ASUS/BENQ LightBoost owners!! Zero motion blur setting!

If it had true 120hz input and more reasonable desktop size perhaps it might be different.
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Actually.... Some HDTV's including plasmas can be overclocked to 120Hz native, much like Catleap 2B's, QNIX Q2710's and Overlord X270OC's.
Success reports too! Blur Busters Blog trailblazes in this area too.

HDTV Refresh Rate Overclocking HOWTO:
120Hz from computer to TV

Here's your link to give out when you see posts "Your HDTV can't do 120Hz natively, it's only interpolation and fake frames" when the true answer has gotten (ahem) -- a lot more interesting!
 
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Nice! I never noticed that area of the site. Very cool. I wonder if the plasma someone mentioned in the comments would have even less blur considering plasma tech itself + 120hz input. Also wonder about judder and such being eliminated considering the framerate of blurays. Hrmmm.

A 120hz forced plasma tv for movies and a glossy lightboost monitor + nvidia card for games would be a couple of sweet setups.
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edit: I might have to sell some of my stuffs and make that switch.

edit: looks like only 720p on some of the tv's for 120hz, and talk of having to bypass reciever, etc... harumph.
 
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elvn said:
Nice! I never noticed that area of the site. Very cool. I wonder if the plasma someone mentioned in the comments would have even less blur considering plasma tech itself + 120hz input. Also wonder about judder and such being eliminated considering the framerate of blurays. Hrmmm.
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For 24fps film on flicker free displays (sample and hold), 24Hz, 48Hz, 72Hz, 96Hz, and 120Hz look identical when playing back 24p material. Each frame is displayed statically for a full 1/24sec regardless of the refresh rate.

For 24fps film on impulse driven displays (e.g. CRT, plasma), more flickers per frame add more motion blur and higher Hz more resembles a flicker-free sample-and-hold display.
24Hz -- less motion blur, potentially zero motion blur, but way too much flicker. Like 1920's film projectors.
48Hz -- similiar to common film projectors (each frame repeat twice). Moderate motion blur.
72Hz -- less flicker, good compromise for the original "film feel". More motion blur.
96Hz -- even less flicker
120Hz -- even less flicker, starts to resemble sample-and-hold

Since you need fps=Hz for zero motion blur, you need to enable interpolation (adding fake frames). Some HDTV's give you that soap opera effect while watching movies. If you prefer the zero motion blur effect while watching film, this is the only way to go. However, I am more of a purist when it comes to film -- I actually prefer motion blur when watching films.
 
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elvn said:
edit: looks like only 720p on some of the tv's for 120hz, and talk of having to bypass reciever, etc... harumph.
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The HOWTO is a bit conservative, to prevent raising user expectations too much. Apparently, many HDTV's that manage 720p@120Hz also do 1080p@120Hz from the success reports received so far.

You can also bring a laptop to Best Buy (any good nVidia laptop with support for 3D Vision on external monitors -- such laptops are able to output 120Hz externally) -- and test the TV's refresh rate overclocking capabilities before you buy. You may need to do some prep to make sure you can do laptop-based HDTV refresh overclocking, test your laptop's HDMI output to driving your ASUS/BENQ/Samsung 120Hz computer monitor to make sure refresh rate override is working via laptop, as it's a bit challenging, but it can be done if your laptop has the right output and supports external 3D Vision (like many high end nVidia laptops can). Once this works, you can test-drive HDTV's at Best Buy to 120Hz, and find out which HDTV's support 120Hz directly from a computer.

Yes, it's unfortunate you have to bypass the receiver to do the HDTV refresh rate overclocking.
 
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Thanks for the further detail. sorry to go off topic somewhat vs pure lightboost tech though.

I always understood that in regard to judder anomalies on TV bluray viewing, 24p vs 60 was not an clean multiple while a true 120hz input display had the potential to be a clean multiple (24 frames repeated 5 times each = 120) if done properly. That is what I was getting at.
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I'll stick with my led backlit lcd for now but it's good to know the option going forward. Having more blur free or greatly reduced blur screens around would be great. I still have a xbr960 crt tv as well btw, which is 1080i / "720p" and has a hdmi input.. but 34" is pretty small for a tv. I mostly use it for console games.
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As for lightboost.. I'm considering getting a XL2720T since they dropped to around $470 currently, but I am still on an amd card so it would be putting the cart before the horse. I already have a non lightboost 27" 120hz monitor and I'm not willing to buy both the lightboost monitor and a gtx780 that I want at the same time right now. I'd also have to ask vega to remove the AG which would cost me $100 and probably additional shipping charges. So that is around $470 + $130 + $650 for a gtx 780, even if I find a buyer for my 27" 120hz samsung A750D and my amd 6990 gpu to help pay for it a little. I've never been very good about selling stuff :b .. I may have to wait until late september when I have a bonus coming. I've also been hoping a 27" glossy lightboost monitor would be in the works from a mfg at some point during my wait, but nothing on that so far.
 
If I can only get 50 or so FPS (DayZ), am I better off just leaving the monitor at 144hz instead of trying to use LightBoost?
 
joikd said:
If I can only get 50 or so FPS (DayZ), am I better off just leaving the monitor at 144hz instead of trying to use LightBoost?
Click to expand...

Some people will argue yes but I will say no. To me blur reduction is better at all frame rates then a blurry image.
 
rudy said:
Some people will argue yes but I will say no. To me blur reduction is better at all frame rates then a blurry image.
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I'll add that some people do notice marginal LightBoost benefits even at framerates 60fps and less.
But not everyone likes it.
...At 60fps@120Hz, it's a double-edge motion artifact (like 30fps@60Hz on a CRT).
...Some people prefer that to motion blur, while others prefer motion blur over multiple-edge artifacts.
...The feel is the same as a 120Hz CRT.
...If you preferred playing at 40fps on a 120Hz CRT than on a 120Hz LCD, then you will like enabling LightBoost anyway.

More unamious rave reviews about LightBoost occur when frame rates begin matching refresh rate...
...Especially you've got virtually complete elimination of all motion artifacts (perfect CRT motion effect with zero motion blur).
...Blur Busters still recommends 120fps@120Hz to avoid dissapointment.

Fortunately, the newer ToastyX method takes only 3 minutes to enable LightBoost.
...So it's worth trying out, enabling it temporarily to test. You may or may not see benefits.
...Also, do yourself a favour and test an older game too (e.g. Quake Live, Team Fortress 2, etc) just to get a brief feel of 120fps@120Hz LightBoost. Do things like strafing in front of walls, to see maximal benefits of LightBoost motion blur elimination.
 
Hi,

I just wanted to say Thanks!

This thread has so much information.

But it seems as this is not yet (easily) ready on AMD GPU's
Maybe in the Future there will be neutral Monitors with backlight strobing for a smoother experience.
 
It is available for AMD, but I don't think they like talking about it, considering it's Nvidia's technology we're using. If you have a cheap Nvidia card, you can set it up with that and then connect the dvi cable to the AMD card. Then, use the ToastyX CRU to apply the resolution settings.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Mark. I haven't yet done it myself, but I expect to within a few weeks
 
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Anandtechs review of the XL2720T is shameful. Chris totally blew the review... Non-gamers reviewing gaming products just doesn't make sense.

TFTCentral really is the one stop shop at this point. They recently updated their input lag tests and the lightboost article was excellent. I can't find another free site that is as comprehensive. I like Prad.de too but they don't have anything on Lightboost yet.
 
Pastuch said:
Anandtechs review of the XL2720T is shameful. Chris totally blew the review... Non-gamers reviewing gaming products just doesn't make sense.
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The clicky.

I am impressed how many of the commentors (without my initiative) scolded the reviewer for not testing the LightBoost feature.

I jumped into the fray a bit late -- to add a few links.
Hopefully the AnandTech staff reads them.
 
Anandtech has gone lame ever since anand went apple, he's all just about mobile now. I have pointed out that key roll over needs to be tested and discussed on any laptop review and they still never bother.
 
AnandTech just heard the community demands by the bunch of people commenting "Why didn't you test LightBoost?"....and will be adding some info about LightBoost to their article.

AnandTech said:
I've been testing Lightboost today after reading the comments and will go in and add some commentary on it. Using lightboost for 2D is undocumented (at least as far as BenQ is involved) and requires some messing around with settings, and never came up in my discussions with BenQ as something to be aware of with the display. I didn't notice any commentary on it online until now either, which is how it didn't get mentioned.

Also, I have no idea how the stats didn't make it into the review, that's just a dumb mistake on my part that needs to be remedied here really quick.
Click to expand...
 
AnandTech has made an addendum to their XL2720T review:

Update: Lightboost

As many people pointed out in the comments, you can use Lightboost, and some trickery, to get the XL2720T to display at 120 Hz with a strobing backlight. Working much more like a CRT, where you have black frames between objects and not object permenance on the screen, this should provide for better motion resolution and a more CRT-like feel. After I was made aware of this (it's not in the documentation with the monitor, or mentioned by BenQ, or really officially supported) and hooked the XL2720T back up and tested it in this mode.

One thing this does do it lock out all the picture controls except color and brightness. You also take a significant hit to light output in this mode. Motion does look smoother, that I can say for sure. However the extra flickering that this backlight causes also gives me a bit of a headache. I went away from CRTs to LCDs a decade ago because the flicker caused more eye-strain for me, and with the BenQ it seems to bring that feeling back. Games were smoother than before, with a noticeable difference in motion resolution, but it wasn't perfect. Losing all adjustments and the light output is a downside as well.

I wish they would make this a normal choice to use the monitor in, and not hidden away and requiring research and work. If motion resolution is the most important aspect to you, then you'll want to at least test out Lightboost mode on the XL2720T. Just know it does entail a few trade-offs as well.
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It hits severals of the well-known LightBoost points, so I consider this a fair addenum.
All review sites on the Internet, testing strobe-capable 120Hz computer monitors, should from now on always test the strobe modes for 2D.

There was definitely significant community demand (in the comments) that made AnandTech do an addendum. Other review sites would take heed from that -- and make sure that strobe modes are covered! Especially when the easy ToastyX lightboost utility arrives -- hotkey enable/disable of LightBoost -- coming by July.
 
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AnandTech has posted a bigger addendum, including measurement tests.
They measured a 779:1 contrast ratio for the BENQ XL2720T LightBoost.

AnandTech said:
As many people pointed out in the comments, you can use Lightboost, and some trickery, to get the XL2720T to display at 120 Hz with a strobing backlight. Working much more like a CRT, where you have black frames between objects and not object permenance on the screen, this should provide for better motion resolution and a more CRT-like feel. After I was made aware of this (it's not in the documentation with the monitor, or mentioned by BenQ, or really officially supported) and hooked the XL2720T back up and tested it in this mode.

One thing this does do it lock out all the picture controls except color and brightness. You also take a significant hit to light output in this mode. Motion does look smoother, that I can say for sure. However the extra flickering that this backlight causes also gives me a bit of a headache. I went away from CRTs to LCDs a decade ago because the flicker caused more eye-strain for me, and with the BenQ it seems to bring that feeling back. Games were smoother than before, with a noticeable difference in motion resolution, but it wasn't perfect. Losing all adjustments and the light output is a downside as well.

I also ran the numbers on the display with Lightboost enabled. As all of the controls except for Contrast are really locked off from you, then you need to rely on a video card LUT to calibrate and get anything remotely close to accurate. I also found the maximum contrast level I could drive was 48 without having severe clipping of whites. At this setting your maximum light output is 129 cd/m2. With the contrast at maximum I got 140 cd/m2 but also severe highlight clipping and color distortions.

Lightboost also causes a severe blue-shift in the image. I mean an extreme shift in the image. If you've read our display reviews, you'll know that 6503K is the ideal color temperature (CCT). Lower than that is reddish and higher is bluish. Sometimes we see a display come in around 10,000-12,000K, but that's very high. With Lightboost enabled, the BenQ has an average CCT of 36,025K. It is very, very blue. Here's a table with the data for the BenQ with Lightboost enabled, and after calibration with Lightboost on.

(graph)

So if you calibrate it, you can get a decent image with Lightboost enabled, but you also have to trade your contrast ratio and peak light output for it. It has to reduce Blue all through the video cart LUT to remove that horrible color cast on the image, and doing that drops the light output. At the default settings, the color tint is extreme and while you might be OK with it for gaming, for any daily use even those unconcerned with a calibration might find it to be way too blue for their liking. Post calibration it looks fine, though. All of the Pre- and Post-calibration charts are in the gallery below.

(ribbon bar of several LightBoost calibration graphics)
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Worth a read -- Page 7 of AnandTech XL2720T review covering LightBoost.
I am also mighty curious if they tested using 320.18 drivers.
 
Can I add a 20$ nvidia card to my system, activate LB then connect the monitor to my AMD card?

basicaly add nvidia to system, install nvidia drivers, activate LB, uninstall nvidia drivers, maybe keep nvidia card in system for future LB activation.

Display is Benq XL2411T
 
grandpatzer said:
Can I add a 20$ nvidia card to my system, activate LB then connect the monitor to my AMD card?

basicaly add nvidia to system, install nvidia drivers, activate LB, uninstall nvidia drivers, maybe keep nvidia card in system for future LB activation.

Display is Benq XL2411T
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I will have a program out next week that will work with AMD cards. The XL2411T is confirmed to work with it.
 
ToastyX said:
I will have a program out next week that will work with AMD cards. The XL2411T is confirmed to work with it.
Click to expand...
Beta testing this.
Note: Blur Busters only officially supports LightBoost with nVidia products, so I'm beta testing only with nVidia products

Conveniently:
-- Easy to use with triple monitors
-- Hotkey for enable/disable LightBoost
-- Hotkey for adjusting LightBoost % setting
 
ToastyX said:
I will have a program out next week that will work with AMD cards. The XL2411T is confirmed to work with it.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the news toasty I have GTX 460 I want to get off of but when I learned amd cards didn't do lightboost easily was going to hold out till maxwell.
 
Gonna keep my eye on that program for amd. If it works I'm probably gonna buy one of these and see what all the fuss is about :D
 
Well, in my last post I was ready to buy the xl2720t....was at work on the internet filling out the order...then BHAM the door to the offices burst open and 30 guys with shotguns and such come pouring in....the FTC closed us down......just like in the movies...well work is still closed and haven't got my pay checks yet.....DAMN
 
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New Blur Busters Blog entry:
________________

Andy of nVidia posted on NeoGaf, that nVidia has noticed the surge of LightBoost popularity.
This is hopefully good for the future of strobe backlights in general.



Monitor manufacturers also need to provide two modes in the same monitors:
(1) PWM-free dimming mode (for people who do not like flicker)
(2) Good strobe mode for CRT-quality motion blur elimination (one strobe per refresh)
 
Just released.... ToastyX StrobeLight, the world’s easiest method to turn on/off LightBoost. Even for 3-monitor surround setups! No 3D Vision setup required anymore!

...

Easy to add common refresh rates.

Ctrl-Alt-Plus = Turn on LightBoost
Ctrl-Alt-Minus = Turn on LightBoost
Ctrl-Alt-# = Adjust LightBoost % setting
 
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commissar said:
Will this support AMD cards now that 3DVision isn't required?
Click to expand...
BlurBusters recommends nVidia cards.
I beta tested only on nVidia cards, and got it working on both my ASUS and BENQ. Blur Busters does not wish to upset nVidia, because we believe nVidia made an important invention called LightBoost, that has shown to be the world's most superior scanning backlight

That said, ToastyX said it works on AMD cards.
 
Mark Rejhon said:
Just released.... ToastyX StrobeLight, the world’s easiest method to turn on/off LightBoost. Even for 3-monitor surround setups! No 3D Vision setup required anymore!

...

Easy to add common refresh rates.

Ctrl-Alt-Plus = Turn on LightBoost
Ctrl-Alt-Minus = Turn on LightBoost
Ctrl-Alt-# = Adjust LightBoost % setting
Click to expand...
lol... On and on? XD

But I would have to say that when they make a IPS with lightboost, that would be awesome. I use multiple NEC color accurate monitors at work, and have an old Vizio tv/monitor (LG IPS panel) that I use prior to this. Using the ASUS monitor makes me not want to look at the monitor much due to off colors, or maybe it's the strobe lighting too.
 
CHANG3D said:
But I would have to say that when they make a IPS with lightboost, that would be awesome. I use multiple NEC color accurate monitors at work, and have an old Vizio tv/monitor (LG IPS panel) that I use prior to this. Using the ASUS monitor makes me not want to look at the monitor much due to off colors, or maybe it's the strobe lighting too.
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That's why I am using the VG278H instead of the XL2411T (same panel as VG248QE). I own both LightBoost monitors.

My VG278H LightBoost colors is actually better (contrast-wise and saturation-wise) than my XL2411T non-LightBoost colors.
Presently, I'm getting more contrast ratio in VG278H LightBoost, than contrast ratio in XL2411T non-LightBoost.

I did 'cheat' a little with the VG278H (not HE, not QE), by pushing Contrast to about 5 clicks below its whiteclipping limits during LightBoost (~Contrast=85%), and undoing the horrible gamma bleach via nVidia Control Panel (Gamma=0.85, but that's not the real gamma -- it just erases the LightBoost gamma curve). This maximizes the LightBoost color gamut on the VG278H. Unfortunately, it's much harder to do so on the XL2411T and VG248QE. But I have punchy contrast, darker blacks, and saturated colors in LightBoost now (something I could never easily can get on XL2411T, same panel as VG248QE). even though I now have slightly more overdrive artifacts (only about 5% more noticeable), it's a worthy tradeoff for my eyes. (I erased my LightBoost overdrive safety margin by choosing near-maximum contrast). Depends on what artifacts you are picky too.

VG248QE is cheaper and has fewer LightBoost overdrive artifacts, but if LightBoost color is numero uno -- definitely skip VG248QE. Better LightBoost color is achieved elsewhere.

LightBoost tradeoff varies from monitor to monitor.
 
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I'm using a VG278H.
How do I do a 'clean' uninstall of the strobelight app?

I used strobelight-setup to add 100Hz only.
Restarted.
Lightboost was instantly enabled upon login and worked properly.

Then I wanted to disable it so I stopped the program, and unplugged the monitor.
Lightboost was gone as expected.
Only problem now is that I'm missing all other refresh rates except 100Hz. (so no 60Hz, 110Hz, 120Hz)

I assume I can simply use strobelight-setup to add the missing refresh rates, reboot, unplug.

But is there another way to get my vanilla setup? (refresh rates and timings)
 
Transsive said:
I'm using a VG278H.]I assume I can simply use strobelight-setup to add the missing refresh rates, reboot, unplug.
Click to expand...

grandpatzer said:
seems like I'm not able to disable LB using Toastyx program, I can read well the pixperan stuff.
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Re-run Strobelight-setup.exe again, and add the modes.
Reboot.

Now you've got the 120Hz (strobed) mode, and 121Hz non-strobed mode.
If you are using a VG248QE, you can use a 120Hz (strobed) and 144Hz non-strobed.

IMPORTANT: Strobelight is a beta at the moment.
Make sure you run strobelight-setup to add both strobed and non-strobed modes

Hope this helps; ToastyX is improving it. If there are bugs -- contact toastyx [at] gmail.com -- and let him know!

For VG248QE, I recommend adding four modes: 120Hz (strobed), 100Hz (strobed), 144Hz, 60Hz
 
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Yes, that's exactly what I needed, much appreciated.
All refresh rates are back.

I'll have some fun with this during the weekend.
 
ToastyX said:
Did you add a non-strobed refresh rate above 60 Hz?
Click to expand...

I actually don't mind having LB on all the time, I doubt it harms my display having it always on?
I'm using LB 10% brightness.

I'm slightly worried my LB is not activated during gaming, It propably is on bcs in windows in pixperpan I can read well text.
I think 144hz non lb has more ghosting compared to LB 120hz on but they are similar looking.

I only play Counter Strike GO atm, also most modern games(bioshock Infinite, Metro LL) are badly optimized I have alot of fps drops in modern games so I tend to only play CS GO.
 
grandpatzer said:
I actually don't mind having LB on all the time, I doubt it harms my display having it always on?
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No it doesn't.

If you want to prevent LightBoost from turning off,
Run strobelight-setup.exe and install only strobed rates (e.g. 120Hz strobed). That will force all games to run LightBoost, since there are no non-LightBoost rates installed.
 
Now if they would just add scanning backlights to VA and IPS panels and make this type of stuff work at lower refresh rates for the mid/low end systems. Congratulations on getting an easy toggle/install system going. Surely Nvidia will start working on ways to offer additional models with tweaks, upgrades, etc. and grab the display market by the horns.
 
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