ASUS VG278HE - 144Hz

Vega said:
The screen is spring balanced to keep it's set height, so why would you need a locking pin? Are you using your monitor to do push-ups or something?
Click to expand...

I do cleaning (usually every wednesday), and if I wipe the top of the monitor, the whole thing will go down like there's nothing holding it. That's why I wonder why there's a pin from the beginning and there's a video on youtube here that says we need to remove the pin in order to adjust the height. So that means if the pin is in, we should not be able to adjust the height at all.
Even JJ says we can use the pin to lock it. But it doesn't work :(
 
Does anyone know if it would be possible to match a couple of these up with the VG278H model for Nvidia Surround?

Cheers.
 
Superbitsandbob said:
Does anyone know if it would be possible to match a couple of these up with the VG278H model for Nvidia Surround?

Cheers.
Click to expand...

NVIDIA driver can be pretty stingy, so not sure if it would work since the EDID info is different. Something like that would most likely have to be tried out to see. Just curious, why would you want to mix the displays?
 
I have a non E version but the E is quite a bit cheaper in the UK. I'm not really interested in 3D surround, just standard.
 
wow.

Sadly I don't know anyone who has one. Or else I'd be camping out on their (snow covered) lawn this morning.
 
In theory it should work with any lightboost supported monitor, right?

Shame they are all 1080p, else I'd get one.

Damnit manufacturers, where are you? DisplayPort 1.2, use it!
 
With lightboost another selling point (perhaps not known that well by most) is the 2ms backlight strobe to cut down blur.


Mark Rejhon said:
One big problem:

There is always motion blur on sample-and-hold displays even with instant-responding (0ms) pixels. This motion blur is caused by eye-tracking based motion, which is the major cause of motion blur. On a modern panel, pixel persistence is no longer the main cause of motion blur because it's now only a tiny fraction (e.g. 2-5ms) out of a 16ms refresh at 60Hz) See Science & References that explains this further.

Your eyes are always moving, while following a moving object. On a sample-and-hold display (non-strobed), your eyes have moved a tiny bit even over the 1/60th second (or 1/120th second), so the LCD frame is blurred across your retinas, as the frames artificially step forward, one frame at a time. The edge blur thickness is equivalent to the step distance. For example, a moving objecte that steps 16 pixels between frames, you've got 16 pixels of edge blur -- even with instant-responding pixels (0ms). Double the Hz, and you've got half the step, and that's why LCD 120Hz has 50% less motion blur than LCD 60Hz. However, CRT 60fps@60Hz has much sharper motion than LCD 120fps@120Hz, and that actually is not only because of pixel persistence -- it's actually scientifically proven/measured to also be eye-tracking based motion blur on a sample-and-hold display. On newer LCD panels, retinal blurring during eye tracking is a MUCH BIGGER cause of motion blur than pixel persistence. (2ms out of 16ms refresh, means pixel persistence on a 2ms LCD is less than 20% the cause of motion blur at 60Hz -- and by itself, does not explain why motion blur is still so bad)

You _need_ more frames (more Hz, or frame interpolation), _or_ strobing (CRT, LightBoost, scanning backlight, etc). The stroboscopic effect eliminates the retinal blurring caused by eye tracking. In a perfect world, we'd have infinite framerate, but that's technically impossible, so strobing is the easiest way (ala CRT) -- and done at a high enough rate that the flicker doesn't bother the eyes. (Thus, 120Hz and up is a good rate for strobing that looks flicker-free to most people)
Click to expand...




The BenQ XL2411T has 1ms backlight strobing that reportedly results in full motion clarity, quoted as 94% blur reduction/crt-like clarity (not 100% since there can be an after image/shadow present that from what I understand does not smear or blur the original objects, textures and text at all). For me personally I would rather have 120hz of motion tracking frames with full un-blurred crt-like clarity than 144hz of motion tracking frames that only have around half as much blur as a 60hz lcd , smearing all the scene objects, high detail textures, depth via bumpmapping (the entire scene) every time I move the FoV.
 
Got myself the 278HE, and i love it! Way better then my old XL2420T from BenQ, those colours where horrible!!
 
Lakigucci said:
Got myself the 278HE, and i love it! Way better then my old XL2420T from BenQ, those colours where horrible!!
Click to expand...
How are the LightBoost colors on it too?
There are more inversion artifacts on the HE than the H, although I'm wondering if ASUS has improved this since then.

Either way, good to know that the colors are large upgrade!
 
Since this thread was bumped up, I need to correct some old information before new information was discovered:
elvn said:
The BenQ XL2411T has 1ms backlight strobing that reportedly results in full motion clarity, quoted as 94% blur reduction/crt-like clarity (not 100% since there can be an after image/shadow present that from what I understand does not smear or blur the original objects, textures and text at all). For me personally I would rather have 120hz of motion tracking frames with full un-blurred crt-like clarity than 144hz of motion tracking frames that only have around half as much blur as a 60hz lcd , smearing all the scene objects, high detail textures, depth via bumpmapping (the entire scene) every time I move the FoV.
Click to expand...
Some new information: All LightBoost monitors have backlight strobing of the same length. The shortest LightBoost strobes is actually measured to be 1.4 milliseconds. The LCD panel pixel response time simply affects how crosstalk-free the LightBoost becomes (the faint trailing sharp ghost effect). Some people prefer great LightBoost colors plus a faint amount of trailing double image (e.g. VG278H), while other people prefer poorer LightBoost colors plus near-lack of trailing double image (e.g. VG248QE).

We've subsequently discovered that during LightBoost enabled -- motion blur becomes controlled by the backlight, so there is no real difference in motion blur between XL2411T, VG278H, VG248QE, VG278H, XL2420T, etc. Just artifact differences, with a cleaner look on VG248QE but poorer colors, and a slight (but still faint) double-image on VG278H/HE but better colors.



Personally I prefer my VG278H now over my XL2411T because of better color quality, and I still get the same motion blur elimination with LightBoost.
 
Last edited:
Mark Rejhon said:
Personally I prefer my VG278H now over my XL2411T because of better color quality, and I still get the same motion blur elimination with LightBoost.
Click to expand...

Would the lightboost function be worth switching out my graphics card for? Im currently using a 7970 atm wich runs my games just fine (BF3 on low 100-200 fps).

thnx for your input ;)
 
NinjaGnat said:
I think there is a utility which enables lightboost on ATI, you might as well give this a shot first.
http://www.blurbusters.com/easy-lightboost-toastyx-strobelight/
Click to expand...
Yep. That said, make sure that it works properly. It's a beta, but when set up correctly (run Strobelight Setup and install multiple resolutions -- 120Hz strobed and 144 Hz), you can easily turn ON/OFF LightBoost independently of the GPU since Strobelight has its own built-in LightBoost initialization code. (Blur Busters has tested only on nVidia, however, but others have said it worked on their Radeon...)

Do this:

1. Install Strobelight.
Run strobelight-setup and install multiple refresh rates (120Hz strobed, 121Hz, 144Hz). Reboot.
Run strobelight and now a lightbulb shows in your system tray.

2. Run Chrome web browser and launch this 120fps web animation: www.testufo.com/#test=photo

3. While viewing the above, turn ON/OFF LightBoost via Ctrl+Alt+Plus and Ctrl+Alt+Minus

4. You should, see a dramatic difference in motion clarity when LightBoost is enabled when viewing that link in Chrome.
(Note: Chrome is the only release web browser to support 120Hz VSYNC. FireFox 24+ pre-beta also supports 120Hz VSYNC.)
 
I am currently running a Benq XL2410T and I love the monitor but I feel in my older age I need a larger monitor ;)

I am severely torn between trying this VG278HE monitor for a larger screen or a QNIX QX2710 for the larger screen plus higher resolution. The downside is I do not really want to rely on overclocking for 120hz on the monitor........
 
Crazy Chuckster said:
I am currently running a Benq XL2410T and I love the monitor but I feel in my older age I need a larger monitor ;)

I am severely torn between trying this VG278HE monitor for a larger screen or a QNIX QX2710 for the larger screen plus higher resolution. The downside is I do not really want to rely on overclocking for 120hz on the monitor........
Click to expand...

I felt the same way, so I bought the XL2720T. The pixel pitch was ok for gaming, but since I spend most of the day doing other things, 1920x1080 at 27" bugged the heck out of me. I've got old eyes and figured it would be ok, but I dropped back to 24" and to me it looks a lot better. That's just me, so your experience might well be completely different. Also, for just gaming, the 27" was nice. I do love 120hz LB, which I use 24/7.
 
Last edited:
Crazy Chuckster said:
I am currently running a Benq XL2410T and I love the monitor but I feel in my older age I need a larger monitor ;)

I am severely torn between trying this VG278HE monitor for a larger screen or a QNIX QX2710 for the larger screen plus higher resolution. The downside is I do not really want to rely on overclocking for 120hz on the monitor........
Click to expand...
Don't forget that during ideal framerate=Hz motion:
QNIX QX2710 at 120Hz has about 40-50% less motion blur than 60Hz LCD -- that's only up to 2x clearer motion
LightBoost at 120Hz has about 85-92% less motion blur than 60Hz LCD -- that's up to 12x clearer motion

Mathematically, it's 50% less motion blur, but the QX2710 has a bit more streaking, while LightBoost strobes backlight to bypass sample-and-hold motion blur.
At 90% less motion blur, you get only 1 pixel of motion blurring where you used to get 10 pixels of motion blurring, for certain fast motion such as http://www.testufo.com/#test=photo
 
Ya, even though the 1440P IPS overclocked to 120 Hz is smoother, the motion blur is still pretty bad. So essentially you are doubling your GPU load over 60 Hz (if you want to match FPS-Hz like I always do), yet don't decrease motion blur significantly.
 
Vega said:
Ya, even though the 1440P IPS overclocked to 120 Hz is smoother, the motion blur is still pretty bad. So essentially you are doubling your GPU load over 60 Hz (if you want to match FPS-Hz like I always do), yet don't decrease motion blur significantly.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the input fella's, it is much appreciated. I may just give the Asus a try.
 
Mark Rejhon said:
Yep. That said, make sure that it works properly. It's a beta, but when set up correctly (run Strobelight Setup and install multiple resolutions -- 120Hz strobed and 144 Hz), you can easily turn ON/OFF LightBoost independently of the GPU since Strobelight has its own built-in LightBoost initialization code. (Blur Busters has tested only on nVidia, however, but others have said it worked on their Radeon...)

Do this:

1. Install Strobelight.
Run strobelight-setup and install multiple refresh rates (120Hz strobed, 121Hz, 144Hz). Reboot.
Run strobelight and now a lightbulb shows in your system tray.

2. Run Chrome web browser and launch this 120fps web animation: www.testufo.com/#test=photo

3. While viewing the above, turn ON/OFF LightBoost via Ctrl+Alt+Plus and Ctrl+Alt+Minus

4. You should, see a dramatic difference in motion clarity when LightBoost is enabled when viewing that link in Chrome.
(Note: Chrome is the only release web browser to support 120Hz VSYNC. FireFox 24+ pre-beta also supports 120Hz VSYNC.)
Click to expand...

Definitly gonna try this when i get home. Ill let you guys know the outcome!
 
Lakigucci said:
Definitly gonna try this when i get home. Ill let you guys know the outcome!
Click to expand...
And when you're finished, test comparing LightBoost=10% versus LightBoost=100%

-- Keep LightBoost ON while viewing the moving photo. Speed up the photo a bit, such as to 1440 pixels/sec (or click this link in Chrome). Now switch between LightBoost=10% (1.4ms strobes) and LightBoost=100% (2.4ms strobes) by pressing Control+Alt+1 (10%) and Control+Alt+0 (100%). You will observe less motion blur in the windows on the buildings in the moving photo, especially in the windows in the 'castle' at the top of the photo.
-- Your human eyes are comparing 2.4ms strobe-driven versus 1.4ms strobe-driven. You are actually visually seeing the 1ms difference. 1440 pixels per second divided by 1000 (1ms) equals 1.4 pixels worth of motion blur; which is noticeable during these fast pans.
-- TFTCentral used an oscilloscope to measure strobe lengths of LightBoost=10% and LightBoost=100%, in their Motion Blur Reduction Backlights (Including LightBoost) article. This suggests this is not the final frontier; monitor manufacturers should aim for ability to do 1ms or 0.5ms strobe lengths in the future (with a brighter backlight, and wider brightness range adjustment).
 
Any news regarding other manufacturer's 144Hz panels? Kinda disappointed that it doesn't seem to have created such a boom/craze regarding Nvidia 3D Vision2 / Lightboost monitors. I would love to see more better options with good overall image quality (by TN panel standards). Particularly if some manufacturers would even go as far as allowing onboard adjustments of all normal settings (brightness, contrast + colors on the monitor itself!) while Lightboost is activated, that had been gold!

I'm still using my ViewSonic VX2268wm 120Hz first gen 3Dvision panel and I've hold off upgrading only because I keep reading the image quality is a bit hit and miss (also not sure I'm that fond of 1080p, quite liking the 16:10 format and also at work the monitor uses 1680x1050 so I've gotten very acoustomed to this particular res and feel comfortable with it). I'm particularly picky about colorbalance which suprisingly my ViewSonic does a very decent job at, in fact it's probably its best IQ aspect, colors look very neutral once very slightly calibrated in the OSD. It has somewhat poor contrast ratio though (If my memory serves right was something like ~730:1 measured) which my eye also can tell and has pretty bad lightbleed so have to use brightness of 23 to get it acceptable but otherwise I've still been satisfied.
 
Last edited:
Mark Rejhon said:
And when you're finished, test comparing LightBoost=10% versus LightBoost=100%

-- Keep LightBoost ON while viewing the moving photo. Speed up the photo a bit, such as to 1440 pixels/sec (or click this link in Chrome). Now switch between LightBoost=10% (1.4ms strobes) and LightBoost=100% (2.4ms strobes) by pressing Control+Alt+1 (10%) and Control+Alt+0 (100%). You will observe less motion blur in the windows on the buildings in the moving photo, especially in the windows in the 'castle' at the top of the photo.
-- Your human eyes are comparing 2.4ms strobe-driven versus 1.4ms strobe-driven. You are actually visually seeing the 1ms difference. 1440 pixels per second divided by 1000 (1ms) equals 1.4 pixels worth of motion blur; which is noticeable during these fast pans.
-- TFTCentral used an oscilloscope to measure strobe lengths of LightBoost=10% and LightBoost=100%, in their Motion Blur Reduction Backlights (Including LightBoost) article. This suggests this is not the final frontier; monitor manufacturers should aim for ability to do 1ms or 0.5ms strobe lengths in the future (with a brighter backlight, and wider brightness range adjustment).
Click to expand...

Ok, ill try that next after work.
The strobelight worked for me on the Asus 278HE using youre guide here. Im very pleased with the results so far. The photo became much clearer with the strobing on. To bad i cant set it to strobe for 144hz tho. It's either 144hz no strobing or 120hz strobed, so i cant use the full potention of my screen.
 
RPGWiZaRD said:
Any news regarding other manufacturer's 144Hz panels? Kinda disappointed that it doesn't seem to have created such a boom/craze regarding Nvidia 3D Vision2 / Lightboost monitors. I would love to see more better options with good overall image quality (by TN panel standards). Particularly if some manufacturers would even go as far as allowing onboard adjustments of all normal settings (brightness, contrast + colors on the monitor itself!) while Lightboost is activated, that had been gold!
Click to expand...

I'm still using my ViewSonic VX2268wm 120Hz first gen 3Dvision panel and I've hold off upgrading only because I keep reading the image quality is a bit hit and miss
Click to expand...
Fortunately, the image quality of the VG278H and XL2720T has had a much smaller delta of image quality loss. You are able to keep the nearly same contrast ratio in LightBoost mode on those monitors. In general, the 27" 120Hz LightBoost monitors have apparently generally produced better color quality than the 24" 144Hz LightBoost monitors, though the new XL2420TE may change things.


The en-masse LightBoost 2D discovery is only half a year old now, but it's already influenced some media. Enough 120Hz users on the Internet now know about LightBoost to start demanding reviewers to test it. For example, AnandTech capitulated to the people in the Comments section and added LightBoost information to the Anandtech XL2720T review. I have also heard that other manufacturers are testing strobe backlights now, as a result of the LightBoost buzz in forums and elsewhere. But manufacturers / media aren't yet really consistently acknowleding its existence. It needs to grow beyond that, and become a feature in more monitors.

The bad LightBoost colors are most loudly complained about from the VG248QE users (popular, inexpensive LightBoost monitor), as that one has traditionally had a larger delta in image quality degradation.
 
Mark Rejhon said:
though the new XL2420TE may change things.
Click to expand...

This looks pretty interesting, seems like it's the first manufacturer that targets Lightboost technology towards 2D gaming, at least that's how I interpret its "ZeroFlicker™" technology haha. :p Remains to be seen what steps have been taken towards making sure it gets as nice experience as possible. Though BenQ has a history of not being able to get out nice colors in gaming monitors unfortunately.

Otherwise I have to applaud you Mark Rejhon for your continued support and focus on LightBoost / motion smoothness in general. There are way too few enthusiasts like this in the world. I also prioritize motion smoothness very highly, well it started as a small kid already why I started wondering on some CRTs the graphics seemed much more fluid and realistic feeling which I then later on learnt it was due to different refresh rates used. I wouldn't be able to handle IPS monitors due to lack of motion smoothness, I prioritize motion smoothness slightly over image quality but ofc ideally I want both. Had Trinitron CRTs still been sold today in retail markets I would have used one today still. (Yes I know Lightboost is equally good smoothness wise but my point is TN panels aren't quite up to high quality CRTs in other aspects (not to mention backlight bleed issues, viewing angles, dead pixels, uneven color uniformity etc - none of which are any worries on CRTs) and we'd need proper adjustments for when Lightboost is activated etc).
 
Last edited:
RPGWiZaRD said:
This looks pretty interesting, seems like it's the first manufacturer that targets Lightboost technology towards 2D gaming, at least that's how I interpret its "ZeroFlicker™" technology haha.
Click to expand...
Just to point out -- ZeroFlicker is only used in non-LightBoost mode.

Scientifically, there's no way to match the full LightBoost effect without using flicker, unless you do insane high refresh rates (and need to use interpolation or insane GPU's).
You would need:
-- 400fps@400Hz (flickerfree) necessary to equal LightBoost=100% (1/400sec strobe flashes = 2.4ms)
-- 700fps@700Hz (flickerfree) necessary to equal LightBoost=10% (1/700sec strobe flashes = 1.4ms).

BTW, thanks for the compliment! That's why I started BlurBusters and TestUFO.
 
I have a couple of questions:

1. I am primarily interested in 3D gaming. I tried Nvidia's 3DTV play with my Panny ST50 and it looks pretty good. But I am seen significant crosstalk in Batman AA. Do you think getting the VG278H or VG278HE will provide less crosstalk? Will the Panny have better PQ?

2. I am torn between VG278H or VG278HE. Which one will be the better display for 3D gaming?
 
Nvidia_ATI said:
I have a couple of questions:

1. I am primarily interested in 3D gaming. I tried Nvidia's 3DTV play with my Panny ST50 and it looks pretty good. But I am seen significant crosstalk in Batman AA. Do you think getting the VG278H or VG278HE will provide less crosstalk? Will the Panny have better PQ?

2. I am torn between VG278H or VG278HE. Which one will be the better display for 3D gaming?
Click to expand...

Panny -- better PQ (colors)
VG278H -- better 3D (less crosstalk)

Most LightBoost displays are very good at eliminating 3D crosstalk, and they also simultaneously eliminate motion blur (for both 2D and 3D gaming). I should mention that the VG248QE has slightly less 3D crosstalk than the VG278* series does. The VG278H/HE/HR are all very similiar, except that the VG278H original is limited to 120Hz. A few forum reports showed that the VG278H had fewer artifacts (checkerboard pixel patern -- the LCD inversion pattern) than the VG278HE, but this may have changed over the last few months due to different manufacturing.
 
Mark Rejhon said:
Panny -- better PQ (colors)
VG278H -- better 3D (less crosstalk)

Most LightBoost displays are very good at eliminating 3D crosstalk, and they also simultaneously eliminate motion blur (for both 2D and 3D gaming). I should mention that the VG248QE has slightly less 3D crosstalk than the VG278* series does. The VG278H/HE/HR are all very similiar, except that the VG278H original is limited to 120Hz. A few forum reports showed that the VG278H had fewer artifacts (checkerboard pixel patern -- the LCD inversion pattern) than the VG278HE, but this may have changed over the last few months due to different manufacturing.
Click to expand...

Thanks Mark for your response. It is very helpful! :) Since I am only interested in gaming in 3D, I do not need the 144Hz capability of the VG278HE. From what I understand, 3D Vision requires 120Hz only? I was just wondering since the VG278HE/HR are newer panels, they might have better 3D than the VG278H. Is this true? I am also wondering if it is possible to get the VG278HR in the US. I considered the VG248QE but the 24' is too small. I currently have a U3011 so I am used to large screens :p But I have heard that 1080p on a 27' panel looks bad because of the large pixels. I am hoping the immersion of 3D will mask this somewhat. What do you think?
 
Nvidia_ATI said:
I am hoping the immersion of 3D will mask this somewhat. What do you think?
Click to expand...
The immersion does help, especially since the lower resolution allows you to turn on AA, which compensates. Besides, your panny has bigger pixels so the 27" will have smaller pixels in comparison.
The H/HE/HR are extremely similiar, but the original H has had at least three forum reports of slightly less checkerboard-pixel-pattern artifacts. Example is hazmatm's post on OCN: VG278H versus VG278HE
Two other forum reports exist, as well.

But from others I had heard of more positive reports, so the manufacturing quality of the HE/HR may have improved since then.
 
Nvidia_ATI said:
Thanks Mark for your response. It is very helpful! :) Since I am only interested in gaming in 3D, I do not need the 144Hz capability of the VG278HE. From what I understand, 3D Vision requires 120Hz only? I was just wondering since the VG278HE/HR are newer panels, they might have better 3D than the VG278H. Is this true? I am also wondering if it is possible to get the VG278HR in the US. I considered the VG248QE but the 24' is too small. I currently have a U3011 so I am used to large screens :p But I have heard that 1080p on a 27' panel looks bad because of the large pixels. I am hoping the immersion of 3D will mask this somewhat. What do you think?
Click to expand...

There is a user on Rage3d who was really disappointed by this panel coming from some samsung display and tri-def strictly due to those artifacts.

Here is a quote

I would avoid that monitor for 3d personally.

Mark Rejhon said:
But from others I had heard of more positive reports, so the manufacturing quality of the HE/HR may have improved since then.
Click to expand...

Thats very possible.
 
Mark Rejhon and BababooeyHTJ, thanks for your comments. I ordered the VG278H from Amazon. I'll post my experiences when I get the chance to test it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top