joeshmoe

    joeshmoe Limp Gawd

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    Bummer :(
    Have you tried calling BenQ tech support?
     
  16. Serzhas

    Serzhas n00b

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    Yeps. They asked me to bring display back for service... I will report afterward.
     
  17. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    ugh... my monitor is back for service now. Is it supposed to work with FW 5 or not?
     
  18. Serzhas

    Serzhas n00b

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    I hope so. There is 005 displays on market, so they SHOULD work! :) Perhaps my case is because of faulty firmware update or bad cable.
     
  19. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I just got back my XL2410T. I actually got a new one never opened. So far no backlight bleed! As a result no color banding the image is unison across the board! I tried except for some 3D movies Far Cry 2 at night and FSX at night also. Virtually no visibility whatsoever so I think I would notice if it was there. Look at my pictures above on my old XL2410T!

    This monitor appear darker but I suppose the backlight need some time to warm up and reach their full potential? I really hope there wan´t be developing any problems in the next few days. Things are supposed to get better not worse though.

    I checked firmware and it´s FW03. I suppose it´s not the firmware that is the issue but QC or they reduced maximum brightness with later models? I don´t know what batch this belongs to compared to the previous.
     
  20. Serzhas

    Serzhas n00b

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    Happy you! I'm still waiting for my display back from service (second time)...
     
  21. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I see. If it doesn´t help demand a new one! I asked a friend that uses three of these with eye finitiy and he hasn´t noticed any issues with any of them. Two FW02 and one FW03. No difference between his.
     
  22. zod96

    zod96 Suspected BAD TRADER

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    I may get this tomorrow from FRYs for $399. Is it that much better for games then the Dell U23 which is IPS and only $249 right now? This would be for BC2 and the up and coming BF3...
     
  23. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It´s better and worse depending on what areas are the most important for you.

    For me it´s near perfect looking at the practical side. VGA/DVI/HDMI=check. 1:1 pixel scaling on all inputs check
    Fully adjustable stand check. Adjustability is important for TN panels with their small optimum viewing area. Also have a center speaker behind it which get free air when I raise my monitor up. Super sturdy for my simracing check. My previous BenQ wobbles like crazy in comparison. I also find the storage part very useful for the glasses and other small stuff.

    Just wished it was 16:10 rather then 16:9
     
  24. zod96

    zod96 Suspected BAD TRADER

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    What is the going price on them? Is $400 about right?
     
  25. Pastuch

    Pastuch Limp Gawd

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    They are $350 in Canada. I would expect similar pricing in the US.

    I am VERY close to buying one of these. The incredibly low input lag is the biggest selling point. I may wait a little longer to see if the Asus VG278HE comes out but they don't even have a release date and I spent all of last year waiting for an Asus 27 inch 120hz. The only reason the VG278H looks more likely is because the VG236H already exists, has solid reviews and looks almost identical (minus size). Even if the VG278 comes out soon it will likely have the same retarded god-awful glossy display that the VG236 has. Glossy is probably a deal breaker for me. On the other hand I have bought and returned both the Dell U2311 and the NEC EA23 because the AG coating is so ridiculous. I wish all the manufacturers used a very slight AG coating similar to what is on the cheap TN panels. It's a great compromise.

    EDIT: I just ordered the XL2410T, here's to hoping it's everything I want in a monitor.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2011
  26. joeshmoe

    joeshmoe Limp Gawd

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    How you finding your new XL2410T?

    BTW, another selling point of this monitor is actually it's design which makes the monitor extremely adjustable. Do you like the adjustability :)
     
  27. Pastuch

    Pastuch Limp Gawd

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    I'm a hard core BF2, BC2 and will be a BF3 player. I'm a former competitive CS player but this monitor is so bad-ass I may go back to playing CS Source. I'm also a Home Theater enthusiast with a massive movie collection run from a Home Theater PC that doubles as my primary gaming machine. I don't like having more than one computer in my home. One is plenty of work as it is.

    XL2410T Review:

    Panel Coating:
    This monitor has what I consider to be the perfect AG coating. It's very thin, not intrusive, and does not create a grainy looking image unlike LG based E-IPS panels used in the Dell U2311 and NEC EA23. It also does a splendid job of not creating any reflections. AG coating: 10/10.

    Ergonomics:
    Excellent, the stand is perfect. The ability to adjust height is so important for TN panels. It's quite sturdy and comparable to Dell stands in every way. Ergonomics: 10/10

    Inputs:
    I don't use anything but the dual link DVI port. DIsplayport can't hurt though!

    Gaming:
    This is the lowest input lag monitor I have ever tried and it has definitely improved my online scores significantly. I have bought and returned the NEC EA23 and Dell 2311. I also own an Asus VW246h which is an excellent bargain TN with low input lag. My best friends have the Dell U2410 and the Samsung F2380. The Benq XL2410T is the best gaming monitor I have ever tried. Input lag is the most important factor to me. Pixel response has never been a big complaint of mine but I do prefer the 120hz and higher FPS cap that this monitor provides. It's not as much of a dramatic difference unless you are coming from an older display. My Dell FPW2005 had horrible pixel response by comparison but the Dell U2311 was pretty similar to this 120hz model. Where ALL these models fall FAR behind is the input lag. The XL2410T has a 5ms average input lag with no spikes over 20ms so long as direct mode is enabled.

    120hz compatibility issues:
    I am not only a die hard gamer but I also run a 10 terabyte home theater from my primary gaming machine. If you're using an ATI graphics card then you will have issues trying to run 120hz to one monitor and 60hz to a TV or AVR receiver in Clone Mode. This issue does not occur with multiple computer monitors, only devices that the Radeon drivers see as an "HDTV". Me and two other [H] guys are having this issue. Oddly all three of us have Radeon 6950s but I believe it's an issue with the ATI driver. PM me if you are having this problem. I still may return the XL2410T because of the Clone mode issues.

    Picture Quality:
    The color depth and measured contrast once calibrated are both stellar for a TN panel. This is the best TN display I have ever seen by far. At almost 1000:1 contrast it was a pleasant surprise. Black levels are adequate but compared to the modern VA panels it's pretty awful. The picture on my Benq W5000 1080p DLP projector embarrasses every computer monitor I have tried. If I didn't play games I would return the XL2410T and buy the Benq BL2400PU VA monitor immediately. 3000:1 contrast is what I want but that is not possible on a gaming display. The XL2410T has pretty shitty viewing angles, it's worse than my old TN Asus VW246h. Fortunately the adjustable stand makes up for this shortcoming.

    Build Quality:
    The panel I got is free of any major back light bleeding and has no dead pixels. It has exceptional uniformity. It has a tiny bit of edge-led bleed at the extreme edges of the screen that annoys me.
     
  28. mADASS

    mADASS n00b

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    So I'm planing on buying this monitor.

    - I'm using a ACD 23" and a 32" TV right now and if I get this monitor I'll be pending between the ACD and my TV as the secondary monitor (depending on movie or work). I'm not using clone mode so this 60 and 120Hz wont affect me, right? Btw I got ATI (5870).
    - Are there any other monitors planing to be released soon that are 23/24" with 120Hz that I should wait for?
    - Will it be weird with two monitors when they are 16:10 and 16:9?
     
  29. Pastuch

    Pastuch Limp Gawd

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    Madass, as long as you don't use clone mode it should work nicely. Clones not an option for you anyway because of the 19:9 vs 16:10. It's a little strange using different aspect ratio monitors.

    I found a workaround for the Radeon Clone mode problem, whenever I turn on my projector the Radeon driver detects the HDTV and autoswitches windows display settings to clone mode at 60hz. When I turn off the projector windows detects it's no longer connected and switches back to extended desktop. I have no idea HOW I set it up to do this but it makes for less headaches. I think it's just Windows 7 remembering the preference.
     
  30. mADASS

    mADASS n00b

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    Yeah. I know it will be a bit weird when I'll drag things over from the 16:9 to the 16:10. Might get stuck if I drag it to close to the bottom. But hopefully it wont be to big of a deal.
    I need my ACD for work and BenQ for gaming :/
     
  31. pitbull46

    pitbull46 Limp Gawd

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    I found this thread very interesting indeed.
     
  32. dpoverlord

    dpoverlord [H]ard|Gawd

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    Problem with all of these 3d monitors is that you spend $400+ then need to spend another $120+ for the glasses. For the price of a 23" you could have a 27 or 30"
     
  33. Pastuch

    Pastuch Limp Gawd

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    Hardly any of us even want the glasses. In fact a huge number of us don't even have Nvidia graphics cards. We just want low input, fast response and higher than 60FPS.
     
  34. dpoverlord

    dpoverlord [H]ard|Gawd

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    The only way to use the 3d is if you have 3d glasses? Just seems somewhat of a waste of a 3d monitor.
     
  35. Dims

    Dims n00b

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    so true =)



    Dunno why they wont make "normal" screens with 120hz.. I know i wont b using that 3d and wont buy those clases. maybe its a trick to get the price tad higher who knows :p
     
  36. vafan13

    vafan13 [H]Lite

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    hmm, if I were to put in an order at Fry's what are the chances I don't get the 005 firmware? Also how is Fry's as far as monitor returns?
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2011
  37. EvilViking

    EvilViking I Drank All Your Beer

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    Frys will charge a 15% restocking fee for returns, They will only return the item if it isn't working. I just bought a XL2410T at Frys. The Manufacturing date was Jan 2011 (Located on outside of box next to Serial #) And it had firmware V005. Love it.
     
  38. oqvist

    oqvist [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Speak for yourself lol.

    I have had my replacement XL2410T for some months now and it did definiatly solve the backlight bleed issues. The uniformity is as good as you can expect from this kind of panel now. Even at max brightness it´s not much of an issue.

    Speaking of combinating it with a 32" LCD TV. It´s what I do but I sadly can´t use 120 hertz using DVI-D for my monitor and HDMI for my LCD TV. using a GTX 580 and Windows 7. Reason I would want to enable HDMI as well is due to get access to dolby digital 5.1 and DTS through the HDMI from the GTX 580 but it´s only active if you send a signal through HDMI which don´t support 120 hertz.

    Otherwise the functionality of it is superb. Stand has been mentioned you really really want something like this for a bigger TN monitor. This simulation of 17" and 19" monitors and aspect ratio etc I didn´t realise how useful it was until I started gold mining at good old Games. Absolutely brilliant to have with older titles.

    Maybe I should have waited for the XL2420T with HDMI 1.4 3D support though my TV is three years old and hope it will break down soon so I can justify a 3D TV instead. I am used to input lag by gamepad on the consoles anyway so hope that will be a lesser issue for that platform lol
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2011
  39. vafan13

    vafan13 [H]Lite

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    Thinking about pulling the trigger on this to give it a shot. BenQ's site is showing free shipping and 10% off with promo code. Their return policy page says nothing about restocking fees, does anyone know if they have one?
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2011
  40. cybz

    cybz [H]Lite

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    So I got this monitor in the mail today, and I must say that I'm very satisfied, once you set it to sRGB, it really gets better. I had a CRT before to game and IPS for work, and I tried another 120hz monitor but it was really bad. The tint shifts a little, and the viewing angles are not that good, what you'd expect from a TN. But the contrast is definetly good compared to my previous 120hz, and much better than my ZR24W. I was expecting a lot more backlight bleed, but once I set it to sRGB I really barely can see it anymore. I don't have a camera that's good enough to show it, you wouldn't be able to see it, I might have got lucky because I saw others had some bleeding. The coating is perfect, it doesn't bother me at all. The overdrive is very agressive, and creates some visible artifacts, but I prefer this than turning it off and having a lot of ghosting, with it turned on it's almost as responsive as my CRT, it didn't affect my frags at all coming from a CRT. I didn't do a test but I don't feel any input lag, and I'm very sensitive to this. Had one stuck pixel when it came in but got fixed after a minute or two. The options on this monitors are very extensive and that makes me happy, you can change the ratio to make it 1:1 whatever the resolution. The build quality seems very good, almost comparable to my ZR24W and you can adjust the height very high. So I was looking since 120hz started coming out for a good one and I finally found one, I know it's not perfect, but it's good enough for me to game on. Bought on futureshop.ca for 350$, I was absolutly expecting to return it at the store the next day, but I'm happy to say that I'm keeping this monitor, first in a long time. So if you're looking for a 23.6" 120hz monitor with a picture that won't blow you away, but has no major issue such as crushed blacks or backlight bleed (might depend on the monitor), with good contrast, a good deal of options, very good responsiveness and a good build quality, go for it.