Attention! You do not need antivirus!

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Summoner said:
I use a firewall but havent installed an AV program since Norton borked my system ages ago. Like people have said, its common sense. I dont open email if i dont know who sent it, let alone open attachments, i dont visit shady websites and i hate anything P2P.
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Second that, that, that and that. :)
 
Well, I installed AntiVir and as I suspected I found nothing. Ad-aware and Spybot always find the same crap and I get rid of it. I guess I'll keep AntiVir around for file scanning but I'm not going to run a resident AV scanner.
 
DigitalisAkujin said:
Maybe not in windows 95 :p

Even if it attached itself to another EXE like Explorer.exe. It still shows up.
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It won't show rootkits and other nasty things.
 
pigster said:
It won't show rootkits and other nasty things.
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exactly
Known Process Attacks > Attacks in Detail > Rootkits
Method: Rootkit Infection
Description: Rootkits are a special class of trojan. Particularly insidious by nature, rootkits actually modify parts of the operating system (such as Windows kernel API functions) to alter the nature of the operating system itself. For example, a rootkit may patch the functions that enumerate processes so that its own process isn't shown. Windows rootkits such as "fu", "Hacker Defender", "He4Hook", "NT Rootkit", "Vanquish" and others all obtain their low-level capabilities by using kernel-mode device drivers (.sys files) which need to be installed by a 'dropper' trojan before the rootkit can go stealth.
Click to expand...
 
your friend needs a kick in the skull.i run BitDefender and Sygate,so far Bit has caught alot of stuff that norton and mc-crappy missed and Sygate popped up with someone trying to get into my machine.when i play a game,i turn them off.

i stopped using P2p software and don't go to BS sites.my sister however hasn't and i don't even want to know what's in her computer i built her.


give him a computer virus,then he'll learn
 
I don't run an anti-virus for many reasons. First being that I HATE people that have the nerve to charge me $40 a year. Any time I have to continualy pay for any product other than utilities I refuse to participate. It's almost as bad as the money whoring, selfish, moron that came up with the hellish idea of pay-for-play. My anti-virus is not a house hold utility. I am not paying for more and more of something to continualy be pumped into my house. It's a program that can easily run forever with small updates. I mean, maybe $10 for a renewal but for $40 he can kiss my pennieless behind. ID doesn't ask me for $10 a month to continue to play Doom 3 but who knows how long that will last. You see, if no one bought his product till he promised to lower the price, he inevitable would but as time progresses people are becomming more and more ok with taking whatever gouging the corps will dish out. The slow numbing of people into thinking that their rediculous prices are justified. Like gas. if they raise it to $2.06 we all rejoice when it's a buck 95 but I'M not fooled. It's no bargain. People are becomming such push-overs surrendering their rights and getting right in line as if there was no other choice. We'll do! boycott, protest, concepts this counrty was founded on... if you don't like it, organize and fight it. Sorry is that rant was a little too long and a bit off topic but I don't know where else to put it.
 
I've never read a thread on any tech forum where so many people have given so much bad advice.
I just have to say, it's pretty disheartening. Oh well, there is a lot of good stuff in there, in between all the idiot posts.

On the bright side, our most vocal oppenent to AV software is some kid that claims he's written his own 'sploits.
 
t. shuffle said:
I've never read a thread on any tech forum where so many people have given so much bad advice.
I just have to say, it's pretty disheartening. Oh well, there is a lot of good stuff in there, in between all the idiot posts.

On the bright side, our most vocal oppenent to AV software is some kid that claims he's written his own 'sploits.
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I didn't say I wrote em. I said I have source code and it's easily modified.
 
anyone else in favor of licensing people to be able to use a computer, because of morons like this guys roommate?

Actually, when you think about it, it all works out in sweet justice. Those of us smart enough to take care of simple security threats by using firewalls and AV programs don't even notice when all these other computer fool-ios are spreading viruses to each other. Oh yeah, then they pay us to fix their shit. woot.
 
ok.. i gave up reading after 2 pages.. but.. i have 2 computers that i use to dl stuff.. both of them have about 20 each viruses in my NAV virus history.. . and this computer that i am tottaly careful with.. still got 1, in a few months time...

a guy at work thought he could run a computer on a cable modem with no AV or firewall.. he brought his computer in after comcast cut him off 3 times.. and every exe on his comptuer had a virus.. every one.. and he had files named for movies and music and shit like his computer was being used to host viruses on kazzaa or some other shitty p2p... so yeah.. he probably wasn't as careful with what sites he went to as i am.. but i doubt he was going to the worst of them, and clicking on every pop up he saw.. (his amount of spyware was pretty low actually compared to other computers i have seen)

use an AV, and a firewall... if your computer is too slow to handle it, then reformat it every few months or don't go on the intenrnet with it.. that's all you can do...


Apologenetic, i did skim your post real quick just now... you are talking about how gas is $2.06.. and $1.95... etc... that is still cheaper than the rest of the world.. seriously.. at least the "western world".. but yeah.. if you have paying for AV software... download AVG.. there are alternatives... seriously.. there are quite a few free AV programs out there.. but really do what you want.. if you haven't had any problems so far.. then i am happy for you and i hope that it lasts too.. i don't really know where i am going with this though...

anyways... my advice.. just run a damn AV program and a firewall... you can leave your car unlocked all the time and you will probably be fine... but one day when you least expect it something could happen...
 
Last Comment on this subject:
Not running an antivirus client because you don't have a virus is like not going to the Denist because you don't have cavaties. You don't know if you do unless it's too late, and by then the damage is already done.
 
Common sense and computer knowhow is better protection than any firewall and AV software combined. That said, my Windows 2000 install has been hooked up to broadband for 2 years now with no firewall. Guess what? No viruses or spyware. I run an updated AV scan (Comes with my utility package) maybe every three months for the hell of it just for kicks. All clear.

Now, i'm not saying it's stupid to use AV software and there are plenty of occasions where it's wise to have it (LAN parties, business). But there are a lot of people too far to the extreme saying that people who don't use AV software are tards. Frankly, I could very easily live without it. It just depends on what you do with your computer. All I use Windows for is games. I can understand how someone wouldn't want the extra bloat of spyware and AV software on their PC. Especially if they have older hardware and need the extra memory and CPU power free.

Now for my sensitive material, I exclusively use Linux for surfing, Email, P2P, etc. While I know it's not practical for everyone to have A Linux install somewhere, there are still Windows only people that don't have any sensitive material on their PC. And most will never be on a LAN. Sure it's a gamble, but if there's not much to risk then living without AV software is very viable.
 
DigitalisAkujin said:
I didn't say I wrote em. I said I have source code and it's easily modified.
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ah ....script kiddie.

Loser. Does [H] have a kill file?

BTW - anonymous FTP is open on your box. RH 7.3 right? There is a known DoS attack that exploits this ... hope you're patched.
 
sc0tty8 said:
It is better then that nutscrap/firefox crap, and there is nothing wrong with it, I have never had a problem with it, so, why would I change it out? Can you tell me it has cause you problems? Firefox is not as secure as most seem to think, either. As it gains popularity, there will be more probs with it. My friend is a linux/opensource guru, and he does not use it, tells me something...
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It causes problems all of the time. It does not conform to some standards. Firefox is going to have holes - of course it is. All software has bugs.

The difference is, at least with Firefox, security holes get patched within 6 months. Normally a patch is available within a few hours of a hole being discovered. Also, at least one "bug" in Mozilla/Firefox was caused by Windows' careless programming. The mozilla dev. team patched their browser as a workaround to Windows...
 
Ion Silverbolt said:
Common sense and computer knowhow is better protection than any firewall and AV software combined.
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Users are always the weakest link in security. Therefore, user training and a helping hand from those of us who are knowledgeable is a must.
 
Apologenetic, do a search for AVG by Grisoft, they have a free version, continually updated (about once a week to a fortnight). A lot have people have mentioned it in this thread, and I'm just mentioning it again, because it's great.

SCotty, what you need to do is map one of your buddie's drives to your machine. Say his machine is called "ImATwat":

Make sure his machine is switched on.
On your machine:
Right click "My Computer", left click "Map Network Drive".
Type:
\\ImATwat\c$\

This should be enough if he's so cavalier about his security. Then run a virus scan on his machine... While he's on a tough bit of Doom 3! :D

It may be an eyeopener for him. See if you can beat my high score of 1069 infections on one PC. Don't heal the infections straight away (without backing up), as you may seriously screw his system up losing his data.
 
ColinR said:
It may be an eyeopener for him. See if you can beat my high score of 1069 infections on one PC. Don't heal the infections straight away (without backing up), as you may seriously screw his system up losing his data.
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8000 infections

scroll down 4 pictures kids and dogs///
 
It seems the most common reason given for not using at least some sort of AV is: i back-up my data, and i don't care if i need to reinstall.

the problem is that posters assume that they are the only ones at risk if they get a virus/worm/whatever. but that is not the case. it has been demonstrated that infected pc's contribute to a host of problems for everyone on the internet, the least of which is the propagation of the infection on the local network.

people such as myself who feel strongly that people should be educated and at least take advantage of a free AV solution often attempt to sway ignorant people with analogies to condom use and hiv; and seat belts and car accidents; which are meaningless becuase you can't draw a correllary betwen death and reformatting your pc.

but the point remains, it is in everyone's best interest to use virus protection as well as patch windows, stop clicking 'yes', and to be aware of what attachments/files are coming into your system.
 
I run AVG, I also use the built in XP firewall, and I disable everything except TCP/IP on my net connection. ZERO, nada, none, not a single infection in almost 2 years.

Oh yeah, I use Mozilla for most of my browsing too.

Any my pc passes those online scanning tools, probes, etc. with 100% stealth.
 
heres some food for thought, what about people running linux or macs? i ran AV on my mac at work, but ive never run any AV for any linux system
 
acascianelli said:
heres some food for thought, what about people running linux or macs? i ran AV on my mac at work, but ive never run any AV for any linux system
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A conversation with Lance Spitzner, Sun Microsystems senior security architect
and a founder of the Honeynet Project
a Honeynet (or pot) is a system that is bait for intrusion so it can be detected, monitored, mined for data and techniques
and eventually deflected, causing no harm from it, not an easy thing to do, considering the intruder has "root"

Excerpted Transcript
Used with permission from both Lance Spitzner and Dana Greenlee Producer and co-host of the WebTalkGuys
but she is a Lady, and very nice one for letting me do this ;)
and of course Lance for taking time out to give me permission and answer a few questions.

We join the discussion of Honeynets in the middle here

WebTalkGuys: Well Lance lets talk about bait, I mean why would...
does a hacker come to one of these sites just because...
or one of these computers, just because he can or
is there something on there that he'd want,
Do you care about that?

Lance: Thats actually one of the most amazing things,
if you just put a computer out there that has no percieved value
it will probably get scanned 10 to 20 time a day
this is any system Im not talking about corporations, small businesses
If any of your listeners have a connection at home
a home connection dsl cable isdn
and they have a dedicated connection
they are most likely getting scanned ten to twenty times a day, also
just as our systems are
the bad guys are being very active,
because it very simple to hack
you just download a tool and run the tool

WebTalkGuys: Why are they doing this though? dont these people have jobs?
Dont they have lives themselves or do they just sit around?

Lance: Well its very interesting and its one of the things weve learned
beacuse of these honeynets we see what these guys do afterwords, so we can monitor the motives
there is a misconception that people think that alot of these attackers are
misguided youths out exploring the internet
the reality is that the vast majority of these individuals
are criminal intent, in other words to make money
we see alot of time peolple hacking systems and
scanning for stolen credit cards
or thier launching attacks against other organizations
and potentially getting paid for it
or they are dealing in stolen music,
videos, licensed software such things called warez
people scanning or scouring the internet for email addresses
to build databases of stolen email addresses to sell to spammers
stolen paypal accounts
stolen ebay accounts
there is just a tremendous amount of criminal activity going on

WebTalk Guys: Ok so its really a malicious type of environment

Lance: Extremely hostile

----------discontiuity-----------------

a large percentage of the bad guys really dont care what systems they break into
they simply download an automated tool that
will literally scan 16 million computers in a night
and any one of those 16 million computers is vulnerable
the program will break into them

----------discontiuity-----------------

WebTalk: What are some of the most hacked operating systems out there?
Everybody has heard about Windows, but is Windows really the most hacked operating system on the internet?

Lance: No everybody is a potential victim, Windows tends to be very popular just because if the bad guys are going to develop an exploit he gets the biggest bang for the buck, for Windows.

we also tend to see alot of focus on Linux just because Linux is a free operating system
so more economically depressed countries its easier for the bad guys to get access to this OS, understand this OS and attack the OS
For example countries like Romania, Eastern Europe very economically depressed,
so we tend to see
alot of hacking activity coming out of those countries

WebTalk Guys: OK cause certainly as far as the numbers of computers that are connected to the Internet most of them are Unix and Linux arent they as far as the overall number?

No I would actually disagree I would say the growing majority is more in the
Windows side as more and more home users are connecting via broadband

WebTalk Guys: Well thats true and thats a fairly recent phenomenon

Lance: Exactly
and the very scary thing is thats why its becoming easier for hackers because people have this misconception that bad guys only target buisnesses or companies, but they dont realize
anybody, any system with an IP stack is a target
so you have these millions of home users coming online
that have no conception of security, who dont beleive theyre a target,
this becomes a very target rich environment for the bad guys.


----------discontiuity-----------------

More >
Click to expand...

the Advantage of Linux is that most of the aps youd get would be open source
and that provided you get them from a trusted source, and run the checksums, they are less likely to be a vector, as mentioned there is a bigger bang for the buck coding for Windows, and the users are easier marks, but if youll recall the Rsynch Gentoo Linux Kernal Server was compromised awhile back, like any OS you need to keep on top of the security developments, the focus in Linux is slightly different but security is still very important
 
/me reads thread title, runs to main rig and un-installs Anti-Virus "Phew, glad to get that off my shoulders"
 
Hmmrmmmmm i'm still online, my PC is running perfectly fine, and I'm programming some PHP right now without any slowdown in PC performance. Looks like you guys gave up. If anyone wants to take another crack at it:

mach1.digitalisakujin.com

btw i'm running VNC on port 5900......

Only 8^62 possible combinations.....(assuming I didn't use symbols....).....
 
Nutscrape as you so elequently put it is old news. Use Mozilla or Opera of Firefox. Lets just forget about tabbed browsing (which will change the way you surf) and pop-up blocker (which you never realized how you lived without it) Mozilla has tons of skins, plugins, extensions yada yada yada. Plus it has an email/web/irc client bundled with it. AVG is a free anti-virus software and really is low overhead and IMHO much better than Norton. Norton bitched about every little action that would occur on my computer (no I wasnt infected) and quite frankly was more annoying then it was worth. Second if your friend takes technical adivse from a LAN party member, he needs more than just friendly advise :)
 
DR_K13 said:
/usr/fart ;)
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/usr/bin/ids/ :p

DigitalisAkujin said:
btw i'm running VNC on port 5900......
Only 8^62 possible combinations.....(assuming I didn't use symbols....).....
Click to expand...

tempting fate I see, on a public forum
I run dual Opterons, and I have friends that I could convince to employ their renderfarms
passwords can and will be forced, especially when instructions as to where they are located are publicly published
(if you lied, congratulations on the disinformation campagin :p )

might I recommend TCP Wrapper with cgywin and openssh? (if its a Windows box)
or at least port forwarding VNC from its default port (unless your behind a NAT)

I employ a 32 chracter Alphanumeric Upper and lower Case Password with Symbols, and do use TCP wrappers and encryption
but I also dont tempt fate

XXXXX is a multi-process password cracking system. The current version of XXXXXX (0.7.3) recovers Windows NT/2000/XP and Samba user account passwords computing DES/MD4 password hashes. Though XXXXXXX includes a dictionary based password recovery algorithm, the main goal of this system is to perform parallel-brute-force attacks. This is why it is designed as a multi-process parallel system with the ability to run in multiprocessor (SMP) or load-balancing cluster systems. XXXXXXX divides the password ranges among sub-processes and then creates the "n" child processes themselves. If XXXXXXX is executed on a load-balancing cluster, the different child processes are migrated to the other nodes increasing the computational speed. XXXXXXX includes a flexible character feeding mechanism that will be used to test different character sets (alphabets) in order to accelerate the password recovery task.
Click to expand...
 
DigitalisAkujin said:
Hmmrmmmmm i'm still online, my PC is running perfectly fine, and I'm programming some PHP right now without any slowdown in PC performance. Looks like you guys gave up. If anyone wants to take another crack at it:

mach1.digitalisakujin.com

btw i'm running VNC on port 5900......

Only 8^62 possible combinations.....(assuming I didn't use symbols....).....
Click to expand...

btw, the file rxit2.exe has the spybot worm on your ftp server, i know this cause you have anonymous ftp access enabled...give me a few minutes and ill post a screenshot.

your welcome
 
DigitalisAkujin said:
Hmmrmmmmm i'm still online, my PC is running perfectly fine, and I'm programming some PHP right now without any slowdown in PC performance. Looks like you guys gave up. If anyone wants to take another crack at it:

mach1.digitalisakujin.com

btw i'm running VNC on port 5900......

Only 8^62 possible combinations.....(assuming I didn't use symbols....).....
Click to expand...

good thing I am a good boy now.


funny036.jpg
 
W32.Spybot.Worm

W32.Spybot.Worm is a detection for a family of worms that spreads using KaZaA file sharing and mIRC. This worm can also spread to computers that are infected with common backdoor Trojan horses.

W32.Spybot.Worm can perform different backdoor-type functions by connecting to a configurable IRC server and joining a specific channel to listen for instructions. Newer variants may also spread by exploiting the following vulnerabilities:

* The DCOM RPC Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-026) using TCP port 135.
* The Microsoft Windows Local Security Authority Service Remote Buffer Overflow (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS04-011).
* The vulnerabilities in the Microsoft SQL Server 2000 or MSDE 2000 audit (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS02-061) using UDP port 1434.
* The WebDav Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-007) using TCP port 80.
* The UPnP NOTIFY Buffer Overflow Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS01-059).
* The Workstation Service Buffer Overrun Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-049) using TCP port 445.
Windows XP users are protected against this vulnerability if the patch in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-043 has been applied. Windows 2000 users must apply the patch in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-049.
 
Ice Czar said:
W32.Spybot.Worm

W32.Spybot.Worm is a detection for a family of worms that spreads using KaZaA file sharing and mIRC. This worm can also spread to computers that are infected with common backdoor Trojan horses.

W32.Spybot.Worm can perform different backdoor-type functions by connecting to a configurable IRC server and joining a specific channel to listen for instructions. Newer variants may also spread by exploiting the following vulnerabilities:

* The DCOM RPC Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-026) using TCP port 135.
* The Microsoft Windows Local Security Authority Service Remote Buffer Overflow (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS04-011).
* The vulnerabilities in the Microsoft SQL Server 2000 or MSDE 2000 audit (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS02-061) using UDP port 1434.
* The WebDav Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-007) using TCP port 80.
* The UPnP NOTIFY Buffer Overflow Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS01-059).
* The Workstation Service Buffer Overrun Vulnerability (described in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-049) using TCP port 445.
Windows XP users are protected against this vulnerability if the patch in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-043 has been applied. Windows 2000 users must apply the patch in Microsoft Security Bulletin MS03-049.
Click to expand...

haha, so he's not even installing the windows updates which he deemed the needed step in preventing infections?
 
now that i have his ip, ill blacklist it on my firewall so i wont get any traffic from his zombie of a computer. hmm, he's using comcast, i wonder if i can get him disconnected if i call up and say ive been getting infected from his ip.
 
i have norton antivirus on my machine, plus ad-aware se. the two together get off everything i need them too.

if i ever get into lan gaming i will invest in a copy of norton professional securities. i have had viruses and spyware on this heap and it is no fun.

if your 'friend' needs convincing, put a light-duty virus on there and see what he does when wierd things start happening. you just want something that will screw things up in a funny way, but that norton will wipe the motherboard with in about 5 seconds.

that will make him change his mind very, very fast.

if it doesn't, then what you want to get a hold of is the portalsearching spyware. i can usually handle viruses, but i ruined a good pair of pants on that one. it puts an icon on your desktop that sez "portal searching" (hence its name) and it embeds itself in svchost.exe, your rcspss. i thought i had sasser and, as i said, i ruined a pair of jeans when i first saw it. it doesn't corrupt or delete anything, just plants an icon on your desktop and makes itself (and, by the same token, other spyware- i had 120 on mine when i finally got rid of the f***ing thing) impossible to get rid of. norton can't see it, if you run ad-aware it will shut your comp down. that n00b will piss his pants in minutes.

i can send you the uninstaller i found online for it. it's really the only thing that can get rid of that spyware. you can also gooooooooogle the name and it will pop right up. someone named ammis came up with the thing. the user interface is crap but it works.
 
teehee.

so he can't ask you for help once you drop that present on his system? heh heh heh... >:-} mean but it'll teach him a lesson.
 
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