ATX vs mATX vs ITX

That's what I have seen as well, though I often see people that say the opposite. That ITX has more choice than mATX.
This is usually the case with Intel; you get to around the mid-range / entry-level enthusiast grade at best, and then there's nothing until you start spending for top-of-the-line boards.

small mATX
Small mATX is hard; mATX boards are usually a little less deep than ATX boards, but in general you're only saving those three slots worth of width / height. Apply the same space-saving measures to an ATX board and you don't gain too much volume, and usually that volume is in height.
 
This is usually the case with Intel; you get to around the mid-range / entry-level enthusiast grade at best, and then there's nothing until you start spending for top-of-the-line boards.


Small mATX is hard; mATX boards are usually a little less deep than ATX boards, but in general you're only saving those three slots worth of width / height. Apply the same space-saving measures to an ATX board and you don't gain too much volume, and usually that volume is in height.
Yeah, this is why I said it's somewhat limited, if I have the space I'll look at ATX first, if I'm space constrained I'll look at ITX. Based on features and costs I'll buy what I feel makes sense. I was specifically responding to the Sliger Cerberus which has a slightly smaller foot print than most but still reasonable space. A bit pricey but seems like a good compromise.
 
This is usually the case with Intel; you get to around the mid-range / entry-level enthusiast grade at best, and then there's nothing until you start spending for top-of-the-line boards.

I went to newegg selected Socket 1200, Z490, in stock:

4 ITX boards (almost all the same - same price range - All $269+).
5 mATX boards ( Steps across price range $129 to $250)

IMO that's better selection for mATX.
 
I went to newegg selected Socket 1200, Z490, in stock:

4 ITX boards (almost all the same - same price range - All $269+).
5 mATX boards ( Steps across price range $129 to $250)

IMO that's better selection for mATX.
Honestly can't disagree. Of course, was more speaking to AMD with the dearth of upper-midrange ITX boards while having more mATX boards relative to Intel, but that's actually a pretty good mATX showing for Intel too.
 
How does that work? mATX is a 4 slot standard. How does the GPU cover all the slots?

Most mATX boards put the GPU in the top slot and have the bottom slot with a full length connector. So even a triple slot GPU, should still give access to the bottom slot. Almost everyone should get the use of two slots on a mATX board if not 3.

So, was looking at motherboards because i'm having issues with my upgrade (another thread under AMD MoBo's) and was looking at some mATX just to see. Seems around 1/2 (estimate, I didn't count or make any spreadsheets) the ones I found are the same layout as the one as I linked, so it's not as uncommon as you guys were saying (at least no when it concerns B550 & X570's in the sub $250 range).

Asus mATX with all but useless pcie ports and 4 sata ports... what does this gain me over ITX besides I save some $? Ok, it does have 4 ram slots :).
https://www.newegg.com/asus-prime-b550m-a-wi-fi/p/N82E16813119316

Funny thing is even with all it's limitations it fits my needs well (onboard wifi means I don't need the extra pcie slot, they do sell a version of this without wifi which I would never do since I can't use the extra pcie slots!), but it won't fit in my case. If I'm going to buy an ATX case, I may as well look at ATX boards.

Now, IMO, MSI has it much better...
https://www.newegg.com/msi-b550m-pro-vdh-wifi/p/N82E16813144331?&quicklink=true
Still 4 SATA ports, but you can actually use the extra pcie slot at the bottom (they left a space under the first pcie card since that can almost never be used anyways)

And this one with the pcie x1 on TOP of the x16 slot makes it very easy to use and not interfere, although it can limit your choice of CPU cooler depending and your GPU can't have to thick of a back plate:
https://www.newegg.com/msi-b550m-pro-vdh-wifi/p/N82E16813144331?&quicklink=true

Anyways, sorry, bored and looking around at a new MB going crazy trying to figure out what makes the most sense. I can't find much in ITX (B550, X570) in stock under $300 and for some reason my B450 can't boot my 3700x. May end up cheaper to keep my current build and just get a new MB (mATX/ATX) + cheap case + RAM and have pretty much another complete build :p.
 
You can find crappy boards if you look?

You can also find good ones, that better leverage the extra space of mATX. MSI B550 Mortar:
6 Sata ports and full size PCIe at the bottom:
Mortar MB
13-144-328-V04.jpg
 
You can find crappy boards if you look?

You can also find good ones, that better leverage the extra space of mATX. MSI B550 Mortar:
6 Sata ports and full size PCIe at the bottom:
Mortar MB
I said (or was trying to say) I was able to find about 50/50 crappy vs decent (" Seems around 1/2 the ones I found are the same layout as the one as I linked")... sorry if I didn't make that clear. Just saying they are actually pretty common though. The response you guys gave me like you've never seen one before when about ever other one I looked at was the same, just bringing it up since I was recently looking and came upon more than I expected I would. Didn't mean to imply there were no good ones.
 
It all depends on what kind of a machine you want to build. Usually the smaller the case compared to the contents and heat generating parts the hotter it will run.

Now the smaller the mobo, the less features you will have, but do you need them? having 3-4 PCIe slots if you are only ever going to use 1 is pointless.

I had a mATX PC for a while but it was not much smaller then an ATX mid tower, your case choice will matter a lot in ease of building and cooling options and what hardware you can cram inside.

I agree. I wish they would make an mATX case that was the correct size for the motherboard you bought. I don't need 2 DVD drive slots and sli is pretty much dead. I prefer saving space.
 
I said (or was trying to say) I was able to find about 50/50 crappy vs decent (" Seems around 1/2 the ones I found are the same layout as the one as I linked")... sorry if I didn't make that clear. Just saying they are actually pretty common though. The response you guys gave me like you've never seen one before when about ever other one I looked at was the same, just bringing it up since I was recently looking and came upon more than I expected I would. Didn't mean to imply there were no good ones.

Well I had never seen one before, but I guess I just focus on quality boards when searching. Search the bottom end of the market and there are more sketchy products. This isn't news.
 
Well I had never seen one before, but I guess I just focus on quality boards when searching. Search the bottom end of the market and there are more sketchy products. This isn't news.
Well, now you can say you've seen more than one and can help others avoid them in the future ;).
 
I still like using a sound card and I have extra USB 3.0 slots. I've thought about going ITX, but I don't like giving up potential expansion. There are some super compact and very usable mATX cases out there now.
 
I still like using a sound card and I have extra USB 3.0 slots. I've thought about going ITX, but I don't like giving up potential expansion. There are some super compact and very usable mATX cases out there now.
What cases, I still can't find good compact mATX cases. My ITX case supports full ATX PSU, full size GPU (300mm) and up to 140mm AIO (120mm with full size GPU, 140mm with short GPU). It's 13L... I can't find much for mATX with any similar features, size and price. The closest I'vee seen is the sliger cerberus which starts at $250 with tons of add-ons if you are happy want a useful case @ 19 liters. If you know of some, please share!! I'd love to have a few more options.
 
There are some, just gotta look. This one is 12.5L, supports full height gpu up to ~280mm long, and has room for a decent sized cpu cooler. No watercooling support, though.
 
There are some, just gotta look. This one is 12.5L, supports full height gpu up to ~280mm long, and has room for a decent sized cpu cooler. No watercooling support, though.
This is pretty close, but "full height" if you don't have a power connector on top of your card + SFX PSU kind of limits it a bit more. For sure another case to think about though! Thanks for sharing.
 
This is pretty close, but "full height" if you don't have a power connector on top of your card + SFX PSU kind of limits it a bit more. For sure another case to think about though! Thanks for sharing.
Yeah, I had to look hard at it myself. If it's higher than the bracket (like most modern cards) and the connector is on top, you'd probably have a bad day. lol
 
I found the Q300L to be good enough for my mATX build.
https://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/cm_masterbox_q300l_q300p/1.htm

But I had actually wanted a slim mATX with a GPU vertically mounted. This one is thick, and that's not ideal. But it's better than others I was seeing.

They actually take that same case, move the PSU and let you install full ATX MB in it:
https://www.coolermaster.com/catalog/cases/mid-tower/masterbox-q500l/

Identical exterior dimensions to the Q300L.

Though airflow isn't great on this. I think I would need to Dremel the fan locations out...
 
Here's another. A brand I hadn't heard of before. sfx again, limited water support, but gpu on back side so it gets air separate from the mb/cpu.

Would probably be a good candidate for a pico-psu or hdplex+distro board, might even be able to squeeze in a custom loop with some planning.
 
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Yeah, I had to look hard at it myself. If it's higher than the bracket (like most modern cards) and the connector is on top, you'd probably have a bad day. lol
Yeah, I've honestly been looking pretty hard for a mATX case because the MB have so much more to offer and are cheaper, but the cases are letting me down. Almost ready to just start making my own case
Here's another. A brand I hadn't heard of before. sfx again, limited water support, but gpu on back side so it gets air separate from the mb/cpu.

Would probably be a good candidate for a pico-psu or hdplex+distro board, might even be able to squeeze in a custom loop with some planning.
Looks pretty nice, I can deal with an sfx if I have to if it's got everything else. This is about as close as I've seen. Again, thanks for sharing. I may bookmark that to take a closer look.
I didn't notice, what size cooler can that fit on th CPU, it's narrow and you lose space for GPU... Very tight for a CPU cooler and glass above so you need extra space for air flow. This is where a small AIO could make sense.

Nm, found it, 60mm. But it does support 240mm water... Need a blower cooler GPU though with the glass panel that close to the GPU. It looks like it has almost no airflow if it's axial fans instead of blower. $160... A bit high for an unknown, but seems nice overall!
 
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Yeah, I've honestly been looking pretty hard for a mATX case because the MB have so much more to offer and are cheaper, but the cases are letting me down. Almost ready to just start making my own case
Looks pretty nice, I can deal with an sfx if I have to if it's got everything else. This is about as close as I've seen. Again, thanks for sharing. I may bookmark that to take a closer look.
I didn't notice, what size cooler can that fit on th CPU, it's narrow and you lose space for GPU... Very tight for a CPU cooler and glass above so you need extra space for air flow. This is where a small AIO could make sense.

Nm, found it, 60mm. But it does support 240mm water... Need a blower cooler GPU though with the glass panel that close to the GPU. It looks like it has almost no airflow if it's axial fans instead of blower. $160... A bit high for an unknown, but seems nice overall!
The whole bottom is vented, so as long as you have fans exhausting up top the gpu should have decent airflow. Maybe not great, but not terrible. Think Dan's A4 (in sff subforum) uses a similar design, but has metal side panels.

Edit: oh, see what you mean now. Yeah, some spacers and longer screws to move the panel out would probably be a good idea.
 
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The whole bottom is vented, so as long as you have fans exhausting up top the gpu should have decent airflow. Maybe not great, but not terrible. Think Dan's A4 (in sff subforum) uses a similar design, but has metal side panels.

Edit: oh, see what you mean now. Yeah, some spacers and longer screws to move the panel out would probably be a good idea.
Yeah, I was talking about the fans being starved from the inlet. Most cases I've seen have a mesh of sorts near the GPU. This case for sure looks nice though. Not sure a 240mm AIO would be able to keep both a CPU and GPU cool enough unless they were pretty low power parts. Maybe a short air cooler on the CPU and use the 240mm water for the GPU? Would take a bit of planning but I think that case could be workable and looks nice. A bit expensive still, but not to much competition that I can find.
 
What cases, I still can't find good compact mATX cases. My ITX case supports full ATX PSU, full size GPU (300mm) and up to 140mm AIO (120mm with full size GPU, 140mm with short GPU). It's 13L... I can't find much for mATX with any similar features, size and price. The closest I'vee seen is the sliger cerberus which starts at $250 with tons of add-ons if you are happy want a useful case @ 19 liters. If you know of some, please share!! I'd love to have a few more options.
https://www.aliexpress.com/i/10000221324472.html

Smaller than a lot of ITX cases, but doesn't support a full PSU. If you're looking for compact, you're going to have to sacrifice something. SFX power supplies are great.
 
I actually have an SFX power supply. The SF750, but it's not being used because my ITX build fits ATX, and everything else I'm doing is either mATX or ATX.
I just want THIN. Thin case with a GPU on a riser cable that lets me mount it flat. I can't believe I can't find this.

I'm just gonna make it myself out of wood in this case.
 
I actually have an SFX power supply. The SF750, but it's not being used because my ITX build fits ATX, and everything else I'm doing is either mATX or ATX.
I just want THIN. Thin case with a GPU on a riser cable that lets me mount it flat. I can't believe I can't find this.

I'm just gonna make it myself out of wood in this case.
Yep, lol. I got an azza csaz-103 (it's) for my daughter, pcie extender to mount the GPU and keep the height low. Full size ATX. I can imagine it's hard to use a pcie with a mATX due to the extra slots you'd end up covering up. Would kind of defeat the purpose of using mATX partially.
 
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BY THE WAY, let me just tell you my thoughts on Corsair's SF750 SFX Power Supply.

I am NOT very happy with it. Yes, it's small, and yes, the "improved" version of it probably doesn't fail anymore, but for one, the 24-pin motherboard cable isn't long enough, and two, the PCIe cables are weird spider things that don't make sense. Tthe cables themselves are all split and "artistic" and not exactly pragmatic. The cables just don't make sense. It's not an ideal power supply, but it's one of the only ones that exist, so Corsair is lucky they don't have competition.

Worth $100, not $180. $75 for the 750 watts, and $25 for size convenience. It just doesn't have the quality and thoughtfulness I'd expect from such an expensive product.

Corsair as a brand seems to be coasting on their previous successes, because lately, Corsair just hasn't been impressing me much, at least in line with their prices.

So not necessarily "bad," but I'm becoming skeptical.
 
That's pretty good. Similar footprint to a normal ATX case, a good bit shorter. For me, SFX is annoying but if that's the only issue it's not a deal breaker.
I used to have a SilverStone SG03. That's a super tiny and compact matx case, as well. The psu sits on top of the cpu, though. Cable management is non existent, too. It's very pretty, though.

I don't think they make it any more.
 
I've had this psu for like 8 years, and I love it. I want to do another SFF build with an old i3 2100 I have lying around.
 
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I used to have a SilverStone SG03. That's a super tiny and compact matx case, as well. The psu sits on top of the cpu, though. Cable management is non existent, too. It's very pretty, though.

I don't think they make it any more.
I've got the SG13 right now, same thing, PSU ove CPU. This is why I'm using AIO, there just isn't room for a decent air cooler, lol. It's for sure different building in small cases than in bigger ones with channels behind the MB to run cables. I try to keep my cables somewhat clean, but there is only so much you can do.
 
I've had this psu for like 8 years, and I love it. I want to do another SFF build with an old i3 2100 I have lying around.
Yeah, I saw your post on the 2100... Sorry I don't have any good ideas/uses for you, lol. 6 of my desktops are for every day use, I have one for running my desktop CNC machine, and I have a dual xeon server for Plex, nas, Minecraft server, and some miscellaneous development stuff. If I have old hardware I tend to give it away to neighbors or friends or kids friends to upgrade their stuff if it's not worth to much. Heck, I just gave away 2 CPUs, 2 GPUs a bunch of old ram and some mice (bnib steelseries) like 2 weeks ago. I could have gone through the hassle of selling/shipping and made a couple bucks, but to much effort when most would hardly (if even) have covered shipping.
 
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Yeah, I saw your post on the 2100... Sorry I don't have any good ideas/uses for you, lol. 6 of my desktops are for every day use, I have one for running my desktop CNC machine, and I have a dual xeon server for Plex, nas, Minecraft server, and some miscellaneous development stuff. If I have old hardware I tend to give it away to neighbors or friends or kids friends to upgrade their stuff if it's not worth to much. Heck, I just gave away 2 CPUs, 2 GPUs a bunch of old ram and some mice (bnib steelseries) like 2 weeks ago. I could have gone through the hassle of selling/shipping and made a couple bucks, but to much effort when most would hardly (if even) have covered shipping.
I decided to do an overkill XP machine with it. Just need a board and case.
 
BY THE WAY, let me just tell you my thoughts on Corsair's SF750 SFX Power Supply.

I am NOT very happy with it. Yes, it's small, and yes, the "improved" version of it probably doesn't fail anymore, but for one, the 24-pin motherboard cable isn't long enough, and two, the PCIe cables are weird spider things that don't make sense. Tthe cables themselves are all split and "artistic" and not exactly pragmatic. The cables just don't make sense. It's not an ideal power supply, but it's one of the only ones that exist, so Corsair is lucky they don't have competition.

Worth $100, not $180. $75 for the 750 watts, and $25 for size convenience. It just doesn't have the quality and thoughtfulness I'd expect from such an expensive product.

Corsair as a brand seems to be coasting on their previous successes, because lately, Corsair just hasn't been impressing me much, at least in line with their prices.

So not necessarily "bad," but I'm becoming skeptical.
See, in my ITX cases that would probably be useful. My PSU 24-pin is way to long, I only needed like 8" cable in one and like 4" cable in the other. The split cables may make it easier to keep out of the way of my fans, but that part sounds kind of weird. Either way, my cases support full ATX so I stick with that.
 
I just wish that they'd make a version of the HTC Vive Wireless adapter that didn't need a PCI-E slot. Otherwise, I'd be able to go ITX.
 
I just wish that they'd make a version of the HTC Vive Wireless adapter that didn't need a PCI-E slot. Otherwise, I'd be able to go ITX.
I mean, maybe you could run a SATA ssd or find a dual NVME board and use one nvme slot tompcie adapter for the vive? My VR is wired and needs USB and HDMI... So it's simple enough to use with my ITX.
 
Ready4Dis j-hack makes a plug that reduces the number of wires going from a modular PSU to the mb 24-pin connector. It's designed for a specific brand (forget which), but if you know your psu's cable pin-out you can just move the pins in the connector on the psu side.
 
I agree. I wish they would make an mATX case that was the correct size for the motherboard you bought. I don't need 2 DVD drive slots and sli is pretty much dead. I prefer saving space.
I hate that so many expensive cases still those drive racks and optical rails/racks with the cutout on the front panel. We don't need this anymore! If you need a DVD drive, there are cheap external ones. Someone gave me one. A quiet computer is accomplished by good airflow and is more important to me than drive bays and racks. I want the case to be open and grommets/good cable management would be ideal but only expensive cases have this.
 
I hate that so many expensive cases still those drive racks and optical rails/racks with the cutout on the front panel. We don't need this anymore! If you need a DVD drive, there are cheap external ones. Someone gave me one. A quiet computer is accomplished by good airflow and is more important to me than drive bays and racks. I want the case to be open and grommets/good cable management would be ideal but only expensive cases have this.
Are you kidding?? I would be upset if I didn't have an optical drive on my tower. Sure on my ITX I don't expect one, but I haven't been able to find a cheap UHD (4k) USB external drive and currently use on of my towers for those chores. If you know of a good cheap model I'd love to be able to just use my mini. My UHD internal drives where about $40-$50 (1 Asus and 1 LG) ... Externals are $150+ and half the ones on Amazon/eBay/Newegg that say UHD compatible aren't.
 
Ready4Dis j-hack makes a plug that reduces the number of wires going from a modular PSU to the mb 24-pin connector. It's designed for a specific brand (forget which), but if you know your psu's cable pin-out you can just move the pins in the connector on the psu side.
It looks to be for SF series Corsair. $40 and out of stock for the 24-pin adapter (it's more than just an adapter, it just takes the 12v and generates the other voltages, this would be great with a single 12v only PSU!!) They have other short connectors for SATA and CPU as well ($4 options). This is very similar to a pico PSU (looks almost identical) except it's to feed from/back to a standard PSU.
 
It looks to be for SF series Corsair. $40 and out of stock for the 24-pin adapter (it's more than just an adapter, it just takes the 12v and generates the other voltages, this would be great with a single 12v only PSU!!) They have other short connectors for SATA and CPU as well ($4 options). This is very similar to a pico PSU (looks almost identical) except it's to feed from/back to a standard PSU.
Yep, I thought it was neat. If I had a modular sfx psu in a tiny case, I'd get one myself. But the case I have had a flexatx psu, so I'm going wholesale on a plugin + meanwell combo. Half the space and 33% more power, though it's a bit more spendy.
 
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