BenQ BL2710PT Review: 2560x1440 Matte AHVA (AUO's Version of IPS/PLS)

Discussion in 'Displays' started by NCX, Jun 17, 2013.

  1. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Written Review

    ICC Profiles & PC+console settings are available within the review.

    Official Product Page. The BenQ uses AUO's AHVA (Advanced Hyper Viewing Angle) panel which is their version of IPS/PLS. It does not use LED PWM Dimming!

    Always buy from retailers with hassle free return+exchange policies if possible.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2014
  2. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    So this isn't an actual VA panel?
     
  3. Thradya

    Thradya n00b

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    With 1000:1 contrast - no.
     
  4. Outbreaker

    Outbreaker Limp Gawd

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    Yes it is VA and it is also out now for arouind 600€ (800$) but i could not find any reviews. :(
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2013
  5. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk n00b

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    NCX, any chance you can review the monitor? if so, please :)
     
  6. Panmaster

    Panmaster Limp Gawd

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    Does AVHA technology eliminate "IPS glow"?
    Are these 27" AUO panels more uniform than the 27" LG panels that all seem to have QC issues with backlight bleed?

    There's nothing special about a light matte coating. 27" IPS have been available with glossy since 2011 at least and PLS is just Samsung's low cost version of IPS.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2013
  7. Cerulean

    Cerulean [H]ardForum Junkie

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    [​IMG]
     
  8. Martha Stewart

    Martha Stewart Gawd

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    nice, someone review this ASAP
     
  9. tran1981

    tran1981 [H]Lite

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    nice. waiting for review.
     
  10. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    BL2710PT Acquired
     
  11. Outbreaker

    Outbreaker Limp Gawd

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    Nice looking forward to the review.

    But i'm afraid to buy another Monitor with 1000:1 contrats. The first LCD Monitor i bought was an "LG IPS235P-BN" (S-IPS / 1000:1) and ohh boy that one was no fun to watching a dark movie or to playing a drak game on it in a dark room everything was so grayish instead of blackish i don't know if it was because of the 1000:1 contrast or because of the aggressive AG coating or even both.
    It would be really helpful if you could do a side by side comparison in a drak room with a good 1000:1 Monitor versus a good 3000:1/5000:1 Monitor.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2013
  12. Namelessme

    Namelessme [H]ard|Gawd

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    If you are playing in a dark room, I'd think you'd have to go VA really. I have never seen a 1000:1 monitor do well in really dark rooms... black will always look gray. Even 1500:1 in a dark room results in grayish blacks. The room at best can be dim at 1000:1 to look even semi-close to a black shade.

    And I'm also curious how this model stacks up. Although I'd be more interested in the smaller 24" brother. It would have been nice if AUO could have managed an IPS flavor with contrast a bit closer to VA levels, but I guess that's impossible to do.
     
  13. madmook

    madmook n00b

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    Cool, very interested to hear about the AG coating, input lag and contrast level. Also, if it is IPS type, then there should be no off-angle color/gamma shift like the VA panel on my GW2750, which is annoying.
     
  14. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Some PLS panels have very little glow, both the VP2770 & current matte Qnix are fine in the dark with a lamp behind the monitor.

    The BenQ has been delayed.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2013
  15. Outbreaker

    Outbreaker Limp Gawd

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    This is what i'm afraid of from buying a 1000:1 Monitor (TN/IPS/PLS):
    Left = Samsung S27C750P (MVA+)
    Rghit = ViewSonic VP2770 (PLS)
    http://youtu.be/by1wAlyNsyA?t=9m26s @ 9:26 - 9:53
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2013
  16. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Pics are over exposed to highlight differences and the monitor next to the Samsung=Crossover 2720MDP
     
  17. Panmaster

    Panmaster Limp Gawd

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    No major retailer lists them in the UK so I don't think they're available yet. edit: Restock date: 04/10/2013

    PLS panels such as the 2770P-LED are 700:1 contrast once calibrated. PCPro rated the contrast even lower than TFTCentral.

    The 29" LG panel has the highest IPS contrast at over 1000:1 calibrated.
     
  18. Outbreaker

    Outbreaker Limp Gawd

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    Last edited: Sep 7, 2013
  19. alienate

    alienate Gawd

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    We'll have to see if this panel is an actual improvement over MVA or just a cost cutting move.
     
  20. XoR

    XoR Gawd

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    @Outbreaker
    and have you seen this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=by1wAlyNsyA&feature=youtu.be&t=10m50s ?

    Gamma Shift on VA is very serious issue. It all looks good at still picture made from large distance but in reality when you have your head much closer to monitor it looks like this
    [​IMG]
    original image is
    [​IMG]
    on my IPS it looks pretty much the same from every angle without some magic 'sweet spot sphere'

    I had three VA and using them made me paranoid about 'hidden details' and even black level itself. I would tilt my head constantly to see if I don't miss some hidden details which would make me see actually way to much details with nasty compression artifacts and other ugly and sad things.

    Problem of VA is how much more shadow details there (lower gamma) are from even slightest angle. Most VA are calibrated in such a way that there is black crush in middle because if picture would be proper in middle it would be too much washed out on sides. It affects colors and there can't be certainty about how color should look like...

    On IPSes blacks are worse but at least there is no worry about details, about colors and all this crap. Frankly I only worried about black level owning VA monitors. On IPS I can watch dark movie like Blade Runner at night and not realize that blacks are dark gray. And if there is some light in room then black level doesn't matter and IPS wins in every category even with it's more grainier coating

    This + much worse motion on VA than on IPS makes IPS much better choice imho. Its entirely different story on TVs where there are a lot of decent VA panels with good enough viewing angles and motion handling. Unfortunately lately VA monitor panels don't get much attention from manufacturers. It's IPS golden time...
     
  21. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    My local dimming Samsung ln46a950 (static 3, 500; 1 contrast plus it dims) has slightly gray blacks in the dark which is why I put a lamp with an 80w 6500k LED bulb behind it.

    Only the highest end plasmas are suitable in a pitch black room. OLED doesn't count

    PRAD and my VP2770 had > 900:1 contrast before and after calibrarion
     
  22. Outbreaker

    Outbreaker Limp Gawd

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    The "LG IPS235P-BN" i had was also reated at 900:1 on prad.de but this grayish blacks and this purple IPS-Glow and the Aggressive AG Coating was so dam annoying. The "BenQ GW2450HM" i have now is okay i'm not 100% satisfied but i can live with it.
    A plasmas would be a good CRT replacement for me but they all have at least 30ms input lag the new once have even over 60ms input lag.
    I'm planning to buy another Monitor this year i probably try out the best 27" IPS/PLS 1080p/1440p Monitor first and see if it is better then my current "BenQ GW2450HM" if not then i will return it and buy a good new MVA+ Monitor.
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2013
  23. Peat Moss

    Peat Moss Limp Gawd

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    Any update on this monitor review ?
     
  24. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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  25. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Cell pick of Wolf Creek HD DVD

    I will not have a functioning PC until next week so I will not be able to measure the color presets with my i1 display pro or compare 100+ pixel transition combos in pixerpixan vs. the Qnix QX2710 & Crossover 2755AMG.

    Some initial impressions after connecting it to my 360 & viewing some scenes from the letter boxed HD DVD Into The Wild & looking @ RE4 HD, Halo 4 & watching Wolf Creek HD DVD

    -Casing looks kind of cheap compared to the BenQ XL2720T on display in the NCIX I bought it from
    +Casing is really light but not as sturdy as the Viewsonic VP2770 or Asus PB278Q
    +Bezel is dark, matte gray, blacks look deeper thanks to the ligher bezel color
    +Matte coating is grain free when viewing whites even @100% brightness when viewed from <30cm away
    +Viewing Angles are very wide, can't say if they are as wide as the best IPS/PLS panels yet but they are definitely wider than my VA Samsung UN32EH5300 TV.
    +No obvious overshoot ghosting (Default AMA High) seen during my RE4 HD & Halo 4 camera pan tests which is rare for BenQ monitor
    +HDMI 0-255+16-255 settings
    +Blacks are quite black with the brightness @30% when the lights are on
    +No dead pixels seen, yet
    +No obvious screen uniformity issues seen with lights offin very dark scenes @30% brightness
    +Default color preset appears very accurate (switched between calibrated Crossover & BenQ)
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2013
  26. Peat Moss

    Peat Moss Limp Gawd

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    Thanks NCX, appreciate the initial observations.

    So it has a matte coating, but it is grain free? Hard to wrap my head around that. How would you describe the difference in appearance between this grain-free matte and say a semi-gloss?

    What connectors and ports (if any) does it have?

    Button or touch menu?

    Sounds intriguing so far, my nipples are definitely stiffening.

    Looking forward to reading more from you about this new kind of IPS/PLS panel from AUO.
     
  27. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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  28. birthdaymonkey

    birthdaymonkey n00b

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    I'm eagerly awaiting your review, NCX. I've tried the Dell, Asus, and Viewsonic so far (nine units in total) and have had bad luck with all of them. Trying to decide on my next move: BenQ or Samsung at $700 each, vs. Qnix/X-star at half that.
     
  29. Panmaster

    Panmaster Limp Gawd

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    I hope TFTCentral reviews this BenQ soon. No major retailer in the UK lists it yet.

    If it does away with IPS glow it would be a no-brainer.
     
  30. Peat Moss

    Peat Moss Limp Gawd

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    I'm hoping the black level is nice and low, and that it does well on a greyscale test.
     
  31. Sir Unreal

    Sir Unreal n00b

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    Prad is testing, but that will last some weeks.
     
  32. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Some will find the touch buttons infuriating, fortunately the angriest I get=slightly irritated.

    Measured the color Presets...whoever decided the monitor needed NINE color presets should be fired. Some of the presets are very close to being perfect while others are horrendous.

    Contrasr ranges from 170-1050:1 depending on the preset, the sRGB mode (1000:1) is the only preset with a >800:1 contrast ratio. The sRGB, Standard & User mode all have nearly perfect RGB Levels & Color Temperature but all have skewed default gamma. There are 5 gamma settings & the gamma curve is skewed on all of them.

    Gamma 2 comes closest to matching the sRGB Gamma Curve & is pretty good. The sRGB mode's gamma averages around 2.58=useless. Using the Gamma 2 setting in the User mode produces very, very accurate colors & an sRGB Gamma curve, but 800:1 contrast ratio

    The User modes color temperature setting is defaulted to Normal, changing it to User mode increases the contrast ratio to 1000:1. Using the above settings I measured the brightness range, it ranges from 60-390nits & the contrast remains stable @1000:1

    RGB Level & Color Temperature: Qnix QX2710 (Matte & Glossy)=BenQ BL2710PT>Viewsonic VP2770>=Asus PB278Q.

    Gamma Preset: Viewsonic VP2770=Asus PB278Q>Matte Qnix QX2710=BenQ BL2710PT>Glossy Qnix. Both the Matte Qnix & BenQ's gamma is closer to the sRGB Gamma Curve while the Viewsonic & Asus's gamma is close to matching a non-linear 2.2 curve.

    Default Color Gamut: BenQ>Matte & Glossy Qnix>Viewsonic>Asus

    Default Contrast: Matte Qnix QX2710 (1100:1)>Viewsonic VP2770=Asus PB278Q (950-1000:1)>Glossy Qnix (900-950:1)>BenQ (800:1). Once the BenQ is set to the User Mode & the color temperature is switched to the User mode it is on par with the Viewsonic & Asus.

    Pixel Response Times: Viewsonic VP2770 (Advanced)>Matte & Glossy Qnix=Asus PB278Q (Trace Free 20). Not sure where the BenQ fits in yet 100% but it will likely be on par with the Viewsonic. So far I have only compared it to my Crossover 2755AMG which is faster than the Qnix.

    Subjective Delay: It's not slower than the Crossover 2755AMG which has 1 frame (22 ms SMT Tool Measurement by Playerwares), need to compare it to the Qnix QX2710.

    Need to compare the BenQ's glow vs. my matte Qnix which has very little glow
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2014
  33. Panmaster

    Panmaster Limp Gawd

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    What about value for money and warranty?

    Dell still wins hand down on those criteria.
    BenQ / Viewsonic cost 25% to 50% more and aren't sold by trusted stores so returns would be problematic. The latter is a USA brand so likely overpriced here anyway.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
  34. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    The Dell U2713HM is plagued by quality control issues, you are pretty much guaranteed to get one with yellow back-light bleeding & matte coating cross-hatching and the newer revisions suffer from obvious overshoot ghosting & have worse color presets. PLS & AHVA panels do not have cross-hatching issues.

    If you don't mind spending the time & effort to exchange Dell's 4 times (& likely having to settle with a monitor with the least amount of defects) then I guess it is a good deal @550-600$+tax. The BenQ will likely become widely available in North America in the next month.
     
  35. DVerde

    DVerde n00b

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    And how do you know that "AHVA panels do not have cross hatching"? Please don't make such assumptions until somebody reviews said panel.
     
  36. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Only semi-glossy (Dell U2713HM, NEC EA244WMi & the Fujitsu P27T-7) AH-IPS panels have cross-hatching issues. I would be pretty surprised to find out that other manufacturers are shipping panels with defective matte coatings like LG does.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
  37. DVerde

    DVerde n00b

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    Another blanket statement, really? Last I checked, most, if not all, AH-IPS were semi-glossy. Just wait for a review before you start responding with stuff to this thread. -_-
     
  38. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    The following AH-IPS panels are semi-glossy

    Asus PA2x9Q Series (no cross-hatching according to =DEAD=/overclock.ru reviewer)
    Del U2x13H Series (no cross-hatching according to multiple sources)
    Dell U2713HM (cross-hatching)
    Dell 3014 (no cross-hatching)
    Fujitsu P27T-T (cross-hatching according to =DEAD=)
    LG 27EA83 R & D (no cross-hatching reports)
    Lenovo LT305P (likely CH free like the 3014, no sources)
    NEC EA244WMi (cross-hatching seen by =DEAD=)
    NEC P242W (mine did not have any cross-hatching, =DEAD='s did)

    None of the frame-less AH-IPS panels have semi-glossy coating. No TN, VA or PLS panel has ever been reported to have cross-hatching. CH is an "exclusive," semi-glossy LG AH-IPS feature.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
  39. Michaelius

    Michaelius [H]ardness Supreme

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    Have you tried overclocking it ?
     
  40. you2

    you2 [H]ard|Gawd

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    I'm having some difficulty following this but if I read it correctly for default settings you seem to suggest:

    vp27 > beq bl27; but with user settings benq bl27 > vp27. If this is accurate any feelings on quality control/reliability between them ?